Doing work at wife farm!

[Hummin]

Time for a new tread what you can do or not do at your own/wife land tread. 

 

My wife is going to ask emigration today, "what can my husband do at my farm while he is living with me and have a retirement visa". I'm curious if anybody else has asked emigration the same question. We are not a big commercial farm, and have little sales of fish, fruits and nuts which I never do anything about.

 

 

[fondue zoo]

 

fingers crossed

 

 

 

 

[MalcolmB]

I doubt you will get a straight answer.

Ask ten different officers get 10 different answers.

But good luck.

 

 

[actonion]

8 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Time for a new tread what you can do or not do at your own/wife land tread. 

 

My wife is going to ask emigration today, "what can my husband do at my farm while he is living with me and have a retirement visa". I'm curious if anybody else has asked emigration the same question. We are not a big commercial farm, and have little sales of fish, fruits and nuts which I never do anything about.

 

 

My Thai wife is a member of  our Village Committee, so I sometimes used to get involved, painting,  reparing things around the viilage, until a Thai Resident asked why is a Farang doing work,  and not a Thai, my wife pointed out that  I am a  Volunteer,   and a Thai would want money to help,  that promted me into asking Immigration what, if any work i can do, one officer said if im volunteering then its no problem, another officer  1 month later said i would be subject to arrest,  they make up the rules as they go along, be careful

[Hummin]

Just now, MalcolmB said:

I doubt you will get a straight answer.

Ask ten different officers get 10 different answers.

But good luck.

 

 

Exactly 

 

I think asking will only make them more aware of you, but I already moved back to my country anyway, and are just here on temporary basis from now on. 

[Tropicalevo]

16 minutes ago, actonion said:

My Thai wife is a member of  our Village Committee, so I sometimes used to get involved, painting,  reparing things around the viilage, until a Thai Resident asked why is a Farang doing work,  and not a Thai, my wife pointed out that  I am a  Volunteer,   and a Thai would want money to help,  that promted me into asking Immigration what, if any work i can do, one officer said if im volunteering then its no problem, another officer  1 month later said i would be subject to arrest,  they make up the rules as they go along, be careful

 

Technically, you do need a work permit for volunteer or charity work.

However, it is down to the individual in charge.

I was at a meeting that was trying to sort out beach patrol and life saving here on the island.

I asked the mayor if I would need a work permit in order to help.

His response was that no one will ever have a problem doing volunteer work that helps the community or saves lives. No work permit needed.

 

I have said this many times - there is the letter of Thai law and there is the spirit of Thai law.

Spirit wins every time.

[novacova]

37 minutes ago, actonion said:

one officer said if im volunteering then its no problem,

Wrong.

37 minutes ago, actonion said:

another officer  1 month later said i would be subject to arrest

Correct.

 

Though personally I have done a lot of “volunteer” work for my wife, out of sight of others of course. A permit is not required for doing chores and maintenance around the house and building your house. Though a permit is required I do believe if you’re going to pitch in on helping a contractor do labor…?

Edited September 23 by novacova

[FritsSikkink]

31 minutes ago, actonion said:

My Thai wife is a member of  our Village Committee, so I sometimes used to get involved, painting,  reparing things around the viilage, until a Thai Resident asked why is a Farang doing work,  and not a Thai, my wife pointed out that  I am a  Volunteer,   and a Thai would want money to help,  that promted me into asking Immigration what, if any work i can do, one officer said if im volunteering then its no problem, another officer  1 month later said i would be subject to arrest,  they make up the rules as they go along, be careful

You should ask the Labor office for starters and not immigration. the Labor law says you need a work permit for any work and you won't get one with a retirement visa. then you have the list of work which you aren't allowed to do anyway.

[Hummin]

Today's Emigration officer, answered to my wife question, that I could do everything and anything in our home! She was even laughing, and joking I maybe did not want to work. 

 

I can not verify, because I was not there today to register my homecoming. However, we/wife can still not register online, so every time we or she have to drive 182km round-trip. 

 

So goo's news or is it bad news ?  

[kickstart]

This subject has come up before, more than once, then as now they are some that work on their farm with basically no paperwork, I have been doing it for a good few year now along with other farangs. Last time someone wrote, and I can agree, they said, if keep yourself to yourself, lean to speak some Thia, help out with some of your neighbors, as well as getting on with, then you will be ok. I helped a local farmer calve one of his cows one evening he was well happy; I was in his good books.

On our place everything is in the wife's name, you could say I am just a part time volunteer.

 

[MarkBR]

12 hours ago, Hummin said:

Time for a new tread what you can do or not do at your own/wife land tread. 

 

My wife is going to ask emigration today, "what can my husband do at my farm while he is living with me and have a retirement visa". I'm curious if anybody else has asked emigration the same question. We are not a big commercial farm, and have little sales of fish, fruits and nuts which I never do anything about.

 

 

Can your wife be a cooking school, and you pay her while she teaches you to cook for 5 years?

[connda]

It's not a problem unless they come and arrest you, throw you in jail, and deport you...then it's a problem.  There ya go!

[rattlesnake]

12 hours ago, actonion said:

My Thai wife is a member of  our Village Committee, so I sometimes used to get involved, painting,  reparing things around the viilage, until a Thai Resident asked why is a Farang doing work,  and not a Thai, my wife pointed out that  I am a  Volunteer,   and a Thai would want money to help,  that promted me into asking Immigration what, if any work i can do, one officer said if im volunteering then its no problem, another officer  1 month later said i would be subject to arrest,  they make up the rules as they go along, be careful

 

Yeah, I would posit that it's riskier asking them (and bringing attention to you) than saying nothing at all.

[actonion]

So, in the eyes of Immigration, and or, the Labour office, Painting  / Maintaining your own house, or Digging your own Garden, is considered working, and taking away  work that a Thai national could be paid to do, where do they draw the line?

[SAFETY FIRST]

On 9/23/2024 at 8:27 AM, Hummin said:

ask emigration today

 

On 9/23/2024 at 8:27 AM, Hummin said:

has asked emigration

 

15 hours ago, Hummin said:

Today's Emigration officer

Can you write immigration, you are not emigrating and we don't have an emigration officer. 

 

Good luck with your immigration situation, I hope it goes well for you. 

 

 

Edited September 24 by SAFETY FIRST

[Hummin]

4 hours ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

 

 

Can you write immigration, you are not emigrating and we don't have an emigration officer. 

 

Good luck with your immigration situation, I hope it goes well for you. 

 

 

I do not have a problem with emmigration, we where just curious about the rules, and I have seen it comes up once and awhile. 

 

I have done, and doing work at our farm, just not anything with those things we make money on. Like picking fruit or vegetables, or driving my wife or her family around for selling fruit, fish or vegetables. I do regular maintenence, but to be true, I do not support my family here to work full time myself. They work for me, taking care of what we have built up here, and Im basically doing what I can do, which they can not do only. 

 

Work for money I do in my orign country, and now we both moving as quick she get her visa. I already moved in April, but still on OA extension for now. 

 

To be true, I never had any problem with immigration, except the normal new documentation things, and small details that made us drive forth and back using extra days or wasting extra days, like last year, they needed two originals of my income letter 😄 Just pissing you around with a smile, and say my boss have said so. First time my embassy experienced that, but was willing to send me a new one in mail, so I did not need to return to BKK for a new one. 

 

 

[Hummin]

4 hours ago, actonion said:

So, in the eyes of Immigration, and or, the Labour office, Painting  / Maintaining your own house, or Digging your own Garden, is considered working, and taking away  work that a Thai national could be paid to do, where do they draw the line?

On yours and your wife private property you are registered on, you can do anything. I can not say if you dealing with harvesting, cleaning and packaging if thats allowed, or slaughter live stock for sale, but thats not an issue. Common sense is of course necessery her as every other place you dealing with officials around Thailand. There is not one set with clear rules. 

[FritsSikkink]

12 minutes ago, Hummin said:

On yours and your wife private property you are registered on, you can do anything. I can not say if you dealing with harvesting, cleaning and packaging if thats allowed, or slaughter live stock for sale, but thats not an issue. Common sense is of course necessery her as every other place you dealing with officials around Thailand. There is not one set with clear rules. 

The Labor Law is very clear.

[JonnyF]

I am in a similar situation. 

 

We have a small farm that I go to at the weekends and sometimes might want to do a bit of light stuff like mowing the lawn, painting a wall, digging a hole for a plant or whatever. If I did this, I think technically they could say I was working as a gardener/handyman but as long as you are discrete about it then I don't think it's going to be an issue. 

 

I also have a tractor that is used to till the dirt on a small motocross track that I have in the top field. That worries me more as I think if I were to drive it then they could claim it was  commercial farm work, but as it is just a hobby I think it might just be a warning not to do it again and then the wife would have to do it. 

 

Ultimately I think someone would have to have it in for you and report you. We employ a few locals and give out surplus fruit to the villagers etc. so I don't think it would be an issue, if I were to do this (which of course I wouldn't dream of doing 😊)

 

In summary, I think they could get you on it if you really upset someone, otherwise they would be fine with it. Thai style enforcement of the law.  

[Dan O]

5 hours ago, actonion said:

So, in the eyes of Immigration, and or, the Labour office, Painting  / Maintaining your own house, or Digging your own Garden, is considered working, and taking away  work that a Thai national could be paid to do, where do they draw the line?

You can do normal maintenance and upkeep to the property but you are excluded from participating in any active on the farm that generates income or in providing service to others. I believe  Volunteering is actually illegal if not on that permission to stay. 

[Gobbler]

On 9/23/2024 at 8:27 AM, Hummin said:

Time for a new tread what you can do or not do at your own/wife land tread. 

 

My wife is going to ask emigration today, "what can my husband do at my farm while he is living with me and have a retirement visa". I'm curious if anybody else has asked emigration the same question. We are not a big commercial farm, and have little sales of fish, fruits and nuts which I never do anything about.

 

 

Stupid me, I thought they produce wives. I was ready to order two.

[Hummin]

14 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

The Labor Law is very clear.

There is very few proved cases, at least I know of where anybody had trouble working on their own property.

 

So again, this is just assuming how the law is practiced. 

[Hummin]

5 minutes ago, Dan O said:

You can do normal maintenance and upkeep to the property but you are excluded from participating in any active on the farm that generates income or in providing service to others. I believe  Volunteering is actually illegal if not on that permission to stay. 

Working as an volunteer, you need visa to, so at your own land (wife land where you are part 50%) you can do work, no need for work permit. 

[Dan O]

10 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Working as an volunteer, you need visa to, so at your own land (wife land where you are part 50%) you can do work, no need for work permit. 

Yes thats what I wrote. Its too different issues and working on the farm in the way I wrote is not volunteering. 

Edited September 24 by Dan O

[FritsSikkink]

9 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Working as an volunteer, you need visa to, so at your own land (wife land where you are part 50%) you can do work, no need for work permit. 

No, first it isn't your land but your wife's and secondly:

 

Prohibited jobs for foreigners in Thailand | Thaiger (thethaiger.com)

What jobs can’t foreigners do

Thailand has a list of restricted jobs for foreigners, often called the “reserved occupation” list. These jobs are protected for Thai nationals to avoid competition in fields that don’t require specialised foreign expertise. Some of these include:

• Manual labour: Anything involving construction, carpentry, or factory work.
• Agriculture: Farming, animal husbandry, forestry, or fishing are restricted.
• Retail and trading: Owning or managing a small retail shop or working as a market vendor is off-limits.
• Artisan and craft jobs: Jobs like woodworking, hairdressing, goldsmithing, and sculpture are reserved for Thai nationals.
• Driving: Driving jobs, including taxi driving or truck driving, are not allowed for foreigners.

[Hummin]

Just now, FritsSikkink said:

No, first it isn't your land but your wife's and secondly:

 

Prohibited jobs for foreigners in Thailand | Thaiger (thethaiger.com)

What jobs can’t foreigners do

Thailand has a list of restricted jobs for foreigners, often called the “reserved occupation” list. These jobs are protected for Thai nationals to avoid competition in fields that don’t require specialised foreign expertise. Some of these include:

• Manual labour: Anything involving construction, carpentry, or factory work.
• Agriculture: Farming, animal husbandry, forestry, or fishing are restricted.
• Retail and trading: Owning or managing a small retail shop or working as a market vendor is off-limits.
• Artisan and craft jobs: Jobs like woodworking, hairdressing, goldsmithing, and sculpture are reserved for Thai nationals.
• Driving: Driving jobs, including taxi driving or truck driving, are not allowed for foreigners.

I'm done with this loop, because you mix paid professional work, with personal property home maintenance and daily routines.

 

And yes, as married, you own 50% if gained during your marriage. 

[recom273]

On 9/23/2024 at 8:42 AM, actonion said:

My Thai wife is a member of  our Village Committee, so I sometimes used to get involved, painting,  reparing things around the viilage, until a Thai Resident asked why is a Farang doing work,  and not a Thai, my wife pointed out that  I am a  Volunteer,   and a Thai would want money to help,  that promted me into asking Immigration what, if any work i can do, one officer said if im volunteering then its no problem, another officer  1 month later said i would be subject to arrest,  they make up the rules as they go along, be careful

 

That's quite strange, with regard to working parties / village life (I never get asked anyway, my wife is just one of the "madam" Mia farang anyway) but when you speak to locals they are unaware of the hoops we need to jump through to get a visa, or the need for a wp, they just presume because we are married that we can just do whatever we want, and that most westerners dont do anything because they are loaded or incapable - I remember painting my road facing lounge and attracting an audience who watched in disbelief as they couldn't paint a wall with a roller themselves.

[FritsSikkink]

16 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I'm done with this loop, because you mix paid professional work, with personal property home maintenance and daily routines.

 

And yes, as married, you own 50% if gained during your marriage. 

The Labor Law doesn't have separate rules for "paid professional work, with personal property home maintenance and daily routines."

You own no land during your marriage. 

[NativeBob]

Imm. officers are only enforcing the law, not arguing the applications and definitions. If they arrest you - it doesn't matter on what reason, but they must come up with such document within 24 hours  (maybe not that, don't care). 

 

You can only challenge your detention in the court, not in the garden on car wash. And yes, you can always sue back. In any case I kindly tell any smart a** to go whistle.

 

Why is this childish paranoia? Esp that recent story about two silly shmucks at Koh Phangan.  

[Hummin]

3 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

The Labor Law doesn't have separate rules for "paid professional work, with personal property home maintenance and daily routines."

You own no land during your marriage. 

Is a joint ownership while married.

 

https://thailand.acclime.com/guides/marital-property-assets/?sfw=pass1727159642

 

3 minutes ago, NativeBob said:

Imm. officers are only enforcing the law, not arguing the applications and definitions. If they arrest you - it doesn't matter on what reason, but they must come up with such document within 24 hours  (maybe not that, don't care). 

 

You can only challenge your detention in the court, not in the garden on car wash. And yes, you can always sue back. In any case I kindly tell any smart a** to go whistle.

 

Why is this childish paranoia? Esp that recent story about two silly shmucks at Koh Phangan.  

It is pure paranoia, since nobody can come up one case where this have been an issue.