Assets to bought condo

[pavlo]

Am to move to Thailand in 2023/24, was looking condo and find few. Am keen to put money in one of them in this buyers market situation and was wondering, I need the paper from bank that money to used to purchase the condo need to come on my local account in Thailand from abroad before can have the ownership title in my own name. My money is still hold on flat am living now in EU, need it until ready to move. I have a change to borrow this money from friend in Thailand, is there any way to avoid hassle to send amount to abroad and send it back to my account in Thai bank ?  We are talking about 3,5 million thb.

Any advice, legal ones , please.

[scubascuba3]

Don't buy offplan

[FriendlyFarang]

Don't buy

[treetops]

Keep your place in EU for your visits back there.

[pavlo]

So, overall your opinions are negative on anything related ownership for farang condo.

There was no opinions nor helpful advices on my question for money transfer or is it just

there is no real knowledge on this matter among those who bothered read my text ?

[skatewash]

11 minutes ago, pavlo said:

So, overall your opinions are negative on anything related ownership for farang condo.

There was no opinions nor helpful advices on my question for money transfer or is it just

there is no real knowledge on this matter among those who bothered read my text ?

Three points, only one of which answers your question.  The other two, however, might be more important to you long-term.  Let's start with the answer first.

1)  Unless you are legally working in Thailand, meaning you have a work permit issued by the Labor Department, the money to buy a freehold condo under the Condo Act must come from outside of Thailand and be documented to have done so.  So in your scenario, the money would have to be sent outside of Thailand (for example, using Dee Money) and then transferred into Thailand from outside (using perhaps a service like Wise or directly by a wire transfer from your non-Thai bank using SWIFT to your Thai bank).  Using either of those methods you can get from your Thai bank a document that specifies that the money was internationally transferred into Thailand for the purpose of buying a freehold condominium.

2) While true it's a buyer's market it's even more a renter's market.  The list of things that can go wrong by renting versus by buying is considerably shorter.  Something to really think about.

3) Buying a unit off-plan puts you effectively into business with your developer.  The success of your developer (for example, selling sufficient units to other people to make your condo a going concern) becomes of great concern to you.  The list of promises made by your developer is very long.  Your satisfaction with your purchase is very much dependent on the success of the developer in being able to keep most or even any of those promises.  In the event your developer cannot, for whatever reason including general economic conditions, his problems will become your problems.  By definition buying off-plan means buying into a condominium which does not yet have a functioning board of co-owners.  There's no guarantee that such a board of co-owners will ever exist (or as in my personal case it may take 7 years after purchasing the condo for it to exist).

[sanuk711]

On 5/28/2022 at 2:58 PM, pavlo said:

Am to move to Thailand in 2023/24, was looking condo and find few. Am keen to put money in one of them in this buyers market situation and was wondering, I need the paper from bank that money to used to purchase the condo need to come on my local account in Thailand from abroad before can have the ownership title in my own name. My money is still hold on flat am living now in EU, need it until ready to move. I have a change to borrow this money from friend in Thailand, is there any way to avoid hassle to send amount to abroad and send it back to my account in Thai bank ?  We are talking about 3,5 million thb.

Buy---Don't Buy its up to you.

 

Is your friend a Thai? because  unless its changed I didn't think you could buy with Thai Funds if you are Farang.,

Must comply with the condominium act section 19.

 

If they are Thai then Surely a written Mortgage from your friend  would be the same.

When you arrive you pay them back with a overseas transfer obtaining your FET  doc at that time.  Probably best to have a lawyer write it up with that in Mind.

 

I dont know what your time schedule is for coming to Thailand-- but no one seems to think the (Real Estate) situation is going to change much in the short term.

[pavlo]

Thank you both latest whom given good advices and also answer to my actual question.

Am not on run to move, time table set to start on the end of year 2023, retirement on September,

after that all still little blur, trying to get my things straight and ready for whatever am finally do.

Was hoping to fly away before winter hits Finland again next year, but am keep my winter clothes

in closet until sure .

On my way to Thailand next month for 6 weeks, opening bank account this time too. Ready for transfer money for condo purchase ( not off-plan ) ,  Bangkok it will be, am having chance to use my friends summerhouse in HuaHin too for time to time, also plan to buy small house in Siem Reap with garden.

Well, need sth to do with all those decades to come on my senior years ????

 

 

[Mac Mickmanus]

On 6/5/2022 at 10:52 AM, pavlo said:

So, overall your opinions are negative on anything related ownership for farang condo.

There was no opinions nor helpful advices on my question for money transfer or is it just

there is no real knowledge on this matter among those who bothered read my text ?

Are you not interested in peoples opinions on whether its better to buy or rent ?

[pavlo]

On 6/6/2022 at 6:08 PM, Mac Mickmanus said:

Are you not interested in peoples opinions on whether its better to buy or rent ?

If you care to read all reply , I got good advices , but was not asking for opinions on this matter.

Rent in long term not my option, am been in area

around last 20 years travelling multiple times in year, lived also in Bangkok one year before, so am not 

any freshman anymore. Was married with thai 13 years too, learn a lot.

[Onerak]

On 6/5/2022 at 5:20 AM, skatewash said:

Buying a unit off-plan

What is off-plan unit?

[Mac Mickmanus]

Just now, Onerak said:

What is off-plan unit?

A Condo that hasn't been built yet 

[Onerak]

There are both pros and cons of buying a unit in Thailand. It depends on one's situation and particular circumstances. As per OP's questions about money coming from abroad, yes it is required that bank certifies the money has come from aboard. If you're married to  a Thai, you can buy in wife's name and avoid all the hassles of foreigners' quota and where the money came from. MY suggestions is not sell your place in Europe. Maybe you can get a loan at a cheap rate and pay over the years.

That's what I did. I got a loan in the USA at 3.2% using my house and bought a cheap nut decent unit for my 6-month stay in Thailand and I pay it now. I had the cash and was earning more from the market when I bought it. The loan rate was very low at that time. So I opted for a loan. I was trying to avoid the hassle of connecting a high speed internet, finding a unit and getting my stuff situated in the new unit every time I go to Thailand (I travel every three months for three months stay twice a year). I did not buy it for investment. Instead of renting a place permanently for 12 months, I just bought one from a developer. I bought in my Thai daughter's name and my GF negotiated a good price that suited me also. I did not have  to show where the money came from or if the foreigner's quota is available. 

[skatewash]

5 minutes ago, Onerak said:

What is off-plan unit?

A unit/building/property before construction is completed which is being developed according to a plan (off-plan) but hasn't finished yet.  Colloquially referred to as "buying a pig in a poke."  Much riskier than buying an existing building, because the range of things that can go wrong is substantially greater than with an existing structure.  Often there is some reduction in price from the anticipated price once the structure is completed offered as compensation for the added risk.  Rarely if ever worth it, in my opinion.

[Onerak]

10 minutes ago, skatewash said:

A unit/building/property before construction is completed which is being developed according to a plan (off-plan) but hasn't finished yet.  Colloquially referred to as "buying a pig in a poke."  Much riskier than buying an existing building, because the range of things that can go wrong is substantially greater than with an existing structure.  Often there is some reduction in price from the anticipated price once the structure is completed offered as compensation for the added risk.  Rarely if ever worth it, in my opinion.

Thanks for the explanation. When I was looking for a unit, I was looking in a completed projects but not all units are sold. I wanted a new unit where I will be the first occupant. Found one in my desired location at my desired price that was completed and I could move in immediately but they were still working on few small things like outside landscapes etc. Swimming pool was also  completed and people were swimming ????

[skatewash]

4 minutes ago, Onerak said:

Thanks for the explanation. When I was looking for a unit, I was looking in a completed projects but not all units are sold. I wanted a new unit where I will be the first occupant. Found one in my desired location at my desired price that was completed and I could move in immediately but they were still working on few small things like outside landscapes etc. Swimming pool was also  completed and people were swimming ????

I would be interested if there is a functioning board of directors as specified under the Condo Act.  When was the last Annual General Meeting?  Can you get copies of the minutes of that meeting?  What is the monthly budget of the condo?  Which of the current owners if any are not current with their maintenance fee payments?  With unsold units (that is, units owned by the developer) there may not be a functioning board of directors and the condo may be "managed" by the developer without any oversight by the other owners.  A developer tends to finish those parts of the common area that will have the most appeal to potential buyers, such as a swimming pool.

[Onerak]

39 minutes ago, skatewash said:

condo may be "managed" by the developer without any oversight by the other owners. 

Yes condo was managed by the developers (a property management company) because lots of units are not sold yet. What I wanted I got why do I care who manages the complex? And someday in the future when all units are sold, it will be managed by owners, the developer's agent told me. 

[skatewash]

4 minutes ago, Onerak said:

Yes condo was managed by the developers (a property management company) because lots of units are not sold yet. What I wanted I got why do I care who manages the complex? And someday in the future when all units are sold, it will be managed by owners, the developer's agent told me. 

In my experience the developer's agent will tell you what they need to tell you to get you to purchase a unit.

I bought my current unit seven years ago.  The first Annual General Meeting was held this year, seven years after I started living there.  Parts of the common area remain unfinished.  There was no oversight of the developer's management.  We, the owners, do not have access to our sinking fund (meaning we don't know where it is, what the balance is, etc.).  We do not have access to the account where our maintenance fees are kept.  We do not have business records to support the expenditure of the maintenance fees.  The developer was stripped of voting rights at the first AGM and subsequently they have not cooperated by sharing any of their business records concerning the management of the building and are completely unresponsive to our queries.  Many units remain unsold and are still owned by the developer and/or the bank holding the mortgage on the units.  Some owners who have paid for their units in full do not have their chanotes because the developer will not go the the Land Transport Office and complete the registration.  Yes, there are several ongoing court cases involving owners and the developer, some of which have been going on for years.  The owners who haven't received their chanotes have had to pay ongoing legal fees to have their units removed from auction.

But hey, the pool is done.  Looks nice. ????

[Onerak]

33 minutes ago, skatewash said:

In my experience the developer's agent will tell you what they need to tell you to get you to purchase a unit.

I bought my current unit seven years ago.  The first Annual General Meeting was held this year, seven years after I started living there.  Parts of the common area remain unfinished.  There was no oversight of the developer's management.  We, the owners, do not have access to our sinking fund (meaning we don't know where it is, what the balance is, etc.).  We do not have access to the account where our maintenance fees are kept.  We do not have business records to support the expenditure of the maintenance fees.  The developer was stripped of voting rights at the first AGM and subsequently they have not cooperated by sharing any of their business records concerning the management of the building and are completely unresponsive to our queries.  Many units remain unsold and are still owned by the developer and/or the bank holding the mortgage on the units.  Some owners who have paid for their units in full do not have their chanotes because the developer will not go the the Land Transport Office and complete the registration.  Yes, there are several ongoing court cases involving owners and the developer, some of which have been going on for years.  The owners who haven't received their chanotes have had to pay ongoing legal fees to have their units removed from auction.

Again as I said i don't care who manages the complex. Common areas are maintained as expected for since 2018. I have my chanote. I don't know about others. Only things I see not completed are the stores inside the condo. Only few stores have opened up. Again I did not buy the condo based on how many stores will be inside the condo. I am not sure what points are you trying to drive across. What is exactly your point? I don't know how many ongoing litigation going on against developers. I really don't care who manages the complex as long as they keep it maintained I am happy. And so far they have done it since 2018. Children's playground is maintained properly, swimming pools are kept clean and maintained, landscaping are done regularly, garbage is disposed every day. I find the management company is more responsive than the HOA for my condo in Las Vegas.

[skatewash]

8 minutes ago, Onerak said:

Again as I said i don't care who manages the complex. Common areas are maintained as expected for since 2018. I have my chanote. I don't know about others. Only things I see not completed are the stores inside the condo. Only few stores have opened up. Again I did not buy the condo based on how many stores will be inside the condo. I am not sure what points are you trying to drive across. What is exactly your point? I don't know how many ongoing litigation going on against developers. I really don't care who manages the complex as long as they keep it maintained I am happy. And so far they have done it since 2018. Children's playground is maintained properly, swimming pools are kept clean and maintained, landscaping are done regularly, garbage is disposed every day. 

I acknowledge that you don't see what point I'm trying to drive across.  I wish you much happiness with whatever decision you make.

[treetops]

9 minutes ago, Onerak said:

Again as I said i don't care who manages the complex.

One day you will and you'll come crying here for help.

[Onerak]

6 minutes ago, treetops said:

One day you will and you'll come crying here for help.

One day in the future what will happen nobody knows. And I don't seek help in the forum where most people have fled their own country to seek refuge in a foreign land because their voices are not heard on any place on earth and they come to this forum to bash Chinese, Indian, and Thaïs and pretend to be expert in everything but nobody in their own country. 

[treetops]

3 minutes ago, Onerak said:

One day in the future what will happen nobody knows.

So if you don't know, it would be better to plan for various needs and requirements to make life easy.  Living somewhere with a functioning, reliable, honest management would be prudent even if you don't need it right now.  It's a due diligence type of thing before you even contemplate living in a shared community.

 

As to the rest of your post, I have no idea what you're on about.  You are a member here with all that entails.

[Onerak]

1 hour ago, treetops said:

So if you don't know, it would be better to plan for various needs and requirements to make life easy.  Living somewhere with a functioning, reliable, honest management would be prudent even if you don't need it right now.  It's a due diligence type of thing before you even contemplate living in a shared community.

 

As to the rest of your post, I have no idea what you're on about.  You are a member here with all that entails.

Without any plan and due diligence advice from this forum I have accumulated six properties in three continents. Neither I need anybody's advice from this forum nor did I ask for it. 

[treetops]

On 6/11/2022 at 8:27 PM, Onerak said:

Without any plan and due diligence advice from this forum I have accumulated six properties in three continents. Neither I need anybody's advice from this forum nor did I ask for it. 

 

On 6/11/2022 at 7:03 PM, treetops said:

One day you will and you'll come crying here for help.

Advice whether from this forum or elsewhere will obviously not affect your ability to blow your own trumpet, but ignoring common sense wherever it comes from is never wise.  As you said, "One day in the future what will happen nobody knows" and one day in the future you may need a functioning management.