5 hours ago, xtrnuno41 said:

Very different, Phil girl has already 2 phones from you and Phuket girl not even 1.

Phil girl, you want to fly to Phil to get her and fly her into Thailand.

Phuket girl is paying a lot and only gets a grumpy old man

You have a strange way in affection.

Phil girl has one phone still. I would have already bought Phuket Girl a phone if her demands were reasonable, but she insisted on an Apple 16 or 17, and if Android an S24. She may be worth it, but it's too early for that.

The mistake I made with Phuket Girl, was that, despite knowning she is the best choice, I still texted BKK girl and Filipina Virgin. I didn't think much of it at the time. It was clear to me that Phuket Girl was the full priority. I'd spent far more time with her, all day and night really. So if I texted the others for 3 minutes whilst she was in the bathroom, it didn't seem like a big denial of loyalty. It was only for friendship really, the bond, as I did not feel they deserved to just be blocked coldly. Now, that was clearly a mistake, because Phuket Girl ended up seeing the texts and it's all about perception.

Whilst the reality was that I never had any intention to see BKK girl again, and the texting was base level friendship texting, this is not what Phuket Girl sees. She sees a guy who is writing to a lot of women, who's asking BKK girl if she'll come after new year, to her this makes me out as a liar, unreliable, untrustworthy, ie all the overthinking, perception errors possible. None of that applies. But it doesn't matter. It LOOKS that way. Perception is everything.

So I should have been even more loyal. I was loyal in that Phuket Girl was always a priority. But that was not enough. I had to be seen as being totally loyal too.

I wasn't and now Phuket girl is still quite angry with me. Hence her refusal to call, send the things I ask for etc.

3 hours ago, mangkut70 said:

Why would she not call you in front of her aunt? If you are someone special to her, if she sees you as the lottery-win future, she would gladly and proudly introduce you to family and friends. (Unless she can’t because she did this already with someone else. In a traditional Isaan village she can do this once – well, maybe every five years 😋).

Well, she did want to introduce me to her family, she asked me repeatedly, several times, to come with her to Sisaket. When I decided not to, due to work reasons, no doubt she was not impressed. The reason she's not calling, not sending her location or a pic, is simple, she doesn't like me now, she's still angry with me. She wouldnt' do anything for me now.

In terms of being a "lottery-win", clearly I'm not in her eyes. Because she thinks she could make 100,000 a month as a bar girl or escort, so unless you gave her 200,000 baht a month she'd always think she can make more alone. And I am 30 years older than her. Yes she finds me attractive, but a 30 year age gap is not exactly a dream come true, even for a girl who prefers older men.

3 hours ago, mangkut70 said:

This “if you have a problem with me, we can break up” is textbook. Drives the hook even deeper.

Seriously, if you are able to provide a generous allowance every month there are thousands of girls who would be happy and treat you like a king. The way she acts seems not worth the trouble.

Why not ghost her for a change? And see how she reacts?

That's exactly what I did.

Yesterday I was becoming a bit irate. I'd asked her to send me a location link, her address, a photo of her with her aunt, to do a video call etc...Simply because I still have a concern about who she is with, where she is etc.

This irritated her a lot. In the evening I just decided to not post any more. So I didn't. Then after midnight I looked and she'd texted several times "Do you have another girl" ..."I will block you"...so suddenly she became needy. But she didn't block me in the end.

Obviously this dynamic now is very toxic. I'm just going to stay distant for a while and see what happens. Her failur to provide a photo of her with her aunt, not to call etc, all this has caused concern in my mind anyway.

3 hours ago, mangkut70 said:

Like I wrote before, it reminds me a lot of a certain special someone from my past. I’ve witnessed firsthand, how she managed her several sponsors, in fact regularly helped her to write emails. Learned a lot in the process. She was literally riding me while on the phone with others, telling them how “good girl” she was. And good she was indeed. Hilarious. Well, that was way before smartphones, age of Nokia bricks, so no video call possible.

It was amazing how much money she could make. Before we met, she used to work Agogo in Phuket until SARS hit 2003, had a substantial list of former customers she kept in contact with. Mindboggling how much money guys sent to her and she did not even need to spread her legs. And the sob stories she could generate. Just wow.

Whilst there was a slightly similar incident, when her ex called and she picked up in front of me (!), though not knowing it was him, then exchanging a few words in Thai and pretending it was her mother, only later telling the truth, I have to say Phuket Girl is not on that level. Not yet anyway. Like you, I was also amazed how men were prepared to throw money at her, reading her Line convos and Whatsapp and Messenger, she could make a fortune if she wanted to.

3 hours ago, mangkut70 said:

Back to your girl – I don’t say it’s impossible that she could in fact be a gem and only had 5 guys instead of 5km. No tattoos, no kids (stretch marks?), no drugs etc. – there is a shimmer of hope. But everything else you disclosed here sounds a lot like she is a skilled operator. Focus on the facts you KNOW and can VERIFY and not the things she told you and you can’t check.

In any case...good luck!

Well, Phuket Girl is a gem. There is no doubt about that. In terms of her physical appearance, her fun side, her general character. But of course women are not really diamonds, they are human beings, so they have a dark side. Like we do. Having said that I think there's little doubt what she says checks out, she had 5 guys, she was in a 5 year rel after all, she's not a freelancer or bar girl, she has no tattoos, hates alcohol and weed.

As to whether the two kids are hers, they are clearly not. Her vagina is the tightest, smallest, I've ever encountered, and I've had sex with women who've had children, that feels rather different. There's no way she's had children. Her body is far too taught, tight and attractive for that. Once a woman has had children, her attractiveness degrades. This is not the case with her.

Thank you for your kind words, a shimmer of hope is all there is now, I think you're right. Dark times.

20 minutes ago, Celsius said:

Thai girl was totally shemeles

I am not making this up. This is 100% true. There is one American TV series she introduced me to. Her favouirite series.

It is called:

"Shameless".

Now, you may think this is proof this is all made up, It is not. This is all real, and once again proves that reality is stranger than fiction. You can't make it up.

Shameless 🤣

I never finished all seasons, oh my what a tragic hilarious comedy

27 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

When I said you can become indispensable, that was in reference to a poster claiming you can control women with money, which, as we all know, is wrong. So whilst you can't control a woman you can do things that make you more attractive, such as becoming indispensable in various ways, richer, better looking, more high status, more competent, etc.

However, even if you do that, it is not a guarantee of anything, it just increases your attractiveness, so your starting point becomes relevant.

I have a friend in CM who is indispensable to his Thai wife and indeed her whole family. In fact his becoming indispensable and him investing in her are more or less the same thing. He is quite wealthy and gave her so much money she's become a landlord with people working on her land. When she got very, very sick, he paid for expensive treatment that ensured she stays alive. He built a house for her father, he's literally taking care of the entire family.

This has not given him control in any way. However, it has ensured that his bond with the wife continues. The way she treated him if he had not become indispensable, if he had not invested in her they probably would have split up. Their relationship is not great, more like a deep friendship than real love in the traditional sense. By becoming indispensable and investing in her, he managed to keep the bond alive, albeit in a degraded way, but the relationship is not great. So there are no guarantees.

Even if you do both, if you become indispensable AND you invest in her, she may well cheat on you. It is actually no guarantee of loyalty. The only guarantee of loyalty is passionate love, ie she passionately desires you and thinks you're her best option in EVERY way, not just financially. Women are complex and holistic, like us, they don't just care about a few things, they care about a lot of things. Like us.

You're absolutely right that there is a danger in doing TOO MUCH, for the simple reason that YOU will start to feel too entitled, you gave so much, so now you can make a withdrawal, you can ask for this and that. Because you did so much. There's obviously an inherent danger in this.

Ultimately almost all women you meet will be better off by having been with you. Not just due to any financial benefits, think of all the experiences you provided. The only time they become worse off is if you leave and withdraw your benefits maybe. Excluding criminal, psychopathic and other male abberations of course.

Of course a man can control a woman, as it happens daily all over the world. The ways are indeed money, because the woman, especially if she has a greedy nature, won't leave if she can buy "things" to show off, even though she doesn't love or even like her man, and many control by threats and abuse, which has many fearing for either their lives or the dark unknown of another man.

If you are observant, you can see daily , how many gorgeous women are with fat, out of shape, drunks or otherwise disgusting men all because of that money in her hands. In Thailand it's the norm, even more so than most other countries because of the poverty here.

All women want money. Some will work for it and have a better chance of finding a more suitable partner because of attraction and decency. The rest want a breadwinner and will either stay at home and take care of things or sit back and watch the man buy, buy, buy. Cutting them off from that money means they'll have to take another chance, trying to find another ATM, which, as they get older, gets harder and harder to do.

And doing things that make you attractive will have you attractive to normal, non greedy women, but they still want a provider, unless they are high so with a lot of their own money. This is why most Hollywood types marry the same, even though their rate of divorce is also very high. Ego causes most of them to falter.

Stop giving money to Thai women and watch how lonely you end up. This isn't a country where attraction of the physical kind attracts most of the women. They all know what some friends and family have gotten when they picked a foreigner over a Thai man.

If you look at the high so Thai women here, almost all are with Thai men. Under that, if they have had relationships with locals, and aren't farmers, who are a lot more likely to stay with their wives, they know most locals leave, especially after a child is created, so this is why they look to the west, meaning western men already here. Most of the Thai women who gravitate to tourist areas have that dream, even if they also have a Thai boyfriend on the side and go with the foreigner because he pays out.

If you think you can't control a woman, look at the women you are finding, who are willing to go with a foreigner for his money, and that money is controlling where she lies. She will surely cheat, lie and hide her life from you, not all but many, but many will stick around until a better deal comes along.

Greed runs this country, and more and more women are picking up on how they can have a better life with a foreigner, even if their nature still involves lying and cheating and having another man waiting in the wings when her foreigner isn't around. I see this all the time, like I mentioned before, with my ex, married again, and has a few boyfriends around while her husband works in Germany and visits a few times a year. I learned of her reputation only after moving here, a lot from her own family, and saw her real self also soon afterwards, which is why I divorced her. Covert narcissists are women many times, and they'll fool you with their love bombing until you are hooked, and by then it might be too late. Honesty is hard to come by here, as women raised in a misogynist country learn to manipulate, especially after they are used a few times.Until you live with them 24/7, you have no idea what they're doing when you're not around, and how many men they have been with is anyone's guess, and it's definitely a guess, as they don't want to lose face here by telling all of themselves. The best indication of a decent, honest woman is observing, if you can, how she gets along with her father.

6 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Shameless 🤣

I never finished all seasons, oh my what a tragic hilarious comedy

Yes, of all the US TV series, that's her favourite. Talk about irony.

2 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

Yes, of all the US TV series, that's her favourite. Talk about irony.

Gets boring after awhile when tragedy after tragedy mix with lucky happenings rolls over for thousands of times. There is a limit to how funny it is in the long run

2 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Of course a man can control a woman, as it happens daily all over the world. The ways are indeed money, because the woman, especially if she has a greedy nature, won't leave if she can buy "things" to show off, even though she doesn't love or even like her man, and many control by threats and abuse, which has many fearing for either their lives or the dark unknown of another man.

No, a man can't control a woman. That's just wrong. Not with money, and not with physical violence.

If a man uses physical violence, that's not control to start with, if you have to resort to that kind of extreme coercion, clearly you are NOT in control. And in the end every man who uses violence will utlimately lose his woman.

The same with money. If a woman stays, because of money, then that is her choice. She is not being controlled. If the woman tires of the money, or finds someone else with more or similar money, then she leaves. There is no control of any kind.

4 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

If you are observant, you can see daily , how many gorgeous women are with fat, out of shape, drunks or otherwise disgusting men all because of that money in her hands.

Yes, however, whilst gorgeous women can be with unattractive men, and you don't like them, that does not mean they do not have other attributes that those women find attractive, apart from money I mean. Unattractive men can still have attributes that make them attractive in some way. So it happens quite a lot that gorgeous women are with less attractive men. It's not just because of money. Most women do not make money a top partnership criterion, it plays a role, sure, but no woman ever said "He wears a Gucci shirt - I must marry him".

7 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

This is why most Hollywood types marry the same,

No, the reason why a Hollywood actress would marry a rich or famous person is actually far more simple, all relationships are exchanges of value, and she has a value in the many millions, fame, etc, she will want someone who surpasses that or at least is in the ballpark.

8 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

If you look at the high so Thai women here, almost all are with Thai men.

Not LaLisa, isn't she with a French guy?

9 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

If you think you can't control a woman, look at the women you are finding, who are willing to go with a foreigner for his money, and that money is controlling where she lies. She will surely cheat, lie and hide her life from you, not all but many, but many will stick around until a better deal comes along.

That doesn't give you control though. Only the temporary illusion of control. Control would be if you could PREVENT her from leaving. But you can't.

3 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

No, a man can't control a woman. That's just wrong. Not with money, and not with physical violence.

If a man uses physical violence, that's not control to start with, if you have to resort to that kind of extreme coercion, clearly you are NOT in control. And in the end every man who uses violence will utlimately lose his woman.

The same with money. If a woman stays, because of money, then that is her choice. She is not being controlled. If the woman tires of the money, or finds someone else with more or similar money, then she leaves. There is no control of any kind.

Yes, however, whilst gorgeous women can be with unattractive men, and you don't like them, that does not mean they do not have other attributes that those women find attractive, apart from money I mean. Unattractive men can still have attributes that make them attractive in some way. So it happens quite a lot that gorgeous women are with less attractive men. It's not just because of money. Most women do not make money a top partnership criterion, it plays a role, sure, but no woman ever said "He wears a Gucci shirt - I must marry him".

No, the reason why a Hollywood actress would marry a rich or famous person is actually far more simple, all relationships are exchanges of value, and she has a value in the many millions, fame, etc, she will want someone who surpasses that or at least is in the ballpark.

Not LaLisa, isn't she with a French guy?

That doesn't give you control though. Only the temporary illusion of control. Control would be if you could PREVENT her from leaving. But you can't.

If you like trouble, keeping a woman on the wrong premises is the recipe

Just now, Hummin said:

If you like trouble, keeping a woman on the wrong premises is the recipe

"Wrong premises" ? What do you mean?

1 minute ago, Cameroni said:

"Wrong premises" ? What do you mean?

Most of what you listed above?

A good man take good care of her wife, trust her and gives her freedom, and if she doesn't act how you like, you give her freedom from you.

We got alot of tools to use, and even some thinks being the main provider is wrong, well news for most of them, that's one way, and nothing wrong with it.

I would say those who say being the main provider is wrong, have been radicalized

8 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

No, a man can't control a woman. That's just wrong. Not with money, and not with physical violence.

If a man uses physical violence, that's not control to start with, if you have to resort to that kind of extreme coercion, clearly you are NOT in control. And in the end every man who uses violence will utlimately lose his woman.

The same with money. If a woman stays, because of money, then that is her choice. She is not being controlled. If the woman tires of the money, or finds someone else with more or similar money, then she leaves. There is no control of any kind.

Yes, however, whilst gorgeous women can be with unattractive men, and you don't like them, that does not mean they do not have other attributes that those women find attractive, apart from money I mean. Unattractive men can still have attributes that make them attractive in some way. So it happens quite a lot that gorgeous women are with less attractive men. It's not just because of money. Most women do not make money a top partnership criterion, it plays a role, sure, but no woman ever said "He wears a Gucci shirt - I must marry him".

No, the reason why a Hollywood actress would marry a rich or famous person is actually far more simple, all relationships are exchanges of value, and she has a value in the many millions, fame, etc, she will want someone who surpasses that or at least is in the ballpark.

Not LaLisa, isn't she with a French guy?

That doesn't give you control though. Only the temporary illusion of control. Control would be if you could PREVENT her from leaving. But you can't.

Of course men control women, have since the beginning of time, and will until the end. A woman will not leave if she thinks she can't have that lifestyle, unless there is either ongoing violence she's gotten tired of, or she is still attractive enough in her mind to find another man of equal or better assets.

Women will stay, and millions do, because of fear of violence or thinking she might find worse if she leaves. She will stay if there is a possible loss of finances or assets. This especially happens in certain ethnic groups, where the woman is afraid to leave for fear of reprisals, some that are actually allowed. Almost half of the couples divorce, and another quarter stay for these reasons. You think that money isn't making her stay, but the possible loss of it is, and that's controlling her thinking. Yes, it's her choice to leave or stay, but that money keeps many around because it's a way of showing off to their "friends" and family here.

A man controlling a woman with violence is keeping her because of control, even if he is indeed out of control. This is something learned from years of reading and observation on human psychology.

Attraction is usually what brings most people together, but under that , ingrained in a woman's mind, is hope for a provider. Unless they are well off, and those usually end up with the same, like the Hollywood types, they are hoping to find that provider, especially if they grew up in poverty, like most do here.

Thailand isn't like western countries, but more like it's bordering countries, where most of the woman prefer to marry their own kind. Those that have been used or abused by locals will look to the west, especially seeing they all know of someone who has gone to a western man for a possible better life and future. The Thai women who are farmers and end up with farmers are usually content with that lifestyle, as it's all they've known. If they had a decent relationship with their fathers, they will look for that in a partner. those that have strife in the childhoods will gravitate to the cities, especially after hearing of friends or family going there and finding a foreigner. You can't prevent a woman from leaving. Those possible losses keep her staying. Many are indeed afraid to leave, as men have gone after women countless times to hurt or kill them when they leave, unless they completely disappear from that area.

10 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Most of what you listed above?

A good man take good care of her wife, trust her and gives her freedom, and if she doesn't act how you like, you give her freedom from you.

We got alot of tools to use, and even some thinks being the main provider is wrong, well news for most of them, that's one way, and nothing wrong with it.

I would say those who say being the main provider is wrong, have been radicalized

Oh I see what you mean. Obviously being a provider is one of the two pillars you need to satisfy. The other is good genes. This is what women look for, a provider and a man with good genes. That's it. Of course those two have many implications.

Clearly the clowns who claim they can get with women and never provide are lying, if they claim they have a long relationship. In long relationships that never works, you have to be able to provide as well.

2 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Of course men control women, have since the beginning of time, and will until the end.

No, those days are long gone. In 2026 you can't control a woman, if she wants to leave, she'll leave. No violence and no amount of money will stop her in the end, only temporarily maybe. History is littered with women who left rich men. Think about Giselle Buendchen leaving the very wealthy Tom Brady. He never hit her, never abused her, and his net worth is very high. She still left.

3 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

A woman will not leave if she thinks she can't have that lifestyle,

That's her choice then. That's not "control". Control would be if she wanted to leave and you can stop her for good. But you can't.

4 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Women will stay, and millions do, because of fear of violence or thinking she might find worse if she leaves. She will stay if there is a possible loss of finances or assets.

Only temporarily maybe, if she decides to leave, there'd be no way to stop her. You would have no control over it.

5 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Those that have been used or abused by locals will look to the west,

Actually many young Thai women look to the West, or China, or Russia. They just prefer foreign partners. Nothing to do with "abuse".

12 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

Oh I see what you mean. Obviously being a provider is one of the two pillars you need to satisfy. The other is good genes. This is what women look for, a provider and a man with good genes. That's it. Of course those two have many implications.

Clearly the clowns who claim they can get with women and never provide are lying, if they claim they have a long relationship. In long relationships that never works, you have to be able to provide as well.

Well, I wouldn’t say thai girls is so sofisticated yet, that the genepool have become a major thing for them to consider. There is a mix there, but still, nope, they seems to go with funny any twit with any shape as long they convince them enough. Genes to them is far out there yet.

It starts to appear, because I see more and more freelancers hitting the gym now than ever before. Something is happening, and thats a awakening.

Never seen so many young girls mid day at the gyms before when we travelling around.

Just now, Cameroni said:

No, those days are long gone. In 2026 you can't control a woman, if she wants to leave, she'll leave. No violence and no amount of money will stop her in the end, only temporarily maybe.

That's her choice then. That's not "control". Control would be if she wanted to leave and you can stop her for good. But you can't.

Only temporarily maybe, if she decides to leave, there'd be no way to stop her. You would have no control over it.

Actually many young Thai women look to the West, or China, or Russia. They just prefer foreign partners. Nothing to do with "abuse".

Those days have been around and will continue forever. Human nature has always been certain ways, and these don't change. I didn't say woman won't leave. I said many are afraid to for those reasons. They are allowing it to control them, even though they have the choice to leave. Violence indeed controls many to stay, for those reasons listed.

A woman usually cannot re-locate if she wants to leave, as there are millions of stalkers on earth. They are being controlled, until they can do something drastic to stop what the man might do. This is either re-locating, which she usually can't do if she has a job or children, or having a restraining order put on the man, which doesn't always work, and they know this.

Again, Asian women usually want to be with their own, and the largest majority do. Some, who have been told by others how a foreign man might give her a better life (not always, as many foreigners are also weirdos and abusive), might look to the west, and even more so if they already have been used by their own kind.

Thinking Thai women are attracted to you for looks first is ridiculous. If they are living in the west, more on equal terms,they might look for that attraction first, seeing they already know western men usually have more money already, and they are also doing well themselves. Asians do not prefer westerners in their own countries. It all has to do with how they were raised, and who they listen to for advice. And that possible better future. They will sleep with one man after another, hoping the next one will stay and provide. This is how many western men use these women, knowing they are naive and dreamers.

32 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Well, I wouldn’t say thai girls is so sofisticated yet, that the genepool have become a major thing for them to consider. There is a mix there, but still, nope, they seems to go with funny any twit with any shape as long they convince them enough. Genes to them is far out there yet.

It starts to appear, because I see more and more freelancers hitting the gym now than ever before. Something is happening, and thats a awakening

They don't consciously sit down and consider the gene pool, that's not what I'm saying. What I mean by "genes" is simply good genes, the girls will want a symmetrical face, a stronger man, etc, this is subconscious their biology impels them to seek out the good looking man with better genes.

Now, of course not all women have the sexual market value themselves to get the man with good genes who is also a provider, so they compromise and may choose a funny uglier guy, yes that happens, if he's a good provider, but they may well cheat with a better looking guy.

And yes, you're quite right, more and more girls now emphasize looks of men.

34 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Those days have been around and will continue forever.

If you think back, even in the older historical days, when violence against women was wide-spread, there was no real control of women.

Think of Napoleon, whose Josephine shamelessly cheated on him with another man. Napoleon controlled entire armies, the whole of France, but he couldn't control his woman.

Think about that.

Even Roman history is littered with females who were out of control. Chinese history too. There is no such control, not even in history.

Even in the animal kingdom, if an alpha male is defeated in battle, his females will follow the new victor, they will leave the alpha male. And total violence was allowed and could not be stopped, but it would be of no use. The defeated male cannot retain his females with violence. Which probably means in our own caveman days too, if the woman decided to leave you couldn't have stopped her.

38 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Thinking Thai women are attracted to you for looks first is ridiculous. I

No it's not. Many Thai women are attracted to the looks of Westerners. It's a fact.

38 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Asians do not prefer westerners in their own countries.

No many Asian girls prefer Westerners, there is no generic "Asian". The women have different attraction archetypes. Some prefer Asians, some Westerners. And many, many do prefer Westerners.

Well, looks like I underestimated how much Phuket Girl's viewing of my phone antagonized her.

She now sees me as a liar, unreliable and untrustworthy. But it's much worse. My phone was littered with convos wih so many girls, Phuket Girl now thinks I'm an out and out player.

On the texting the ex point perhaps our passionate love could have saved us. However, it's become clear she now thinks I'm a massive player on top, having seen my phone, so now her love itself may have been killed.

That would explain her not calling. Not sending a photo, or her location.

She went from suggesting we move in together in Chonburi yesterday to saying quite nasty things.

I still get a thrill when I think of her, but when she thinks of me now she may just feel disgust, hatred and contempt.

13 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

If you think back, even in the older historical days, when violence against women was wide-spread, there was no real control of women.

Think of Napoleon, whose Josephine shamelessly cheated on him with another man. Napoleon controlled entire armies, the whole of France, but he couldn't control his woman.

Think about that.

Even Roman history is littered with females who were out of control. Chinese history too. There is no such control, not even in history.

Even in the animal kingdom, if an alpha male is defeated in battle, his females will follow the new victor, they will leave the alpha male. And total violence was allowed and could not be stopped, but it would be of no use. The defeated male cannot retain his females with violence. Which probably means in our own caveman days too, if the woman decided to leave you couldn't have stopped her.

No it's not. Many Thai women are attracted to the looks of Westerners. It's a fact.

No many Asian girls prefer Westerners, there is no generic "Asian". The women have different attraction archetypes. Some prefer Asians, some Westerners. And many, many do prefer Westerners.

Control happens daily all over the world in all types of relationships. If you read enough literature written by psychiatrists, counselors and psychologists, you would see how many women are controlled, abused and neglected worldwide. many aren't going to tell anyone besides them and close friends or family, and even then, so a lot have no idea what goes on behind closed doors, and only their own experiences.

Women are indeed out of control all over, but for different reasons than men sometimes.

Asian women, along with all other nationalities, are attracted to other types, just as we are, but men and women look for different things. but they still prefer their own in the largest majority. In countries like Thailand, their attraction means money first in most instances, for the reasons I mentioned. Of course most women want an attractive man, although that's still the minority, as most people are average looking or overweight, so the wallet size is what counts more for most in countries like Thailand. A future with things sounds a lot better than being in poverty with a man that's a lot more likely to cheat and walk away.

22 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

They don't consciously sit down and consider the gene pool, that's not what I'm saying. What I mean by "genes" is simply good genes, the girls will want a symmetrical face, a stronger man, etc, this is subconscious their biology impels them to seek out the good looking man with better genes.

Now, of course not all women have the sexual market value themselves to get the man with good genes who is also a provider, so they compromise and may choose a funny uglier guy, yes that happens, if he's a good provider, but they may well cheat with a better looking guy.

And yes, you're quite right, more and more girls now emphasize looks of men.

Well, thai ladies is a bit different when they chose life partner, because they are still in the dependent mode, and not like any of our women back home, even they exists there to.

Thai women in general and general speaking, wants a good provider, who are a safe card, but as you say, unconsciously f..ks around with anyone, and do not consider even good genes, and it is bisarr if you ask me, again generally speaking.

Good thai women is in my opinion boring, grey and not that attractive and useally got education as well. So-called good girls who do what is expected from them and do not understand their marked value, and rather talks down on other women’s who is out there on the marked selling themselves one way or the other.

Often racist and look at themselves as a better option than the darker uneducated Isaan women, and cant understand why foreigner likes them more than them.

A bits of everything here, but take it for what it is. Thai women is not like any other women around, and thats includes finest Bangkok women to dirt poor Isaan women.

16 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

Well, looks like I underestimated how much Phuket Girl's viewing of my phone antagonized her.

She now sees me as a liar, unreliable and untrustworthy. But it's much worse. My phone was littered with convos wih so many girls, Phuket Girl now thinks I'm an out and out player.

On the texting the ex point perhaps our passionate love could have saved us. However, it's become clear she now thinks I'm a massive player on top, having seen my phone, so now her love itself may have been killed.

That would explain her not calling. Not sending a photo, or her location.

She went from suggesting we move in together in Chonburi yesterday to saying quite nasty things.

I still get a thrill when I think of her, but when she thinks of me now she may just feel disgust, hatred and contempt.

Ask yourself that question. Are you a player only looking to score or do you want to settle down with one? It's obvious to those here, and you can see by their replies how they think. You are only thinking how you think of your relationships with these girls. You aren't thinking how they think. Assuming you know how they feel is just assuming, as most women will tell you what you want to hear, especially if they are gaining somewhere. "You're the best lover I've ever had, you're so big, you handsome man." We've all heard them all and more, and if you've been with enough women, especially normal ones, you know more how a woman thinks.

Many men never figure them out at all, and only think they do because they get laid. More so in this country, where cash gets most sex, and they never truly understand how a woman thinks. Going after those in teens and lower 20's, you're still seeing only immature thinking women, who are easily fooled. This is why many men look to the younger crowd, as the older, smarter ones won't have them. Then their excuse is I don't want women older than 25, to which I say LOL.

6 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Control happens daily all over the world in all types of relationships. If you read enough literature written by psychiatrists, counselors and psychologists, you would see how many women are controlled, abused and neglected worldwide.

No, i think that's a fiction and a fantasy. It's just wrong. Nobody in a relationship controls the other in a true, meanigful, long term and finite way.

If Tom Brady, a handsome celebrity with a large net worth, who is tall, strong, ticks all the boxes, could not control his wife and she leaves him, if Napoleon who had control of all of France could not control Josephine's behaviour, then it seems clear that control is not possible.

Only the illusion of control, a short term control that is not real control, but actually desperation, is possible, but in the end, if the woman wants to leave, she will. If she doesn't, then she's not being controlled, it's her desire to stay.

Obviously shrinks have a vested interest to make the most of the temporary control and all the issues, that's how they make money after all, but I'm not buying it. Reality just doesn't support this.

10 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

but they still prefer their own in the largest majority.

Many Thai women prefer Thai, no doubt about it, however, it's to be expected that most Thai women end up with Thai men, since Thai men make up the majority of men in the Kingdom. That's not to say that many, many Thai women don't prefer Western, Chinese or Russian looks, that happens a lot. There is no generic Thai, different Thais have different archetypes and preferences.

Indeed the SAME woman, can go from going only with Western men, to then changing and marrying a Thai man, much is due to personal opportunity and chance.

13 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

In countries like Thailand, their attraction means money first in most instances, for the reasons I mentioned. Of course most women want an attractive man, although that's still the minority, as most people are average looking or overweight, so the wallet size is what counts more for most in countries like Thailand.

You make an important point here, which is very true, most people ARE unattractive. The very vast majority, about 90% of people at least, maybe more. So they know they have no hope of getting a Johnny Depp, or a Brad Pitt, so they settle, and look for other characteristics. We take what we can get.

Nevertheless, whilst indeed poverty is more prevalent and more significant in Thailand than in the West, to say that women are across the board so one dimensional that they put money first is I think untrue. Yes, money and an ability to provide will always play a role, but few women make money the top criterion, unless she's an out and out whore.

11 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Ask yourself that question. Are you a player only looking to score or do you want to settle down with one?

Both really, I had to play but then I found Phuket Girl and I would have liked to settle down with her. Unfortunately, this now seems unlikely. Even though I did not have sex with another woman, did not talk of sex with another woman, and always made Phuket Girl a priority. Texting an ex raises too many trust issues, and then her seeing my whole phone with the many, many convos with girls, photos etc, it would have been like a horror show to her.

13 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

This is why many men look to the younger crowd, as the older, smarter ones won't have them

No, that is again nonsense, most men want young and attractive girls, not because the older ones won't have them, but they simply prefer young, good looking women who are prime child bearing specimens. It's of course much easier to get an older woman than a younger one.

14 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Then their excuse is I don't want women older than 25, to which I say LOL.

No man needs an excuse to find a young, fit and attractive woman a preferable choice. If I could choose, my preference would always be to get a woman under 25, rather than an older woman. And I could get an older woman exceedingly easily. I just don't want to.

Just now, Cameroni said:

No, i think that's a fiction and a fantasy. It's just wrong. Nobody in a relationship controls the other in a true, meanigful, long term and finite way.

If Tom Brady, a handsome celebrity with a large net worth, who is tall, strong, ticks all the boxes, could not control his wife and she leaves him, if Napoleon who had control of all of France could not control Josephine's behaviour, then it seems clear that control is not possible.

Only the illusion of control, a short term control that is not real control, but actually desperation, is possible, but in the end, if the woman wants to leave, she will. If she doesn't, then she's not being controlled, it's her desire to stay.

Obviously shrinks have a vested interest to make the most of the temporary control and all the issues, that's how they make money after all, but I'm not buying it. Reality just doesn't support this.

Many Thai women prefer Thai, no doubt about it, however, it's to be expected that most Thai women end up with Thai men, since Thai men make up the majority of men in the Kingdom. That's not to say that many, many Thai women don't prefer Western, Chinese or Russian looks, that happens a lot. There is no generic Thai, different Thais have different archetypes and preferences.

Indeed the SAME woman, can go from going only with Western men, to then changing and marrying a Thai man, much is due to personal opportunity and chance.

You make an important point here, which is very true, most people ARE unattractive. The very vast majority, about 90% of people at least, maybe more. So they know they have no hope of getting a Johnny Depp, or a Brad Pitt, so they settle, and look for other characteristics. We take what we can get.

Nevertheless, whilst indeed poverty is more prevalent and more significant in Thailand than in the West, to say that women are across the board so one dimensional that they put money first is I think untrue. Yes, money and an ability to provide will always play a role, but few women make money the top criterion, unless she's an out and out whore.

I didn't say all relationships have control. I said many do, which is a fact. Just look at how many thousands of books are written on human interpersonal relationships and see what the problems are. Just going by your own experiences you have almost no idea what goes on in the rest of the world.

Of course you if look at your partner as an equal there shouldn't be any control whatsoever. That means you value them and their opinions. Many men look at women as secondary, and especially more so in countries like this one, where religion has women secondary right from the start.

Rich people that are with other rich people aren't controlling them with their money but other factors still come in, because not all rich people were raised by good parents. Men who control other things in their lives don't always control their mates. It depends on what they saw with their parents.

Some rich men are pushovers with their women because of this. Shrinks are there to help people in their relationships. making money doing that is just like making money in any other se3fvice job. In fact, many counselors and psychologists are divorced at least one time, because attraction has many making bad choices in mates, even if they know the red flags. Asian women, just as all ethnic women, more prefer their own because they can relate to them easier, being from the same culture. Especially regarding the language barrier, their own are easier to understand and relate.

Yes, like I mentioned, people from all over are attracted to different, but usually they stay within their own, especially if they're living in their home country. In the US, everyone is either from somewhere else or their relatives were, so it's easier to get together with different types, especially seeing many are also making more money, which makes them more equal in some ways. And more speak English there, which is a huge positive trait.

You can't say you can "get" an older women easily if you haven't been in relationships with them more than a few dates. They aren't as easy to fool, nor to keep around. Young girls are easy to fool, especially if you have that player mentality. The close the ages are, the better the relationship is. 5 or so years either way isn't a problem, as that's still in the same age group.

Most people are actually attractive, seeing that average looking is still attractive. Thinking men like Brad Pitt or Johnny Depp are attractive to all women is wrong. They are just another in the long line of good looking men, of which we all see daily everywhere.

Most men aren't looking at women as "child bearing specimens" They are looking for sex, and hopefully one that won't drive them crazy afterwards. And older women are not easier to "get", as they are smarter on average. The younger ones are easily fooled by BS and the dream of cash. Older women, especially good looking ones that take good care of themselves, are much harder for a player to fool, as they already know the BS. You really have to look outside Thailand to see reality in relationships, as most here are looking at you as cash first.The reason many men come here is because you can "get" a young women easier than in the west, because a poor women will sleep with most anything if she can get those "things", no matter how pretty she is now. They all know they lose attraction as the years pass by. It's easy for an older man to get a young women here for those reasons. Try it at home and see how it works.

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

No, a man can't control a woman. That's just wrong. Not with money, and not with physical violence

Let them do whatever they want, whenever they want.

If you don't approve, stop giving them money.

18 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

I didn't say all relationships have control. I said many do, which is a fact

I know what you mean of course, domestic abuse situations and such, but really that's the illusion of control. It's not real control. In the end the woman will leave.

21 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Most people are actually attractive, seeing that average looking is still attractive.

I literally disagree strongly with everything you write here. Most people are unattractive.

21 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

And older women are not easier to "get",

Again, just not true. Older women are much easier to get.

17 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Let them do whatever they want, whenever they want.

If you don't approve, stop giving them money.

Yes, so you can control your own resources, but you still can't control her. Some women will not be deterred by losing resources, they can get them elsewhere.

1 minute ago, Cameroni said:

I know what you mean of course, domestic abuse situations and such, but really that's the illusion of control. It's not real control. In the end the woman will leave.

I literally disagree strongly with everything you write here. Most people are unattractive.

Again, just not true. Older women are much easier to get.

Most people are average looking, which is a positive thing. You might think you are attractive but that's your own thinking, as many women might not give you a second look anywhere in the world. Most men think they are more attractive than they really are, and most women think the opposite.

No matter how good looking anyone is, they aren't attractive to everyone. Ask yourself just how many older women you have been in an actual relationship with. Younger ones might be intelligent, but as far as knowing men and how they really are, they're very naive and this is why they give themselves up to men who are plain trash users. Eventually after a few of these men, then they get issues with all men, thinking we're "all the same", which we aren't. Mismatches are the main reason the world has all it's problems. Narcissists who think they can do whatever they want and greedy women only looking at men for their assets. Then the children growing up the same ways.

Of course many men like younger women than them. Many like them closer to their own age because younger women can drive an older man nuts.

Many men actually think they deserve pretty women, but if women were smarter in their choices of men, many men would never get laid period. Some men with no fitness and a large belly actually think they are attractive and can get any woman. This is only because they have fooled some with their assets and not how they appear. If all women were as well off as most men, then you would see more couples actually getting along, as they would need to both look at each other as equals and treat them as such.

10 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

No matter how good looking anyone is, they aren't attractive to everyone.

Well, that may be true, but most women in the world would find Brad Pitt good looking. Probably 98%. There are objective standards of beauty, even if preferences are a real thing.

15 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

this is why they give themselves up to men who are plain trash users.

A lot of older women give themselves up to plain trash users, looking at Big C queues.

16 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

If all women were as well off as most men, then you would see more couples actually getting along, as they would need to both look at each other as equals and treat them as such.

It's the exact opposite of course, if women were as well off as men, then there would be fewer relationships alltogether, as women only want a man who improves their lives, including financially. Women don't want an "equal", they want a superior man, the best they can get. In fact in the US now women earn more than men, and it's resulted not in nirvana style equality and men and women getting along, but in the exact opposite, realtionships are in full on crisis.