Two young girls rescued from an illegal karaoke bar in Bangkok

[fredwiggy]

38 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I agree that no one has to sell their body here to survive. But many do it because they want a better life.

It's their choice, even if you don't like it.

With your background I wouldn't be surprised if there is a lot of Christian background with you about things which good girls do and not do and what society accepts or not. In that way Thailand is very different. Lots of women which made lots of money in the bar business and who maybe married a rich farang are well accepted in those rice villages. Lots of girls want that they will grow up and be like that. And parents want that their daughters grow up like that.

You probably don't like it and don't understand it. But that is reality in Thailand.

Being a Christian doesn't mean being a prude. I've had many girlfriends and was with a couple of prostitutes in my early twenties, before I realized I could catch something from them that could kill me, as aids was coming into the media back then. Saying lots of women who are bar girls are accepted isn't true. Thailand isn't a country without gossip, and even the best of friends talk about each other here, as in other places. Nobody looks up to a prostitute. In reality, a lot of so called friends here are backstabbers, and if not jealous of others, hateful towards them. I was fully aware of what goes on here more than 20 years before I moved here. There are countless Thai's in America, and I talked to many of them before I came here. A parent who wants their daughters, or sons, to be prostitutes isn't a parent but a poor excuse for a human being. A greedy lowlife that only looks at what they can get from their kids belittling themselves with strangers. Seeing one bar girl marry a rich farang makes jealousy, and you know what comes from that. I don't like to see women, or boys, taken advantage of, even if they seem to be going along with it because of instability in their thinking. Selling your body doesn't give you a better life. It only buys you things. Things that wear out, break or you get bored with. A bar girl doesn't look at their husband as a partner. Just a better transaction they made, for the time being.

[Mickeymaus]

46 minutes ago, Purdey said:

You can see the overview of data protection laws in the link below. Personal info includes your photo (not talking about personal photos). It is especially notable that children under the age of 20 must receive parental consent before using their personal information.

Publishing a clear photo without consent where the subject appears involved in a criminal offence is risky for the media as they could get sued for defamation. Which is why they usually blur the faces of alleged prostitutes. The photo Thai PBS showed has nothing to suggest it was published with permission. 

 

https://www.dataguidance.com/notes/thailand-data-protection-overview

Very complicated. So if I take a picture in the Walking Street and put it online I have to ask all persons under the age of 20 for the permission or blur their faces - is this correct? I don't talk now about very young people where you even need the permission of the parents. 

[Skeptic7]

Boggles the mind how easily "uncomfortable and outraged" some posters/posers claim to be. Obviously weren't here 2-3 decades ago❗They'da blown gaskets and suffered conniptions early 90s thru early 2000s, when in many bars of Nana & Cowboy the old ladies were early-mid 20s. ????

[Yellowtail]

Fortunately there are no prostitutes in Texas. 

 

People generally weigh their options and make a choice. 

 

The girls that are smart and don't get mixed up with dope and whatnot can often work a few years and get a little business going. Countless little shops/kiosks/salons all over the country owned by ex prostitutes. 

 

The difference between prostitution and dancers in the US VS Thailand, is that 95% of those in the US are drug addicts. That is not the case here, 

[OneMoreFarang]

22 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

A bar girl doesn't look at their husband as a partner. Just a better transaction they made, for the time being.

It seems you made up your mind about lots of people or groups of people.

There is no such thing as the groups of bar girls. They are not all the same.

Some women, bar girls or not, marry rich guys because they want to live with lots of money. Some like it, some not so much.

Other women, including bar girls, stay with guys or marry guys who they are comfortable with or maybe they love them. 

It's not all the same.

[jak2002003]

1 hour ago, proton said:

Under Thai law they are minors until 18, illegally employed and at risk. 

Under thai law prostitution at any age is illegal.  What can you do? 

[Skeptic7]

3 hours ago, BritManToo said:

X is right about the work, not much to be had and an extra 3 years of high school + 4 years at university (that all involves significant fees and living expenses at least 300kbht+) might get her a job earning 20kbht/month if she's really bright.

Or in Pattaya she can earn 20-60kbht a month ............

Spot on❗Tho not only Patts...Bangers, Phuket et al. I knew girls making B20-50k in the 90s. B20-60k is low end today...and some make that online! B60-80k+ for hustlers & hotties. There is also no shortage of saps, suckers and sponsors nowadays too. It all adds up. 

????

Edited June 29, 2023 by Skeptic7

[proton]

25 minutes ago, jak2002003 said:

Under thai law prostitution at any age is illegal.  What can you do? 

Keep away from it!

[brewsterbudgen]

35 minutes ago, jak2002003 said:

Under thai law prostitution at any age is illegal.  What can you do? 

No it isn't.  Aspects of prostitution, like being underage, soliciting and running a brothel are illegal (so, most of what this thread is about), but prostitution per se is not illegal and is steeped in Thai traditions.

[BritManToo]

51 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

It seems you made up your mind about lots of people or groups of people.

 

But what really amuses me is a guy that has God looking out for him personally, suffers 3 disastrous marriages (women's fault not his), never pays for sex .... but is an expert on both marriage and prostitution ............ beggars belief really.

Edited June 29, 2023 by BritManToo

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, fredwiggy said:

A bar girl doesn't look at their husband as a partner. Just a better transaction they made, for the time being.

Looking on any woman as your 'partner' seems to me like an easy way to lose all your money.

But that may just be my twisted mind.

 

Nearly all sex is transactional .......... Briffault's Law.

 

But tell me, after 3 disastrous fails, are you still looking for age appropriate love with no financial gain to her .......... or have you given up? Please feel free to include God's thoughts in your answer.

Edited June 29, 2023 by BritManToo

[Grumpy one]

14 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

Guess you've never been there, or used a computer to see that the US is the most advanced country on earth. But prejudice and ignorance betrays such information.

Has the learning level increased since 1969?

I ask this as in that year in Sydney, Australia I was asked by some Vietnam R @ R troops where could they catch an Emu taxi

OK they were not the brightest candles in the box, but how dumb can you get?

[fredwiggy]

1 hour ago, Yellowtail said:

Fortunately there are no prostitutes in Texas. 

 

People generally weigh their options and make a choice. 

 

The girls that are smart and don't get mixed up with dope and whatnot can often work a few years and get a little business going. Countless little shops/kiosks/salons all over the country owned by ex prostitutes. 

 

The difference between prostitution and dancers in the US VS Thailand, is that 95% of those in the US are drug addicts. That is not the case here, 

Wondering where you get your data from. And actually, there are prostitutes in every country on earth. Texas isn't an exception, unless you were trying to make some kind of point. Being smart and still being a prostitute does happen, but intelligence and sense aren't the same. A person who's smart doesn't hire or become a prostitute. There are other ways to get sex besides buying it, and they are safer. Some here treated their wives badly, and then complained when the sex stopped. If a woman is treated with love and respect, and you end arguments with both satisfied, the sex always comes.  Granted, you do always pay for it, but in a relationship with a normal or semi normal woman, it isn't just about sex, but companionship, shared interests, family.

[fredwiggy]

55 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Looking on any woman as your 'partner' seems to me like an easy way to lose all your money.

But that may just be my twisted mind.

 

Nearly all sex is transactional .......... Briffault's Law.

 

But tell me, after 3 disastrous fails, are you still looking for age appropriate love with no financial gain to her .......... or have you given up? Please feel free to include God's thoughts in your answer.

Sex in a relationship, where you treat the woman as a partner and not something that has to give you some, isn't a transaction. In a relationship, if you want it to last, both have to support the other. i didn't have that. Coming from a background of abuse and or neglect, they didn't know their role in a relationship, so only used or turned to silence or anger when conflict arose. I studied relationships, reading many books and articles for the last 30 years, to try and understand the other side. I became a better listener, father and husband, which helped a little, but when the other side reverts to the child in them when inevitable conflict arrives, you don't stand a chance at making things work. It always takes two. The second marriage didn't involve mutual children, but she was addicted to pain killers, and that messed with her mind, and our marriage. She died last year from a heart attack, obviously from the strain of many years on prescribed drugs. The first was a lunatic, and kidnapped my kids and took them to another state until I got them back and had them until they hit 19 and left the house. Her mom did this when she was a child also.  I have a nice girlfriend now, who I help out When I need a little cash, she helps me. She cooks most of the time, great Thai, and she comes from a background of abuse and indifference. Husband didn't do anything much, including work, hit her, drank a lot, and didn't help out financially after she went back home with the kids. Then he passed away. She tells me everything, and trusts me because I've always treated her as number one. Arguments come, and I try to stifle them with a good ending. She never had this in her life, and it's alien to her, but she knows my intentions are good. When I move back home with my daughter, I would like her to come, but that's totally up to her. Thailand doesn't offer women over 40 much besides being used and taken for granted. She's younger than I am, but I'm in great shape besides my joints for my age, and no health problems. I understand my role here as a mate, and like everyone else, I'm okay with it.but she isn't near as greedy as others I've seen and heard about for may years before I came here. As far as God's thoughts, I'm always thinking you do what you think is right, hopefully being taught that by your parents, and try and learn as much as you can about things that are important to your life, and those that share your life.Briffaults Law is a theory, which sounds a little true, but in a mutual relationship, both make the decisions and are satisfied with the others desires. Both should get benefits from the relationship, if it's going to work. That doesn't mean money. If a woman is more interested in money, that's the one you stay away from. Leave her to the ones who want to buy her.

Edited June 29, 2023 by fredwiggy

[HuskerDo2]

Why aren't the parents being held accountable in these types of situations? In America, many black men refuse to be true fathers. They are there for the sex with the mothers but after the women give birth the guys are long gone. The parents need to be held accountable when their kids get into trouble like this. Jail sentences for them will change their attitudes.

[fredwiggy]

1 minute ago, HuskerDo2 said:

Why aren't the parents being held accountable in these types of situations? In America, many black men refuse to be true fathers. They are there for the sex with the mothers but after the women give birth the guys are long gone. The parents need to be held accountable when their kids get into trouble like this. Jail sentences for them will change their attitudes.

Exactly why there are so many fatherless children here. The court system doesn't make them accountable so they just go from one to another, making babies and not contributing. Generation after generation and you would think all the girls would understand. Some do, after their first child, and then look for farangs to maybe give them a more secure future. In America, if you don't pay for 18 years for the child you helped make, you go to jail, just like my ex girlfriend did. I had custody and she started missing payments. I didn't care, but in America, they have a child support division that goes after the ones that stop or refuse to pay. She got a month in jail, and never missed a payment again.

[HuskerDo2]

1 hour ago, Yellowtail said:

Fortunately there are no prostitutes in Texas. 

 

People generally weigh their options and make a choice. 

 

The girls that are smart and don't get mixed up with dope and whatnot can often work a few years and get a little business going. Countless little shops/kiosks/salons all over the country owned by ex prostitutes. 

 

The difference between prostitution and dancers in the US VS Thailand, is that 95% of those in the US are drug addicts. That is not the case here, 

"is that 95% of those in the US are drug addicts".... that's just your opinion. There are no facts you can offer to back such a statement.

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, Grumpy one said:

Has the learning level increased since 1969?

I ask this as in that year in Sydney, Australia I was asked by some Vietnam R @ R troops where could they catch an Emu taxi

OK they were not the brightest candles in the box, but how dumb can you get?

That reminds at the time when I spoke with American soldiers with my broken English, and I told them I always forget the difference between much and many.

They looked at me and asked: Is there a difference?

I gave up after that. And yes, I consulted a dictionary, at that time on paper, and I found the answer. 

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, fredwiggy said:

Wondering where you get your data from. And actually, there are prostitutes in every country on earth. Texas isn't an exception, unless you were trying to make some kind of point. Being smart and still being a prostitute does happen, but intelligence and sense aren't the same. A person who's smart doesn't hire or become a prostitute. There are other ways to get sex besides buying it, and they are safer. Some here treated their wives badly, and then complained when the sex stopped. If a woman is treated with love and respect, and you end arguments with both satisfied, the sex always comes.  Granted, you do always pay for it, but in a relationship with a normal or semi normal woman, it isn't just about sex, but companionship, shared interests, family.

Option 1, you really don't know. Option 2, you pretend you don't know.

There is a difference between sex and love and relationships.

Some guys sometimes just want to f#^$, or get a BJ. Baby, let's do it. And after he comes that's it. Thanks, and maybe see you another time. No, you don't have to tell me your name.

[OneMoreFarang]

55 minutes ago, HuskerDo2 said:

Jail sentences for them will change their attitudes.

Really? Where does that wisdom come from?

[Confuscious]

What I don't understand, is the outrage of some members over this "Catching of underaged girls into prostitution".
Everytime something like this happens, it is only because of some NGO making an official complaint and forcing the Police to send a few man to look at this.
Otherwise, NOBODY of the Police would be bothered with this and as long as the bar/karaoke owners fill the brown enveloppes everything is fine.
The Police will even do an inspection with the full force trough Walking Street in Pattaya without finding a single prostitute.
There are tens/hundred thousend underaged girls in Thailand, working every day in the sex industry.
Many of them against their own will or forced by their parents out of poverty.
Why is the RTP not doing their job and protect these children?
They might satisfy the few members of this group that are outraged by this behavior in Thailand.

[fredwiggy]

18 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Really? Where does that wisdom come from?

Losing money is about the best teaching method known. If they aren't held accountable, they won't stop using girls for sex, or at least have the sense to use birth control. They don't care here, because the justice system doesn't care about the children like it should. If no consequences for their actions, they won't think about them beforehand.

[Purdey]

3 hours ago, Mickeymaus said:

Very complicated. So if I take a picture in the Walking Street and put it online I have to ask all persons under the age of 20 for the permission or blur their faces - is this correct? I don't talk now about very young people where you even need the permission of the parents. 

Any child must be protected by not revealing their identity. Section 4 of the Child Protection Act

 defines “Child” means a person whose age is less than 18 years but does not include those who attain majority through marriage." 

 

Section 50 of the Act says, " No person shall advertise or disseminate by means of mass media or any other form of information technology the disclosed information in violation of the provisions under paragraph one or paragraph two."

 

We should not photograph children and put those photos in the media without disguising their identity or getting written permission from their parents. 

 

There are also defamation laws. One has to assume that using a photo with an article about prostitutes implies the photo is associating her with the story.

 

Your holiday photos may not be a problem, but if you are making money from photos I would be careful.

 

P.S. The Thailand personal data protection act (PDPA) does not specifically use the word photo but does say “Personal Data” means any information relating to a Person, which enables the identification of such Person, whether directly or indirectly, but not including the information of the deceased Persons in particular.

I take a photo to mean something that enables identification.

Edited June 29, 2023 by Purdey
added information

[brewsterbudgen]

1 hour ago, Confuscious said:

What I don't understand, is the outrage of some members over this "Catching of underaged girls into prostitution".
Everytime something like this happens, it is only because of some NGO making an official complaint and forcing the Police to send a few man to look at this.
Otherwise, NOBODY of the Police would be bothered with this and as long as the bar/karaoke owners fill the brown enveloppes everything is fine.
The Police will even do an inspection with the full force trough Walking Street in Pattaya without finding a single prostitute.
There are tens/hundred thousend underaged girls in Thailand, working every day in the sex industry.
Many of them against their own will or forced by their parents out of poverty.
Why is the RTP not doing their job and protect these children?
They might satisfy the few members of this group that are outraged by this behavior in Thailand.

Yes, unfortunately it's endemic throughout Thailand, although less so in the areas frequented by westerners, like Pattaya.  Just because many locals are indifferent to the issue and many of the authorities happy to accept their brown envelopes, doesn't mean that us members shouldn't be outraged when it's publicised.

[Yellowtail]

2 hours ago, HuskerDo2 said:

"is that 95% of those in the US are drug addicts".... that's just your opinion. There are no facts you can offer to back such a statement.

Sorry, 97%

 

Patterns and Epidemiology of Illicit Drug Use Among Sex Workers Globally: A Systematic Review - Sex Work, Health, and Human Rights - NCBI Bookshelf (nih.gov)

[giddyup]

21 hours ago, Olmate said:

 Why do you even know that? 

Research.

Edited June 29, 2023 by giddyup

[Yellowtail]

3 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

Wondering where you get your data from. And actually, there are prostitutes in every country on earth. Texas isn't an exception,,,

Texas is not a country.

3 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

,...unless you were trying to make some kind of point. Being smart and still being a prostitute does happen, but intelligence and sense aren't the same. A person who's smart doesn't hire or become a prostitute. There are other ways to get sex besides buying it, and they are safer. Some here treated their wives badly, and then complained when the sex stopped. If a woman is treated with love and respect, and you end arguments with both satisfied, the sex always comes.  Granted, you do always pay for it, but in a relationship with a normal or semi normal woman, it isn't just about sex, but companionship, shared interests, family.

You stated: "A person who's smart doesn't hire or become a prostitute."

 

Yet in the same post you state: "Being smart and still being a prostitute does happen..."

 

And in a earlier post you claimed you had hired prostitutes.  

 

[fredwiggy]

Just now, Yellowtail said:

Texas is not a country.

You stated: "A person who's smart doesn't hire or become a prostitute."

 

Yet in the same post you state: "Being smart and still being a prostitute does happen..."

 

And in a earlier post you claimed you had hired prostitutes.  

 

I lived in Texas 32 years, and I'm pretty sure, although some might argue the point, that Texas is a state. Intelligence comes in many forms, as you should know if you're over 18. Some are IQ, wisdom,common sense, intrapersonal, interpersonal, musical, spatial, linguistic, etc. Some women can have a high IQ, and still be ignorant of the ways of men. Some can be a genius in figures, and not know how to use a computer, and so on, if you understand my point. Everyone makes mistakes, just like I did when I hired a couple working girls, but you learn from your mistakes, or you just repeat them over and over. I didn't want a disease back then, so I stopped. Awhile after, I realized women were precious creatures, and men shouldn't take advantage of them. I went through relationships, always looking for a permanent one, but sometimes they are damaged goods, and don't know how to make a relationship work. But I, like others, wanted a woman around, so I continued looking. A woman can be hurt as a child by family members, and choose this lifestyle, not for a lack of intelligence, but because they live what they've seen or felt growing up, not understanding it was a bad decision for them to make until they went through it and looked back and felt shame or discomfort.

[Olmate]

28 minutes ago, giddyup said:

Research.

Then you and him are researching weird $hit!! 

[Hummin]

8 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

You do realize, with your habit of purchasing women, that your opinion is even less valid than most. Anti sex propaganda? Who is against sex? Not normal people. This isn't normal sex. It's a transaction, where it's mostly the man who has pleasure, and some that are involved get beaten or killed. Thailand's rate of STD'S isn't propaganda. Statistics come from hospitals and clinics, who report these incidences. People who are pro prostitution are those that need to buy a woman, or boy, for sex, those who make money in the act, and those who make money trafficking young girls and boys. Having not caught anything, that you know, because many are asymptomatic, means so far you've been lucky. A bar girl will never live a normal,married life, and if you think so, you're completely clueless. The problems with sleeping with many men, for money, are passed down into her future relationships, and I'm sure you've seen some of this with yours, even though you might not admit it. Kids from former prostitutes don't look at their own sexuality as normal, because mom did it skews their thinking about their own.

Waste of time, as much damaged audience as the girls, and think they actually helping girls by using and abusing them, especially directed against yung girls and boys who for one or other reasons ending up selling their body, nder legal age illegally.

 

most girls and boys do mot sell their body no matter life experiences or where they come from, but most pro child prostitutes often comes from broken homes and easily trafficked under the right circumstances, and some here try to make acceptance for that as normal

Edited June 29, 2023 by Hummin