Poll/Survey: Expat Tax Residency Status

[Skeptic7]

Since many/most of us are to be officially considered Thailand "tax residents", what's your plan of action❓

[BritManToo]

My plan is to do nothing, and expect them to be too lazy and incompetent to notice me.

[2ndhomepattaya]

Spend summer in Europe at my apartment. As a minimum, I avoid very hot temperature here and my family sees more of me. Looking forward to it.

[Skeptic7]

11 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

My plan is to do nothing, and expect them to be too lazy and incompetent to notice me.

Same for me 👍

[Mutt Daeng]

When I've been resident for 180 days this year, I will visit the local tax office and explain my tax situation and see whether I need to get a TIN and file a tax return.  With what is known so far, my tentative calculations indicate that I will not need to pay any Thai tax.

[bkk6060]

22 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

My plan is to do nothing, and expect them to be too lazy and incompetent to notice me.

Exactly, good one.

[TroubleandGrumpy]

11 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

When I've been resident for 180 days this year, I will visit the local tax office and explain my tax situation and see whether I need to get a TIN and file a tax return.  With what is known so far, my tentative calculations indicate that I will not need to pay any Thai tax.

Up to you - but not recommended.  They have not been 'trained' and dont really know themselves, but you will have drawn your name to their attention and that is usually a bad idea in Thailand.

 

When tax rules are changed in a 'civilised' country like say Aust. UK, USA - before the new rule takes effect the Tax Depts send detailed advice and information out to all the staff (with site by site training for big changes like this one), plus they publicise all the detailed information on the web for the taxpayers and provide Q&A services, and they inform/train all the accredited tax professionals. They aint happened in Thailand (yet) and who knows when it will happen - IMO you would be wise to stay quiet and what until that happens (if it ever does). Even then I would still not go and see them and ask anything - I would ask one of the 'informed' tax experts.

[JBChiangRai]

By far the best approach is to do nothing.

 

If they are going to make an example of someone, wait till they do it which I suggest they won't.

 

They WILL be pursuing large crypto sales though, regardless of nationality.

[JimHuaHin]

2 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

Up to you - but not recommended.  They have not been 'trained' and dont really know themselves, but you will have drawn your name to their attention and that is usually a bad idea in Thailand.

 

When tax rules are changed in a 'civilised' country like say Aust. UK, USA - before the new rule takes effect the Tax Depts send detailed advice and information out to all the staff (with site by site training for big changes like this one), plus they publicise all the detailed information on the web for the taxpayers and provide Q&A services, and they inform/train all the accredited tax professionals. They aint happened in Thailand (yet) and who knows when it will happen - IMO you would be wise to stay quiet and what until that happens (if it ever does). Even then I would still not go and see them and ask anything - I would ask one of the 'informed' tax experts.

Spot on TroubleandGrumpy.

 

For at least the past 50-odd years, whenever there have been changes to Australia's tax laws, policies, procedures, etc., the changes have been published in the media or in specialised tax publications (eg the annual Master Tax Guide, etc.), and for the last few decades on the ATO website.  So the average tax payer in Australia can access information on what changes are happening and how the changes will impact them.  And for some decades, tax information has been available in a number of "community" (read immigrant) languages.

 

Meanwhile, in Thailand .... the hub of hubs of hubs ....

[Skeptic7]

12 minutes ago, JimHuaHin said:

Meanwhile, in Thailand .... the hub of hubs of hubs ...

Right on. The hub of verbal "hub-bub" 

[WhatMeWorry]

3 hours ago, Skeptic7 said:

Since many/most of us are to be officially considered Thailand "tax residents", what's your plan of action❓

My plan is to pray to God about this situation and then do the right thing and obey the laws of Thailand.

[connda]

4 hours ago, Skeptic7 said:

Since many/most of us are to be officially considered Thailand "tax residents", what's your plan of action❓

I'm not doing anything. 

I've read the US DTA to determine what is taxable.  Actually nothing although Thailand could challenge me on my pension - my Social Security is untouchable via the DTA.  So I worked through the tax forms for my pension funds I remit to Thailand and worked out all of the exemptions.  I  don't remit anywhere near my Thai tax exemption threshold.  So - I'm doing nothing.  No plans to file unless I'm forced to.

What I'll probably end up doing is transferring more money to my US brokerage account and investing more of my pension instead of bringing it here.

So I plan to wait to see what 2025 brings and then reassess. 

 

 

[connda]

1 hour ago, JimHuaHin said:

Spot on TroubleandGrumpy.

 

For at least the past 50-odd years, whenever there have been changes to Australia's tax laws, policies, procedures, etc., the changes have been published in the media or in specialised tax publications (eg the annual Master Tax Guide, etc.), and for the last few decades on the ATO website.  So the average tax payer in Australia can access information on what changes are happening and how the changes will impact them.  And for some decades, tax information has been available in a number of "community" (read immigrant) languages.

 

Meanwhile, in Thailand .... the hub of hubs of hubs ....

Spot on. 

 

Thailand new tax rules:  Obfuscation Through Obscuration.

[mania]

I actually have a tax ID but only because years ago when Thai banks were giving 4% on savings I got taxed & was then allowed to reclaim it at the end of year. (Which was quite easy)

 

But this new deal we have a wait & watch attitude. We are retired but if we sell property elsewhere in the world there is a snowballs chance in hell that we would agree to pay taxes on that in Thailand just because we brought money in to use IN THAILAND.

 

That in itself is a benefit to Thailand & if they don't see it that way then of course we do not have to bring it in & spend it. We surely wouldn't give them 15-30% off the top of it! That would be Nuts 😉 

 

They have no rights to monies we receive in other countries thru years of investment

[Rimmer]

Thanks for the topic Skeptic7  I have moved your topic into the Jobs, Economy, Banking, Business, Investments forum where similar issues are already being discussed.

[Presnock]

I only have a US govt pension which according to the DTA is not assessible in Thailand plus I obtained the BOI LTR so am exempt on any foreign remittances so I will do nothing different unless they do add that even with nothing assessible, one who stays more than 180 MUST get a tax ID and in that case I will get an ID number IAW the new law which would have to be amended since it now states that one must get a tax ID number within 60 days after remitting assessible funds into Thailand.  I really do not believe they will be able to even begin processing all of the input from ex-pats and it will be interesting to hear how many Thais are actually affected if any.

[Mike Teavee]

I selected "Wait and see what happens. Take no action. Carry on same as before." as that's the closest option to what I'm doing but it's not really accurate as I'll be:-

• Reducing how much money I bring into Thailand to ensure that I stay below the number where I might have to pay Tax
• Remitting money directly to GF's bank account ensuring that she stays below the number where she might have to pay Tax
• Taking more overseas holidays paid for on my UK credit cards & using the £7,500 I brought back from the UK with me as spending money there.
• Spending down the savings I already have in Thailand   

Estimate I'll be bringing in approx. 25% of what I would normally bring in.  

[KannikaP]

1 hour ago, WhatMeWorry said:

My plan is to pray to God about this situation and then do the right thing and obey the laws of Thailand.

Which God please?

[connda]

18 minutes ago, KannikaP said:

Which God please?

The God of Taxes.

[Skeptic7]

1 hour ago, connda said:

I'm not doing anything. 

I've read the US DTA to determine what is taxable.  Actually nothing although Thailand could challenge me on my pension - my Social Security is untouchable via the DTA.  So I worked through the tax forms for my pension funds I remit to Thailand and worked out all of the exemptions.  I  don't remit anywhere near my Thai tax exemption threshold.  So - I'm doing nothing.  No plans to file unless I'm forced to.

What I'll probably end up doing is transferring more money to my US brokerage account and investing more of my pension instead of bringing it here.

So I plan to wait to see what 2025 brings and then reassess. 

 

 

Solid❗👍

[Skeptic7]

1 hour ago, Mike Teavee said:

I selected "Wait and see what happens. Take no action. Carry on same as before." as that's the closest option to what I'm doing but it's not really accurate as I'll be:-

• Reducing how much money I bring into Thailand to ensure that I stay below the number where I might have to pay Tax
• Remitting money directly to GF's bank account ensuring that she stays below the number where she might have to pay Tax
• Taking more overseas holidays paid for on my UK credit cards & using the £7,500 I brought back from the UK with me as spending money there.
• Spending down the savings I already have in Thailand   

Estimate I'll be bringing in approx. 25% of what I would normally bring in.  

Yeah was just keeping it simple. I'm taking same as your steps above...#1, #2 and #4. Thx for participating despite not being comprehensive...and for the excellent explanation. 👍

[NoDisplayName]

2 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

I selected "Wait and see what happens. Take no action. Carry on same as before." as that's the closest option to what I'm doing but it's not really accurate as I'll be:-

• Reducing how much money I bring into Thailand to ensure that I stay below the number where I might have to pay Tax
• Remitting money directly to GF's bank account ensuring that she stays below the number where she might have to pay Tax
• Taking more overseas holidays paid for on my UK credit cards & using the £7,500 I brought back from the UK with me as spending money there.
• Spending down the savings I already have in Thailand   

Estimate I'll be bringing in approx. 25% of what I would normally bring in.  

 

Agree with the above.  Spend down what I've already transferred in, any further transfers go via Wise to the wife's bank account.  She can then withdraw a monthly "salary" by ATM for me to spend locally.

 

I manage my investments to stay just below the taxable amount in the US.  Any tax here can not be claimed as a foreign tax credit on my US return, so I won't be able to "just get it back."

 

Major purchases requiring external funds will be delayed.........or cancelled.....pending how this clusterbomb is actualized.

 

If it's just a matter of limiting transfers in, that's manageable.  If it comes to providing certified copies of US tax returns at annual extension time, though.............

[KhunLA]

Interesting poll, in that there might actually be 50 or so members of AN that actually live in TH.

 

I guess we'll all be scrambling to the TRD when reports of fines are issued for not filing a tax return, whether tax due or not ...  

[connda]

58 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

Major purchases requiring external funds will be delayed.........or cancelled.....pending how this clusterbomb is actualized.

The Thai government doesn't seem to understand the real negative effects of their pursuit of more and more tax revenue.  This is one thing that I've read and reread by expats in this forum regarding their future purchases of big ticket items - they aren't going to make major purchases.  Of course - in a vicious cyclical manner - taxation creates an environment where those who are taxed make fewer purchases resulting in less VAT revenue which results and the government thinking up more "novel" methods of taxation - like the cluster-foxtrot that we are now experiencing here. 

Dear Foreigner scum - You never become real resident of Thailand because we think you all be national security risk to Thailand.  Foreigner bad. "Ai farang!"

But we make you Tax Resident so you pay your fair share like every Thai citizens....which you'll never be!  Now foreign scum, pull out wallet and give us money like real Thai citizen.....which you'll never be. 

🙄 Dear Thailand - We planned on purchasing a new car <enter other big ticket items here> this year, but now due to your decision to tax us like Thai citizens -- which we'll never be -- we're putting off all major purchases due to you taxing us like Thai citizens.....which you'll never allow us to be.
So - please feel free to kiss the Value Added Tax from those major purchase(s) we'd otherwise make (and all other future major purchases we'd otherwise make) good-bye 👋 as well as any taxes from funds we remit to Thailand -- as we simply won't be bringing foreign funds into Thailand except for those funds needed for basic needs. 

If you want to tax us like Thai citizens - then open up access to permanent residency to those of us whom you label as "Tax Residents."  Quid pro quo.

 

 

[connda]

34 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Interesting poll, in that there might actually be 50 or so members of AN that actually live in TH.

bob smith 

[Skeptic7]

1 hour ago, connda said:

This is one thing that I've read and reread by expats in this forum regarding their future purchases of big ticket items -

Right on. Have been looking to spend around 3 million baht on a condo in the Jomtien area, however that plan has been flushed down the commode 🚽 due to this this very topic. Will just continue renting. Happy as hell I purchased my Ford last year. NO more high dollar purchases for me in LOP...Land of Pilfer. 🚫

[Mike Lister]

Interesting to compare the results of this poll to the one we ran two weeks ago, wildly different results!

 

I see the expected Thai bashing posts from the usual suspects and also the longing for the warmth and safety of the nanny home state facilities. As an aside, I do wonder sometimes why some foreigners choose to live here when all they do is complain and tell us how much better things are back "home". But for the most part, it does look as though members have started to look into their personal tax situation, which is a good thing.

 

.

[jayboy]

6 hours ago, mania said:

 

actually have a tax ID but only because years ago when Thai banks were giving 4% on savings I got taxed & was then allowed to reclaim it at the end of year.

 

Are you sure it is still applicable? I'm pretty sure there was a reorganization a few years ago with different numbers being issued.But I may be mistaken.

[Flummoxed]

5 hours ago, KhunLA said:

Interesting poll, in that there might actually be 50 or so members of AN that actually live in TH.

The poll is pretty useless for the above reason. Personally I'm declaring as much tax as possible since I'm going through the citizenship process. More declared income = more points... So, why no "I'm paying as much tax as possible" option? Don't the 3 or 4 people like me count?

[Skeptic7]

2 hours ago, Flummoxed said:

The poll is pretty useless for the above reason. Personally I'm declaring as much tax as possible since I'm going through the citizenship process. More declared income = more points... So, why no "I'm paying as much tax as possible" option? Don't the 3 or 4 people like me count?

Now that makes 2 of us who are "flummoxed". 🤣