Thai wife required to have work or Tabien Baan in province for marriage extension?

[GroveHillWanderer]

3 minutes ago, sanooki said:

Thanks for that. You're the second to say that. That's my final worry at the moment. Are you in Korat, by any chance? I imagine it may vary by office.

No, Hua Hin - but my point was that if they accept it, it can't be a mandatory provision. However, as is often pointed out on here, individual IO's (or offices) can come up with additional, non-official requirements - and often do.

 

The bottom line I think though, is that if they've accepted the application and given you an "Under Consideration" stamp, it's pretty much a done deal.

[Sydebolle]

Years back I wanted a re-entry permit from the immigration office in Korat. As I was registered in Nong Khai then, the officer said that I would have to get the re-entry permit in Nong Khai and flatly refused to do it. 

I went on to Buriram, got my re-entry t here in order to cross into Cambodia. 

Quite obviously the entire immigration's revamp from scratch is overdue; if you are punished by dealing with a p1rkc of an officer, usually lacking thorough knowledge of the (arguably confusing and overlapping) rules and regulations or has an inferiority complex which is vented on such occasions .........

[sanooki]

15 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

The last time they tried to persuade me to take the retirement route they said it didn't matter if I worked or not.

Ooh, I wouldn't believe them on that. The other day at immigration, when I was suggesting that if they didn't approve, I would go for the retirement visa, they emphasized with us that I could not work if I went that way. Additionally, it is written into the actual printed rules on visas everywhere I've seen the rules. Unless, something has recently changed...

[sanooki]

16 minutes ago, GroveHillWanderer said:

No, Hua Hin - but my point was that if they accept it, it can't be a mandatory provision. However, as is often pointed out on here, individual IO's (or offices) can come up with additional, non-official requirements - and often do.

 

The bottom line I think though, is that if they've accepted the application and given you an "Under Consideration" stamp, it's pretty much a done deal.

Thank you. I believe the same, but have a backup plan just in case.

[sanooki]

17 minutes ago, Sydebolle said:

Years back I wanted a re-entry permit from the immigration office in Korat. As I was registered in Nong Khai then, the officer said that I would have to get the re-entry permit in Nong Khai and flatly refused to do it. 

I went on to Buriram, got my re-entry t here in order to cross into Cambodia. 

Quite obviously the entire immigration's revamp from scratch is overdue; if you are punished by dealing with a p1rkc of an officer, usually lacking thorough knowledge of the (arguably confusing and overlapping) rules and regulations or has an inferiority complex which is vented on such occasions .........

Yes. I had only heard good things about Korat, and it seemed well-organized and chill on my other visits this year. So, I was a bit shocked the other day. It's definitely not out of the parameters of the kinds of things I've experienced or heard about all these years, however.

[BritTim]

35 minutes ago, GroveHillWanderer said:

I don't believe that's an official requirement. We've always used my wife's son (my step-son) as a witness. It's never been a problem.

Sigh! I am going to regret this post.

 

I am glad that you have never had a problem. You have benefited from Thai pragmatism.

 

In Thailand, as in many other countries, there is a general rule (not limited to foreigners or any specific procedure) that witnesses you use as references cannot be family members or employees working under you.

 

Please do not ask me to track down the specific Thai laws that outline this restriction. I have better use for my time.

[bigt3116]

1 hour ago, sandyf said:

If you have been using type B then Korat may have taken the view that you cannot extend that visa type to marriage. It is an office interpretation and happened to me a few years back. People on here said immigration was wrong but the visa office in MFA said they were right.

Only the FIRST extension must match the reason for issue of the initial visa, any subsequent extension can be for any reason.

[sanooki]

34 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Sigh! I am going to regret this post.

 

I am glad that you have never had a problem. You have benefited from Thai pragmatism.

 

In Thailand, as in many other countries, there is a general rule (not limited to foreigners or any specific procedure) that witnesses you use as references cannot be family members or employees working under you.

 

Please do not ask me to track down the specific Thai laws that outline this restriction. I have better use for my time.

That seems reasonable. It's the unwritten or obscure rules that always make me most nervous, as well as the multivariate "interpretations."

[sanooki]

7 minutes ago, bigt3116 said:

Only the FIRST extension must match the reason for issue of the initial visa, any subsequent extension can be for any reason.

That's good to know.

[phetpeter]

Perhaps it is time to think about using an agent, I have used one now for three years, based near KK, and when approved returned passport I go to the local office and register change of address. Its simple, no questions and a great peace of mind. The 90 day officer told me last week, that it doesn't matter which office or agent that assists you, just remember to change the address to the local office of where to are staying. I have been married 24 years and living in Thailand for 18 years.

 

Edited July 20, 2023 by phetpeter

[sanooki]

1 minute ago, phetpeter said:

Perhaps it is time to think about using an agent, I have used one now for three years, based near KK, and when approved returned passport I go to the local office and register change of address. Its simple, no questions and a great peace of mind. The 90 day officer told me last week, that it doesn't matter which office or agent that assists you, just remember to change the address to the localoffice of where to are staying.

 

Thanks for the idea. I've also considered that again this week. Generally, however, I use my feet to walk when I can, and my mind to do mental tasks. Keeps me alive longer. I have training in law and legal writing. I am dubious whether if something was truly illegal for me, that an agent could save me. Other than that, I have faith that I can still find my own way so far, using the wealth here and on the internet in general.

[Stevemercer]

If the Korat Office has accepted your application, and you have paid, then you are most likely to be approved. It sounds like there may have been some confusion about your 'move' to Korat, but a long term lease (>6 months) should have been acceptable in evidencing your intentions. The office should have requested this sort of information if they had doubts.

 

Anyway, I would be surprised if you are knocked back. I don't doubt it can and does happen, but I have never heard of it or read such on this forum over the last 10 years.

[problemfarang]

I dont know this will help you or not

my ex-wife is from khon kaen. Her registration is khon kaen. But i was working in bangkok. I wanted to do my extension base on my work and work salary. 

Where ever you work it doesnt matter. You have to do your extension where your wife is registered. in your case i think she is from khon kaen too (because you mentioned khon kaen) and she registered there. 

now if she works in some other city that means most likely she moved there and also moved her registration there too. in this kind of case you must go this city and extend your visa there not khon kaen anymore. 

So basically, where ever she registered herself, extension is there. 

 

Suggestion: go to khon kaen, do your extension. travel where ever or live where ever you want. If the police wants to visit you they will visit you where ever you live (the address you provided and TM30) thats how happened to me. Sometimes they may insist to see you in khon kaen.. thats something you need to talk and explain to them.

Edited July 20, 2023 by problemfarang

[sanooki]

18 minutes ago, Stevemercer said:

If the Korat Office has accepted your application, and you have paid, then you are most likely to be approved. It sounds like there may have been some confusion about your 'move' to Korat, but a long term lease (>6 months) should have been acceptable in evidencing your intentions. The office should have requested this sort of information if they had doubts.

 

Anyway, I would be surprised if you are knocked back. I don't doubt it can and does happen, but I have never heard of it or read such on this forum over the last 10 years.

Thanks for the additional encouragement. With our application, we included our 6 month lease as required, and they do have record of the first one from when we moved here last year. A weird point about that is the standard practice in Thailand about landlords giving a several month lease, and then just letting you stay past the end of them. Then, once it's time to go for a visa, we tend to make a new lease for the occasion. Everywhere I've been it's the same, yet the IOs act oblivious to this reality.

[sanooki]

24 minutes ago, problemfarang said:

I dont know this will help you or not

my ex-wife is from khon kaen. Her registration is khon kaen. But i was working in bangkok. I wanted to do my extension base on my work and work salary. 

Where ever you work it doesnt matter. You have to do your extension where your wife is registered. in your case i think she is from khon kaen too (because you mentioned khon kaen) and she registered there. 

now if she works in some other city that means most likely she moved there and also moved her registration there too. in this kind of case you must go this city and extend your visa there not khon kaen anymore. 

So basically, where ever she registered herself, extension is there. 

 

Suggestion: go to khon kaen, do your extension. travel where ever or live where ever you want. If the police wants to visit you they will visit you where ever you live (the address you provided and TM30) thats how happened to me. Sometimes they may insist to see you in khon kaen.. thats something you need to talk and explain to them.

That's a very interesting concept. It's possibly true in some sense. But then we have all the comments here and my own experience that contradicts this as a hard rule. I mentioned Khon Kaen because that's the intermediate office they said they would send our app to for approval.

 

My wife is actually from Ubon and hasn't worked in the 5 years we've been together. She's never changed her Tabien Baan from there. But that kind of makes sense why they would ask about her work, and be confused what to do. If they had told me to go do it in Ubon, I would have with zero problem. I believe I need to do it where I'm currently living.

 

When we went to Ubon a month ago to visit my wife's grandfather in hospital, we stopped in at immigration there to ask about the possibility we might move there before doing this extension. They also asked why we don't move to the family farm and do it there. We had to explain that I don't really want to live on the farm and prefer having a city with good shopping and transportation, etc. They didn't object and said they would do it if I asked. I do think there might be something to what you're saying though.

Edited July 20, 2023 by sanooki
spelling

[sanooki]

Still waiting for the glorious officers to make their dramatic appearance...

 

After my last reply, it occurs to me that one of the first things an IO on desk might do is to try to find a way to avoid doing a marriage extension, especially a first one, since they tend to take a lot of time resources to accommodate. I'm guessing their office may lose money on these. So, they look for any excuse to discourage us. This is probably as likely or unlikely as other thoughts.

[TigerandDog]

3 hours ago, sanooki said:

Hi, thanks, appreciate the thought. However, we did report to Korat imm. immediately (within one day) upon finishing our move here last year. We haven't moved since. At the time we were making our app, I was also speculating that they hadn't checked their own records yet, because they quizzed us on our location after seeing we had a new lease from this month. But they had looked at our first lease a year ago already, and we had submitted documentation of the landlord also at that time.

check your TM30 in your passport. What address is on that? If it's your OLD address then that will be the main reason for the IO response and you will need to get a new TM30 submitted.

[sandyf]

4 hours ago, sanooki said:

That's very interesting. They didn't use that as a reason at all in what they said to us. However, my visa is indeed a "B." But, I've had two marriage extensions already on it. Somehow, I don't think they would even accept my application if this was not acceptable to them.

Yes fair point. Your OP did indicate a reluctance to accept the application and I made the response before I realised there was a second page. When I saw that you had made an application I was about to go back and delete my post but decided to leave it for info. The line from the MFA was that work extensions should be on a B and marriage/retirement on an O. Fairly obvious that many immigration offices have taken a different view.

Hope it works out and as someone else said once you get the under consideration, almost cast in stone.

[sanooki]

1 hour ago, TigerandDog said:

check your TM30 in your passport. What address is on that? If it's your OLD address then that will be the main reason for the IO response and you will need to get a new TM30 submitted.

I replied above that I reported to immigration, as required, almost immediately upon moving in. If not clear, this necessarily included giving them my new address and rental lease to peruse. I do believe that if they still had my old address the other day, there would already have been problems and we wouldn't have been able to get this far. However, as I was also previously musing, it seemed they hadn't reviewed all my information there on file before going on their initial offensive.

[sandyf]

3 hours ago, bigt3116 said:

Only the FIRST extension must match the reason for issue of the initial visa, any subsequent extension can be for any reason.

That wasn't the view of the MFA but at the end of the day it is always the view of the man with the stamp that counts.

[sherwood]

21 hours ago, sherwood said:

The witnesses should not be related and have separate house books. You should be OK.

Cheers 

There seems to be a problem for some about the validity of my above post so I will give you a little more info on my recent experience.

Received the under consideration stamp and informed of the house visit, would need to produce two witnesses no problem.

Police turn up do their thing and leave after saying everything was fine.

Next day wife gets a call from the IO from window 2, Korat asking us to bring in another witness as the two old girls we presented were related, ie, sisters but no relation to my wife. Different blue books and all.

We took another lady into the office and was assured that all was in order, again.

Just the luck of the draw but how they interpret the rules is a mystery to me.

The same two original old girls were my witnesses five years ago on my first Non O extension.

Go figure.

[sanooki]

15 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Yes fair point. Your OP did indicate a reluctance to accept the application and I made the response before I realised there was a second page. When I saw that you had made an application I was about to go back and delete my post but decided to leave it for info. The line from the MFA was that work extensions should be on a B and marriage/retirement on an O. Fairly obvious that many immigration offices have taken a different view.

Hope it works out and as someone else said once you get the under consideration, almost cast in stone.

No worries. I had no choice about the first marriage extension on my B. It was pandemic days and they were doing all sorts of conversions I hadn't seen before to avoid having people leave the country.

 

My visa info had been stamped into a new passport just before the pandemic, so I don't even have my original visa anymore. Just stamps and scribbles. I thought they said they were converting me to an O, but they didn't really. Just an extension.

[Kalasin Jo]

23 hours ago, BE88 said:

were in your place I will come back alone to clarify the situation but you will use English with simple terms.

 

 You could try that. Take along your smartphone with Google translate or similar to help with your conversation. However for a marriage extension application your wife needs to be present to sign various documents.

[sanooki]

12 minutes ago, sandyf said:

That wasn't the view of the MFA but at the end of the day it is always the view of the man with the stamp that counts.

You're probably right, but a lot changed a couple years ago, as I was just writing.

[sanooki]

2 minutes ago, Kalasin Jo said:

 You could try that. Take along your smartphone with Google translate or similar to help with your conversation. However for a marriage extension application your wife needs to be present to sign various documents.

Thanks, I would but I think we're already beyond that point.

[sanooki]

14 minutes ago, sherwood said:

There seems to be a problem for some about the validity of my above post so I will give you a little more info on my recent experience.

Received the under consideration stamp and informed of the house visit, would need to produce two witnesses no problem.

Police turn up do their thing and leave after saying everything was fine.

Next day wife gets a call from the IO from window 2, Korat asking us to bring in another witness as the two old girls we presented were related, ie, sisters but no relation to my wife. Different blue books and all.

We took another lady into the office and was assured that all was in order, again.

Just the luck of the draw but how they interpret the rules is a mystery to me.

The same two original old girls were my witnesses five years ago on my first Non O extension.

Go figure.

I have a potentially very interesting update to relay. The pair of Korat's finest left us a little while ago.

 

We will be receiving a second visit on Sunday, by just one of them. The reason is thus: We were prepared, as requested, for a visit "after 10am" with 2 witnesses, Our landlord and her daughter. The daughter took off work for half a day to be here for us. They were late and didn't show until about 14:00. This daughter had to go back to work at 13:00. There was discussion among all of us.

 

Our landlord offered to bring a second daughter out who was asleep in their house, which is adjacent to our building. This was unacceptable because, dunh dunh dunh, that daughter is on the same Tabien Baan as her mother, the landlord.

 

The first daughter lives somewhere else and has a separate Tabien Baan, so would have been acceptable, ding. But she must work today through Saturday.

 

I brought up getting the security guy from the shopping mall entrance down the soi, but we didn't think he'd have his Tabien Baan with him for work. The food stall lady nearby was disqualified because she doesn't live in Amphur Mueang, where we do.

 

The main IO guy was mai bpen rai'ing and saying we still have time, and he can come back Sunday.

 

So, at least for now for these IOs in Korat, if we put this all together, the requirements seem to be that there must be two witnesses, and they can be related, but must be on different Tabien Baans, which must be in the same Amphur. Wow. Hope this is helpful to someone.

[sherwood]

Yep, all good fun.

I would still go with the two Tabien Baan thingy but if you're dealing with the IO at desk #2 then non related witnesses would be the best option.

Just from my experience of 20 days ago.

Good luck fella.

[sanooki]

2 minutes ago, sherwood said:

Yep, all good fun.

I would still go with the two Tabien Baan thingy but if you're dealing with the IO at desk #2 then non related witnesses would be the best option.

Just from my experience of 20 days ago.

Good luck fella.

It seems Korat has more diverse practices than some other immigration offices? To me, it's maybe a sign of new supervision. Someone got promoted, things got loose. Dunno. Government people, in my experience (I worked in a Rajabhat), have a terrible time admitting when they don't know something. Even more pressure than in the civilian population. Then they often get caught out when they start winging it...

[sherwood]

I think the changes from their previous congeniality stems from the problems at District 4 HQ, KohnKaen. Something to do with bogus dealings with the Chinese.

 

Clean broom and more scrutiny.

I just play the game and smile while being mucked about, not much else I can do.

Cheers

[sanooki]

24 minutes ago, sherwood said:

I think the changes from their previous congeniality stems from the problems at District 4 HQ, KohnKaen. Something to do with bogus dealings with the Chinese.

 

Clean broom and more scrutiny.

I just play the game and smile while being mucked about, not much else I can do.

Cheers

Hadn't heard about that, but it fits my hunch, though higher up. It also fits what the super was saying when we were there. Worrying is that this seems to provide the possibility that all the other assurances that since my application was accepted here already, that I'm a shoe-in, could be mistaken.