British tourists to Thailand: Are you really covered? Travel insurance warning for medical emergencies

[stratocaster]

Was reading a UK forum and the topic accident insurance in Thailand caught my eye. Someone posted the fine print on their policy. "Policy covers treatment in state run hospitals only. No private treatment covered." "Aerial transport only covered on journeys to and from government registered airports." I assume that means hot air ballooning and skydiving is not covered. Maybe the insurance company could stretch that to bungee jumping and zip lining.

[CartagenaWarlock]

3 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

You can't fix stupid sadly but the comparison sites make it easy to choose

Any link for such comparison sites please. 

[SiSePuede419]

I think everyone coming here should be required to have health insurance with a $1000USD deductible.

 

If you can't afford to pay the first $1000USD after a medical emergency, then you should probably just stay home on your council estate and watch some telly instead of coming here pretending you're rich. ????

 

[gunner1]

4 hours ago, still kicking said:

I am not British but I have top class insurance so were does that leaves me 

Insured! and hopefulle fully insured!

 

[Foexie]

They just start a crowd funding as usual.

[Foghorn]

Don’t trust insurance companies they lie and deceive you , that’s the moral of the story . If you don’t ride a motorbike at home don’t ride one here , Thais don’t think about safety it’s only a word here

[Foghorn]

Insurance companies are a bit similar to Thailand as in “give us your money then <deleted> off”

[SS1]

56 minutes ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

Insurers have every right to impose limitations on what they will cover and I don't think it should surprise anyone that hazardous activities like bungee jumping or motorcycling without a helmet would be excluded. Insurers are well aware of the frequency and severity of injuries involving these pursuits, certainly more so than most of those who would undertake them.

 

The main problem is if the insurance company doesn't clearly define the hazardous activities that are not covered and use vague wording in their policy. This essentially gives them the power to reject much any claim if they deem your sports activity / transport hazardous. 

 

With Luma Health I use for global IDP insurance, they actually gave a very clear definition including a list of the sports and circumstances that are not covered. 

[bkk6060]

Buy a quality coverage from a reputable company. 

 

Sorry, the " wear a helmet" may protect from insurance not paying.  But, it certainly will not protect your injury or life.  The lids these people are using from rented bike shops are make of Styrofoam. Might as well fold a piece of paper over your head. Worthless POS.

[actonion]

4 hours ago, harleyclarkey said:

What we see here is mostly scooter/motorcycle accidents. A recent go fund me for £200,000 - really??? ????

Stupid to rent a bike anywhere in the world without at least a helmet. 

Stupid of any country to allow bikes to be rented without providing a helmet.

Stupid of any police force not to fine idiots with no helmet. 

Most bike rental places  do provide helmets,  the cheapest form of helmet,  made of  egg box looking material, that  covers them legally,  but doubt it would save any life..

 

[kingstonkid]

3 hours ago, hotchilli said:

Best not come to Thailand then, considering the likelihood of an accident and the inflated hospital charges.

There is o likelihood of the accident if you are safe and take care of yourself.  How many people here would go out on a wood balcony in this country at a hotel?

how many would drive on a scooter late a night with no helmet?

How many of us go for walks at night in places like =Khao Toa

 

As to hospital prices, they are cheaper than in any other Western country the difference is for Brits and Canucks at least they expect their government health care to cover it.

 

If you look at the inflated costs, it is not so much the health care as the repatriation that raises the cost, and I am sure that most of the people involved are not shopping and looking for a deal from Thai to UK but talking to UK companies.

 

Bottom line is 

 

Have a set of questions ready before you get the insurance.

When they answer, you have them, show you where it says what you want it to say

Ask about exclusions

a. read the whole document.

Don't do stupid things If it is illegal to drive a bike without a helmet in the UK what makes you think they will cover you if you do it in Thailand.

If you are sick do not go to HHISO hospitals go to mid-range.

Learning to drive a scooter by renting one here is a stupid idea.

 

 

[worrab]

I think I have related this story before but here goes. Back in 2014 I came here on a holiday and met up with my girlfriend, now wife, and flew up to Chiang Mai from Bangkok. Whilst there I fell seriously ill and popped into the local hospital. Long story short, transferred to Larna Hospital where I went under the knife for possible appendicitis. Surgeon removed healthy appendix and therefore suspected diverticulitis. It was so long op to remove part of the colon and after a few days left to continue the holiday.

No, back in on blues and twos 2 nights later and another major op as I had a sepsis leak. Came out of the op with a colostomy bag!! This was a temporary fix for 9 months to allow my colon to heal naturally. Anyway had to cancel flights due to time in hospital and had to rebook to Bangkok then myself back to UK.

The total bill came to just over £ 7000 which included new flights for the two of us and bank charges as I was paying upfront off my UK debit card. Thai hospitals are fantastic for itemised bills so sent everything off to the insurance company. This company was linked to my Lloyds Bank card which I had originally used to book the holiday therefore automatic cover. Paid out within 2 weeks!!

[sidneybear]

4 hours ago, harleyclarkey said:

Start your insurance journey with;

The purpose of any insurance company is to decline your claim and maximise their profits. 

You have a chance to succeed if you really persist. I did....twice. 

 

Stupid, stupid declines over obviously genuine claims. I made a formal complaint to the UK Head Office and lo and behold....an immediate settlement,  an apology plus €200 extra.

Spot on. Insurance companies are profit making businesses, so they have a knee jerk reaction to try to wriggle out of paying, hoping that claimants will give up. Good for you in insisting and getting a payout. 

[jmccarty]

Buyer beware, purchasing travel insurance, any cheap insurance policy as an individual, will most often not pay out per the way it is advertised.  Last trip I did from Bkk to the US had a late arrival in Dubai which resulted in missed connections and very late arrival and no reimbursement, not just an inconvenience as I was travelling to meet my father before his death and he could not wait for the delays.  Waste of money on that so-called travel insurance.   

[shackleton]

Must be getting serious if newspapers Thai visa putting out news on having proper insurance cover????

Probably  quite a few Brit tourists won't read this ???? 

So there will still be people with not the right  insurance or proper cover coming to Thailand 

Time will tell let's see how many more GoFundMe  appear in the future ????

 

[Henryford]

In the past i had to ask my insurance company several times if bikes over 125cc were covered. Eventually they confirmed they were not. Many people probably think their Aerox and PCX 150s are covered, until they try to claim.

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

33 minutes ago, SS1 said:

The main problem is if the insurance company doesn't clearly define the hazardous activities that are not covered and use vague wording in their policy. This essentially gives them the power to reject much any claim if they deem your sports activity / transport hazardous. 

 

With Luma Health I use for global IDP insurance, they actually gave a very clear definition including a list of the sports and circumstances that are not covered. 

This is certainly an area where the policyholder may wish to make sure they understand their policy.

 

A policy may exclude hazardous activities and then provide a list. It is important to understand whether this list is exhaustive or only examples of the most common hazardous activities a policyholder is likely to undertake, with all other "hazardous activities", even if not listed, also excluded. If this is the case, then the policyholder may wish to seek clarification in advance if he/she is intending to engage in something that carries additional risk but is not listed.

 

 

[The Fugitive]

1 hour ago, stratocaster said:

Was reading a UK forum and the topic accident insurance in Thailand caught my eye. Someone posted the fine print on their policy. "Policy covers treatment in state run hospitals only. No private treatment covered." "Aerial transport only covered on journeys to and from government registered airports." I assume that means hot air ballooning and skydiving is not covered. Maybe the insurance company could stretch that to bungee jumping and zip lining.

Great wording! Made me think of the extreme rides at amusement pleasure parks (not that I've been on one or ever wished to). As I remember 'Revolution' was very popular at Blackpool UK in the 1980's because you were turned completely upside down. Over the decades some people must have suffered after effects? Could insurance companies categorise such rides as engaging in hazardous activities?     

[chang1]

3 hours ago, WHansen said:

Insurance companies globally (not just British) are thieves and deliberately hide what's not covered, wether it be home, vehicle, business, health or travel insurance.

 

Yes, everybody should read and understand the policy they are purchasing but it can be a minefield if you are not fairly well educated or too young to understand that insurance is legalised robbery.

The insurers will do everything in their power to avoid paying out.

 

You are talking <deleted>. There will be some rougecompanies who will give you little cover but they are a minority.

I have been hospitalised twice in Thailand and both times the insurance companies were fantastic.

The first was for a broken leg which the Thai hospital gave me a hip replacement (totally unnecessary, I was offered to be transferred to a private hospital in Bangkok but chose to stay in a government hospital) and I was covered by the cheapest backpacker insurance I could find (£50 for 3 months). Flown back business class even after I said I don't mind flying back on my economy return ticket.

The second was when I broke the same leg when my bus ended up upside down and the roof collapsed. I was covered by the travel insurance provided by my bank account. This time I chose to be  transferred to a (top) Bangkok hospital for treatment. Me and my (now) wife were both flown back business class, she was my non medical assistant.

There was never a hint of trying not to pay in either case and both companies were courteous and helpful.

What is covered and not covered is easy to see if you are prepared to read the policy. I always check the medical section and ensure I am covered for motorbikes.

For me the bigger problem is in Thailand where businesses don't cover you. The bus company only gave me £300 compensation and I was unable to work for over a year. Classing elephant trekking as dangerous is bad and I have not seen that in any policy but the Thai company should have you covered for that as they have the duty of care.

If someone goes for longer than they are covered for it is hardly surprising if they are not covered.

 

[spidermike007]

4 hours ago, SunnyinBangrak said:

Some 35 years ago with nothing to read on a Thai island I pulled out the travel insurance package from my backpack and had a read. Turned out any accident involving anything with an engine was not covered. $1,000 down the drain and never bought travel insurance again - apart from when forced during the pandemic. 

I don't like insurance companies either. And one has to bear in mind they operate like a mafia. It is the M.O. of most insurance companies to turn down as many claims as they can, find any excuse not to pay, and put alot of exclusions in the policy. All the more reason to go with a top rated company, and read the fine print. 

[Liverpool Lou]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

The Association of British Insurers pointed out that 17% of all overseas claims are rejected

Thank you ABI for confirming, once again, that the huge majority of claims (83%) are successfully paid out by insurers.

[Andrew65]

At a guess, things that they could refuse to payout on related to motorbike accidents:

No helmet.
Intoxicated (had been drinking or high) at the time of the accident (according to a medic).
Riding a motorcycle for which you're not licenced (Riding a 750cc or 1,000cc bike when your licence only covers you up to 125cc).

In my many years in Thailand I almost always managed to avoid riding on motorbikes anyway, too risky.

Edited April 10, 2023 by Andrew65

[Liverpool Lou]

5 hours ago, still kicking said:

I am not British but I have top class insurance so were does that leaves me 

It leaves you bragging, for some reason.

[Liverpool Lou]

4 hours ago, ukrules said:

Indeed, the Foreign Office should put out a warning stating this.

 

It does...

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/thailand/safety-and-security

[Liverpool Lou]

4 hours ago, SunnyinBangrak said:

Some 35 years ago with nothing to read on a Thai island I pulled out the travel insurance package from my backpack and had a read. Turned out any accident involving anything with an engine was not covered. $1,000 down the drain and never bought travel insurance again

Just reading the policy coverage would have saved you wasting your money, no one to blame but you.

[Liverpool Lou]

4 hours ago, SunnyinBangrak said:

Some 35 years ago with nothing to read on a Thai island I pulled out the travel insurance package from my backpack and had a read. Turned out any accident involving anything with an engine was not covered. $1,000 down the drain and never bought travel insurance again

Just reading the policy coverage would have saved you wasting your money, no one to blame but you.

[Liverpool Lou]

4 hours ago, WHansen said:

Insurance companies globally (not just British) are thieves and deliberately hide what's not covered, wether it be home, vehicle, business, health or travel insurance.

100% nonsense.

[Liverpool Lou]

4 hours ago, WHansen said:

The insurers will do everything in their power to avoid paying out.

Is that why approximately 90% of all insurance claims are paid out?

 

There is no reason for insurers to pay out for claims that aren't covered by the policy and that does not make them thieves.

Edited April 10, 2023 by Liverpool Lou

[chang1]

4 hours ago, SunnyinBangrak said:

Some 35 years ago with nothing to read on a Thai island I pulled out the travel insurance package from my backpack and had a read. Turned out any accident involving anything with an engine was not covered. $1,000 down the drain and never bought travel insurance again - apart from when forced during the pandemic. 

My previous post shows why being covered for medical problemsis essential. I like to also be covered for flights but these and baggage losses etc are all manageable, medical bills can easily be unmanageable - best part of £30000 in my case. Try finding that while in hospital in a foreign country.

Not having any medical insurance is reckless.

[richard_smith237]

4 hours ago, Andycoops said:

Unfortunately is all down to a lack of research and education on the part of tourists who just sign up, probably online, for the cheapest cover and then break the law 

by not wearing a crash helmet and engage in dangerous activities.

It comes down to age as well....  when I was young I was under the impression that the travel insurance provided by my ‘credit card’ sufficient cover... why wouldn’t I ????.... when I took the card that was one of the main points of the advertising (full travel insurance) so when I received the card I thought I was covered whenever I travelled (turns out I needed to book the travel through the ‘cards travel provider, or some such similar technicality’). 

 

I’m sure many others have fallen into that trap / been mistaken and look back and realise they were lucky. 

 

 

The No Helmets / Riding while drunk / without a licence etc are also issues - I know this is common sense, but Insurance companies could be a lot clearer with their exclusions, particularly in key areas of cover. 

(i.e. on front page - NOT COVERED IF RIDING WITHOUT A LICENCE, WITHOUT A HELMET OR WHILE INTOXICATED)

 

 

Regarding the main article: 

6 hours ago, webfact said:

**Two were participating in hazardous sports such as elephant trekking

Since when was this considered a ‘hazardous sport’ ??....   I’ve done this, my family have all done this - IF such activities are considered dangerous insurance policies need to **list them, not hide behind vague wording ‘DANGEROUS ACTIVITIES’ because what I considered dangerous may be different and if an insurance company is not specific on this, their wording simply gives them wiggle room when the underwriter decides the claim is too high and ’rafting down a river’ or ‘falling off an elephant’ (or horse etc) was a ‘DANGEROUS ACTIVITY’....

 

 

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Two were relying on British driving licences, which are not lawful in Thailand.

This is untrue - Driving in Thailand on a UK licence is legal, there is also misconception that an IDP is needed (it not for a Licence issued in English from a country which is signatory to 1968 Vienna convention on road traffic).

(*Note: if the driver is a resident (i.e. on a Non-Immigrant Visa) they need to have a Thai Licence).

 

I don't care to get into the nth debate about these facts and the various interpretations surrounding the vagueness of the Thai Land Traffic Act etc (That said: I would advise any tourist to also get an IDP and any resident to get a Thai licence to avoid such debates with ether the police or an insurance company etc).

 

----------

 

**Regarding Elephant tracking being considered a dangerous sport. 

No insurance policy I have ever read mentions this. 

A while back it took me two months to obtain clarification from an insurance company regarding their wording ‘dangerous activities’...    their response was repeatedly vague and ambiguous... 

At one point the response was something along the lines of “cover (for skiing) will be decided upon based on the extent of the injuries in the event of an accident”, when pushed on this they responded that they’d decided IF in the event of injury they’d interpret if we were skiing dangerously based on the extent of injury... Which, IMO was utterly ridiculous. 

Eventually after a lot of back and forth and pushing them into corners I received a list and of specifics regarding cover. 

- Skiing (any country On Piste and / or Off-piste with a guide) - [full cover]

- Bicycling (in Thailand, on roads) - [full cover]

- Mountain biking  (on and off road) - [full cover]

- Wakeboarding / water skiing  (in Thailand) - [full cover]

- Motorcycling (in Thailand, on roads) - [full cover when licensed]

- Motorcycle Taxi  (in Thailand) - [full cover / no mention of helmet or not]

- Taxi  (in Thailand) - [full cover / no mention of seatbelt wearing or not]

- Diving - [full cover - when recreational diving IF certified (PADI) or with an instructor]

- Competitive Sports - [when not professional - fully covered]

 

Things I didn’t think of... 

- Rafting / Elephant riding / Bungee jumping / SkyDiving / *crossing the road !!!... 

 

(*potetnially one of the most dangerous activities in Thailand !)

 

The Point with my List is that it took two months to push the insurance company to be specific - their initial ambiguity provided them with sufficient wiggle room to avoid a claim, I accused them of such. 

At that point I was a few months away from needing renewal cover and wanted to ‘win’ and push them to give specific responses just to see how far they would go to avoid specifics and potentially avoid responsibility.

IMO, they’re [insurance companies] are all as bad as each other and look for the smallest of reasons not to pay out. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 10, 2023 by richard_smith237