Popular Post LittleBear57 Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 There doesn't seem any real info around, but apparently this will come into effect on January 1st 2024, not far away at all. Does anyone actually know what the Taxation rate is in Thailand and is there a personal allowance free of Tax like in the UK.? It's possible Ex Pats will be able to claim their pensions tax free if you can prove tax has already been paid at country of origin. Some things are difficult to prove. I rely on income from a rented property and a small private pension and to be honest paying another 10% tax here would probably be the final straw even though I have a wife and child here. I was going to buy a car here soon to replace my old truck however I may have to put that on hold until there is some clarification on the issue. I could bring some money over before January to avoid the potential issue of the truck purchase. Another case of Thailand killing the Golden Goose not satisfied with us spending our pensions here they want more. What are your thoughts? 10 1 1 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Mike Lister Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 4 minutes ago, LittleBear57 said: There doesn't seem any real info around, but apparently this will come into effect on January 1st 2024, not far away at all. Does anyone actually know what the Taxation rate is in Thailand and is there a personal allowance free of Tax like in the UK.? It's possible Ex Pats will be able to claim their pensions tax free if you can prove tax has already been paid at country of origin. Some things are difficult to prove. I rely on income from a rented property and a small private pension and to be honest paying another 10% tax here would probably be the final straw even though I have a wife and child here. I was going to buy a car here soon to replace my old truck however I may have to put that on hold until there is some clarification on the issue. I could bring some money over before January to avoid the potential issue of the truck purchase. Another case of Thailand killing the Golden Goose not satisfied with us spending our pensions here they want more. What are your thoughts? My thoughts are that you should try reading any of the numerous threads that already exist on this subject rather than add yet another one! Try this one, start at the end and work back. https://aseannow.com/topic/1306896-thai-government-to-tax-all-income-from-abroad-for-tax-residents-starting-2024/ 1 2 3 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post WilliamSmits Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 I am optimistic and think retirees will not get taxed on money transfered into Thailand. Alternatively, there are lots of ways to get money into Thailand without showing up in my Thai bank account. (like taking in out of ATM with foreign card, etc. etc) Just keeping 800.000 in an account is enough for immigration. 3 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post DrJack54 Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 (edited) OP, news article today in "Pattaya Mail" ...like many similar articles it does not clarify things. Suggest you ignore all this fuss. Think it's aimed at certain offshore accounts rather than eg Pensions. Article header in Pattaya Mail "Thai Revenue offers glimmer of clarification on tax changes" Edited November 25, 2023 by DrJack54 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Lite Beer Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 My thoughts are that you are worrying about nothing. Not going to happen for a long time if at all. Even if they did want to tax my measly frozen pension the allowances would take it out of the limits for tax. 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OJAS Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 24 minutes ago, LittleBear57 said: Does anyone actually know what the Taxation rate is in Thailand and is there a personal allowance free of Tax like in the UK.? https://www.rd.go.th/fileadmin/user_upload/AEC/AseanTax-Thailand.pdf 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Lacessit Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 I am wondering how the Thai authorities could possibly tax a pension paid into an account in the expat's country of origin. They have no information on where and how much it is. The other country would be unable to disclose said information without breaching data privacy laws. I suspect this is a brain fart, which will be dumped as soon as it is realized the cost of pursuing payment far exceeds any returns. 5 1 1 2 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post topt Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 1 minute ago, Lacessit said: I am wondering how the Thai authorities could possibly tax a pension paid into an account in the expat's country of origin. They have no information on where and how much it is. The original idea was to tax remittances into Thailand if you are tax resident here. Nothing to do with income kept outside the country. 4 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lacessit Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 2 minutes ago, topt said: The original idea was to tax remittances into Thailand if you are tax resident here. Nothing to do with income kept outside the country. You may be right. The prospect of Thai Immigration co-operating with the tax authorities to determine which pensioners are here for more than 180 days is not one that fills me with dread. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post BobBKK Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Mike Lister said: My thoughts are that you should try reading any of the numerous threads that already exist on this subject rather than add yet another one! Try this one, start at the end and work back. https://aseannow.com/topic/1306896-thai-government-to-tax-all-income-from-abroad-for-tax-residents-starting-2024/ I think a separate thread relating to the UK is very useful. I don't think those who are taxed in the UK, as I do, should lose sleep over this. Edited November 25, 2023 by BobBKK 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post biervoormij Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 1 hour ago, LittleBear57 said: I could bring some money over before January to avoid the potential issue of the truck purchase. Another case of Thailand killing the Golden Goose not satisfied with us spending our pensions here they want more. What are your thoughts? I think bringing the money over before January would be smart. You don't have to spend it on the new truck but avoiding any possible tax seems like a smart thing. I have transferred money into Thailand to live on in 2024 just so I can live my life without worrying about how the Thai government will implement this change. I personally don't have a lot of trust in the Thai government not trying to tax ex-pats. I hope it is not the case but they already tax the interest I get here and they feel it is ok to charge me more in the hospitals because I am a retiree. 6 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post 142857 Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 (edited) It is a very silly idea to start taxing the overseas income of Expats, but that has not been confirmed yet. For those expats with a bit of cash, set up a company, and LEND the money you bring into Thailand and then LEND that money from the company to yourself!! Accountants are cheap in Thailand. say 30K a year, but let's say you can live on a million baht a year, that represents an effective rate of tax of 3%. Peanuts compared to the max of 35%. the other way of sorting this, is not to bring it into Thailand. Use your offshore bank accounts and make sure you have a big limit on your ATM withdrawals. Just take out cash and the Thai Taxman is none the wiser... Edited November 25, 2023 by 142857 Need to add to comment. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lacessit Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 4 minutes ago, 142857 said: It is a very silly idea to start taxing the overseas income of Expats, but that has not been confirmed yet. For those expats with a bit of cash, set up a company, and LEND the money you bring into Thailand and then LEND that money from the company to yourself!! Accountants are cheap in Thailand. say 30K a year, but let's say you can live on a million baht a year, that represents an effective rate of tax of 3%. Peanuts compared to the max of 35%. the other way of sorting this, is not to bring it into Thailand. Use your offshore bank accounts and make sure you have a big limit on your ATM withdrawals. Just take out cash and the Thai Taxman is none the wiser... The Thais can't tax what doesn't get transferred in. Good thinking 99. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Moonlover Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 Whenever I see yet another thread being raised on this topic, I immediatly refer back to the original article on this matter, which stated quite clearly: 'Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'. (with apologies to the mods for the use of big fonts!) That's my mantra, and I'm sticking to it. 10 1 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhunLA Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 1 hour ago, Moonlover said: Whenever I see yet another thread being raised on this topic, I immediately ... ... ignore it with every other repetitive scaremongering, doom & gloom BS 😎 Maybe if OP actually searched for real info ... he/she/it may have found it 🙄 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post The Cyclist Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 This needs repeating for the benefit of the doomers & gloomers Quote Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranki Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 Which countries does Thailand have double tax treaties with? At the time of writing, Thailand has concluded 61 double tax agreements with countries worldwide. Armenia Hungary Poland Australia India Romania Austria Indonesia Russia Bahrain Israel Seychelles Bangladesh Italy Singapore Belarus Japan Slovenia Belgium Korea South Africa Bulgaria Kuwait Spain Cambodia Laos Sri Lanka Canada Luxembourg Sweden Chile Malaysia Switzerland China Mauritius Taipei Cyprus Myanmar Tajikistan Czech Republic Nepal Turkey Denmark Netherlands Ukraine Estonia New Zealand United Arab Emirates Finland Norway United States of America Germany Oman Uzbekistan Great Britain and Northern Ireland Pakistan Vietnam Hong Kong Philippines 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lacessit Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 45 minutes ago, cranki said: Which countries does Thailand have double tax treaties with? At the time of writing, Thailand has concluded 61 double tax agreements with countries worldwide. Armenia Hungary Poland Australia India Romania Austria Indonesia Russia Bahrain Israel Seychelles Bangladesh Italy Singapore Belarus Japan Slovenia Belgium Korea South Africa Bulgaria Kuwait Spain Cambodia Laos Sri Lanka Canada Luxembourg Sweden Chile Malaysia Switzerland China Mauritius Taipei Cyprus Myanmar Tajikistan Czech Republic Nepal Turkey Denmark Netherlands Ukraine Estonia New Zealand United Arab Emirates Finland Norway United States of America Germany Oman Uzbekistan Great Britain and Northern Ireland Pakistan Vietnam Hong Kong Philippines Someone might get demoted, CHINA is not listed. I don't know what benefit they will get out of taxing Bhutan expats. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlover Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 1 hour ago, cranki said: Which countries does Thailand have double tax treaties with? At the time of writing, Thailand has concluded 61 double tax agreements with countries worldwide. Armenia Hungary Poland Australia India Romania Austria Indonesia Russia Bahrain Israel Seychelles Bangladesh Italy Singapore Belarus Japan Slovenia Belgium Korea South Africa Bulgaria Kuwait Spain Cambodia Laos Sri Lanka Canada Luxembourg Sweden Chile Malaysia Switzerland China Mauritius Taipei Cyprus Myanmar Tajikistan Czech Republic Nepal Turkey Denmark Netherlands Ukraine Estonia New Zealand United Arab Emirates Finland Norway United States of America Germany Oman Uzbekistan Great Britain and Northern Ireland Pakistan Vietnam Hong Kong Philippines 33 minutes ago, Lacessit said: Someone might get demoted, CHINA is not listed. I don't know what benefit they will get out of taxing Bhutan expats. China, 12th down on the left. Where does Bhutan come into this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Zioner Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 1 hour ago, cranki said: Which countries does Thailand have double tax treaties with? At the time of writing, Thailand has concluded 61 double tax agreements with countries worldwide. Armenia Hungary Poland Australia India Romania Austria Indonesia Russia Bahrain Israel Seychelles Bangladesh Italy Singapore Belarus Japan Slovenia Belgium Korea South Africa Bulgaria Kuwait Spain Cambodia Laos Sri Lanka Canada Luxembourg Sweden Chile Malaysia Switzerland China Mauritius Taipei Cyprus Myanmar Tajikistan Czech Republic Nepal Turkey Denmark Netherlands Ukraine Estonia New Zealand United Arab Emirates Finland Norway United States of America Germany Oman Uzbekistan Great Britain and Northern Ireland Pakistan Vietnam Hong Kong Philippines This list is wrong.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleBear57 Posted November 25, 2023 Author Share Posted November 25, 2023 5 hours ago, OJAS said: https://www.rd.go.th/fileadmin/user_upload/AEC/AseanTax-Thailand.pdf Thanks that's interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post LittleBear57 Posted November 25, 2023 Author Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 3 hours ago, Moonlover said: Whenever I see yet another thread being raised on this topic, I immediatly refer back to the original article on this matter, which stated quite clearly: 'Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'. (with apologies to the mods for the use of big fonts!) That's my mantra, and I'm sticking to it. Thanks I must have missed the original article, and I knew the UK has a double tax agreement with Thailand. Wouldn't put it past the Thais to tax you and then make it difficult for you to claim back. No offence taken. 1 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlover Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 6 minutes ago, LittleBear57 said: Wouldn't put it past the Thais to tax you and then make it difficult for you to claim back. That's the way. End on a negative! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleBear57 Posted November 25, 2023 Author Share Posted November 25, 2023 6 hours ago, Mike Lister said: My thoughts are that you should try reading any of the numerous threads that already exist on this subject rather than add yet another one! Try this one, start at the end and work back. https://aseannow.com/topic/1306896-thai-government-to-tax-all-income-from-abroad-for-tax-residents-starting-2024/ I missed this article somehow. However it seems very clear it will not affect people from countries with a double taxation agreement. Thank you for posting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lister Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 2 minutes ago, LittleBear57 said: I missed this article somehow. However it seems very clear it will not affect people from countries with a double taxation agreement. Thank you for posting. Not exactly, keep reading. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleBear57 Posted November 25, 2023 Author Share Posted November 25, 2023 4 minutes ago, Moonlover said: That's the way. End on a negative! Must have been here too long. Things seemed so much easier and less confusing 15 years ago. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lister Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 4 minutes ago, LittleBear57 said: I missed this article somehow. However it seems very clear it will not affect people from countries with a double taxation agreement. Thank you for posting. It depends on whether your home country has a double taxation agreement with Thailand and the sources and amounts of your income. UK Government (Civil Service) pensions are exempt, State Pension is not, company and private pensions are not. The Thai tax system has fairly generous allowances and deductions plus a large zero rated band which means you can import around 10k Pound per year, without being subjected to Thai tax (which is tiered at 5%, 10% 15% 20% bands) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lacessit Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 51 minutes ago, Moonlover said: China, 12th down on the left. Where does Bhutan come into this? Missed that, greyscale type. Bhutan is mentioned as an example of an insignificant return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlover Posted November 25, 2023 Share Posted November 25, 2023 8 minutes ago, Lacessit said: 1 hour ago, Moonlover said: China, 12th down on the left. Where does Bhutan come into this? 8 minutes ago, Lacessit said: Missed that, greyscale type. Bhutan is mentioned as an example of an insignificant return. It's only natural I guess for folks to gravitate toward personal taxation when discussing DTAs, but actually they are more about business taxes and a designed to smooth out and simplify business transactions between nations. The fact that we benefit at a personal level is more a byproduct of those treaties. The treaties benefit both nations, which is why we are very unlikely to see any changes in our situations. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post MeaMaximaCulpa Posted November 25, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 25, 2023 7 hours ago, Lacessit said: I am wondering how the Thai authorities could possibly tax a pension paid into an account in the expat's country of origin. They have no information on where and how much it is. The other country would be unable to disclose said information without breaching data privacy laws. I suspect this is a brain fart, which will be dumped as soon as it is realized the cost of pursuing payment far exceeds any returns. You may want to think again... 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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