British press support UK pensioners losing out in Thailand

[billd766]

15 minutes ago, sawadee1947 said:

.....and how they survived then? Definetely there are other sources of income.

So complaining on High Level????

They have survived because the country that they retired to supplemented their miserable UK frozen pensions.

 

Also in part they may well have had other pensions.

[wwest5829]

Thanks to Buddha (OK, whatever). We Yanks are not affected by this unfairness. Our earned Social Security has continued to receive any increase that all US Social Security recipients receive. So, I support your demands for equity, you earned the old age pensions for which you were taxed. I ask a question of you ... do fully retired British military receive medical cost reimbursement globally? My reason to inquiring ... fully retired US military receive earned medical costs reimbursement around the globe but earned Medicare retirees cannot get covered care outside US territory (while continuing to pay a monthly premium).

[Liverpool Lou]

11 hours ago, webfact said:

that petition has had over 10,296 signatures which means that Government must respond to all petitions that get more than 10,000 signatures.

Regrettably, that does not mean that it will get anywhere near being considered for debate in parliament which means that no increases will ever be given to expats in the affected countries.

[salavan]

6 hours ago, Orinoco said:

Or have 3 properties in the uk rented out,

Job's a good'un 

Yea and this government is slowly and surely destroying the rental sector 

[CharlieH]

A post commenting on Moderation and replies to it have been removed.

[Kwasaki]

23 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Agree 100%......I have four pension streams......three are UK CPI index linked.

Good for you youngans my private pensions got hit by 2008 world financial crash.

 

Recovered a bit by 2012 so still enough of a top up to add to my UK gov pension.

 

No need for a Pathos appeal at the moment. ????????????

[Liverpool Lou]

6 hours ago, 10baht said:

You get what you vote for.

That's what you think.  No government, whatever side of the aisle, has ever agreed to apply the state pension increases.

[Liverpool Lou]

6 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

You want a pension for your expat lifestyle go get a private pension or savings plan. 

You may want to read the OP properly.

 

No one is asking for a basic state pension to sustain what you describe as an "expat lifestyle", suggesting an extravgant way of life, just the annual cost of living increases that all pensioners in the UK and some other countries receive automatically.

[Grusa]

3 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

How did you lose it? private pension?

Yes.

[Liverpool Lou]

6 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

This may sound crazy but why has no  one sued the government in a class action lawsuit.

Obviously, because it could never succeed.   The government is not doing anything illegal.

[Liverpool Lou]

6 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

As a Cdn Vet it makes more sense than ....

What's being a "Cdn Vet" got to do with it?   

[Orinoco]

1 hour ago, PremiumLane said:

This is what you get when you have a Tory government - they only care about their rich mates and their own business interests 

Mate your out of date.

They all do this now days,  it's viewed as a perk of the job

you forgot private schooling for the kids.

Go Go the Labor party uk. 

 

[Liverpool Lou]

5 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Some people get a job in the Army for four years after leaving School and think the Country should support them for the rest of their life . 

...and assume that everyone should "thank them for their service" every five minutes!

Edited May 2, 2022 by Liverpool Lou

[Orinoco]

18 minutes ago, salavan said:

Yea and this government is slowly and surely destroying the rental sector 

They make it hard for sure. it's all a bit counter productive of them,  as we landlords are now very very selective of our tenants.

we cant be truly honest of why refuse some tenants. but most know why. 

 

 

[Liverpool Lou]

5 hours ago, Thailand said:

Anyway, can I expect my UK pension to more than double now it has the attention of the press in the UK?

No, of course you can't.  The last increase did not double state pensions.

[Liverpool Lou]

5 hours ago, Elkski said:

It does seem like a bad policy.  But from the government standpoint no vote to change things I imagine.   Was it always this way?  

  "Was it always this way?" 

Yes. That's why it's the way it is.

[Jonathan Swift]

7 hours ago, Orinoco said:

Unfortunately we are viewed as no more than traitors and scum for leaving the uk and living in Thailand,  that's the government, general population, friends and family, the latter will never say it to your face.

But keep trying, never say never and all that. 

People are insanely jealous of anyone who has a happier life than them, cannot admit it to themselves, and there you are.

[Liverpool Lou]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

1 hour ago, Will B Good said:

She was clever in that respect......mortgaging the future to save the present (and her skin).

 

Police, armed forces, fire services......all received amazing deals whilst she sold off the family silver to pay for it all (at least in the short term).

Expand  

Meanwhile Gordon Brown literally sold off the complete UK gold reserves at a bad price, just to pay the bills.

No, he, literally, did not.  He sold 401 tonnes out of the UK's holding of 715t at the time.

Edited May 2, 2022 by Liverpool Lou

[sandyf]

4 hours ago, PaDavid said:

The point you may have missed is that we’ve paid for our pensions our entire working lives through something called National Insurance. So, in effect, it’s a contributory pension scheme in the same way as if we had paid into a private plan

You are both right and wrong. The 1946 National Insurance Act changed the state pension from non-contributory to contributory but not in the way you seem to think.

As there were no existing contributions in place, when contributions did start in 1948 they were immediately used to pay the pensioners of the day, not of the future.

[robsamui]

"For example, a single pensioner who retired in late 1982 after having made the full contributions would be getting £32.85 a week, or £1,708 a year, if their pension were frozen then. If they had stayed in Britain, they would now be getting £141.85 a week, or £7,376 a year."

 

Are there really so many 105-year-old pensioners staggering about?

[Thunglom]

Whether or not pensioners living abroad receive increases in UK state pensions is a bit random....in the USA it keeps up ... in Australia no.....it is clear that something needs to be done to rationalise the system.

 

It is also worth bearing in mind that the UK state pension basic rate is only around  £8000 p.a. so I'm not sure where the figures in the OP come from.

Before Brexit, the UK government was under pressure to come inline with EU pensions which would have nearly doubled the OAP for many people - 

Another problem for Brits is they aren't accustomed to paying health insurance so that can be a killer for those wanting retire abroad.

 

The UK state pension is about half of that in France and a third of that in Germany. So spare a thought for those old Brits nursing a Chang outside the 7/11 - they can't afford much more.

 

 

Edited May 2, 2022 by Thunglom

[sandyf]

2 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

The maximum as you say was due to the amount you paid in N. I.  payments the more you earned the more you N. I. you paid. 

Under the old system NI was paid in 2 parts, there was the basic part that went to NHS/basic state pension and a second part that went towards additional state pension.

If people contracted out of the state additional pension then the second part of their NI was paid into their occupational or private pensions. There are many people receiving pensions other than the state pension that have been partially funded by NI contributions.

 

[jacko45k]

6 hours ago, brianthainess said:

Funny thing is even if you are Married in Thailand the must have 400k in the bank, is less than a UK pension. 

You made me get my calculator... my UK state pension currently works out at nearly exactly 400,000 baht for one year!

[LivinLOS]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

You may want to read the OP properly.

 

No one is asking for a basic state pension to sustain what you describe as an "expat lifestyle", suggesting an extravgant way of life, just the annual cost of living increases that all pensioners in the UK and some other countries receive automatically.

if you can afford to go live in another country, you can afford to let go of any state benefits.. 

I have a simple deal with the uk.. Let me pay for a passport every few years and I wont bother you, you dont bother me.. I will never ask for state aid, unemployment, a state pension, or anything else.. Even when I have contributed millions in direct and indirect taxes through businesses I owned. 

[sandyf]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

You are obviously the kind of person who skims a headline and does no research on the subject at all. If you had done any research and found this page (it took me a couple of minutes to find and a bit longer to read).

 

The truth is nothing at all like the post you posted, but anything will do to bash the conservatives, and the truth doesn't matter

 

When a previous attempt reached as far as the ECHR, the UK PM went to the courts and spoke against equalisation.

 

What was his name now?

 

Ah, now it comes to me.

 

His name was Tony Blair and he was the PM and the leader of the Labour party.

 

Do you believe that if Labour get back into power, that they will parity to frozen pensions?

 

BTW the frozen pensions have been around longer than me and I am 77.

 

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01457/

 

The UK State Pension is payable worldwide to those who meet the qualifying conditions. It is up-rated where there is a legal requirement to do so, for example, where recipients are living in countries where there is a reciprocal agreement that provides for up-rating. The Government has no plans to change the policy on up-rating UK State Pensions overseas; the policy is longstanding and has been supported by successive Governments for over 70 years. The Government understands that people move abroad for many reasons and that this can have an impact on their finances. However, the decision to move abroad remains a personal choice. Advice that the UK State Pension is not up-rated overseas except where there is a legal requirement has been provided to the public for many years. Information is provided in leaflets and on gov.uk (PQ HL 11595 5 January 2021)."

 

There is a lot more that you can read and download via the link.

"BTW the frozen pensions have been around longer than me and I am 77."

Very close Bill, came about with the 1946 NI Act.

 

"the policy is longstanding and has been supported by successive Governments for over 70 years."

If historical precedence made thing right then we would still have slavery.

 

I think the previous court challenge was badly handled and time for another. Also there has been some changes in the law since then and with what the government did with those in the EU post brexit would constitute a clear case of discrimination.

Problem is only those being penalised have a vested interest and if they could afford to initiate such an action they wouldn't be in a country that suffered.

 

 

[kingstonkid]

1 hour ago, Purdey said:

Would they be complaining if they had other money in the bank?

Yes it is the point that they have paid for the pension and should  be fully entitled to it.

 

An example that is strange is Americans living outside the country and not affected  by covid in the US all got the same cheques as if they were living in the US.

[LivinLOS]

2 hours ago, nahkit said:

The government, in the main, receives revenue through three streams, Income tax, National Insurance and VAT. I was always under the impression that National Insurance was a means to fund a future pension rather than a coffer for government services.

The government is in deficit, that means they are not taking in enough each year in those revenue streams to pay for the services provided to the nation.. 

So no.. To truly be creating a set aside, like a sovereign wealth fund, they would need to radically raise those revenue streams, something that causes howls from the population and gets governments voted out.. So by democratic decree, everyone agrees to just maintain the fiction. 

[Will B Good]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

Were you ever in the military?

 

I was for 25 years, boy and man. In those 25 years I went where the RAF sent me and I was lucky enough never to be shot at or involved in a minor or major war.

 

No, sadly to say, we don't all get astronomical pensions, that basically depends on what rank you were and what salary you were receiving when  you retired.

 

And, yes, I do pay income tax on my RAF pension.

 

BTW If the pensions are so astronomical, why are there so many ex-servicemen living on the streets in the UK? Why are so many suffering from PTSD and other medical problems.

A world class pension scheme for your military service

 

When a member of the armed forces reaches their retirement age, they receive one of the most generous pensions available in the UK. This fairly reflects the unique sacrifice they have provided their country throughout their career.

 

 

All members of the armed forces are automatically enrolled into the Armed Forces Pension Scheme. Unlike all other public schemes, members pay 0% in contributions each month. The scheme is unfunded and paid from the public purse.

 

 

Just for comparison teachers pensions accrue at 1/80th and they pay for it, Forces pensions accrue at 1/47th and it is free.

[kingstonkid]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

What's being a "Cdn Vet" got to do with it?   

The difference is that while I am in Thailand I lost 70 a month on muy Old Age Security but still am entitled to full coverage by the military

[Will B Good]

1 hour ago, Kwasaki said:

Good for you youngans my private pensions got hit by 2008 world financial crash.

That was a killer......I watch my Directors pension crash at the time, but still had another 10 years in which it could recover.......as they say.....all in the timing.