5 hours ago, stevenl said:

China is right. Give in and trump will come back for more.

China is the most dangerous country in the world. Xi is a dictator. Argue against this,

3 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

No dude, because the Chinese are MORE prone to the effects of tariffs, because they export more, that is why they are weaker. It's not rocket science.

 

No dude, only 14% of their exports goes to the US, that is about 1/8th of their exports, and thay may actually replace that 14% with exports to some of the ~200 countries in the world, that will import less from the US now

1 minute ago, Cameroni said:

 

That's not the most relevant issue. The most relevant issue is that China is about to lose 400 billion USD worth of market share. Whereas America is not losing very much at all from Chinese tariffs.

 

As Germany showed when it replaced 94 per cent of Russian oil imports with alternative suppliers from Canada to Norway, it is always possible to find alternative suppliers. Including for rare earths, btw, which can be recycled.

 

Clearly it is China that will suffer the most, 400 billion USD is not chump change to an economy that is already in trouble.

First of all, stop with the "very big number" stuff. Sure that would be a very big number for Germany or France, but not so much for China. What does it take to make you understand that less than 14% of China's exports go to the USA? And exports are only 20% of China's GDP.

But the real problem with your comment is that you keep on sticking to your prejudice that the buyer has the advantage. That's true if there's of competition among the sellers. But if the sellers are all or mostly located in China, that means that the stuff the buyer needs is either going to be hugely more costly or not available.

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

As an American, your egregious arrogance is the reason many Australians question whether an ally who cuts and runs from multiple conflicts when a fickle public gets tired is worth having.

 

You lost in Vietnam. You lost in Iraq. You lost in Afghanistan. You are hanging Ukraine out to dry. As an ally, you're not worth p!ssing on.

 

FYI, 5.5% of the Australian population is Chinese. They are probably one of the most law-abiding and hard-working racial groups, but then we don't share your bigotry and racism.

Haha you do not know me well enough to say I am a bigot or racist... What i do know is the Chinese though after living there many years. 

I am not saying the US is better. It is clear to see you are a bitter person angry at the US for dumping Ukraine because they want to continue their wars at Americans expense.  Hmm... I do not see Australians volunteering their tax money and divvying out trillions to pay for their war. 

1 hour ago, placeholder said:

Who were these leftists saying Harris would win by a landslide. Stop making things up.

 

I will not name names.

But those that stated this belief here know who they are.

 

2 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

I will not name names.

But those that stated this belief here know who they are.

 

And there were plenty of Trump partisans in the 2020 election who predicted that Trump would win. Oh, wait a minute, I forgot. They're still claiming that he really won but that the election was stolen. Now that's just plain pathetic.

50 minutes ago, CallumWK said:

 

Too late.

 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-begging-china-deal-over-163200207.html

 

Trump Is Begging China to Make a Deal Over Tariffs

 

The fundamental problem here is that it is already TOO LATE once you begin this kind of WORLD WAR....

 

China will NEVER FORGET, and never is the word.

 

The US has shown its hand.

The US wants to exclude China from trade, and cripple China.

China can never forget, and will now be hellbent on never letting this happen again.

 

There is no turning back.

 

Things will get grim.

There is no doubt about this.

GRIM, I say!!!!

 

Beginning now, and for the next many months.

 

 

15 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

China is the most dangerous country in the world. Xi is a dictator. Argue against this,

I don't know about the most dangerous country, i'd say USA is on par. Yes, Xi is a dictator, why would i argue against it?

How does this relate to my post? Give in to trump now and he'll be back for more.

Trump is a bully and generally speaking most people (and countries) despise bully's so on this one I'm with China.

 

What Trump has done to America's allies is despicable we now increasingly see the USA under Trump not as an ally but more of an advasary and certainly not an ally we can trust, the USA is very soon going to find itself with very few if any friends if Trump wants to isolate the USA from the rest of the world he can have it.

 

It's not just countries I for instance positively will not buy American or American brands if I can possibly find an alternative.

 

On my own that is of no importance at all but there are millions just like me and there is only one man if you can call him a man that is responsible for all this.

2 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

The fundamental problem here is that it is already TOO LATE once you begin this kind of WORLD WAR....

 

China will NEVER FORGET, and never is the word.

 

The US has shown its hand.

The US wants to exclude China from trade, and cripple China.

China can never forget, and will now be hellbent on never letting this happen again.

 

There is no turning back.

 

Things will get grim.

There is no doubt about this.

GRIM, I say!!!!

 

Beginning now, and for the next many months.

 

 

Griminess for the next many months. That's just what the people who voted for Trump signed up for. Grimness. It's a good thing he didn't make extravagant economic promises before he was elected...just kidding.

2 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Griminess for the next many months. That's just what the people who voted for Trump signed up for. Grimness. It's a good thing he didn't make extravagant economic promises before he was elected...just kidding.

 

By grimness, I am only saying that we can look forward, fairly soon, to hyperinflation in the USA.

Maybe depreciation and collapse of the US Dollar.

 

This economic war with China will last a VERY LONG time.

 

Nobody knows, but can only guess, the outcome.

Even I do not know.

 

 

 

 

8 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

The fundamental problem here is that it is already TOO LATE once you begin this kind of WORLD WAR....

 

China will NEVER FORGET, and never is the word.

 

The US has shown its hand.

The US wants to exclude China from trade, and cripple China.

China can never forget, and will now be hellbent on never letting this happen again.

 

There is no turning back.

 

Things will get grim.

There is no doubt about this.

GRIM, I say!!!!

 

Beginning now, and for the next many months.

 

 

Ah! The CCP shill has spoken. Beware. 

1 minute ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

By grimness, I am only saying that we can look forward, fairly soon, to hyperinflation in the USA.

Maybe depreciation and collapse of the US Dollar.

 

This economic war with China will last a VERY LONG time.

 

Nobody knows, but can only guess, the outcome.

Even I do not know

If your outlook is correct, which is dubious in the extreme, I can't see it lasting much past the next midterms.

51 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

Oh, is it time for a visit from Tel Aviv again?

Please explain!

5 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

That's not the most relevant issue. The most relevant issue is that China is about to lose 400 billion USD worth of market share. Whereas America is not losing very much at all from Chinese tariffs.

 

As Germany showed when it replaced 94 per cent of Russian oil imports with alternative suppliers from Canada to Norway, it is always possible to find alternative suppliers. Including for rare earths, btw, which can be recycled.

 

Clearly it is China that will suffer the most, 400 billion USD is not chump change to an economy that is already in trouble.

American farmers lost heavily in Trump's first presidency. Soybeans, grains, meat, tree nuts and cotton. 

 

Boeing has 760 unfilled aircraft orders. Most are from China, who has now halted deliveries. Each aircraft is about $55 million, making a market loss of $40 billion. You think Boeing will survive that?

 

It takes 5-7 years to develop the mine and processing infrastructure for iron ore, which is quite a lot simpler than what's required for rare earths. What are you going to do in the interim?

 

So you think countries exporting rare earths to America are not going to slap an export tax on them, in response to Trump's tariffs? Dream on.

 

IIRC it was Teddy Roosevelt who said when you have them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow. IMO it's China that has the firmer grip.

 

 

 

 

Just now, placeholder said:

If your outlook is correct, which is dubious in the extreme, I can't see it lasting much past the next midterms.

 

You mean you believe that China will forget this by midterms, if Trump were to be thrown out?

I would think not.

China will do what is necessary to protect its economy from similar situations in the future.

 

What these measure may turn out to be, let's wait and see.

 

6 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

Nobody knows, but can only guess, the outcome.

Even I do not know.

 

What a pointless post. 

9 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

By grimness, I am only saying that we can look forward, fairly soon, to hyperinflation in the USA.

Maybe depreciation and collapse of the US Dollar.

 

This economic war with China will last a VERY LONG time.

 

Nobody knows, but can only guess, the outcome.

Even I do not know.

 

 

 

 

I thought you loved Donald?

Have you come to your senses?

 

18 minutes ago, stevenl said:

I don't know about the most dangerous country, i'd say USA is on par. Yes, Xi is a dictator, why would i argue against it?

How does this relate to my post? Give in to trump now and he'll be back for more.

Since Trump started this Xi has nothing to loose as he is not accountable to "his people" but the orange one will become so at the md terms.

6 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

American farmers lost heavily in Trump's first presidency. Soybeans, grains, meat, tree nuts and cotton. 

 

Boeing has 760 unfilled aircraft orders. Most are from China, who has now halted deliveries. Each aircraft is about $55 million, making a market loss of $40 billion. You think Boeing will survive that?

 

It takes 5-7 years to develop the mine and processing infrastructure for iron ore, which is quite a lot simpler than what's required for rare earths. What are you going to do in the interim?

 

So you think countries exporting rare earths to America are not going to slap an export tax on them, in response to Trump's tariffs? Dream on.

 

IIRC it was Teddy Roosevelt who said when you have them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow. IMO it's China that has the firmer grip.

 

 

 

 

 

Boeing was already in trouble anyway, maybe it will be bailed out, maybe it won't, but clearly Boeing has deeper issues than Chinese cancellations. I can't imagine Trump will let them fail, but let's see.

 

Yes, farmers lost a few orders, but overall, the losses the US sustains are a fraction of the losses the Chinese have to bear. Again, they made 400 Billion USD from the US market. They are hurting way more than America.

 

The US may solve the rare earths issue with reycycling technology, it's not a big concern.

 

China has very little. America holds the better cards.

28 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

I will not name names.

But those that stated this belief here know who they are.

 

if you cannot post any names or proof why make the pointless post? (as usual for you)

33 minutes ago, placeholder said:

And exports are only 20% of China's GDP

 

You may want to check the figures, 20% of China's GDP is 3.5 TRILLION USD. Now maybe you come from a very rich family, but for most Chinese peasants that's a lot of fortune cookies.

 

 

40 minutes ago, CallumWK said:

 

No dude, only 14% of their exports goes to the US, that is about 1/8th of their exports, and thay may actually replace that 14% with exports to some of the ~200 countries in the world, that will import less from the US now

 

Only 400 billion USD. Okay gotcha.

 

Good look finding new buyers for 400 billion USD worth of product. I'm sure that'll be very easy, especially after the Chinese have been dumping their products all over Asian countries and destroying local industries like the Indonesian garment industry. I'm sure Asian countries are so looking forward to paying for 400 billion USD of Chinese products and ruin yet more of their indigenous industries. Oh no wait, they're already worried about the Tsunami of Chinese products about to come their way.

41 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

China is the most dangerous country in the world. Xi is a dictator. Argue against this,

And how does that comment mitigate against the fact that Trump cannot win because of the fact that he does not face elections but the orange idiot will do during the mid terms!

45 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

Yes, that's what Chinese are known for the world over. Sticklers for rules they are. Put the Swiss to shame.

Please explain the relevance, if any, of that comment in relation to the topic?

34 minutes ago, thesetat said:

Haha you do not know me well enough to say I am a bigot or racist... What i do know is the Chinese though after living there many years. 

I am not saying the US is better. It is clear to see you are a bitter person angry at the US for dumping Ukraine because they want to continue their wars at Americans expense.  Hmm... I do not see Australians volunteering their tax money and divvying out trillions to pay for their war. 

You don't know much history, do you? Australia has spent its blood and treasure in wars you have started, going way back to Korea. Pine Gap and North West Cape on Australian soil has made us a nuclear target.

 

I am angry because putting tariffs on a staunch ally with whom the US has a positive trade balance is the act of an ingrate, without any decency whatsoever.

 

You have probably drunk so much Trump KoolAid you don't realize he is turning friends into enemies.

10 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

You may want to check the figures, 20% of China's GDP is 3.5 TRILLION USD. Now maybe you come from a very rich family, but for most Chinese peasants that's a lot of fortune cookies.

 

 

What's that got to do with China's exports to the US?

1 hour ago, placeholder said:

You have entirely missed the point. You believe that in this situation it's the buyer who holds the advantage. But that only works in a marketplace where the seller has competitors. Now it's true that individual Chinese manufacturers do have competitors. But it's other Chinese manufacturers. So when that whole extraordinary industrial ecosystem is blackballed, it's not the Chinese who will suffer the most. After all, the American share of their exports is less than 14 percent. But where are the Americans going to find these products?

Trump has massive factories springing up overnight. It's reminiscent of Hitler marshaling non-existent armies to defend Berlin.

 

America has tariffs on everyone. China is offering zero tariff trade deals to everyone. Who is going to get more market share in that situation?

6 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

You don't know much history, do you? Australia has spent its blood and treasure in wars you have started, going way back to Korea. Pine Gap and North West Cape on Australian soil has made us a nuclear target.

 

I am angry because putting tariffs on a staunch ally with whom the US has a positive trade balance is the act of an ingrate, without any decency whatsoever.

 

You have probably drunk so much Trump KoolAid you don't realize he is turning friends into enemies.

Tariffs on Australia is mainly about beef imports. Banned for 20 odd years because of a mad cow disease outbreak in the US in 2003. The 10% tariff on Australia according to all opinions I've seen will have very little impact. As for Pine Gap and North West Cape you're talking more than 50 years ago (late 60's NW Cape/early 70's pine Gap). The US will always be Australia's greatest military ally.

38 minutes ago, placeholder said:

What's that got to do with China's exports to the US?

 

You don't think the US will be the only ones to slap tariffs on China? The EU have already done so. So have Turkey, Brazil, Indonesia and many others. The Asean countries are worried sick that now that the US has closed its doors there will be an avalanche of cheap Chinese products coming their way. Destroying more of their indigenous industries, the way Chinese dumping has already done in the past. You don't think they will put their own tariffs in place?