9 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

More like stupidity.

 

 

One man's love is another man's stupidity.

 

 

You have obviously been burned in the past............................which you would classify as stupidity.

Looks ugly; take it down! 😉 

Just now, StayinThailand2much said:

Looks ugly; take it down! 😉 

 

 

Looking at the other day having breakfast.......and couldn't work out if it was under construction or finished and an abomination.......5555

1 hour ago, Look Chang said:

This foreign money benefited the many bar girls in Pattaya and their families, so it can't be called a loss..

I don’t think bargirls and their families constructed that condo.

39 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

 

 

One man's love is another man's stupidity.

 

 

You have obviously been burned in the past............................which you would classify as stupidity.

Never had a Thai missus.  Never sent money for a sick buffalo.  Happy to rent when the need "arises."    I'm still here while I have seen many go home broke and either back to work or onto welfare. 

 

Did you know they have even written books about it? 

To purchase or not to purchase, in hindsight it was a good move to purchase. Lived in it for 10 years at 1.9 Mil, rented it out for 10 years, sold it for 3.5. I'm very happy!!.

6 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

More misleading real estate posting by yourself.

 

I've posted the math before in regards to property.  Below is condensed version.   

 

Currently, Australian banks are paying around 5% interest.  My managed fund returns more, and Australian Super even more again.  

 

You don't factor in the returns on the cost of the condo being near, equal, or higher than the rent, in which one can pay peanuts more, the same, or keep the difference and be ahead, and still have the funds "liquid" with no risk of being scammed, or fees, or maintenance costs, and can move anytime should they wish to or have to.   

 

Since when CAN'T you have your own things in a leased property????

 

So, you agree with the member, the median price is the same, or lower.  Where's the capital gain?  You post that there isn't one, and in fact there is a possibility of a loss. 

 

Your words:  "10 years ago we were selling View Talay 5 high floor seaview studio condos for around 3.25 MB to 3.5 MB.  Hipflat today has high floor seaview VT5 studio condos listed for around 2.8 MB to 3.5 MB."

 

The top asking price hasn't moved in 10 years. Like the member said, they were lucky to get their money back. 

 

So then you look to "saved rent" as the the main return on investment, because it's not capital gain.   

 

Let's look at some numbers.  Given what you say is true, let's pick the average between 3,250,000 baht and 3,500,000 baht. 

 

3,500,000 - 3,250,000 = 250,000.

 

The mid way figure is 3,375,000.

 

3,375,000 x 5% = 168,750 / 12 months =  14,062 baht per month. 

 

By your own admission condo fees are 1,000 a month, which the tenant does not pay. 

 

You also do not factor in property maintenance, and given the poor build quality here, that could be significant, but the owner would most likely be up for an air conditioner, fridge, hot water system and washing machine within 10 years because they do not build things like they used to.  These are the main items, but let's not forget microwave, TV etc, then you have lighting, leaking taps, switches and power outlets, and possibly, tiling, which would be a significant cost. 

 

As can be seen in the above figures, you basically get to live "rent free" in the same Thai condo in VT5, without condo fees and property maintenance, with your capital still at call and safe in a bank in your home country, with the freedom of moving condo's should you want to or have to, possibly due to old age and / or ill health, and no agents fees and taxes to pay upon selling. 

 

Not to mention, the risk of foreign property ownership in Thailand.

 

Now, I think bank interest was not 5% 10 years ago, but rents were cheaper also. 

 

Why would someone buy????  Their money is tied up in a Thai condo that you admit makes no capital gain in 10 years, and they have to pay fees and maintenance to pay also. 

 

Now, the elephant in the room is life expectancy.  You don't mention that either in your "saved rent" formula.  In Australia, depending on when you were born, retirement age is 65 or 67 years of age.  Of course, if you are self funded, you can retire when you like, but you can not access your Super until 60 years of age. 

 

Retiring at 65, and moving to Thailand and buying a condo in VT5, the "saved rent" as you call it, to equal the cost of the condo in years, the owner must live for another 18.75 years before the rent saved surpasses the outlay for the cost of the condo. 

 

15,000 per month rent x 12 months = 180,000 baht.

 

3,375,000 (median of your low and high price) / 180,000 baht = 18.75 years. 

 

65 + 18 = 83 years old. 

 

How many expats do you know here who are over 83 years old????

 

I haven't even mentioned the risk of the condo block becoming a hotel with daily rental, or management skimming / incompetence and the block becoming a dump and decreasing in value significantly.  

 

Once again, why would anyone buy, short or long term???? 

 

I rent, and have my own bed, entertainment system, and lounge. 

 

Since when is having your own furniture some type of financial gain over owning instead of renting? 

 

       The big question for me is whether someone will have the financial discipline to save that 3.75MB over the years.  Or, will they fritter it away over time, when this or that financial desire comes up.   How many people have started out with what they thought was a nice financial nest egg and, somehow, managed to end up with little as the years went by. 

      Owning property has been very good to me financially over the years and I like owning a property asset that I can pass on to my Thai spouse.  And, we both like owning rather than renting someone else's space.   If there are no Thai relatives in the picture, that might make a difference in one's thinking, living here.   Or, if one already owns property in one's native country, with plans to return.  Also whether full-time or part-time in Thailand.   I'm here full-time and for the long haul, with no plans to return to the US--and certainly hope to live to 83 or more. 

      For us, buying makes more sense, especially now when we have moved up to buying and living in pool villas that would rent for around 60,000 baht a month or more.   I think it all just comes down to some people preferring to rent, and others preferring to buy, with a lot depending on their particular circumstances and wants.  There's no right or wrong answer.  Whatever floats your boat. 

     And, once again, it doesn't have to be an either or proposition--you either rent a property and invest your money or you buy a property and don't invest your money.  There's no reason you can't do both--as many, including my spouse and I, do.  We don't have all our financial eggs in one basket but, instead, have a combination of cash, properties, stocks, and mutual funds.  

I kinda got used to this eyesore. It really stands out in the Bali Hai area, and has become an essential part of the scenery. I might miss it either way, whether demolished or turned into something that is not an eyesore. 

1 hour ago, KhunHeineken said:

 

 

Did you know they have even written books about it? 

 

 

I have read most of them.........but you can't beat experience...😂

Is half the money there in the building already ?

 

The foundation and cement structure seems sound so would it cost 50% to finish the project, kitting out the electrical and plumbing work - or is that more like another 70% to 80% of the cost ?

 

 

 

 Can’t wait to see the demolition special broadcasted on tv - oh never mind, I wont live that long.  

3 hours ago, Edina said:

To purchase or not to purchase, in hindsight it was a good move to purchase. Lived in it for 10 years at 1.9 Mil, rented it out for 10 years, sold it for 3.5. I'm very happy!!.

Happy?  

Why, you think it was a good investment?

2 hours ago, hotandsticky said:

 

 

I have read most of them.........but you can't beat experience...😂

Most guys only get one chance here in Thailand, after retirement. 

 

Make poor decisions, and back to your home country on welfare you go.  Of course, she could be "different." 

2 hours ago, NickyLouie said:

Is half the money there in the building already ?

 

The foundation and cement structure seems sound so would it cost 50% to finish the project, kitting out the electrical and plumbing work - or is that more like another 70% to 80% of the cost ?

 

 

 

Concrete cancer. 

On 10/7/2025 at 4:02 PM, Will B Good said:

 

 

I wonder how many innocents have money tied up in this?

 

I'd never buy in Thailand, but buying off the plot can be suicidal.

Make a good casino 

9 hours ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

You've missed out on high returns. 

 

I've bought a dozen properties in Pattaya over the decades.

Some say I'm a gambler, Bitcoins, shares on the stock market, kilograms of gold, sexy Thai chicks 

Life is a gamble. 

 

The suicidal guys are long gone 

 

Is your first name Wayne

6 minutes ago, theshu25 said:

Is your first name Wayne

Oh, it's you again, you're the Japanese guy who was assaulted recently. 

 

3 hours ago, newnative said:

The big question for me is whether someone will have the financial discipline to save that 3.75MB over the years. 

 

 

Firstly, you have changed from promoting the virtues of property ownership here, to the financial discipline of the individual.  That's quite a back flip.

 

Secondly, do you accept the math?  Yes, or no? 

 

It was 3,375,000 in the example, which was the median of the upper and lower sale prices you posted, and they don't have to save it, they have already saved it.

 

I think what you are getting at is will they have the discipline to not spend it, and if they don't, it basically funds pretty much rent free living here.  Thus, the "rent is dead money" or "saved rent" argument falls down. 

 

3 hours ago, newnative said:

How many people have started out with what they thought was a nice financial nest egg and, somehow, managed to end up with little as the years went by. 

How many don't? 

 

TIP:  Rent and pay as you go in Thailand, including your women. 

 

3 hours ago, newnative said:

Owning property has been very good to me financially over the years and I like owning a property asset that I can pass on to my Thai spouse. 

Those days are over, and as previously discussed, leaving a property to a Thai spouse is like leaving an anchor now.  I'm sure the Thai spouse would prefer cash, rather than a property they can't liquidate. 

 

3 hours ago, newnative said:

Or, if one already owns property in one's native country, with plans to return. 

That's also a smart move.  Rent out a property in your home country, the proceeds of which will more than cover the rent in Thailand, and some, with that property actually realizing a capital gain over the longer term.  

 

3 hours ago, newnative said:

For us, buying makes more sense,

Based on what, storing furniture? 

 

Where's the financial "sense?" 

 

3 hours ago, newnative said:

I think it all just comes down to some people preferring to rent, and others preferring to buy, with a lot depending on their particular circumstances and wants.  There's no right or wrong answer.  Whatever floats your boat. 

Sure, but when people like yourself promote owning as an "investment" I laugh. 

 

You even posted 10 years later the top asking price in VT5 has not changed. 

 

3 hours ago, newnative said:

And, once again, it doesn't have to be an either or proposition--you either rent a property and invest your money or you buy a property and don't invest your money. 

You still don't get it. 

 

Not buying in Thailand IS the investment. 

 

3 hours ago, newnative said:

There's no reason you can't do both--as many, including my spouse and I, do.  We don't have all our financial eggs in one basket but, instead, have a combination of cash, properties, stocks, and mutual funds.  

Yes, and I have property also, but it's just not in Thailand as it's a waste of money. 

3 hours ago, Edina said:

To purchase or not to purchase, in hindsight it was a good move to purchase. Lived in it for 10 years at 1.9 Mil, rented it out for 10 years, sold it for 3.5. I'm very happy!!.

Those days are long gone. 

 

Do you think you could do the same now? 

6 hours ago, newnative said:

   So, even if they just got 'their money back', they've saved on '10+ years' of rent so they still should come out ahead or at least break even.   Plus, they had 10+ years of living in their own space, with their own things, rather than likely tacky rental quality stuff--from the bed to the tv and everything else. 

   For example, 10 years ago we were selling View Talay 5 high floor seaview studio condos for around 3.25 MB to 3.5 MB.  Hipflat today has high floor seaview VT5 studio condos listed for around 2.8 MB to 3.5 MB.  If someone bought one of those VT5 studios 10 years ago for 3.25 to 3.5 MB, they would have saved 1.8 MB in rent at 15,000 baht a month or 1.2 MB in rent at 10,000 baht a month.  In both cases, subtract 120,000 baht from the savings for 10 years of condo fees at 1,000 baht a month.

     Short-term, if often makes more sense to rent.  Or, if you want to be able to move from one place to another quickly.   But, if you are going to be here for longer periods, especially 10 years or more, there can be some advantages to owning, especially if you like being able to do whatever you want with your space and like have all your own furniture, art, good bed and mattress, high-grade appliances, large tvs, etc.  

This assumes that the B3M was not invested in something else. 

 

B3M at 6% earns you the B15K a month, and 4% would earn you B10K a month. 

 

Invested in the S & P over the last ten years, the B3M would be worth over B11M today.

 

To be clear, I own my own home and would not have it any other way, 

11 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

This assumes that the B3M was not invested in something else. 

 

B3M at 6% earns you the B15K a month, and 4% would earn you B10K a month. 

I've pointed out similar.

 

11 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Invested in the S & P over the last ten years, the B3M would be worth over B11M today.

 

Or, one can just use the return to pay the rent on the exact same condo in Thailand. 

 

12 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

To be clear, I own my own home and would not have it any other way, 

How long ago did you buy it?

 

It makes no financial sense to buy now. 

7 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

I've pointed out similar.

 

Or, one can just use the return to pay the rent on the exact same condo in Thailand. 

 

How long ago did you buy it?

 

It makes no financial sense to buy now. 

I bought one about 10-15 years ago and one about six months ago. 

 

I did not buy them to save money, I bought them because I like owning my home. 

 

Of course, if you can get a decent loan, buying a home makes a lot more sense than if you are just buying outright, 

A monument to corruption in Pattaya

10 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

I bought one about 10-15 years ago and one about six months ago. 

 

I did not buy them to save money, I bought them because I like owning my home. 

 

Of course, if you can get a decent loan, buying a home makes a lot more sense than if you are just buying outright, 

So, you bought for sentimental reasons.  I get that.  At least you are not promoting it as an "investment" like another member constantly does, because it's simply not.

 

I can understand guys basically getting a loan for a property, through their Thai girl's name, so they don't get screwed over. 

 

15 years ago, those days are long gone.  Too much oversupply here now, and they keep building. 

4 minutes ago, ross163103 said:

A monument to corruption in Pattaya

And broken dreams. 

2 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

So, you bought for sentimental reasons.  I get that.  At least you are not promoting it as an "investment" like another member constantly does, because it's simply not.

It is absolutely an investment, just not a great one. 

 

There are clear benefits to both owning and renting, 

2 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

I can understand guys basically getting a loan for a property, through their Thai girl's name, so they don't get screwed over. 

I would never get a loan in someone else's name.

2 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

15 years ago, those days are long gone.  Too much oversupply here now, and they keep building. 

Where is here? 

10 hours ago, petermik said:

Looking forward to another 10 years of discussions about what to do with it, I'm guessing the powers that be will be hoping a sink hole will swallow it up...

Well it’s swallowed up quite a few bank accounts 🤷🏼

3 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

It is absolutely an investment, just not a great one. 

How and when do you hope to realize a financial benefit? 

 

4 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

I would never get a loan in someone else's name.

That's not the way it goes. 

 

The Thai girl gets the loan.  The farang gives her money to pay the loan every month.  You don't own the property, nor is it completely in her name.  The bank owns it.  If she dumps the farang, all he loses is around the cost of rent he would have to pay anyway, and she's left dealing with the bank over the loan.  It simply keeps the Thai girl "honest" and no one has to go over a balcony.   

 

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Where is here? 

Pattaya, but many tourist places in Thailand are similar. 

1 minute ago, KhunHeineken said:

How and when do you hope to realize a financial benefit? 

I don't. But I do not have to realize a financial for it to be an investment. 

 

1 minute ago, KhunHeineken said:

 

That's not the way it goes. 

 

The Thai girl gets the loan.  The farang gives her money to pay the loan every month.  You don't own the property, nor is it completely in her name.  The bank owns it.  If she dumps the farang, all he loses is around the cost of rent he would have to pay anyway, and she's left dealing with the bank over the loan.  It simply keeps the Thai girl "honest" and no one has to go over a balcony.   

You are talking about something other than what I was talking about. 

1 minute ago, KhunHeineken said:

Pattaya, but many tourist places in Thailand are similar. 

Similar in what way? 

11 hours ago, MalcolmB said:

It serves as a huge phallic symbol reaching into the sky which celebrates all the money lost over the years by foreigners in Pattaya.

You should buy it to create a monument dedicated to bar girls.