And time to let her go. That's why you may need the counsellor; it does appear that despite the horrible treatment and the lack of love you are still attached to her in a very unhealthy way- as if it should still be astonishing at this point that she's no good. She's no good! Stop waiting for her to bottom out and come back up- your presence is just allowing her to get away with further bad behaviour. Cut her out of your life. The last few posters have excellent advice regarding the children- and the family you have described is no place to leave children.

I din't get to read the whole thing, but I had to stop here. My heart goes out to you, but there are certain truths you need to face.

name='tuky' date='2009-02-18 18:47:02' post='2541557']

Well...it looks like the bank is going to reposess the house as she has used the money I have been sending for other purposes...whatever they may be.

She is no good. Any sentiment you have towards this woman will just be used to manipulate you. They are very good at exploiting that. You're obviously "hurt" by all this. They're like any addiction.

Infact, I spoke with her today and she was all fire telling me how I have ruined her life, how I made her start taking drugs and how I made her start selling her "pussy" because I do not send her enough money.

It's always your fault. They will never own anything. This is a game they play. It;s always his fault, and they let you know it. I'm starting to get angry. Believe me, it's a game, and you should accept it, but look at her like she's crazy. They will try to tear your heart out. They are very stupid.

Please bear in mind, I have only been sending 100k per month and she only gets 90k per month rent from two rental properties so I guess I have been a little unfair on her by selling her short. I can actually see the need for her to sell her "pussy" with the tiny amount she gets each month. The kids live with her Mum BTW.

All her money, that she can get her hands on, goes towards buying her, and her BS's, drugs. There's never enough. She is making me sick.

Anyway, I have decided I need to rethink my values as she tells me I a the most selfish person she has ever met and I have made her life very bad. I wish I could have done more for her, but it seems I have failed.

You must be kidding. Is this a joke?

I suggested today on the phone that she took some time to reflect on what happened and why we are now separated, that when she finds another man she needs to make every effort to make sure he WANTS to come home every night, she asked me why I never told her this before...I hadto point out that I had been telling her for 6 years but she never listened.

Anyway, I feel really sorry for her. Deep down she is still a person, she was just taught the wrong things by her Mum, like because she has boobs and a vagina that she can get anything she wants without giving anything back.

Deep down she is not a "person." She is a sick drug addict. She's not even a whore. She;s a drug addict. Learn something about drug addicts and their behavior. All they do is take. Only her BF, for whatever reason, fulfills whatever sick motivations she has. Please don't express any sentiment for her.

I gave up on reading the rest because you seem very deluded. All your reasoning is wrong. I hope this is sarcasm, and you're smarter than all that.

Incredible story! If you saw it in general, you'd reckon it would have to be a troll.

Sadly, I will verify everything Tuky has told you... I witnessed it.

Tuky,

How many times did I tell you that a leopard cannot change its spots?

How many times do you have to repeat the same mistakes before you finally learn?

You seem to almost enjoy the emotional abuse and her domination of your life.

About time you grew some balls and opened your eyes... walk away man.

I gave up on reading the rest because you seem very deluded. All your reasoning is wrong. I hope this is sarcasm, and you're smarter than all that.

Yes, don't worry mate. Most definately sarcasm on my behalf. Sarcasm due to the fact that I can't possibly work out her reasoning with regards to how I have ruined her life.

I gave her everything, perhaps that is how I ruined it?

JD, don't worry mate. I most assuredly will not be entertaining even the slightest thought of going back to her.

As I mentioned earlier, I have a new girlfriend. Her name is Else, she is a college student studying Business Administration, she has a shop in a local shopping centre where she provides PR type services, business cards, photoshop, banners, mobile phones, mp3 players and songs etc etc. She also reads the news on the local radio station. She has the greatest sense of humour and spends most of her time laughing and taking the p1ss out of me. She bought me a T-shirt the other day that said something along the lines of "I am not fat, I am just incredibly short for my weight" if you knew me I am actually quite tall and slim.

Every morning when I am in the shower she makes my coffee, lays my clothes out, puts my noodles into a bag with a nice little "welcome to today" kinda note, she makes sure I have enough smokes. She cooks everyday, she has just spent her own money on buying new modification parts for my motorbike.

She is 29 years old and a very conservative muslim Indonesian girl. She treats me like I have never been treated before and in return she gets treated very well by me. We have been together about 8 months now.

There is no way I will be giving this up to have anything to do with the wife.

As for my Kids...Else is really keen to have my kids here with me, the Grandparents want the kids with me, my company will pay for their education and all health matters. The only obstacle is the wife herself. She says she will never give them to me, I know for a fact this is only because she sees them as her meal ticket from me. As long as the kids are there, I will keep sending money for them...she thinks. We spoke yesterday about a divorce, I told her that we should do it nicely. She refused, she says she is going to make life as hard for me as possible. She is going to fiught for 80% of my monthly wage, all the houses and she is going to keep hassling my company until they sack me. <deleted>???

Again I suggested to her that we just settle everything nicely, her answer was that she is the boss now and it will all be on her terms. And she wants everything.

I told her for the third time that we should settle this nicely, come to an acceptable agreement. She says NO WAY. So I told her it is either nicely or she gets cut off totally, there is nothing she can do about it, I am not Thai, I do not live in Thailand, I am non resident of Australia, I can just disappear and she can do nothing to stop me. If you want anything in this divorce we need to do it nicely, still she refused and said she doesn't care, she is going to fight to get as much out of me as she can even if it means she gets nothing. I had to laugh.

What are these people thinking?

Incredible story! If you saw it in general, you'd reckon it would have to be a troll.

Sadly, I will verify everything Tuky has told you... I witnessed it.

Tuky,

How many times did I tell you that a leopard cannot change its spots?

How many times do you have to repeat the same mistakes before you finally learn?

You seem to almost enjoy the emotional abuse and her domination of your life.

About time you grew some balls and opened your eyes... walk away man.

Yes, but you have snipped my original post, so that others only reading this abridged part might be of the mind that I was having a dig - which I clearly was not. I don't want people thinking I am insensitive to Tuky's unfortunate plight.

I certainly did not intend for your post to be interpreted as such.

This is Outside the Box, where serious dicussions are encouraged without going off the rails as they do elsewhere on the forum.

I'm sure that anyone reading this topic would take it seriously enough to read the entire thread and all the comments herein before offering an opinion.

My post was to verify Tuky's situation... as my wife and I were the ones that came to his resue and subsequently had to seek police protection and intervention.

And Tuky, I'm glad you have found a nice girl... she sounds lovely and a lot of fun.

Treat her well mate.

You know me Pal, I can do nothing but treat them well. This one is a keeper, she is bit small, but she is great. I wish you could meet her.

Unfortunately I lost his friendship

Friends like this are too good to lose Tuky, do what you can to rebuild bridges.

It is the most improbable turn of events, absolutely incredible.

Good Luck for the future and may Providence keep a close eye on your two girls.

Moss

I too can verify a great deal of what Tuky has been telling you, and I saw some of it with my own eyes.

There absolutely no doubt that Tuky must walk away from this woman for ever - she is 100 % evil.

There is also no way that she will ever agree to an amicable divorce. Even if she seems like she is agreeing, I will guarantee you that everything will change when you come back to Thailand. It's the nature of the beast - and Tuky, you know that I know.

If it wasn't for the kids you should walk away and never have anything to do with her again, and not even divorce her.

There is nothing she can do if you don't divorce her, provided you stay out of Thailand. It is only at the point of divorce that she can enforce a division of the joint assets. That's why many Thai men never agree to divorce, so that they don't have to settle with their wives. In theory, the wives could go to court, but in practice it hardly ever happens. In Thailand the law favours the men, and it is only farang men who end up getting screwed.

But we have the kids to think of. The best suggestion so far is from Boo. You have to use your money to make this work for you. DON"T TRUST ANY LAWYERS!!. The farang lawyers have no experience of this kind of problem, and the Thai lawyers will sell their soul to the highest bidder, and often to both sides. However larger a fee you pay them, it will never come close to a percentage of the action, which is what they will get from the woman. The last lawyer I used ended up trying to fck my wife!! Employing a high up BIB from another part of the country is a good idea. However, even they will play both sides if you are not careful - it happened to me.

I know this sounds a bit corny, but I do believe there are a few very good, farang run Private detective firms in Bangkok, and some of them are very well connected with the right people. Maybe you should make some discreet inquiries and get some personal recommendations. If you find one, I wouldn't go the divorce or court route. I would just have them kidnapped and take them out of the country. Do not go anywhere near Pattaya yourself, and just wait somewhere in Bangkok to meet up with the kids and get them out of Thailand. I hope they have Oz passports. If you can get them out without you coming to Thailand, then do so.

If there is anything I can do then don't hesitate to PM or call me - I think you have my number.

Think this through and start to plan. But don't talk to her any more - let her worry and stew, and you will get the upper hand.

Good luck

Mobi.

I received two sms messages from her sister (in Canada) this morning.

Here is the contents verbatim...

1.

Hi live how r u y you not get dv wish tukki mamma tell me she ceazy to much have ya ice everyday i worry about kit and ken i need she go get job she can forget ya ice if you have good daddy for kit and can pls do dit.

2.

She pay tarapura but not too much i and tik need she go get job in japan not working girel work same tik she can have good life sriracha not good for hey i and tik can help if u singh she can get visa i don't know what to help.

tik is the sister living in Japan, tarapura is the 3rd house I built for her, it seems to me that the sister in Canada wants me to divorce the wife so that she can get a Japanese visa, Tik is married to a Japanese dude and she works in a Thai restaurant in Tokyo. I think this is what the older sister is saying.

I have a feeling that I might be able to organise with the Mamma and with the older sister to come and get my kids without the wife knowing. I think they will see it as a way to get the wife back on the straight and narrow, with no kids perhaps she will go to Japan and sort her sh1t out instead of using the kids a tool to get money.

If anyone is interested I will keep this page up to date whenever something developes.

sounds promising but again, take hired guns to do the dirty work & show you mean business & stay well hidden until the papers need signing. TBH the whole family sound fcuked up & who knows what games they might have in their heads but if you can organise it so that the girls can be removed & delivered to your helpers then it sounds good. The get you & the girls on the first available plane out of there.

I agree with both Boo and Mobi, get some help, don't go alone and run as fast as you can with your girls.

Tuky, we have never met, and do not really know one another. You sound like the total victim, the sucker. Your wife sounds like total poison. Run away and never go back to her. Use a lawyer, the courts, police, etc., but never speak to her again, or look at her. That's my advice..

Your daughters....I was sending my ex wife well over half my salary, and she was wasting it on her new husband, new child, and 2 or 3 random strangers. Sometimes no plumbing, no electricity. I finally came to my senses and told her (after my eldest left with her own little boy), that I was taking the twin girls away from her, and she agreed! I had four kids living with me one summer. But she is a reasonable woman; your wife is not.

I even suggest you never send any of them one satang more. Never, unless the girls come to live with you, legally, without any relatives from their Mum's side.

Sorry, Tuky. Time to stop being the victim, maybe?

Tuky, you know I've got your back here, but I agree with IJWT and Boo, something needs to be done about your girls. I know you don't have any place to take them to right now, but here's hoping that not too long in the distant future you can get them.

And you've already heard what I've had to say about your wife, so I guess it probably shouldn't be repeated here for those with delicate constitutions

thanks SBK. shivering with fear i had my finger already on my computer's shut-off button @Tuky: extremely sad story. but without the back-up postings from others i would have considered you a troll². best of luck to you!

Tuky

Your move to Indo is very good first step. I understand some of the pain you are feeling about your kids.

If you make the decision to take the kids ensure you have legal paperwork to cover your rear otherwise you may end up in a bigger mess. Remember that while Thailand has not signed the Hauge convention for the rights of the child Australia and many countries in SE Asia have, and that could become a problem. The big bundle of cash you spend to do that part legally could be a good investment. There is a Scotsman who drinks in Pong who got custody of his daughter from a hostile/unstable wife, awarded by a Thai court, so it is do-able.

Take care mate.

CP

Tuky, you know I've got your back here, but I agree with IJWT and Boo, something needs to be done about your girls. I know you don't have any place to take them to right now, but here's hoping that not too long in the distant future you can get them.

And you've already heard what I've had to say about your wife, so I guess it probably shouldn't be repeated here for those with delicate constitutions

thanks SBK. shivering with fear i had my finger already on my computer's shut-off button @Tuky: extremely sad story. but without the back-up postings from others i would have considered you a troll². best of luck to you!

I understand Naam, I guess that might be why I stayed around so long. I couldn't believe it either so I figured either I had been doing something wrong or it was all in my head.

ANyway, I spoke with the kids last Sunday and they were great. Kitty rak Daddy to the moon etc etc. Grandma didn't know where their mum was.

I spoke with the Hubby of the younger sister the other day too. He said he had been having the same troubles with his wife in Tokyo. I remember when it started for him, his wife came to Thailand and my wife took her out and got her on the drugs. His wife then went back to Tokyo and found some Thai girls working in Karaoke bars and befriended them, did drugs with them. The Jap dude is really tight with the money so she had to sleep with people to buy her drugs. I know this because my wife told me all about it and the hubby confirmed it the other day. Anyway, he got her a job in a Thai restaurant and things seem to have calmed down for them now, although when I spoke to his wife she told me (in Thai so he couldn't understand) how unhappy she is and how she wished she was married to someone like me instead).

What a truly screwed up family.

In the mean time, here I am typing away, my Indo girl just got me a new beer in between mopping the floor, checking the washing and she is just about to start the ironing. Last night she spent her time decorating small boxes with wrapping paper and ribbon so she can store her belongings.

Life is much better than I thought it could be.

CP, I am in it for the long run concerning my kids. However at this very point in time I have to get myself stable enough to take care of them first. I have kept all transaction records for the money I have sent, I hve all emails and sms messages from the family airing their concerns about the wife and their urges to get me to stop sending money to support her drug addiction and her boyfriends etc etc.

I will get the kids, I just have to do it correctly.

Tuky

We also don't really know each other, but I have read all this thread and I can understand to some extent how you feel as I also had/have a wife who has a similar affliction, I haven't commented until now because for me there was one big difference, we don't have any children together, I have a step daughter that I have known since she was barely thee years old, she is adorable and she thinks I'm her real Dad, so for me, walking away was really tough, and it hurt, she'll be nine years old now and I miss her more than I miss her mother.

I will get the kids.

I pray that that comes true.

There was a thread not long ago by an american who managed to get his son to the States.

Good luck Tuky, your wee girls are gorgeous!!

There was a thread not long ago by an american who managed to get his son to the States.

that is correct. the big advantage was that his baby son has an american passport.

Sorry, I just presumed that Tuky's daughters had dual nationality too.

Sorry, I just presumed that Tuky's daughters had dual nationality too.

Strange that one. I guess it is mostly my fault as I thought I still had years before they needed their passports. I did give it a try with the missus early on when we took the kids to meet my family but she didn't think it worth the trouble to get the passports yet.

I never thought twice about it, but now I do wonder if there was some kind of ulterior motive way back then...

Anyway, from emails and sms messages I have received from her family it seems she has been outcast. But I could never truly believe anything they have to say anyway. I do believe they all know what they are doing and it all revolves around $$$.

They are kinda cute aren't they

I have just been on the phone with the exwife, who strangely enough called to demand money.

I told her I want my kids, she said NO.

But then she called back 5 minutes later and said I can have my kids here with me on the one condition that the Grandmum comes with them and lives with me.

The grandmum is the basis of all our problems I believe, if I could have taken the ex away from the grandmum when we were first married things may have been better.

On the other hand, if she comes here with my kids, perhaps there is a chance that after a short while living here, not knowing the language, having no friends, and life being made as difficult for her as possible by me she may well decide to go back to Thailand and leave the kids with me...

What do you all think?

let her come, and then dob her into immigration so she gets deported. Evil, I know, but the grandmother is a wicked old cow.

let her come, and then dob her into immigration so she gets deported. Evil, I know, but the grandmother is a wicked old cow.

Yeah.

You know, it occured to me that the ex knows how much I want the kids, she also knows her mother is a wicked old cow so I am wondering if she sees herself killing two birds with the one stone by agreeing to this.

Her life would be much easier without the old beast present.

I just remember what it was like before at home when she was around, my skin literally crawled each time I saw her.

But it would be a start yeah? My kids both have their Indonesian 'Kitas'

You know these bitches better than us, but it somehow seems to me unlikely that (a) she would really try to send the kids with Grandma, and whether the grandma would really agree to go.

What's in it for her? She can't be stupid, so she must know she will end up in a strange country where she can't speak the language, and amongst complete strangers and with and ex son in law who hates her.

As for your ex - I wouldn't trust anything she proposes or agrees to. As you know they are all very devious.

But the thought occurs to me that if you can get your kids to Indonesia - presumably on Thai passports, then you can try to register them as Australian citizens and get them Aussi passports. Do you have the necessary documents to do this or can you get them? You can always tell your ex that you the need docs etc in order to get permission for them to live with you.

Sorry to put a dampener on this, but my guess that this whole idea is a ruse to get some money out of you.

Yep Mobi, you are correct. She told me not long ago that she will agree for the three house plus 1 million baht and the Mum comes.

She did have another option, I go to Thailand with my girlfriend and collect the kids ourselves for free. I asked her how could I be sure she would not have someone waiting with a gun... her reply was to that I know her too well.

Anyway, it all went bad and now she is on her way to Indo with said gun to make troubles for me...however, she always says this and I always remind her she would never get through immigration with a gun and then always says she will come anyway and "box" me and I always end up reminding her that this is Indo and she would end up in an Indo prison so what is she hoping to acheive....keep rereading what I just wrote and you can get the gist of our phone conversations

I actually have all this recorded now I will see if I can edit it and post on her some of the better bits...

I continue to believe that as she obviously doesn't care one bit about the kids in her deluded druggie daze, that if you simply make it clear to her that you will take the kids but never offer her anything else (and keep to this consistently without engaging in her other games) she will eventually tire of what little responsibility she is managing to maintain with respect to them and ask you to take them off her hands as a relief. She sounds far too warped and selfish to behave any other way.

In fact, I'd recommend your next step be to tell her you're too busy to deal with her any more and she can have the kids.

I bet before long she'll be BEGGING you to take them. Sad, but effective.

I continue to believe that as she obviously doesn't care one bit about the kids in her deluded druggie daze, that if you simply make it clear to her that you will take the kids but never offer her anything else (and keep to this consistently without engaging in her other games) she will eventually tire of what little responsibility she is managing to maintain with respect to them and ask you to take them off her hands as a relief. She sounds far too warped and selfish to behave any other way.

In fact, I'd recommend your next step be to tell her you're too busy to deal with her any more and she can have the kids.

I bet before long she'll be BEGGING you to take them. Sad, but effective.

Not a bad idea. In fact you really don't have much choice as you could never trust her.

The only other alternative is to have them "whisked away" to Bangkok where they can be kept in hiding, while you try to sort their paperwork.

I continue to believe that as she obviously doesn't care one bit about the kids in her deluded druggie daze, that if you simply make it clear to her that you will take the kids but never offer her anything else (and keep to this consistently without engaging in her other games) she will eventually tire of what little responsibility she is managing to maintain with respect to them and ask you to take them off her hands as a relief. She sounds far too warped and selfish to behave any other way.

In fact, I'd recommend your next step be to tell her you're too busy to deal with her any more and she can have the kids.

I agree. As long as she believes that she can use the kids as a bargaining tool she's got you by the danglies. Tell her to keep them and do not respond to any contacts for the next 3 months. Don't answer the phone - don't reply to texts. Nothing.

You don't want the MiL there.. there has to be a complete break from that family, get out of their clutches and stop them controlling your life. Does your ex know where you live in Indo ? If yes.. that's a shame, if no.. then definitely no MiL, your location would then be known by the ex.

I agree with the other previous posts, take her advantage away... say she can keep the kids, cut off contact and leave the ball in her court. I know it won't be easy given the fact you love your kids, but think of the long term.

Truth be known, If i were in the same situation, knowing what to do would be very confusing... but one thing is for sure, you have got to stop her from walking all over you.

Good luck

Totster