Thai will for foreigner

[Tom H]

So final question is:

Do I have to deposit the will as it was asked in first posting by the lawyer or not?

[scorecard]

13 hours ago, Raybangkok said:

I was informed that the will should be in English and Thai. If there is any problem the English section is to be followed. This is the will form that has been recommended and my Lawer a family friend says it is suitable,

 

LAST WILL AND TESTAMENT OF.docx 21.46 kB · 17 downloads

From my understanding, by Thai law, the Thai language version will be followed.

 

Judges etc., in the Thai judicial system are not expected to be native speakers of English therefore they are not responsible to follow things written in english (and at the same time ignore there's a Thai language version). 

 

It's often mentioned .... 'in the event of any dispute the Thai language version of the contract / the gurantee etc., will prevail'.

 

Edited June 30, 2023 by scorecard

[Kwasaki]

2 hours ago, Tom H said:

So final question is:

Do I have to deposit the will as it was asked in first posting by the lawyer or not?

I would say it depends on your financial circumstances.

In my situation I only have money in a my name only account and have stated in my Will it her money to take.

[CMBob]

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

From my understanding, by Thai law, the Thai language version will be followed.

To be admitted to what we call Thai probate, the Will must be in Thai (or another language with a certified translation into Thai).  And, yes, the proceedings will be in Thai.

In my opinion, it's wise to have a Will made in both Thai and your native language [the first to be used to probate your estate here in Thailand and the second one if needed for your embassy/consulate (to release your body, for example....this just saves your executor the hassle of obtaining a certified translation) and/or to used in any needed probate in your home country (provided the Will meets the requirements of your home country].

[Kwasaki]

18 minutes ago, CMBob said:

To be admitted to what we call Thai probate, the Will must be in Thai (or another language with a certified translation into Thai).  And, yes, the proceedings will be in Thai.

In my opinion, it's wise to have a Will made in both Thai and your native language [the first to be used to probate your estate here in Thailand and the second one if needed for your embassy/consulate (to release your body, for example....this just saves your executor the hassle of obtaining a certified translation) and/or to used in any needed probate in your home country (provided the Will meets the requirements of your home country].

As said in the beginning I believe that an English persons Will is expected to be in English how it turns out to be translated into Thai is a Thai problem.

[JimGant]

29 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

As said in the beginning I believe that an English persons Will is expected to be in English how it turns out to be translated into Thai is a Thai problem.

Yes, if your Will is in English, because you prepared it yourself, then the Thai version is just a translation, needed for the court. As such, any conflict between the English and Thai wording interpretation defers to the original (English) version.

 

When you have a Thai law office prepare a Will, in both Thai and English, it's assumed the Will was prepared in Thai, then translated to English. As such, the Thai version holds precedence.

[Kwasaki]

3 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Yes, if your Will is in English, because you prepared it yourself, then the Thai version is just a translation, needed for the court. As such, any conflict between the English and Thai wording interpretation defers to the original (English) version.

 

When you have a Thai law office prepare a Will, in both Thai and English, it's assumed the Will was prepared in Thai, then translated to English. As such, the Thai version holds precedence.

Only if it ends up in a Thai Court.

A Norway guy died in our village his wife ended up with all his stuff no problem at all no court involved.

[Mike Teavee]

Am thinking maybe I should take a more "Grown Up" (None of us wants to think about our deaths) approach to what happens when I die...  So would appreciate any recommendations for a Thai Lawyer (Pattaya) who can help me put a Will together for my Thai Assets...

 

 

 

  

 

 

 

 

[Raybangkok]

14 hours ago, scorecard said:

From my understanding, by Thai law, the Thai language version will be followed.

 

Judges etc., in the Thai judicial system are not expected to be native speakers of English therefore they are not responsible to follow things written in english (and at the same time ignore there's a Thai language version). 

 

It's often mentioned .... 'in the event of any dispute the Thai language version of the contract / the gurantee etc., will prevail'.

 

Please read the actual will it is stated clearly that the English version will be followed. It also stops anybody changing it in the Thai version. 

 

It is made in both English and Thai language. In the case of any discrepancy between the English language and Thai language, the English language shall be used for interpretation.

In case of revocation of this Last Will and Testament, such revocation shall not be completed unless it is effected in all the duplicates.

[Tom H]

10 minutes ago, Raybangkok said:

Please read the actual will it is stated clearly that the English version will be followed. It also stops anybody changing it in the Thai version. 

 

It is made in both English and Thai language. In the case of any discrepancy between the English language and Thai language, the English language shall be used for interpretation.

In case of revocation of this Last Will and Testament, such revocation shall not be completed unless it is effected in all the duplicates.

Shall but not must:).

[Tom H]

Still open:

 

Question in first posting:

Last will must be deposit by a lawyer or not????

[Raybangkok]

16 minutes ago, Tom H said:

Shall but not must:).

Shall can be used as an order. Oxford English Dictionary. Ex:  

• Candidates shall remain in their seats until all the papers have been collected.

[Kwasaki]

3 hours ago, Tom H said:

Still open:

 

Question in first posting:

Last will must be deposit by a lawyer or not????

Fling me it's up to you.

 

E.G. If only money in bank and you want your wife and no-one else to have anything and you provide your wife with access to the account why need a lawyer.

 

If you own a condo a house, truck, cars, motorbikes I would say yes get help from a lawyer to do your Will.

 

Edited July 1, 2023 by Kwasaki

[soisanuk]

15 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

Am thinking maybe I should take a more "Grown Up" (None of us wants to think about our deaths) approach to what happens when I die...  So would appreciate any recommendations for a Thai Lawyer (Pattaya) who can help me put a Will together for my Thai Assets...

 

I used Triple888 Law in Pattaya. It is in both Thai & English.

 

They have also done wills for several friends. Two of those have since passed away and they handled the probate in the Pattaya court with no problems.   They also handled the probate for my Thai partner who had no will and passed away a year ago November.  The fee was 22,000 baht and took 2 months to complete.  They offer a discount on wills for Pattaya City Expat Club members - was 5,000 baht when they did mine, now that discount price is 6,000 baht. At the time I did my will, other lawyers were charging at least 10,000 baht for a will.   After my partner passed, I had my will changed to name a new executor and beneficiary - their fee for the updated will was 2,000 baht.      Their website URL --  https://thai888.com/

 

  The managing director is Australian - his Thai wife is the lawyer that does the legal work including handling probate.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 1, 2023 by soisanuk

[Tom H]

6 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Fling me it's up to you.

 

E.G. If only money in bank and you want your wife and no-one else to have anything and you provide your wife with access to the account why need a lawyer.

 

If you own a condo a house, truck, cars, motorbikes I would say yes get help from a lawyer to do your Will.

 

He wrote according to law:), not up to someone:).

 

“A lawyer this week told me this would not be acceptable in a thai court because it must be on the stationary of a lawyer to be accepted.”

Edited July 1, 2023 by Tom H

[scottiejohn]

53 minutes ago, Tom H said:

He wrote according to law:), not up to someone:).

 

“A lawyer this week told me this would not be acceptable in a thai court because it must be on the stationary of a lawyer to be accepted.”

That's probably just because he wants you to use his services!

Show me anything that states you MUST use a lawyer (in Thailand) to make a court acceptable will!

[Kwasaki]

1 hour ago, Tom H said:

He wrote according to law:), not up to someone:).

 

“A lawyer this week told me this would not be acceptable in a thai court because it must be on the stationary of a lawyer to be accepted.”

There ya go again "A lawyer told me" .

With respect if you don't understand what I'm trying to say when a falangie hits the bucket as I say get a lawyer then.

I don't need one.

 

Edited July 1, 2023 by Kwasaki

[Tom H]

No deposit of the will at the office of a lawyer because the law does not have such a restriction. 

 

 

[john donson]

On 6/29/2023 at 12:33 AM, Duke007 said:

 

 I have a Will, typed,signed and witnessed by 2 Thai friends. I have previously read that this format is one of several legally acceptable formats. A lawyer this week told me this would not be acceptable in a thai court because it must be on the stationary of a lawyer to be accepted. Can anyone clarify the legality of a personally typed will kept in my home?

my understand was that a will has to be hand written to be valid

in my home country at least...

[topt]

2 hours ago, john donson said:

my understand was that a will has to be hand written to be valid

in my home country at least...

Where is your home country?

Not a stipulation to be found in most western nations that I am aware of......... 

[topt]

On 7/1/2023 at 5:37 AM, Tom H said:

Still open:

 

Question in first posting:

Last will must be deposit by a lawyer or not????

Not. 

[topt]

if anybody is interested and has a few spare hours there is a lot of info (often conflicting.....) in here - 

You could always skip to the last half dozen or so pages which are probably more relevant

[topt]

On 6/30/2023 at 1:30 AM, Raybangkok said:

I was informed that the will should be in English and Thai. If there is any problem the English section is to be followed. This is the will form that has been recommended and my Lawer a family friend says it is suitable,

 

LAST WILL AND TESTAMENT OF.docx 21.46 kB · 22 downloads

I have one main issue with that document, which I have seen before, and that is the following  - 

Quote

This Last Will and Testament has been made in one original copy and is to be kept by the testator.

Duplicate copies will be given to the appropriate people.

and then after one small para it states - 

Quote

In case of revocation of this Last Will and Testament, such revocation shall not be completed unless it is effected in all the duplicates.

Which does not make sense to me. For a start you may not be able to lay your hands on all the "duplicates".......

If you revoke a will normally you state in the new will that you revoke any prior wills unless you are adding a codicil.......

 

For that reason and not being able to read Thai I have not been able to consider using that template but that's not to say it wouldn't be ok especially if you were never planning to change it.

[Confuscious]

I gave a copy of my Last Will (Notarized and signed by 2 whitnesses) to my embassy in Bangkok.
Another copy is at the office of my lawyer and the address is know by the Embassy.
Never heard that this would be illegal.
 

[newnative]

10 hours ago, Confuscious said:

I gave a copy of my Last Will (Notarized and signed by 2 whitnesses) to my embassy in Bangkok.
Another copy is at the office of my lawyer and the address is know by the Embassy.
Never heard that this would be illegal.
 

    You've never heard 'this would be illegal' because it is not.  You can make as many copies of a Will as you feel you need to have.  It does not need to be on any special paper or paper with a law office letterhead.  If it is submitted to a Thai court, it must be translated into Thai. 

     I'm a bit surprised your embassy would take the Will--the embassy needs to take responsibility for it, an employee needs to file it somewhere, which takes work and space.  If you change your will, they then need to go and retrieve the old one and then file the new one.  I doubt my American embassy would do that but maybe I am wrong.  I think the important thing to remember is that someone needs to know where to locate your Will in the event of your death.

    I do think it's a good idea to have your lawyer in possession of a copy--to have one available in  case yours cannot be located--and to also have a copy handy should you notify him that you want to make changes to the Will.

[Confuscious]

12 hours ago, newnative said:

 I'm a bit surprised your embassy would take the Will--the embassy needs to take responsibility for it

The Embassy of Belgium offers 2 kind of services to their citizens.
1. The citizens that chose to keep the address in Belgium or somewhere else outside Thailand.
2. The citizens that chose to shift their address to the Embassy of Belgium when they move to Thailand.

In the case that a citizen chose to be REGISTRERED at the Embassy of Belgium, the Embassy will keep a personal file about that person and will take care of all the official documents which would be to asked to the Belgian authorities otherwise (Birth certificate; Divorce certificate; etc.)

You can ask your Embassy if they have a similar convention.

[newnative]

34 minutes ago, Confuscious said:

The Embassy of Belgium offers 2 kind of services to their citizens.
1. The citizens that chose to keep the address in Belgium or somewhere else outside Thailand.
2. The citizens that chose to shift their address to the Embassy of Belgium when they move to Thailand.

In the case that a citizen chose to be REGISTRERED at the Embassy of Belgium, the Embassy will keep a personal file about that person and will take care of all the official documents which would be to asked to the Belgian authorities otherwise (Birth certificate; Divorce certificate; etc.)

You can ask your Embassy if they have a similar convention.

Good service!

[TimeMachine]

On 6/30/2023 at 1:54 AM, hotandsticky said:

Seriously?

 

You think in Thailand an English worded version of a Will would prevail. Good luck getting Probate with that Nang Rong or Kanthalarak.

 

The English version is solely for the Farangs information and to allow translation into a Thai Will.

If the wording in the Thai translation is ambiguous the English will be refered to again to get a more precise translation if challenged.  So in a way,  yes the English version by Foreigner will be prevailing.  Btw.  Just finished up chasing info at pattaya court rooms in Jomtien. They have a Customer service office on level 2.

khunpee is the person i dealt with.  Was quoted 32k plus 2k for translation and eventually probate document within 2 month period.  

 

Does that sound fair.  

[Denim]

What about a cashiers cheque. Can't you write one out for your wife so that if you croak she just cashes the cheque ?

[hotandsticky]

6 hours ago, Denim said:

What about a cashiers cheque. Can't you write one out for your wife so that if you croak she just cashes the cheque ?

All mandates cease on death.

 

Knowingly presenting it after death would probably infringe the law. You have cheques on your Thai bank account?