How Many of US are Lucky Enough to Still Recall....Riding in a Brand-New...1962 Hillman Imp?

[GammaGlobulin]

Dear Friends,

 

A few days ago, Google served up to me a video of the Hillman Imp.

 

How many of us are still able to recall our first ride in a 1962 Hillman Imp?

 

Strangely enough, my first ride in one of these happened when a young friend of mine invited me to his house in Gladwyne, Pa.

 

The steering wheel was on the right, something I had never seen before.

 

This family had a huge house, made mostly of granite, and a tiny car, something which made no sense to me.

 

My friend's mother was a fox.

 

I have not forgotten my first ride in the Hillman Imp.

 

Riding with a mother-fox was titillating, too.

 

What a magnificent ride.

 

Such an experience that one does not easily forget.

 

Regards,

GammaRays

 

 

Unfortunately, there are no subtitles provided for this video.

 

 

 

Edited December 13, 2022 by GammaGlobulin

[GammaGlobulin]

Although I did not fully appreciate the beauty of the Hillman, at age 10, I do today. 

 

Looking back now, I realize that so many beautiful snippets of my life have had connections to Scotland. 

 

[HauptmannUK]

I drove and repaired many Imps. Our family business (established by my grandfather in 1921) sold and serviced cars. I had to help out in the business and worked on many Imps in the 1970s. They were a popular car with good reason. The engine was a development of the Coventry Climax FW (featherweight) all-aluminium OHC designed by Harry Mundy. The gearbox had synchromesh on all forward gears. The weight distribution of the car front to back was pretty good and this made for good handling and braking - they became popular in motorsport.  One infuriating aspects was the use of a carbon throw-out bearing which wore prematurely and I changed many clutches for that reason. Also the front steering swivels had grease points which got overlooked - so many cars arrived with stiff steering. I used to free up the swivels by squirting in gear oil.

[thaibeachlovers]

40 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

Although I did not fully appreciate the beauty of the Hillman, at age 10, I do today. 

 

Looking back now, I realize that so many beautiful snippets of my life have had connections to Scotland. 

 

I never was so unfortunate as to ride in an Imp, but I owned a Hillman Hunter for many years. So rusty that in the end it probably had more filler than steel. Nevertheless it was reliable and lovely to drive. I was sad to see my old faithful go to the scrapper, but couldn't get parts anymore from wreckers.

[GammaGlobulin]

In my opinion, this topic has less to do with motorcars, per se, than chicks. Rather, I had envisioned this topic as being one that might resonate with others, something to help others dredge up feelings of nostalgia for one’s past among those my age. When one is just about over the hill, and when one has forgotten most of one’s youth, then, out of nowhere, up pops a photo or image or video of something reminding one of what had been completely forgotten. 

 

You might say that the 1962 Hillman is my metaphor for the wonderment I once felt when I was age 10, amazement for and confusion about everything I did not understand at that tender age.

 

At age ten, I had no idea that the engine behind me might be made of aluminum, and I did not care.

 

I was not a motorhead at age 10.

And, in any case, it was my friend’s mother who was driving.

 

My friend’s mother also allowed my friend to raise chicks in his bedroom, something I have just recalled.

 

The upshot of getting to know this friend whose mother allowed him to raise chickens in his bedroom was that I began raising young chickens, too.

 

Raising chickens indoors in our basement was tolerated for a while. I built plenty of tunnels made of cardboard through which the chicks would run.  I added lightbulbs to keep them warm in the winter months. Some chicks inevitably died.  There were insects and worms which infested our basement.

 

I had successfully blocked out this chicken-raising experiment for the past many decades until Google finally coughed up this 1962 Hillman video.

 

Looking back, I realize just how stressful the basement-chicken-raising experiment had actually been for me as a young person.

 

I believe this is why I have such an aversion to chickens and roosters, today, especially the raising of roosters in residential areas in Thailand.

 

When we are young, automobiles are like music in that they are both emotionally charged parts of our environment that children find fascinating. In later years, especially during the final two decades, our memories of the automobiles of our pre-teens act like memory tags which tie together many other memories of any given year of our lives.

 

So then… Does the mention of the 1962 Hillman stir up in you any memories? What was your life like at the time you took your first ride in a Hillman?

 

I really doubt that you now care that the Hillman had an aluminum block, for example. Aluminum was expensive in 1962, as you might recall.

 

Finally, when I think of my ride in the Hillman, I think of chickens, roosters, and building tiny huts and tunnels for chicks to travel through. Even today, I shudder at the thought of it.

 

If I had not taken a ride in the Hillman in 1962, then there is no doubt that I would not have purchased a VW in 1969.  The VW, in 1969, was truly an amazing car.

 

The VW, in 1969, was good for chicks!!!

And, the chicks were amazing in the summer of 1969!!!

 

 

Edited December 13, 2022 by GammaGlobulin

[GammaGlobulin]

 

Honestly speaking, I am not quite sure how I ended up in the Motorhead Forum.

I mean, I have never really been all that interested in motors.

 

Except, maybe, I am interested in the Sterling Engine...

 

Just hope I can find my way....home......

 

The Motorhead Forum is not one I would have chosen, myself.

 

Anyway, please watch this Sterling Engine while listening to Rolling Stones' HOT STUFF...

 

My best advice.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 13, 2022 by GammaGlobulin

[Lacessit]

The Hillman Imp was not a shining example of British engineering. Changing tyre pressures by a few psi front and back could convert the handling from mild understeer to raging oversteer, or vice-versa.

When I was looking for my second used car, I test drove one on offer. I also found the floor stick gearbox was like stirring porridge.

I passed on buying, I thought there were easier ways to commit suicide.

[GammaGlobulin]

10 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

The Hillman Imp was not a shining example of British engineering. Changing tyre pressures by a few psi front and back could convert the handling from mild understeer to raging oversteer, or vice-versa.

When I was looking for my second used car, I test drove one on offer. I also found the floor stick gearbox was like stirring porridge.

I passed on buying, I thought there were easier ways to commit suicide.

If it's perfection you seek, then, 

There is nothing more perfect than the ideal Sterling Engine, 

As you know. 

 

Those who can spell, call it the Stirling. 

 

 

Edited December 14, 2022 by GammaGlobulin

[kwilco]

the Imp was. classic example of how the British motor industry collapsed.

A really interesting design that was compromised engineering and then ruined by build quality.

The car had a long run, but like most UK cars too long a run and very little development.

The release was a cock up and the moving of production was a total shambles that resulted in the car being released before it was ready. 

The move to Scotland was political but the fact that it happened was down to Rootes management which like all auto industry management in the UK at the time was dominated by a blinkered class system attitude that lead to confrontation rather than cooperation and pride in product.

[ozimoron]

Somehow, I never pictured the Hillman Imp as a chick magnet. Something has obviously been missing from my life.

 

I learned to drive in an MGB. I rather thought that was more of a chick magnet.

 

My first car was a mini. That definitely wasn't a chick magnet. Or I wasn't or something, I never did figure it out. Another thing I couldn't figure out is why the mini stopped every time it rained when it came from a country where it rained so much.

Edited December 15, 2022 by ozimoron

[Denim]

Owned an Imp and 2 Sunbeam Stilleto coupe versions which had much better trim. The clutch and gear shifting was heavy on all of them. To improve handling I had a sack of sand in the front compartment. Not a great British car but I liked the look of the coupe.

My then Filipina nurse girlfriend who I was teaching to drive once drove the Imp 5 miles to work in 2nd gear because she couldn't work the heavy clutch.

[kwilco]

7 hours ago, Denim said:

Owned an Imp and 2 Sunbeam Stilleto coupe versions which had much better trim. The clutch and gear shifting was heavy on all of them. To improve handling I had a sack of sand in the front compartment. Not a great British car but I liked the look of the coupe.

My then Filipina nurse girlfriend who I was teaching to drive once drove the Imp 5 miles to work in 2nd gear because she couldn't work the heavy clutch.

Sounds like you had the clutches set up badly. The Imp used a diaphragm spring cutch and the Laycock original was actually the best but save cylinder problems etc may have spoiled it for you.

Imp range could handle really well if the suspension was maintained. The VW habit of putting weight in the front was unnecessary and could actually impair the handling.

 

[xylophone]

9 hours ago, Denim said:

To improve handling I had a sack of sand in the front compartment.

Ah, so it wasn't my driving!! I borrowed a friends Imp in order to get to a football match, and was running late, so really put my foot down, but a high wind and some bumps in the road occasionally lifted the front of the car off the road, so the steering wheel had no effect whatsoever, and it was a bloody frightening experience.

 

I mentioned it to my friend and he had experienced the same thing, so he put a concrete block in the front compartment (boot) and there it stayed!!

[Stocky]

As a child the first car I can remember was a green Triumph Herald, much like the one in the photo below. After that we had a Ford Cortina Mark 1, also green, my father's favourite colour.

 

[kwilco]

4 hours ago, xylophone said:

Ah, so it wasn't my driving!! I borrowed a friends Imp in order to get to a football match, and was running late, so really put my foot down, but a high wind and some bumps in the road occasionally lifted the front of the car off the road, so the steering wheel had no effect whatsoever, and it was a bloody frightening experience.

 

I mentioned it to my friend and he had experienced the same thing, so he put a concrete block in the front compartment (boot) and there it stayed!!

not needed! It was your driving.

[xylophone]

17 minutes ago, kwilco said:

not needed! It was your driving.

Never had a problem driving all manner of cars for 58 years and in several countries..........and anyway the owner (not me) of the car put the concrete block in the front because he had experienced the same thing, and it was often mentioned..............

The Hillman Imp, much loved and now over 50 years old

https://www.adrianflux.co.uk › cult-classics › hillman-i...

 

The Hillman Imp - the small economy car made by the Rootes Group, ... was if you went above 80 mph the front would lift up and the steering went very loose.

[kwilco]

1 hour ago, xylophone said:

2 hours ago, kwilco said:

not needed! It was your driving.

Never had a problem driving all manner of cars for 58 years and in several countries...

never REALISEd you had a problem.

 

lots of people did that because they did it in VWs - wasn't needed

Edited December 16, 2022 by kwilco

[Liverpool Lou]

On 12/14/2022 at 2:35 AM, HauptmannUK said:

The weight distribution of the car front to back was pretty good and this made for good handling

Hahahahaaa!

[Liverpool Lou]

On 12/16/2022 at 12:15 AM, ozimoron said:

Somehow, I never pictured the Hillman Imp as a chick magnet.

He's talking about young hens, surely, when he says that?!    

[ozimoron]

In the 70's I had an Austin Healey Sprite 2A. We used to race Datsun 2000, Alfa Romeo Spiders and Triump Tr4's in the hills in Sydney's north shore on Sundays. I caned the lot of them.

[ozimoron]

3 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

He's talking about young hens, surely, when he says that?!    

Probably they used to nest in it because they were always off the road ????

[kidneyw]

Passed my driving test in a Hillman Imp.

[kwilco]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Hahahahaaa!

The Imps did handle well - the running gear was specified by Mike Parkes who apart from being an F1 driver was also an engineer for Ferrari. He is the reason the car had a Coventry Climax alloy engine and not the 3 cylinder one originally envisaged. The mechanicals of this vehicle were streets ahead of the mini ... it's a pity the production was so bdad

 

 

[Liverpool Lou]

16 minutes ago, kwilco said:

The Imps did handle well

Not until Rootes were forced to revise the crapppy original suspension.

[kwilco]

13 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Not until Rootes were forced to revise the crapppy original suspension.

Not really – the handing was good from the start – the mods were an improvement on something that was already good.

Remember the Imp had coil springs and rear trailing arms – something almost unheard of in those days. The front was designed to counteract the effects of a rea engine car – it was copied from the Chevy Corvair (they learned from Chevy's mistakes) and a radical improvement on the old VW.

Edited December 17, 2022 by kwilco

[HauptmannUK]

10 hours ago, kwilco said:

Not really – the handing was good from the start – the mods were an improvement on something that was already good.

Remember the Imp had coil springs and rear trailing arms – something almost unheard of in those days. The front was designed to counteract the effects of a rea engine car – it was copied from the Chevy Corvair (they learned from Chevy's mistakes) and a radical improvement on the old VW.

Correct.  I worked on and drove plenty of Imps. Correctly set up and maintained they were a great little car and handled very well by the standards of the time. Most that we saw suffered from poor maintenance because they were a small cheap car bought by people on a tight budget who adopted an 'if it ain't don't fix it' approach.  The front swivels needed regular  lubrication (this usually got overlooked). The clutch was just fine and a sloppy gearshift could be tightened up with new bushes.

Rust protection was almost non-existent (as with many other cars of the time) and they rotted badly around the rear wings. The bodyshell was pretty rigid though and stood up well to motorsport use.

In the early 1970's an ex-Lotus engineer designed a GRP kit-car based on the Imp - the Clan Crusader. Clan were initially based around Newcastle IIRC but later moved to Northern Ireland.  In the mid-1970's my father and I built up an 'new old stock' Crusader kit for a customer.  Fitted with the 875cc Imp Sport engine it flew along and would easily do 100mph. The handling was excellent and almost impossible to get the rear to break loose.  I believe some of these were used in motorsport.   The one we built got wrecked a couple of years later when a bin lorry reversed into it one morning. 

Edited December 17, 2022 by HauptmannUK

[kwilco]

14 minutes ago, HauptmannUK said:

Correct.  I worked on and drove plenty of Imps. Correctly set up and maintained they were a great little car and handled very well by the standards of the time. Most that we saw suffered from poor maintenance because they were a small cheap car bought by people on a tight budget who adopted an 'if it ain't don't fix it' approach.  The front swivels needed regular  lubrication (this usually got overlooked). The clutch was just fine and a sloppy gearshift could be tightened up with new bushes.

Rust protection was almost non-existent (as with many other cars of the time) and they rotted badly around the rear wings. The bodyshell was pretty rigid though and stood up well to motorsport use.

In the early 1970's an ex-Lotus engineer designed a GRP kit-car based on the Imp - the Clan Crusader. Clan were initially based around Newcastle IIRC but later moved to Northern Ireland.  In the mid-1970's my father and I built up an 'new old stock' Crusader kit for a customer.  Fitted with the 875cc Imp Sport engine it flew along and would easily do 100mph. The handling was excellent and almost impossible to get the rear to break loose.  I believe some of these were used in motorsport.   The one we built got wrecked a couple of years later when a bin lorry reversed into it one morning. 

The IMP engine was fantastic - it was originally used in Fire pumps!  All alloy, developed by Walter Hassan of Jag V12 fame and also used by Lotus in one form or another.

TH dam thing was OHC!!! - Compare that to the engines put in the Minis.....mind you Issigonis didn't want them!...not even in the Morris Minor

[GammaGlobulin]

This Topic, despite being moved to the Motor Forum, has turned out much better than I would have imagined.

 

 

Edited December 19, 2022 by GammaGlobulin

[stratocaster]

Fun facts. The aluminum castings for the engine were done in Linwood. The bare castings were sent to Coventry to be assembled into complete engines which were shipped back to Linwood. When the factory opened the paint shop was not completed, so unpainted body shells were sent to Coventry by rail in open wagons to be painted, then sent back to Linwood. No wonder early shells were rot boxes. Development consisted of driving the cars 1000's of miles non stop but nobody thought to test the cars in the city environment hence the heavy clutch and throttle problems went unnoticed.

[kwilco]

  

 

Another fun fact - when parts were delivered by road from Coventry to Linwood, the distance was too far/long for HGVs on tachos, so they all had to stop on the way for compulsory sleep break before continuing on their way.

 

The Linwood plant was a political animal and the work force were not trained sufficiently to work in the motor industry - no v=background at all and the management couldn't train them.

The Rootes family really didn't understand what they were getting into with the Linwood plant but it looked like they were getting a good deal off the government. When this finally collapsed and Chrysler took over, it was inevitable that things would get even worse. US car companies could never manage European work forces - GM, and Ford realised early onto give them as much autonomy as possible, Chrysler thought differently and to their cost.

 

The Imp was just one of the symptoms of the demise of the UK motor industry – a potentially good product totally  ruined by poor management, lack of vision and no product development.

 

In the 1960s and 1970s the UK motor industry entered a downward spiral from which they couldn’t recover.

Contrary to popular myth, this wasn’t a deliberate sabotage by the unions, it was dreadful management and appalling product development that left the UK industry training behind the rest and unable even to identify Japan as a competitor, let alone actually compete.