O-A retirement medical insurance

[Jai Dee 962]

I arrived in Thailand in 2014 with a O-A visa.  Phuket does NOT require that I carry mandatory health insurance because I arrived 2014 (i think 2018 is the cut off date, but really not sure).

 

my question is this, those of you in other provinces that arrived before 2018 with an O-A visa, does your local immigration office require that you carry health insurance? Or are you also exempt from this requirement?
 

I’m asking because I’m planning to move out of Phuket and curious if I’ll be needing health insurance for immigration purposes.

 

Thanks!

[MPoll]

I arrived in Bangkok in 2017 with an OA visa. After Thailand implemented the health insurance requirement for OA visas I was required to have health insurance for my yearly extensions. I extended in the Bangkok Immigration office.

 

I had purchased Thai insurance before the health insurance requirement which qualified for the requirement so there was no practical change for me other than having to sync the dates of my insurance and extentions. This year I got an LTR visa and my insurance met that requirement as well. 

[mfd101]

I've lived in Surin province since late 2015 on OA. Since the health insurance ruling came in I have had cover from PC, which at my age (now 74) makes sense (though it's expensive).

 

It had never occurred to me that I might be exempt from the requirement & Surin Immigration has never indicated otherwise.

 

I'll ask them when I do my annual renewal in October (not that I'll dish the insurance, but it does give me more flexible options for the future).

 

 

[KhunBENQ]

Quite likely you will be forced into a health insurance following their guidelines.

On one hand there still seem to be "pro-forma" insurances with extreme excess (self payment). 

Price for such waste paper seems to go down to the four digit range.

 

On the other consider to cancel your Non O-A with a border run and visa exempt entry.

That's what I and others did.

This route is only recommended if you do your extension on the base of 800k in the bank.

Multiple threads in the forum if you are interested.

[BritTim]

Most immigration offices impose the insurance requirement if you entered on a Non O-A visa, regardless of when the entry was made. Phuket is one of the few offices that does not.

[JimHuaHin]

I arrived in Thailand 10 years ago tomorrow on an Non Immi O-A "Retirement" visa.

 

I am in Hua Hin, and every year that the compulsory Thai health insurance policy have been required, an immigration officer checks that I have a valid policy letter in Thai before I am permitted to enter the office to apply for an extension.   When I see the Immigration Officer inside and present all the required documentation and photocopies, he/she gets up, goes to another computer at the back of the office, and checks that my policy is valid.

 

[Pib]

You will be required to have insurance.  But in Phuket they implemented rules which grandfathered some....they kinda went rogue on the medical insurance requirement...but rogue in a good way for some.

Edited July 26, 2023 by Pib

[wwest5829]

On 7/26/2023 at 9:03 AM, Jai Dee 962 said:

I arrived in Thailand in 2014 with a O-A visa.  Phuket does NOT require that I carry mandatory health insurance because I arrived 2014 (i think 2018 is the cut off date, but really not sure).

 

my question is this, those of you in other provinces that arrived before 2018 with an O-A visa, does your local immigration office require that you carry health insurance? Or are you also exempt from this requirement?
 

I’m asking because I’m planning to move out of Phuket and curious if I’ll be needing health insurance for immigration purposes.

 

Thanks!

I arrived on my O-A Visa for reason of retirement in 2011 and have maintained Chiang Mai as my only global residence. When the rules for the O-A retirement Visa changed I was forced to take out health insurance. I viewed it as a “tax” due to the fact that pre-existing conditions and a high deductible would make its use untenable. I have now switched to an”O” Visa without being required to carry the useless insurance.

[CFCol]

Arrived Samui 2014. Health insurance is required here.

[AlfonsV]

On 7/26/2023 at 9:48 AM, KhunBENQ said:

Quite likely you will be forced into a health insurance following their guidelines.

On one hand there still seem to be "pro-forma" insurances with extreme excess (self payment). 

Price for such waste paper seems to go down to the four digit range.

 

On the other consider to cancel your Non O-A with a border run and visa exempt entry.

That's what I and others did.

This route is only recommended if you do your extension on the base of 800k in the bank.

Multiple threads in the forum if you are interested.

If you enter with a tourist visa and apply later for a retired visa based on 800k you will get automatically a NON-O which not needs any insurance (at least in CNX). Thus you are free to choose an insurance or not and if you like to have any you are free to choose a domestic or an international insurance. There is no need to have a O-A which is only required if you apply a visa from abroad, i. e. your home. I did so spending a few days in Luang Prabang (even 1-2 night would be enough). Inexpensive Laos Air starts from BKK or CNX, is easy to book online and reliable.

[B Glen]

Out of curiosity, how much is your insurance costing you?

[AlfonsV]

On 7/26/2023 at 10:12 AM, JimHuaHin said:

I arrived in Thailand 10 years ago tomorrow on an Non Immi O-A "Retirement" visa.

 

I am in Hua Hin, and every year that the compulsory Thai health insurance policy have been required, an immigration officer checks that I have a valid policy letter in Thai before I am permitted to enter the office to apply for an extension.   When I see the Immigration Officer inside and present all the required documentation and photocopies, he/she gets up, goes to another computer at the back of the office, and checks that my policy is valid.

 

Compulsory insurance is only needed if you continue the Non Immi O-A Retirement visa. At least in Chiang Mai. Ask and confirm at your immi.

[matta]

I have an O-A type visa and like everyone else, I would need 800,000 baht for an annual extension proof and also need to have proof of medical insurance. A holder of a type O visa only needs half of this for an annual extension amount and does not need to have insurance.

This is against my principles why one requires proof and the other must not show anything. For that reason, I am doing a year extension based on marriage with my O-A visa.

I do not have to prove that I have insurance and I now make use of an affidavit. I do not have to give any more bank book statements or proof from the bank.

[Pib]

6 minutes ago, matta said:

I have an O-A type visa and like everyone else, I would need 800,000 baht for an annual extension proof and also need to have proof of medical insurance. A holder of a type O visa only needs half of this for an annual extension amount and does not need to have insurance.

 

For a retirement extension under a OA "or" O visa the deposit requirement is the same if you use the deposit method:  Bt800K.    

 

Not sure where you are getting only Bt400K deposit is required for a Non O....Bt800K is required.

Edited July 27, 2023 by Pib

[BritTim]

5 minutes ago, Pib said:

Not sure where you are getting only Bt400K deposit is required for a Non O....Bt800K is required.

I think he is referring to Non O (marriage) rather than Non O (retirement). You are correct that the money in the bank requirement is the same for extension of Non O-A and extension of Non O (retirement).

[matta]

https://www.immigration.go.th/en/?p=14714

 

18 marriage

22 retirement 

[BritTim]

1 minute ago, matta said:

https://www.immigration.go.th/en/?p=14714

 

18 marriage

22 retirement 

Accurate, but with a warning Reason 22 (retirement) for extension of stay has been amended at least twice since that Police Order was issued. It is necessary to be aware of whether those amendments apply to you.

[rwill]

I arrived before you.  I live in Ratchaburi.  I am required to have the medical insurance.  I am contemplating trying to switch to a regular O visa.  I'd mainly like a wider choice of insurance to choose from.

[TigerandDog]

I arrived in 2014 on O-A Retirement visa. Chiang Mai have required me to have the health insurance since it's inception.

[JimHuaHin]

17 hours ago, AlfonsV said:

Compulsory insurance is only needed if you continue the Non Immi O-A Retirement visa. At least in Chiang Mai. Ask and confirm at your immi.

Same in Hua Hin.

[Red Phoenix]

It is only in PHUKET that local Immigration made some 'grandfathering' arrangements, which allow some long-staying residents there not having to comply with the mandatory Non Imm O-A compliant Health Insurance requirement.  Afaik, at all other Imm Offices in Thailand, when applying for a 1-year extension of that original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement that Health-Insurance requirement is mandatory.  

There are two options to 'escape' from that mandatory Health Insurance requirement (which also has to be with a THAI insurer that is mentioned on the TGIA list kept by Immigration).  

#1 - When married to a Thai national or with Thai dependent children, you could apply for the 1-year extension of stay for such reason.  On top of the much lower financial requirements (+400K that only need to be on your personal Thai bank-account in the 2 months preceding your application), applying for the 1-year extension of that original Non Imm O-A Visa for a different reason than retirement, does NOT require any Health Insurance. 

NOTE that you can only 'switch' from retirement to marriage, after you have done your first 1-year extension for reason of retirement.  And that you would have to show that you met the financial requirements under which your 1-year extension for reason of retirement was issued. 

#2 - When exiting Thailand without a Re-Entry Permit will 'kill' the Non Imm O-A based Permission to stay.  So doing a border-run and returning same day (or combining it with a trip in the neighboring country) will provide you with a 30-day VisaExempt Permit to stay.  And in the 15 days before expiry of that VisaExempt based Permission to stay (some offices - e.g. Chiang Mai and Phuket - do require a longer period) you could then apply for a NEW Non Imm O Visa at your local Imm Office.

NOTE that there are some rogue offices (e.g. Chiang Rai) that refuse to do that 'change of Visa' process and want you to apply for the 90-day Non Imm O Visa at a Thai Embassy/Consulate abroad (e.g. at the Vientiane Thai Embassy in Laos). 

Also note that when re-entering Thailand with a NEW Permission to stay having 'killed' your previous one, that you are required to notify your local Imm Office within 24 hours of your arrival at your address, that you are staying there again by providing Immigration with a TM-30.

[oldcpu]

On 7/27/2023 at 7:57 PM, TigerandDog said:

I arrived in 2014 on O-A Retirement visa. Chiang Mai have required me to have the health insurance since it's inception.

I wonder how this works in practice at Chiang Mai and Hua Hin before and after the country wide health insurance requirement for type-OA(retirement). 

 

I wonder, because prior to the Thailand immigration countrywide requirement for holders of a Type-OA visa, applying for a 1 year extension (based on retirement), I do not believe there was an immigration database setup for the entry of the Health Insurance data.  

 

At the same time as the Thailand requirement for Health Insurance (for type-OA visa holders for 1-year retirement extensions) was implemented, Thai immigration implemented what I think was a new database (for the Visa holder's insurance data to be entered).

 

My understanding is the Health Insurance companies are required then to enter the proof of health insurance into the Immigration database, for an individual on a type-OA visa (seeking a retirement 1 year extension) who is purchasing the Health Insurance to meet the new country wide requirement. 

 

My experience is that offices of Health Insurance companies outside of Thailand will not enter such information into a Thai immigration database. Further the Thailand branch of a Health Insurance company will not enter the data into the Thai immigration database UNLESS the insurance is purchased from their specific Thai branch. 

 

In essence this means in most cases, one must have Health Insurance from the Thai branch of a Health Insurance company.  Superior health insurance from outside the country does not count (for a Type-OA extension(retirement) if the Health Insurance office that issued that health insurance refuses to enter the data into the Thai database (which foreign offices typically refuse to do).

 

Hence I think that drove a number of us (who were on a Type-OA) to switch to a Type-O visa (as our superior non-Thai branch health insurance was not accepted by immigration), or in other cases, take advantage of the new LTR Visa where we could instead self insure by having sufficient money in the bank.

 

Am I correct in assuming that your Health Insurance is from a Thai branch of a Health Insurance company ? (and hence willing to fill in the appropriate data into the Thai immigration database)?

 

Edited July 29, 2023 by oldcpu

[BritTim]

2 hours ago, oldcpu said:

I wonder how this works in practice at Chiang Mai and Hua Hin before and after the country wide health insurance requirement for type-OA(retirement). 

 

I wonder, because prior to the Thailand immigration countrywide requirement for holders of a Type-OA visa, applying for a 1 year extension (based on retirement), I do not believe there was an immigration database setup for the entry of the Health Insurance data.  

 

At the same time as the Thailand requirement for Health Insurance (for type-OA visa holders for 1-year retirement extensions) was implemented, Thai immigration implemented what I think was a new database (for the Visa holder's insurance data to be entered).

 

My understanding is the Health Insurance companies are required then to enter the proof of health insurance into the Immigration database, for an individual on a type-OA visa (seeking a retirement 1 year extension) who is purchasing the Health Insurance to meet the new country wide requirement. 

 

My experience is that offices of Health Insurance companies outside of Thailand will not enter such information into a Thai immigration database. Further the Thailand branch of a Health Insurance company will not enter the data into the Thai immigration database UNLESS the insurance is purchased from their specific Thai branch. 

 

In essence this means in most cases, one must have Health Insurance from the Thai branch of a Health Insurance company.  Superior health insurance from outside the country does not count (for a Type-OA extension(retirement) if the Health Insurance office that issued that health insurance refuses to enter the data into the Thai database (which foreign offices typically refuse to do).

 

Hence I think that drove a number of us (who were on a Type-OA) to switch to a Type-O visa (as our superior non-Thai branch health insurance was not accepted by immigration), or in other cases, take advantage of the new LTR Visa where we could instead self insure by having sufficient money in the bank.

 

Am I correct in assuming that your Health Insurance is from a Thai branch of a Health Insurance company ? (and hence willing to fill in the appropriate data into the Thai immigration database)?

 

I have not held a Non O-A visa myself, so I may be misunderstanding the requirement, but I think you are partly correct (in that a problem exists) but not accurate on details. There is no special immigration system that holds a record of all the insurance policies.

 

The problem, as I understand it, is that if a policy does not specifically state that it provides coverage for you when inside Thailand that satisfies the requirements for health insurance for a Non O-A visa, then you must get a letter from the insurance company that guarantees this. As a practical matter, your home country insurance company will not provide such a letter. If you purchased a policy there, and the company has a Thailand branch, the management in Thailand will refuse to provide a letter that confirms what they know to be true (your home policy provides the necessary coverage). They insist that you buy a useless policy from them in addition to your existing policy from the same company.

 

It should be noted that those applying for an LTR-WP (Long Term Resident Wealthy Pensioner) visa have sometimes been able to convince the BOI (that handles their application) that their policy qualifies (without a letter) even when Thai immigration has refused to accept the policy.

[TigerandDog]

On 7/29/2023 at 2:10 PM, oldcpu said:

I wonder how this works in practice at Chiang Mai and Hua Hin before and after the country wide health insurance requirement for type-OA(retirement). 

 

I wonder, because prior to the Thailand immigration countrywide requirement for holders of a Type-OA visa, applying for a 1 year extension (based on retirement), I do not believe there was an immigration database setup for the entry of the Health Insurance data.  

 

At the same time as the Thailand requirement for Health Insurance (for type-OA visa holders for 1-year retirement extensions) was implemented, Thai immigration implemented what I think was a new database (for the Visa holder's insurance data to be entered).

 

My understanding is the Health Insurance companies are required then to enter the proof of health insurance into the Immigration database, for an individual on a type-OA visa (seeking a retirement 1 year extension) who is purchasing the Health Insurance to meet the new country wide requirement. 

 

My experience is that offices of Health Insurance companies outside of Thailand will not enter such information into a Thai immigration database. Further the Thailand branch of a Health Insurance company will not enter the data into the Thai immigration database UNLESS the insurance is purchased from their specific Thai branch. 

 

In essence this means in most cases, one must have Health Insurance from the Thai branch of a Health Insurance company.  Superior health insurance from outside the country does not count (for a Type-OA extension(retirement) if the Health Insurance office that issued that health insurance refuses to enter the data into the Thai database (which foreign offices typically refuse to do).

 

Hence I think that drove a number of us (who were on a Type-OA) to switch to a Type-O visa (as our superior non-Thai branch health insurance was not accepted by immigration), or in other cases, take advantage of the new LTR Visa where we could instead self insure by having sufficient money in the bank.

 

Am I correct in assuming that your Health Insurance is from a Thai branch of a Health Insurance company ? (and hence willing to fill in the appropriate data into the Thai immigration database)?

 

yes my health insurance is with one of the approved Thai Health Insurance companies. However, your understanding about external insurance companies is not entirely correct. Immigration will accept those companies BUT only if at renewal of extension time you provide a certificate from that insurance company signed by company directors. That is what the external insurers will not do. They cannot enter details into the Thai database as they do not have access to it.

[Pib]

3 hours ago, TigerandDog said:

yes my health insurance is with one of the approved Thai Health Insurance companies. However, your understanding about external insurance companies is not entirely correct. Immigration will accept those companies BUT only if at renewal of extension time you provide a certificate from that insurance company signed by company directors. That is what the external insurers will not do. They cannot enter details into the Thai database as they do not have access to it.

We can thank the Thai insurance companies mafia for getting Immigration to set the requirement for a specific form signed by three directors of a foreign insurance company to effectively kill the option of using foreign insurance to renew an OA visa.  Immigration can brag clearly they give the option to use foreign insurance but they only mumble unintelligently about the fine print of requiring a form foreign insurance companies will not complete/sign.

[LarryLEB]

I entered Thailand on O-A in May 2011.  I've been in Jomtien since then.  Immigration here requires the mandatory insurance.  I bought my insurance from a Thai company in a couple weeks after my arrival in 2011, so I already had it before the mandate was brought in.  

 

I will change to O sometime in the next year, so I have more decision room as the policy rates increase with age.

[Red Phoenix]

On 7/31/2023 at 10:32 AM, Pib said:

We can thank the Thai insurance companies mafia for getting Immigration to set the requirement for a specific form signed by three directors of a foreign insurance company to effectively kill the option of using foreign insurance to renew an OA visa.  Immigration can brag clearly they give the option to use foreign insurance but they only mumble unintelligently about the fine print of requiring a form foreign insurance companies will not complete/sign.

There are several reports of people with a non-Thai Health-insurance policy (that meets the financial tressholds) applying successfully for the 1-year Non Imm O-A Visa in their home-country using the Foreign Insurance form. 

The problem arises when you apply for the 1-year extension of that original Non Imm O-A Visa.  Local Thai Immigration then requires a statement from a THAI insurer that your Health-Insurance policy is compliant with the Non Imm O-A regulations for the coming period.  And on top of that they require that the policy is registered in the TGIA-database. 

So they are effectively blocking the use of foreign insurers to apply for 1-year extensions from such Non Imm O-A Visa, as only TGIA-assocatiated insurers have access to that database.  When subscribing to a HI-policy from a Thai insurer in order to meet the requirement, you also need to make sure that the Thai insurer is TGIA-associated (not all of them are, and people that had HI-policies issued by non-TGIA associated Thai insurers have been refused their extension).

Note: The Health-insurance requirement is only applicable when applying for the 1-year extension of your original Non Imm O-A policy for reason of retirement. So when you are married to a Thai national, you have the option to apply for that reason and get rid of that HI-policy requirement. However, that is not possible for your very first 1-year extension as you can only 'switch' the reason for application from retirement to marriage, when you are already on a 'retirement' extension. So there is no escaping the need for a Thai Non Imm O-A compliant HI-policy (at least for the first 1-year extension) when wanting to extend  the Permission to stay of your original Non Imm O-A Visa.

> Needless to say that the Immigration mandated TGIA-associated Thai Insurer HI-policies, pushed by the Thai insurers lobby, have not resulted in the Goldmine these insurers envisioned, but instead resulted in long-term residents fleeing to the Non Imm O Visa (retirement) and  1-year extensions of such that do NOT require any HI-policy.

 

Edited August 1, 2023 by Red Phoenix