Air Conditioner Issue

[swm59nj]

     In January of this year the owner of my condo had the air conditioners cleaned.  This is done every six months. The air conditioner in the bedroom is a Daikin Inverter.  The type of unit on the wall.   It was installed March 2020 prior to me moving in.  Before I go to sleep I would turn it on with a setting of 25 C.  This kept the room comfortable cool all night.

     After the air conditioner was cleaned in January.  I noticed many times waking up, the room would be warm.  The compressor would not be running. And the air coming out of the air conditioner slightly cool from the fan inside the unit.  I observed it for a couple of weeks.  I noticed most of the time the compressor would run at the start, maybe for a few minutes or hours.  Then stop but not come on again.  Even if the room got warm.  I tried other lower temperatures and it would do the same thing.

      I contacted the owner.  Daikin sent two technicians.  It was explained to me they couldnt find anything wrong. A couple of weeks later, the owner had some independent technician look at it.  She said he told her that the sensor was bad.  But couldnt replace it.  He said that the air conditioner had to be taken apart by Daikin.  Because the sensor was inside the air conditioner. I was under the impression that any air con technician could replace a sensor.

     So yesterday Daikin sent a senior technician here.  And of course he said nothing is wrong.  And its very early morning now. I woke up a couple of hours ago.  The room was again very warm. I kept reducing the temperature on the air conditioner.  The compressor comes on for maybe five minutes. Then it stops but the room is still warm.  I have the temperature set on 22 C. Then it comes on about a half hour later for only about five minutes.  When it does come on, it is blowing cold air.   I also happen to notice there seems to be a lot of condensation inside the air conditioner.

    Does anyone have any idea what might the problem might be?  The issue started after the last cleaning.  Everything was fine before that.

      

Edited March 8, 2022 by swm59nj

[meatboy]

could be the main power board needs replacing.check if the lights on the front,POWER,THERMOSTAT.or it could be the handset batteries not sending instructions to the power board.

[steven100]

buy a new aircon .....  the new Mitsubishi's are great as well as the LG and Panasonic.

Put new batteries in the remote control,  reset all settings if you can and set the AC to normal Cold operation say 24 deg,  then run it for 20 minutes and turn off,  let it sit for 10 minutes then start again and run for 10 more minutes. 

Try that and see how it works.

[Crossy]

Are you sure it's set to "cool" (usually a snowflake symbol on the display)?

 

If your remote has some sort of master reset button, press it to restore default settings.

 

[Muhendis]

2 hours ago, meatboy said:

could be the main power board needs replacing.check if the lights on the front,POWER,THERMOSTAT.or it could be the handset batteries not sending instructions to the power board.

Quite possible.

Some years ago I had similar symptoms. Turned out to be a kamikaze inclined lizard which made a short across some mains to low voltage circuits on the main board. All the indicator lights looked fine but no cooling. Cost 2,000 Baht for a replacement board.

[tonray]

It's puzzling because surely the Daikin techs have thermometers to gauge whether it is at proper cooling temperatures ? How could they miss that ?

[meatboy]

one other to consider,if like we have had low temps.the past month,ours is set at 25 and outside is cooler,then it wont work,the wife used to be a sales rep for an air con.co.so she knows most problems and she can also clean them..our dog tells us when its TOO warm.

[bunnydrops]

Maybe they are not staying long enough. Maybe every thing is fine at first but the problem comes up after a time.

[Doctor Tom]

1 hour ago, Crossy said:

usually a snowflake symbol on the display)

Is that a picture of a social media 'influencer'? 

 

Has the gas been checked?  It could be a Leak but any competent technician should check that, and therein lies your problem, people, calling themselves 'specialists',  who are nothing of the sort.  If the makers of thing can't send someone to fix it, then change the aircon, or get someone with a known reputation for competence.  Locals usually know of someone who fits that description. 

[Crossy]

6 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

Is that a picture of a social media 'influencer'? 

 

I now need to get tea out of my keyboard!! 

 

[swm59nj]

After a few minutes the tech called me into the room.  He showed me on his temperature gauge that it was the correct temperature.  I translated to him that was not the issue.  The issue was the unit itself does not maintain the temperature.  It does not do any good if the unit blows cold air initially, but does not maintain the set temperature .  

 

I then asked him if he checked the sensor or any diagnostics.  He then opened the air conditioner to check it. I thought he should of did this on his own. 

Edited March 9, 2022 by swm59nj

[SomchaiDIY]

Daikin can have temperature sensor for air and sometimes also on evap line

 

On new model tiny thermistor sensor located on small pcb at front and moisture here makes bad reading

 

Engineer must check these thermistor for damages correct location and value with test meter

 

These sensor can give bad reading after ac starts the cool down

 

Possible the cleaning service caused problem with these sensor or control board inside or outside

 

Best buy cheap digital thermometer and make photo of reading and remote control setting when fault happens

[tonray]

3 hours ago, meatboy said:

one other to consider,if like we have had low temps.the past month,ours is set at 25 and outside is cooler,then it wont work,the wife used to be a sales rep for an air con.co.so she knows most problems and she can also clean them..our dog tells us when its TOO warm.

I explain this to GF almost daily. Hot day outside with sun hitting west wall, can set at 30 and will kick compressor on. Cool day or later in the evening must lower to 27 for cooling to take effect.

[swm59nj]

Thank you for the responses.  Just an update.

Daikin customer service called me a little while ago.  The person told me one of their engineers suggested to replace the mother board.  I asked the rep if that was the actual cause of the problem.  He said he didnt know and would ask the engineer and get back to me.  I asked if it was unusual for a mother board to be replaced after two years.  The rep said it could have been damaged from the cleaning that was done. Which is when these issues started.  So it makes sense.  But the impression is they dont really know if that is the problem. So I want more information.

The cost would be 2800 baht.  I contacted the owner since I rent.  She already was aware of the problem.  The impression I got was she doesnt want to pay.  I never had an issue in the past if there was an problem.  

I will pay if I have to, Im not happy.. I spoke to the Juristic about it.  A nice lady. She contacted a guy that services air conditioning.  She said a lot of people use him in the building and are happy with him. He will come Saturday to look at it.  No charge.  And the Juristic will be here too. So at least other people have used him with good results.

 

 

 

Edited March 9, 2022 by swm59nj

[OneMoreFarang]

Take a thermometer and measure your room temperature.

Set the aircon i.e. to 22 degrees. Then measure (not just in front of the aircon).

If the room temperature is not 22 degrees then do the same procedure in front of the owner and then let the owner sort out the problem. You are entitled to a working aircon. It is not your job to analyze the problem and find a decent technician.

[OneMoreFarang]

19 minutes ago, swm59nj said:

Daikin customer service called me a little while ago.  The person told me one of their engineers suggested to replace the mother board.  I asked the rep if that was the actual cause of the problem.  He said he didnt know and would ask the engineer and get back to me.

These days electronics if often all on one board. If anything, even a 1 cent component, does not work then the the whole board does not work and the manufacturer will tell you to replace the whole board.

This is the easiest and fastest way to solve the problem.

Just make sure that if the motherboard is not the problem then you don't have to pay for it.

 

If a talented technician knows exactly which of the thousands of components on the board does not work then he might replace that part. But maybe troubleshooting to find out which part is broken takes hours. This is why replacing is often the cheapest solution - not just for aircons

[swm59nj]

Daikin rep just called me.  He said the specific engineer  handling my case is in quarantine for Covid.  So the engineer can’t answer my specific questions at this time . Such as if he thinks the mother board is the exact cause.  This is because he doesn’t have  complete access to my file. But they can make an appointment to change the mother board but not for almost two weeks.  
I guess no one else can access my file.  It must be top secret lol.  You can’t make this stuff up. 
And OneMoreFarang is correct.  The owner should be coordinating and paying for this.  I’m just desperate to get it done. 

[Crossy]

44 minutes ago, swm59nj said:

Daikin rep just called me.  He said the specific engineer  handling my case is in quarantine for Covid.  So the engineer can’t answer my specific questions at this time . Such as if he thinks the mother board is the exact cause.  This is because he doesn’t have  complete access to my file. But they can make an appointment to change the mother board but not for almost two weeks.  
I guess no one else can access my file.  It must be top secret lol.  You can’t make this stuff up. 
And OneMoreFarang is correct.  The owner should be coordinating and paying for this.  I’m just desperate to get it done. 

 

Ah yes, "covid" the universal excuse!

 

But I agree that swapping the main board would be the way to go, but try to get an agreement that if it doesn't fix the issue then no charge (and put the not dead old one back). Good luck! (in the style of The Great Escape)

[bluejets]

If it did indeed start straight after the maintenance on the fan coil was done, then possible the return air sensor has been damaged or displaced during the cleaning process.

Most rental premises , it is the responsibility of the renter to pay for any repair work done.

Edited March 9, 2022 by bluejets

[swm59nj]

7 hours ago, bluejets said:

If it did indeed start straight after the maintenance on the fan coil was done, then possible the return air sensor has been damaged or displaced during the cleaning process.

Most rental premises , it is the responsibility of the renter to pay for any repair work done.

Thank you for the information regarding the sensors.

In regard to the renter having to pay for any repair work done.  Did you mean the owner?

Because in any place I have rented in the past my contracts have stated the owner is responsible for specific repairs. This was in either in the states or here in Bangkok.

I dont know why a renter would make repairs for  a property they dont own. 

Edited March 10, 2022 by swm59nj

[swm59nj]

On 3/9/2022 at 3:52 PM, OneMoreFarang said:

Take a thermometer and measure your room temperature.

Set the aircon i.e. to 22 degrees. Then measure (not just in front of the aircon).

If the room temperature is not 22 degrees then do the same procedure in front of the owner and then let the owner sort out the problem. You are entitled to a working aircon. It is not your job to analyze the problem and find a decent technician.

Can you please tell me where I can purchase this thermometer?   I do know what type you mean. I live in Bangkok.  I had to go to central chidlom yesterday. I checked in central department store and even powerbuy.  Thinking at least they sell digital ones.  I shown staff photos of a few kinds as examples. The description on the photos are in Thai.  The staff reacts like they never seen anything like that before and say no have.  This is not an uncommon item lol.

I also checked the Homepro website.  I dont see that type either.  

I do have one of those hand held digital thermometers someone gave me. It measures body temp and also has a setting for surface.  I set in on surface and held in up in the middle of the room.  It read 33.4 C.  And the air conditioner was set at 22 C.  for a few hours.

 

Edited March 11, 2022 by swm59nj

[sometimewoodworker]

59 minutes ago, swm59nj said:

Can you please tell me where I can purchase this thermometer?

Lazada 

is one source 

[OneMoreFarang]

2 hours ago, swm59nj said:

Can you please tell me where I can purchase this thermometer?   I do know what type you mean. I live in Bangkok.  I had to go to central chidlom yesterday. I checked in central department store and even powerbuy.  Thinking at least they sell digital ones.  I shown staff photos of a few kinds as examples. The description on the photos are in Thai.  The staff reacts like they never seen anything like that before and say no have.  This is not an uncommon item lol.

I also checked the Homepro website.  I dont see that type either.  

I do have one of those hand held digital thermometers someone gave me. It measures body temp and also has a setting for surface.  I set in on surface and held in up in the middle of the room.  It read 33.4 C.  And the air conditioner was set at 22 C.  for a few hours.

Search in Lazada for room thermometer. There are many of them. This is one example for 115THB.

https://www.lazada.co.th/products/htc-1-indoor-room-lcd-electronic-temperature-humidity-meter-digital-thermometer-hygrometer-weather-station-alarm-clock-htc-1-i261380843-s402224854.html

 

[bluejets]

On 3/10/2022 at 6:10 PM, swm59nj said:

I dont know why a renter would make repairs for  a property they dont own. 

Obviously never had any commercial experience then.

[Yellowtail]

Were it me and I were desperate to get it fixed I would just pay the B2K and fight with the landlord later. 

 

When shopping air conditioners, make sure whatever brand you buy has a authorized dealer nearby, as using unauthorized service providers may void your warranty. 

 

Also compare warranties between brands, it looks like Daikin is only a 1/3 warranty while 3/5 and even 5/10 warranties are pretty common. The first number covers everything, the second only the compressor. The compressors almost never go out. 

 

I think the best way to buy a new AC, is to figure out what you want buy shopping online and in person at HomePro or some-such, and them figuring out what you should have pay by checking the specific model on Lazada or wherever. Once you know what you want and what you should pay, go to the closest authorized seller and buy it from them. They should be able to come pretty close to the best legitimate price you find. In the event you need service later, use the same company your bought it from. 

[NanLaew]

On 3/10/2022 at 2:10 PM, swm59nj said:

Thank you for the information regarding the sensors.

In regard to the renter having to pay for any repair work done.  Did you mean the owner?

Because in any place I have rented in the past my contracts have stated the owner is responsible for specific repairs. This was in either in the states or here in Bangkok.

I dont know why a renter would make repairs for  a property they dont own. 

What your previous landlords agreed to pay for is irrelevant. Chances are you never had a major appliance outage before either to test these contracts?

 

Does your CURRENT rental agreement say anything about who's responsible? Typically light bulbs and any low power appliances that are part of the agreed and signed rental property inventory are for the renter to repair/replace as they are the ones using them. If it says nothing, then the landlord has no obligation to repair/replace anything at all. If a property is air conditioned or has expensive appliances like water pumps, washers, driers and the like, the renter should get an agreement on who pays for that. However, most rental contracts are generic copy/paste jobs with holes in them for tenants to fall into.

 

If the control board solves the problem but the landlord doesn't want to pay, then the OP could keep the old control board and swap it back when it's time to vacate? But since it is only about 2000 baht versus upwards of 12,000 baht for a complete new unit, just pay and get on with ensuring a cool March and April.

[swm59nj]

   Just giving an update.  Thank you all for trying to help.

    I had an air conditioning tech come for a second opinion.  He did not charge me for the service call. The juristic told me some people have used him in the building and seemed to be pleased.  He is Thai and speaks English. He spent about two hours here.

    He finally saw the issue with the compressor not coming back on.  He said something about the sensor needs to be replaced.  Looked like the one in the area the control box.  I told him Daikin said the 

motherboard needs to be replaced. He said he did not think it was the motherboard.

    So I told him replace the sensor and lets see if that solves the issue. He said he would give me the price that Monday morning.  Well I have not heard from him since then.  I have called him, and he doesnt return my call.  I have sent him a message on his Line account. Which he reads but does not respond.  

     So it looks like I will be dealing with Daikin, to settle this once and for all.  They still insist its the motherboard. I have an appointment for Monday at noon for replacement.  But I was quoted originally 2800 baht for the job total two weeks ago. When I called to make the appointment two days ago.  I was told maybe around 3000 baht, but not sure of the cost. Because the motherboard and possibly another part needs to be replaced. But one of their engineers needs to call me.  Because the person at the call center does not know what the other part is or why.

So now Im waiting for the engineer to call me. But Daikin needs to tell me what they are replacing and the total cost.  

 

   

[Crossy]

Sometimes you just can't win ???? 

[Muhendis]

On 3/9/2022 at 5:24 AM, swm59nj said:

The compressor comes on for maybe five minutes. Then it stops but the room is still warm. 

This is probably a silly question to ask but does the fan run ok on the external heat exchanger?

[lopburi3]

6 hours ago, swm59nj said:

So I told him replace the sensor and lets see if that solves the issue. He said he would give me the price that Monday morning.  Well I have not heard from him since then.  I have called him, and he doesnt return my call.  I have sent him a message on his Line account. Which he reads but does not respond.  

This is likely because he can not obtain the sensor to replace; or he too now has covid (a lot of people have it currently - really).  

 

Expect you will find Daikin extra item will actually be a sensor - that should cover all bases.