The Early Release of Thousands of Prisoners in UK Proves to be Very Unpopular

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1 hour ago, JonnyF said:

Even The Guardian are running stories highlighting what a stupid idea this is. Must be serious.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/society/article/2024/sep/10/police-left-to-deal-with-fallout-of-poorly-planned-early-release-of-1700-prisoners

 

 

Was it a stupid idea when the Conservates were in power?

[Bday Prang]

1 hour ago, MalcolmB said:

We have it all wrong, we should be sending over Thai Prison Governors to sort this out. 

They would create an extra 300,000 spots without building a single cell.

cram the bastards in and hand out free lube.

Nah , cram them in and ban the lube.  Oh dear is that hate speech ?   

[Bday Prang]

Just now, placeholder said:

Was it a stupid idea when the Conservates were in power?

It is obviously a stupid idea regardless of who is  "in power"     Another who has been blinded by this false, manufactured  left versus right distraction.    Cant't you see that they are all as bad as each other?    They must be laughing their heads off at the way people have fallen for it all,    

[JonnyF]

They've clearly thought this through and executed the plan brilliantly.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13838641/Inmate-arrested-suspicion-rape-sex-assault-SECONDS-released-Keir-Starmers-early-prison-release-scheme.html

 

What a farce. 

 

[placeholder]

1 minute ago, Bday Prang said:

It is obviously a stupid idea regardless of who is  "in power"     Another who has been blinded by this false, manufactured  left versus right distraction.    Cant't you see that they are all as bad as each other?    They must be laughing their heads off at the way people have fallen for it all,    

It may be obvious to you, but what's the solution? Apart from building more prisons? Is the UK locking up too many people in the first place? Are sentences too long? I don't know the answer to these questions. Do you have any genuine information you could provide that might answer these questions?

[IvorBiggun2]

4 hours ago, thesetat2013 said:

i am confused. Why is it such a big deal? Wasn't Australia initially populated mostly by convicts? That is what the history book told us in school anyway. 

No, the school books didn't tell us that . It was first populated by Aboriginals and Torres Strait Islander peoples. Thousands of years before convicts. Now go to the bottom of the class.

[IvorBiggun2]

Should ship them all to Rwanda along with illegal immigrants.

[James105]

18 minutes ago, placeholder said:

It may be obvious to you, but what's the solution? Apart from building more prisons? Is the UK locking up too many people in the first place? Are sentences too long? I don't know the answer to these questions. Do you have any genuine information you could provide that might answer these questions?

 

Deport foreign nationals who are in prison.   Keep UK nationals in prison. 

 

10,000 spaces freed up.   It's so ridiculously simple.   You are welcome.  

[JonnyF]

15 minutes ago, placeholder said:

It may be obvious to you, but what's the solution? Apart from building more prisons? Is the UK locking up too many people in the first place? Are sentences too long? I don't know the answer to these questions. Do you have any genuine information you could provide that might answer these questions?

 

Perhaps they could start by not jailing people for "offensive" FaceBook posts.

 

https://www.thewestmorlandgazette.co.uk/news/24514302.sellafield-worker-jailed-sharing-offensive-facebook-posts/

 

That way, they wouldn't have to release rapists, drug dealers etc. to make room for them.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13838641/Inmate-arrested-suspicion-rape-sex-assault-SECONDS-released-Keir-Starmers-early-prison-release-scheme.html

 

Just a thought. Crazy, I know. 

 

What was that saying when I was kid? "Sticks and stones may break my bones but words offensive FaceBook posts will never hurt me land me in jail within a week"? Something like that anyway...

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1 minute ago, James105 said:

 

Deport foreign nationals who are in prison.   Keep UK nationals in prison. 

 

10,000 spaces freed up.   It's so ridiculously simple.   You are welcome.  

If it was just about exporting them, you'd have point. But there another half to this problem which you are ignoring.

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2 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

Perhaps they could start by not jailing people for "offensive" FaceBook posts.

 

https://www.thewestmorlandgazette.co.uk/news/24514302.sellafield-worker-jailed-sharing-offensive-facebook-posts/

 

That way, they wouldn't have to release rapists, drug dealers etc. to make room for them.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13838641/Inmate-arrested-suspicion-rape-sex-assault-SECONDS-released-Keir-Starmers-early-prison-release-scheme.html

 

Just a thought. Crazy, I know. 

 

What was that saying when I was kid? "Sticks and stones may break my bones but words offensive FaceBook posts will never hurt me land me in jail within a week"? Something like that anyway...

Is this some kind of time travel thing? Where the future actually causes the past? Do you believe that there wasn't a problem with overcrowding and early release before?

[James105]

1 minute ago, placeholder said:

If it was just about exporting them, you'd have point. But there another half to this problem which you are ignoring.

 

Which half?   Enlighten me as to why we cannot release foreign nationals early to deport them, but we can release UK nationals early to cause mayhem.      

[oxo1947]

8 hours ago, Social Media said:

release thousands of prisoners early has sparked widespread concern and debate

 

 Don't know why.....................

 

Keir Starmer's early release scheme - as one inmate is re-arrested within SECONDS of getting out---- 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13840277/Former-senior-police-chiefs-warn-Britain-faces-new-crime-wave-thousands-prisoners-free-Keir-Starmers-early-release-scheme-one-inmate-arrested-SECONDS-getting-out.html

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1 minute ago, James105 said:

 

Which half?   Enlighten me as to why we cannot release foreign nationals early to deport them, but we can release UK nationals early to cause mayhem.      

‘Recalcitrant’ and ‘Uncooperative’: Why Some Countries Refuse to Accept Return of Their Deportees

https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/recalcitrant-uncooperative-countries-refuse-deportation

[JonnyF]

5 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Is this some kind of time travel thing? Where the future actually causes the past? Do you believe that there wasn't a problem with overcrowding and early release before?

 

Is this some kind of "blame it on the Tories" thing?

 

Is that really all you've got? It's Starmer's policy to release these people early. As stated he could easily free up spaces by releasing and deporting non UK citizens in the prison system. 

 

He could also release people jailed for hurty words on social media posts. 

 

Longer term he could stop sending billions in aid to foreign countries and build more prisons. Or stop illegals entering the country, some of whom commit crimes and end up in jail. That would have the added benefit of easing pressure on the NHS, schools, housing, public services etc. He'd have enough left to reverse his policy of removing pensioners winter fuel allowance.   

[James105]

4 minutes ago, placeholder said:

‘Recalcitrant’ and ‘Uncooperative’: Why Some Countries Refuse to Accept Return of Their Deportees

https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/recalcitrant-uncooperative-countries-refuse-deportation

 

Ah so you are saying it could be difficult, and the current government is too weak to attempt this.  That is your argument for this?  

[placeholder]

9 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

Is this some kind of "blame it on the Tories" thing?

 

Is that really all you've got? It's Starmer's policy to release these people early. As stated he could easily free up spaces by releasing and deporting non UK citizens in the prison system. 

 

He could also release people jailed for hurty words on social media posts. 

 

Longer term he could stop sending billions in aid to foreign countries and build more prisons. Or stop illegals entering the country, some of whom commit crimes and end up in jail. That would have the added benefit of easing pressure on the NHS, schools, housing, public services etc. He'd have enough left to reverse his policy of removing pensioners winter fuel allowance.   

Can you share with me your financial analysis that shows how much the savings would be? Amongst other things, I'm not sure that building prisons is a way to save money but I'm sure you will provide evidence to explain how that works.

[JonnyF]

4 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Can you share with me your financial analysis that shows how much the savings would be? Amongst other things, I'm not sure that building prisons is a way to save money but I'm sure you will provide evidence to explain how that works.

 

No, building prisons creates [drumroll......................], prison spaces.

 

It's really not that complicated if you think before posting. I already explained where the money could come from.

[placeholder]

4 minutes ago, James105 said:

 

Ah so you are saying it could be difficult, and the current government is too weak to attempt this.  That is your argument for this?  

No. I'm citing the report.

 

And the report does note that the EU is using conditionality, to enforce deportation. This means that aid is being withheld from some countries if they refuse to accept deportees from EU nations. Of course the EU nations have a lot more clout in this regard than does the UK. 

[Bday Prang]

5 minutes ago, placeholder said:

It may be obvious to you, but what's the solution? Apart from building more prisons? Is the UK locking up too many people in the first place? Are sentences too long? I don't know the answer to these questions. Do you have any genuine information you could provide that might answer these questions?

                 I don't have the answers, its not my job or my responsibility .   but its pretty obvious that we have been failed repeatedly by all governments  ( both left and right if there is such a thing)  whos job it is to sort this kind of stuff out.   Regarding that depressing fact I do at least have a thoery  as to why it has happened.

                I work as an engineer in the construction industry, a rather high pressure environment, where incompetance is totally unacceptable, anybody who fails to make the grade does not last long, They are gone ,  never to return, that is not to say that there are no chancers , but they are inevitably weeded out sooner rather than later, 

                Compare that to politics where no qualifications are required  and  even those guilty of major incompetance are pretty much unsackable,  Is an environment like that condusive to efficiency  or inclined to provide us with the best service ?  I hardly think so.

                 This left verses right rubbish is total fiction, they create the illusion that they are battling it out , almost at each others throats, all for our benefit but it is just a carefully manicured and choreographed illusion.  There are 650 of them in total and they are all without exception in it for themselves, Its not left verse right , its them verses the electorate.  Lying and deceit is considered perfectly acceptable behaviour and incompetance is not an issue until it is percieved to cost them votes

                 Once their "days work" is completed and they all retire to one of the generously subsidised bars and restaurants in the building does anybody really think that their political differences continue to be expressed and argued about, ?   Of course not, rather they enjoy a good laugh at our expense, whilst patting each other on the back. eternally thankful for the stupidity of the electorate who put them there, and for the system in place that ensures this will continue

[placeholder]

7 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

No, building prisons creates [drumroll......................], prison spaces.

 

It's really not that complicated if you think before posting. I already explained where the money could come from.

Even if all the savings from cancelling all foreign aid was to be realized, a politically sure way to reduce even further the UK's influence and access to world trade, might there not be other sectors competing for those funds? 

[Bday Prang]

59 minutes ago, placeholder said:

It may be obvious to you, but what's the solution? Apart from building more prisons? Is the UK locking up too many people in the first place? Are sentences too long? I don't know the answer to these questions. Do you have any genuine information you could provide that might answer these questions?

I tend to believe that too many people are locked up for too long for the wrong reasons,  How many people are banged up for not paying their TV licence fee ?  I can't be bothered looking it up but I am reasonaby certain the figure is in the thousands and I have heard that the vast majority of those are single parent unmarried mothers

 I am in no way an expert on penal reform  but it strikes me that just blindly following a system that was dreamed up hundreds of years ago  by locking people up in prisons , most of which where built hundreds of years ago has been a complete failure and is in serious need of a total rethink.  Just like our political system itself  which is totally unfit for service and I include the whole civil service too

[placeholder]

1 minute ago, Bday Prang said:

I tend to believe that too many people are locked up for too long for the wrong reasons,  How many people are banged up for not paying their TV licence fee ?  I can't be bothered looking it up but I am reasonaby certain the figure is in the thousands and I have heard that the vast majority of those are single parent unmarried mothers

 I am in no way an expert on penal reform  but it strikes me that just blindly following a system that was dreamed up hundreds of years ago  by locking people up in prisons , most of which where built hundreds of years ago has been a complete failure and is in serious need of a total rethink.  Just like our political system itself  which is totally unfit for service and I include the whole civil service too

I doubt that thousands are being locked up on account of delinquent TV license fees. I found this article, which, while certainly condemning the criminalization of delinquent license fees, did not mention any case where someone was locked up.

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2024/feb/29/tv-licence-fee-scandal-1000-people-week-casually-criminalised

That said, there are certainly categories like drug offenses, which ought to be decriminalized, or, at worst, have sentences sharply reduced.

[Bday Prang]

2 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Even if all the savings from cancelling all foreign aid was to be realized, a politically sure way to reduce even further the UK's influence and access to world trade, might there not be other sectors competing for those funds? 

But do we need or indeed actually have any "influence" or all this access to world trade ?     Simple example, where I lived in the UK was a farming area good soil produces quality vegetables, yet when I visit the local supermarket  most of the vegetables seem to  come from the other side of the world.  Do people really need to eat  out of season strawberries from Egypt in the middle of winter ?  Of course not.   Sure some natural resources will need to be traded and imported but is it all absolutely necessary? 

[mikeymike100]

2 hours ago, Bday Prang said:

Personally I think "SURREAL" would be a better descriptive.  along with  "very very worrying"  jailing people for "wrongspeak" is straight out of 1984 and where will it stop ?     They are already replacing the term "illegal immigrant" with  "irregular immigrant" how long before it becomes a crime to use the original term?    If this state of affairs continues I think we can expect a lot more early releases of increasingly dangerous prisoners to make way for those who have said , or even just thought the wrong things, 

A recent example being a woman who was standing silently near an abortion clinic accused of "praying" 

This is not just about immigration,  it is about a nasty authoritarian government who have become very unpopular very quickly, making an example of anybody who dares to disagree with them.  It is in effect an extension of the current "cancel culture"  

 

 

Totally agree with your post! What is very scary is that this 'trend' to prosecute posters on facebook etc is getting worse and obviously the UK Government is attempting to intimidate people into submission.

What is equally scary is that the the UK Government do not believe there is 2 tier policing, even though there is insurmountable evidence. Things are looking very bleak for the UK!

 

[JonnyF]

10 minutes ago, Bday Prang said:

But do we need or indeed actually have any "influence" or all this access to world trade ?     Simple example, where I lived in the UK was a farming area good soil produces quality vegetables, yet when I visit the local supermarket  most of the vegetables seem to  come from the other side of the world.  Do people really need to eat  out of season strawberries from Egypt in the middle of winter ?  Of course not.   Sure some natural resources will need to be traded and imported but is it all absolutely necessary? 

 

Certainly not to the tune of 11 Billion for the 'climate' crisis when we can't afford to stop pensioners freezing to death.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/article/2024/jul/26/ed-miliband-labour-honour-pledge-11bn-overseas-climate-aid

 

[BarraMarra]

1 hour ago, placeholder said:

It may be obvious to you, but what's the solution? Apart from building more prisons? Is the UK locking up too many people in the first place? Are sentences too long? I don't know the answer to these questions. Do you have any genuine information you could provide that might answer these questions?

How do you put an end to a prolific shoplifter, or someone who constantly breaks into cars or steals motorcycles ? they have to be taken off the streets but here in the UK if your sentenced for a stretch your out half way into your stretch do you think there going to change there way's ? it gets worse for the ones homeless there put up in Hotels. 

[MalcolmB]

2 hours ago, JonnyF said:

 

? Just deport any illegals in the prison system. Immediately. No appeal. Straight into the cargo hold of the nearest RAF plane and back to their country of origin. 

RAF plane.

A rubber dingy and push them out to sea.

Towards France.

[Bday Prang]

10 minutes ago, mikeymike100 said:

Totally agree with your post! What is very scary is that this 'trend' to prosecute posters on facebook etc is getting worse and obviously the UK Government is attempting to intimidate people into submission.

What is equally scary is that the the UK Government do not believe there is 2 tier policing, even though there is insurmountable evidence. Things are looking very bleak for the UK!

 

Several senior police officers themselves have admitted to the existence of 2 tier policing, in fact one would have to be blind or in denial to dispute it.   Another worrying thought is that even if this government is voted out at the first opportunity, historically new governments have always been very reluctant to overturn any legislation put in place by previous administrations.  As an example one would have expected any labour government to have cancelled maggies move to enable people to buy their own council houses, but it  never got a mention did it? 

[placeholder]

18 minutes ago, Bday Prang said:

But do we need or indeed actually have any "influence" or all this access to world trade ?     Simple example, where I lived in the UK was a farming area good soil produces quality vegetables, yet when I visit the local supermarket  most of the vegetables seem to  come from the other side of the world.  Do people really need to eat  out of season strawberries from Egypt in the middle of winter ?  Of course not.   Sure some natural resources will need to be traded and imported but is it all absolutely necessary? 

No, it's not absolutely necessary. But how much of what people consume is actually necessary?