Foreign survivor criticises slow response of Thai police in Siam Paragon shooting (video)

[tandor]

4 minutes ago, sqwakvfr said:

Only the owners of the malls in Thailand could answer this.  I know the mall operators in the US would never do bag searches in the US. 

this aint Manila or the US, best you let Thais work it out eh!

[BarraMarra]

8 hours ago, sqwakvfr said:

Not defending the RTP but getting to everyone in this type of circumstance in a rapid manner is essentially “mission impossible”.  Otherwise BKK can become like Manila  where most shopping malls have actual security guards posted at all entrances along with actual bag searches.  One can imagine how long it would take to get people into the malls if actual security procedures were implemented in BKK.  

Mmm imagine a suicide bomber being allowed to walk into a big shopping center like Parogan without being searched and Detonating it. We in the UK know only full well because a Suicide bomber wasn't searched. He detonated a bomb in Manchester killing 22 people mostly kids in a Music venue and hundreds were injured could he have been stopped? yes with a quick search.

[kwilco]

11 hours ago, webfact said:

headquarters was not equipped with the necessary special operations team

Why?

[kwilco]

19 minutes ago, BarraMarra said:

Mmm imagine a suicide bomber being allowed to walk into a big shopping center like Parogan without being searched and Detonating it. We in the UK know only full well because a Suicide bomber wasn't searched. He detonated a bomb in Manchester killing 22 people mostly kids in a Music venue and hundreds were injured could he have been stopped? yes with a quick search.

Bet you were the first to complain about being tested for covid at shop doors.

Comparing a shopping mall to a concert is irrelevant, even a bit sick. A concert is a one off event with a massively higher concentration of people.

 

You say "we in the UK" almost as if it is a natter of pricmde or competition in deaths.

Just think of the practicalities....which shopping malls would you compel  to have searches etc etc  

Edited October 5, 2023 by kwilco

[lopburi3]

3 minutes ago, kwilco said:

Bet you were the first to complain about being tested for covid at shop doors.

Comparing a shopping mall to a concert is irrelevant, even a bit sick. A concert is a one off event with a massively higher concentration of people.

Just think of the practicalities....which shopping malls would you compel  to have searches etc etc  

But the Philippines - which has a much lower level of income - can and do.  Obviously some levels of customers/owners would not be in agreement here - so expect that is a more important factor.

[sqwakvfr]

35 minutes ago, tandor said:

this aint Manila or the US, best you let Thais work it out eh!

Ok.  

[sqwakvfr]

30 minutes ago, BarraMarra said:

Mmm imagine a suicide bomber being allowed to walk into a big shopping center like Parogan without being searched and Detonating it. We in the UK know only full well because a Suicide bomber wasn't searched. He detonated a bomb in Manchester killing 22 people mostly kids in a Music venue and hundreds were injured could he have been stopped? yes with a quick search.

Spent a year in Afghanistan and in Iraq so implementing security protocols to deal with IED's and Suicide Bomber attacks is something I have been trained for.  But this Bangkok and I don't believe similar protocols can be implemented.  Also, it is not "a simple search".  Simple searches are rarely effective.  

[PETERTHEEATER]

6 hours ago, tandor said:

a rapid bag and body scanner system..Im sure 10 seconds of your precious time would be acceptable.

Shouldn't take any longer than the Covid period temperature scan and sign-in circus.????

[atpeace]

How many mass shooting  deaths in Thailand malls?  It happened and time to move on to real worries. I'm sure more people die each month tripping or falling into cracks on Thai sidewalks than have died in mall shooting the last few decades.

[kwilco]

54 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

But the Philippines - which has a much lower level of income - can and do.  Obviously some levels of customers/owners would not be in agreement here - so expect that is a more important factor.

So you consider a police state is the solution?

[lopburi3]

1 minute ago, kwilco said:

So you consider a police state is the solution?

Would hardly rate PI a police state.  The guards are private hire by business owners with full agreement of the customers.

[2baht]

2 hours ago, freeworld said:

Just like the US then.

Wherrre's that, Bobby Joe???

[Dogmatix]

20 guys in tactical gear, armed to the teeth could pop along to Big Joke's residences in armoured cars but in a shooting opposite Police National HQ it took 90 minutes for cops to respond to a mass murder who was tackled by a cop in a motor cycle helmet who decided to have a go.

Edited October 5, 2023 by Dogmatix

[fusion58]

9 hours ago, ChipButty said:

I would have thought a major city like Bangkok would have rapid response units stationed in areas like the shopping centers were a high volume of damage could be done. 

Shopping centers are a target for maximum damage, 

 

Especially shopping centers in locations which have long histories of similar occurrences..

[Tropposurfer]

Multiple officers within a short running distance from the Paragon.

All trained to fire their weapons.

Multiple officers armed to respond.

 

Slow response from same.

 

Sound like the same BS excuses and cowardice as at the Uvalde school to me.

 

You put on the uniform, you take to oath to serve and protect even unto your own life.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 5, 2023 by Tropposurfer

[BarraMarra]

7 hours ago, sqwakvfr said:

Spent a year in Afghanistan and in Iraq so implementing security protocols to deal with IED's and Suicide Bomber attacks is something I have been trained for.  But this Bangkok and I don't believe similar protocols can be implemented.  Also, it is not "a simple search".  Simple searches are rarely effective.  

I'd be interested in what a person who is haunched over with a heavy bag on his back would be carrying in that rucksack into a venue be it a concert hall or a packed shopping center. Wouldnt you be suspiciouse if your on the door or on a security walk about.

[Artisi]

19 hours ago, 300sd said:

500 meters away and the police can't make it for 1-2 hours because they are not equipped!

 

What garbage. They are useless to the public and don't deserve to be employed as police. Get rid of them.

 

 

Come on now, they did turn-up, eventually, remember it's about getting the priorities right, a shooter in an mall requires carefull planing and discussion over coffee and snacks before any action can be undertaken. 

 

[jacko45k]

17 hours ago, PETERTHEEATER said:

Shouldn't take any longer than the Covid period temperature scan and sign-in circus.????

Maybe, maybe not. But there are many buildings in say Bangkok with a mall of restaurants and coffee shops on the lowest floors and the rest going up is busy offices. The flow of people at rush hours and lunch hours would be impossible to deal with.

[lopburi3]

7 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Maybe, maybe not. But there are many buildings in say Bangkok with a mall of restaurants and coffee shops on the lowest floors and the rest going up is busy offices. The flow of people at rush hours and lunch hours would be impossible to deal with.

Maybe - maybe not.  But just on premise trained law enforcement officers paid for by owners would not cause any disruption to business and could provide timely response, and extra income for persons involved.  Shopping centers are a major tourist attraction for Thailand and in turn a source of income.

[jacko45k]

2 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

Maybe - maybe not.  But just on premise trained law enforcement officers paid for by owners would not cause any disruption to business and could provide timely response, and extra income for persons involved.  Shopping centers are a major tourist attraction for Thailand and in turn a source of income.

All I saw was a guy with a little desk doing nothing and all so soon after Paragon.... the public and workers being required to use particular doors was alone having an impact.

[lopburi3]

2 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

All I saw was a guy with a little desk doing nothing and all so soon after Paragon.... the public and workers being required to use particular doors was alone having an impact.

My suggestion was roving uniformed police presence, as I believe is the case in many countries.  

[Captor]

On 10/5/2023 at 4:47 AM, HampiK said:

The problem, even if the scanner show something is there. nobody stop you and look.. The scanners are there but nobody really looks on it. It's even simple to walk around the scanners. And this works in every mall. If you want bring anything inside a mall.. this is a very easy task.

 

But what I do not understand is the complain about how long it took. They need long to clear up the whole shopping center after they cached the shooter. But I think before you can go inside shopping mall and release all the customers and staff waiting inside the stores. you have to make sure there is no danger anymore.

What I saw and heard the security this time have done in general a great job... closed the store, and told all the customer and staff to go inside store in the back-part. This is a much better thing, than let run out all customers so they can run directly into the shooter.

They closed the store? So no one can come out or after everyone is out already? Sounds like a good way to make it more easy for the shooter to find targets.

[HampiK]

2 hours ago, Captor said:

They closed the store? So no one can come out or after everyone is out already? Sounds like a good way to make it more easy for the shooter to find targets.

They put the customers inside the store in the back.. and closed the store. So the shooter could not go inside.

I think this actually much safer than let run out all people. Especially if your store not near an exit. Because you don't know where the shooter is. If you tell all people to run to exit.. the chance that some persons will cross the way with the shooter is greater than when they stay inside the store. WHich the shooter can't enter!

[ChipButty]

5 minutes ago, HampiK said:

They put the customers inside the store in the back.. and closed the store. So the shooter could not go inside.

I think this actually much safer than let run out all people. Especially if your store not near an exit. Because you don't know where the shooter is. If you tell all people to run to exit.. the chance that some persons will cross the way with the shooter is greater than when they stay inside the store. WHich the shooter can't enter!

The shooter got out as he ran to the hotel but before that many people also ran in that direction into the hotel, then the hotel locked the doors, many staff who did not escape did hide in the stock rooms. 

[Captor]

9 hours ago, HampiK said:

They put the customers inside the store in the back.. and closed the store. So the shooter could not go inside.

I think this actually much safer than let run out all people. Especially if your store not near an exit. Because you don't know where the shooter is. If you tell all people to run to exit.. the chance that some persons will cross the way with the shooter is greater than when they stay inside the store. WHich the shooter can't enter!

Um, it sounds good in theory but the guy I know working there (manager position) said nothing worked. It was full chaos. And actually some people did not want to go because they did not know what all was about. And they don´t even knew on what floor the shooting was. Could be of interest to know that when announcing in the loudspeakers. And maybe also in English and maybe Chinese. But they only talked Thai and only said that the customers must leave the building. Not why. I understand that they dont want to have panic too of course.