What Would You Have Israel Do to Defend Itself?

[OneMoreFarang]

10 minutes ago, Wobblybob said:

A year ago is not 80, stop trying to justify the crimes of these evil People, the rest of your post is just gibberish!

If you don't see that Israel did a lot of bad things for many years in that area, then I can't help you.

It must be nice to be convinced that only all the others are bad. It's so wonderful black and white and easy.

Enjoy your ignorance.

[Wobblybob]

7 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

If you don't see that Israel did a lot of bad things for many years in that area, then I can't help you.

It must be nice to be convinced that only all the others are bad. It's so wonderful black and white and easy.

Enjoy your ignorance.

It's obvious I cannot compete with a poster with a 130+ IQ, but there again I don't have to revert to insults when the argument is lost. 🙁

This is about a war that started on the 7/10, so don't start wars then claim you are the victim as it will not wash with right minded people! 

[Nick Carter icp]

1 hour ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

My moral compass is like: If someone does something bad to me and people I care about, then I hope whoever did that will be punished. 

In some countries for some crimes this punishment happens from the authorities. In other countries lots of bad people get away with horrendous crimes and the authorities do nothing. I understand when in such situations people fight against the bad guys and against the bad authorities.

 

And this is of course something which applies to many situations in many countries all over the world. 

 

When you write: "The past is long gone", do you apply this to anything? If someone murdered your family a year ago, was that in the past and long ago and it doesn't really matter anymore? Or 10 years? Or how long ago is long enough? 

 

   So you support Israel going into Gaza and punishing the people that carried out the Oct 7 th terror attack , because no one else will punish them and they got a reward going back to Gaza after committing war crimes 

[CG1 Blue]

4 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

As far as I know all countries, with the only exception of the USA and Israel, are demanding a ceasefire. So, it seems >90% of the world agrees that Israel should stop their aggression. 

I thought I read that Hamas refused to even confirm the number/names of hostages they're holding, let alone release them. That prevents a ceasefire from being possible. 

I don't understand why Hamas are being given such an easy ride in the propaganda war when they have shown zero signs of wanting peace in the region. 

 

Hamas' use of human shields is paying off spectacularly. No doubt other Islamist groups will use these actions as a blueprint for success in the future, especially given how the mass media have taken their side now. 

[OneMoreFarang]

3 hours ago, Wobblybob said:

This is about a war that started on the 7/10

 

UN Secretary-General Antonio Guterres: “It is important to also recognize the attacks by Hamas did not happen in a vacuum, the Palestinian people have been subjected to 56 years of suffocating occupation. They have seen their land steadily devoured by settlements and plagued by violence; their economy stifled; their people displaced and their homes demolished. Their hopes for a political solution to their plight have been vanishing.”

 

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/un-chief-says-hamas-attacks-did-not-occur-in-vacuum-sparking-israeli-fury/

[OneMoreFarang]

2 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   So you support Israel going into Gaza and punishing the people that carried out the Oct 7 th terror attack , because no one else will punish them and they got a reward going back to Gaza after committing war crimes 

 

Yes, the people who carried out the Oct 7th attack should be punished.

It was not necessary to kill >30,000 people, including lots of children, because of that attack. 

[OneMoreFarang]

2 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

I thought I read that Hamas refused to even confirm the number/names of hostages they're holding, let alone release them. That prevents a ceasefire from being possible. 

I don't understand why Hamas are being given such an easy ride in the propaganda war when they have shown zero signs of wanting peace in the region. 

 

Hamas' use of human shields is paying off spectacularly. No doubt other Islamist groups will use these actions as a blueprint for success in the future, especially given how the mass media have taken their side now. 

It seems to me Israel fights every Palestinians, not only Hamas. 

Why don't they allow food and water for innocent Palestinians?

[Nick Carter icp]

1 minute ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

Yes, the people who carried out the Oct 7th attack should be punished.

It was not necessary to kill >30,000 people, including lots of children, because of that attack. 

 

   Many of those 30 000 dead people in Gaza were the people responsible for the Oct 7 th attack , about half the dead were members of the terror group, it was also necessary to kill the civilians, woman and children in order to get to the terrorists 

[Nick Carter icp]

28 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

It seems to me Israel fights every Palestinians, not only Hamas. 

Why don't they allow food and water for innocent Palestinians?

 

  Do learn  bit more about the subject .

There is plenty of food and water  going in to Gaza

Do you only watch biased anti Israel news sources ?

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

  Do learn  bit more about the subject .

There is plenty of food and water  going in to Gaza

Do you only watch biased anti Israel news sources ?

I could ask: Do you believe everything "Israel" tells you?

Lots of international organizations confirm that people have no food. Do they all look at the wrong news? 

[Hummin]

1 hour ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I could ask: Do you believe everything "Israel" tells you?

Lots of international organizations confirm that people have no food. Do they all look at the wrong news? 

Can't reasons with extremists! 

[thaibeachlovers]

18 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

One of the things which Israel's politicians and population should do is to think about why there is something like "Hamas's aggression".

Did that aggression come out of nowhere? Or do Palestinians have reasons to be upset?

 

Does Israel's settler policy, with over 500,000 settlers on Palestinian territory, increase the chance of peace? Or is that one reason why there is no peace? Does the fact that Palestinians are thrown out of their houses in Jerusalem help to live in peace with the neighbors? Or does it give those neighbors just another reason to hate the occupiers?

 

Maybe it's time for Israel to radically change their politics. If Palestinians have food and water, will that help to make them happy? Sure. If Palestinians see that Israelis treat them like fellow human beings, will that help or hurt?

 

Obviously both sides do things wrong. But who is in charge? Who has the power to change something? Israel is in charge. And they can do whatever they want because the USA and many other countries let them get away with it. If Israel wants peace, then they should work on peace and don't make more and more war. Because if they treat their neighbors like animals then they should not be surprised if those neighbors react like starving dogs. 

It's good to see a sensible post. Just be prepared for the attacks for not supporting israel.

Edited March 29 by thaibeachlovers

[thaibeachlovers]

7 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

I don't understand why Hamas are being given such an easy ride in the propaganda war when they have shown zero signs of wanting peace in the region. 

That's likely because people that are not israeli apologists realise it was caused by decades of israeli oppression and land theft.

Despite their wishes, October 7 was not the start of this conflict.

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

18 hours ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

thats  irrelevant, all out  war  will decide what happens whether its  fair  or  not, many wars are not  just.

It's not and never will be a "war". It's just slaughter, IMO.

[thaibeachlovers]

17 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Mostly I gave up reading and watching news about this. Because what can any of us do? Nothing!

As long as the USA supports Israel almost unconditionally, they have no reason to change.

And it seems any US government will support Israel.

So, what can we do? Look at the news and think how unfair the world is? Or try to ignore it because we know it's unfair.

I'm with you on that. I've basically given up on Al Jazeera as it is just more Palestinian death and destruction every day, and it just sickens me that the leaders of the so called free world do nothing to stop it. South Africa and a few other western aligned countries have spoken up, but what can they do against the US and the colluder in chief, Biden?

 

All I can do is hope that America runs out of bombs to send before they are all dead.

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, herfiehandbag said:

A process which really would involve a genocide - there are what, 9.5 million Israelis. They would literally be driven into the sea and slaughtered. October 7, and all it's horrors would only be a "taster".

 

Israel knows and understands this. They will not lose. Ultimately they know that the only thing which will buy a generation of relative peace is to utterly destroy Hamas. Something else will eventually arise to replace them, but Israel will be prepared.

 

There is not going to be peace in Israel. End of.

LOL. Do you actually think such a thing is possible? Israel has the most powerful military in the region, and the US would step in if Iran tried to invade.

IMO the idea that israelis could be "driven into the sea and slaughtered" is ludicrous and just bad propaganda trying to justify an impossible to justify slaughter of Gazans.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

18 hours ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

thats  irrelevant, all out  war  will decide what happens whether its  fair  or  not, many wars are not  just.

We already know it's not fair. Why else are there huge demonstrations in support of the Palestinians?

Israel has already lost the support of most ordinary people. Only their "leaders" support israel's genocide. I look forward to the elections, when the colluders in genocide get the boot.

 

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/3/26/un-expert-accuses-israel-of-several-acts-of-genocide-in-gaza

UN expert accuses Israel of ‘genocide’ in Gaza

[Rampant Rabbit]

44 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

We already know it's not fair. Why else are there huge demonstrations in support of the Palestinians?

Israel has already lost the support of most ordinary people. Only their "leaders" support israel's genocide. I look forward to the elections, when the colluders in genocide get the boot.

 

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/3/26/un-expert-accuses-israel-of-several-acts-of-genocide-in-gaza

UN expert accuses Israel of ‘genocide’ in Gaza

UN "expert"  yeah they have such a  good track record, as for protests maybe because most people dont feel the need to go out on the streets. ie the VAST majority. Maybe next time Hamas butchers people  their followers  will think twice, if  not rinse and repeat

[Rampant Rabbit]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

It's not and never will be a "war". It's just slaughter, IMO.

well its not a  sunday afternoon picnic. Its   war alright, a  war of cultures amongst other things

[herfiehandbag]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

LOL. Do you actually think such a thing is possible? Israel has the most powerful military in the region, and the US would step in if Iran tried to invade.

IMO the idea that israelis could be "driven into the sea and slaughtered" is ludicrous and just bad propaganda trying to justify an impossible to justify slaughter of Gazans.

 

You don't really debate do you? You just use posts as a trigger, and excuse, for another of your predetermined rants.

 

Let me make my point again, as simply as I can; @Nick Carter icp postulated one possible scenario, the emergence of an Islamic theocracy which would defeat Israel and destroy it. I commented on that, suggesting what the implications would be for Israelis, and, broadly in line with his views, suggesting why it would be impossible!

 

Enter stage left @thaibeachlovers, shrieking from the gospel according to Al Jazira, doing a passable imitation of a bull having multiple orgasms in a china shop!

 

So no, if you had followed our discussion you would have realised that neither of us thought that Israel would lose, and it's people's be driven to slaughter. I was suggesting that would be a result of that scenario emerging and precisely why Israel would never allow itself to lose, or be allowed to lose.

 

Both @Nick Carter icp and (I hope) myself are reasonably intelligent and humane beings who abhor the casualties in Gaza as much as we do the slaughter on October 7th last, not purveyors of "ludicrous and bad propaganda", a role which you have rather made your own.

 

In summary, perhaps read the discussion?

 

 

Edited March 30 by herfiehandbag
Tidying up grammar.

[Wobblybob]

8 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

UN Secretary-General Antonio Guterres: “It is important to also recognize the attacks by Hamas did not happen in a vacuum, the Palestinian people have been subjected to 56 years of suffocating occupation. They have seen their land steadily devoured by settlements and plagued by violence; their economy stifled; their people displaced and their homes demolished. Their hopes for a political solution to their plight have been vanishing.”

 

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/un-chief-says-hamas-attacks-did-not-occur-in-vacuum-sparking-israeli-fury/

So there you have it, I hate to burst your bubble but Guterres is part of the problem, good grief some of the terrorists were UN members and to try and use the old excuse of picking a moment out of the air is beyond beggars belief to justify those horrific murder on 7/10. It is disgraceful and disingenuous at the very least and the people that were so brutally tortured by these animals were not even born when your link goes on to mention "56 years ago".

So as the topic title states "What Would You Have Israel Do to Defend Itself?"

 

[Nick Carter icp]

6 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I could ask: Do you believe everything "Israel" tells you?

Lots of international organizations confirm that people have no food. Do they all look at the wrong news? 

 

   Oh, you did say that people were starving and that is what we were discussing , now that you are saying that people have no food .

   Where did all the food go , the 27 tonnes of food that was part of just one food drop a few days ago and the many 100's of daily food trucks that go into Gaza go ? 

  Some people may have no food in their cupboards at home, but no one is actually starving , starving to death .

   Some people currently having no food doesn't mean that anyone is starving , it just means that they are waiting for the next food delivery 

[Nick Carter icp]

9 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

UN Secretary-General Antonio Guterres: “It is important to also recognize the attacks by Hamas did not happen in a vacuum, the Palestinian people have been subjected to 56 years of suffocating occupation. They have seen their land steadily devoured by settlements and plagued by violence; their economy stifled; their people displaced and their homes demolished. Their hopes for a political solution to their plight have been vanishing.”

 

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/un-chief-says-hamas-attacks-did-not-occur-in-vacuum-sparking-israeli-fury/

 

   Although Israel wasn't occupying Gaza , Israel completely withdrew from Gaza in about 1979

[Nick Carter icp]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

LOL. Do you actually think such a thing is possible? Israel has the most powerful military in the region, and the US would step in if Iran tried to invade.

IMO the idea that israelis could be "driven into the sea and slaughtered" is ludicrous and just bad propaganda trying to justify an impossible to justify slaughter of Gazans.

 

 

   I seem to recall that you recently predicted that soon the USA will no longer be a World power and will be overtaken by China and then at time China and Palestine would unite to defeat Israel 

[Nick Carter icp]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

 

Israel has already lost the support of most ordinary people.

 

   Once again, Palestinian  supporters speaking on behalf of the whole World 

[OneMoreFarang]

What I find sad in threads like this that there are always some Israel fanboys who deny any facts that Israel ever did anything wrong.

Israel great, Palestinians bad, all of them.

I wonder if these people think like that or just write like that.

 

How can anybody look at this conflict and not see that both sides contribute to the problems. Both sides fight each other since decades. Both sides blame the others.

 

I can understand that some people think Israel is more right, and other think the same about Palestinians. But anybody with open eyes and ears should acknowledge that there is no black and white. There is a lot of grey - and no easy solution. 

[Bkk Brian]

20 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

What I find sad in threads like this that there are always some Israel fanboys who deny any facts that Israel ever did anything wrong.

Israel great, Palestinians bad, all of them.

I wonder if these people think like that or just write like that.

 

How can anybody look at this conflict and not see that both sides contribute to the problems. Both sides fight each other since decades. Both sides blame the others.

 

I can understand that some people think Israel is more right, and other think the same about Palestinians. But anybody with open eyes and ears should acknowledge that there is no black and white. There is a lot of grey - and no easy solution. 

Making things up now then. Who are these fanboys who claim Irael have never done anything wrong and all Palastinians are bad?

[Nick Carter icp]

24 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

What I find sad in threads like this that there are always some Israel fanboys who deny any facts that Israel ever did anything wrong.

 

 

   OK, I will listen and decide .

What has Israel done wrong ?

What are those facts that they/we/I am denying ?

Tell me those facts which have been denied 

[Jeff the Chef]

1 hour ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Although Israel wasn't occupying Gaza , Israel completely withdrew from Gaza in about 1979

 

Close but no cigar: 

 

Israel's Disengagement from Gaza and North Samaria (2005)

 

https://embassies.gov.il/MFA/AboutIsrael/Maps/Pages/Israels Disengagement Plan- 2005.aspx#:~:text=By 22 September 2005%2C Israel's,settlements in Samaria%2C was completed.

[Hummin]

28 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

What I find sad in threads like this that there are always some Israel fanboys who deny any facts that Israel ever did anything wrong.

Israel great, Palestinians bad, all of them.

I wonder if these people think like that or just write like that.

 

How can anybody look at this conflict and not see that both sides contribute to the problems. Both sides fight each other since decades. Both sides blame the others.

 

I can understand that some people think Israel is more right, and other think the same about Palestinians. But anybody with open eyes and ears should acknowledge that there is no black and white. There is a lot of grey - and no easy solution. 

A soi dog, will always be just a soi dog for some!