Our Clubs In Europe Thread............ All Competitions.

[StevieH]

why they need more than a week to put eight pingpong balls in a bag is beyond me. they should do the draw in patpong with aid of one of the ladies there. it'd be far better television.

[bkkjames]

why they need more than a week to put eight pingpong balls in a bag is beyond me. they should do the draw in patpong with aid of one of the ladies there. it'd be far better television.

plattina blatter and co need a week to do the math IE - "if we put weights inside the English team balls we will be sure to get them drawn against each other. This way in the semi we will have English team 1 vs Barca and English Team 2 vs Bayern - man are we smart!"

[Plus]

Firstly, Chelsea were never behind in the whole tie from minute 1 of the First Leg..

Nitpicky, are we?

Chelsea were 0-1 down, then 1-2 down in the second leg.

Secondly i suggest you watch the 90 mins in Milan & tell us how you view the difference in the 2 Teams then..

I just watched 90 min at Old Trafford, if you want to see my opinion on the first leg, I posted it somewhere, probably in Man U thread.

Thirdly, if having all 4 English Teams qualify for the QF's & all 3 Italian Teams knocked out before the QF's isn't a sign of dominance, i'd like you to show me what is ??

It's just one result in the knockout stages. Don't read too much into it. Both Uve and Roma had reasonable chances and that would have left two clubs for both coutnries.

Who'd call penalty shootout win a sign of world dominance? Don't get ahead of yourself.

& lastly, Chelsea in decline ??? Don't make me laugh, they've had a dodgy Year but are still head & shoulders above anything else that Europe has to offer & argubly only behind 1 Team in England..

There were AHEAD of that 1 team in England not long time ago and it has been downhill ever since. They have never lost a home game then, things have certainly changed.

They don't have a stable manager, btw, Hiddink still works for Russia, and it's a third manager in two seasons. Way to go. Grant took them to CL finals but that wasn't good enough.

I don't see them challenging Alex Ferguson again any time soon. Abramovich and Maurinho both didn't have enough discipline to stay on top. That time has passed, Chelsea needs to build a new team but no one is in charge.

[rixalex]

but as a fan, i don't think that the champions league is a whole lot of fun at the moment .

Don't worry about. As we know, football is cyclical. You'll be moaning in 5 years that you can't qualify cos all the otherteams are better

You know for me what is getting boring? All this negative crap. 4 English teams have made it through to the quarters of the biggest club competition in the world, and they made it through not by dirty tactics, not by iffy refereeing decisions, not by some jammy fluke, but they made it through by out-playing the opposition and winning fair and square.

Why can't we just enjoy whilst it lasts, the fact that English football clubs are some of the strongest and most exciting in the world right now for goodness sake! As Mr Boj rightly says, and as Plus inferred, give it a few years and the tables will have turned - they always do - and then we can go back to moaning about how English teams are failing in Europe once again.

Stevie you know what i think your problem is? You don't like the fact that you're having to share the limelight four ways. Had Liverpool been the only team to go through this week from England, you would no doubt have been basking in the adulation of the English press - they would have been going crazy about your demolition of Real Madrid. As it is though - your feat impressive though it was - it is just one of four pretty impressive displays. What's more, you fancy your chances much better playing a team from outside the Premiership. You are scared stiff of getting beaten on the big stage by your nearest and biggest enemy. That's what this is really all about - not some high and mighty sense of injustice at the way other European clubs are struggling to compete.

[StevieH]

Stevie you know what i think your problem is? You don't like the fact that you're having to share the limelight four ways. Had Liverpool been the only team to go through this week from England, you would no doubt have been basking in the adulation of the English press - they would have been going crazy about your demolition of Real Madrid. As it is though - your feat impressive though it was - it is just one of four pretty impressive displays. What's more, you fancy your chances much better playing a team from outside the Premiership. You are scared stiff of getting beaten on the big stage by your nearest and biggest enemy. That's what this is really all about - not some high and mighty sense of injustice at the way other European clubs are struggling to compete.

you're definitely beginning to get it, rix. . . .i'd be more than happy to see just liverpool from the english clubs in the last eight but i would never expect the 'adulation of the english press'. liverpool have never had that in my lifetime and frankly i don't want it. of course i want united, chelsea and arsenal to lose, i'm a liverpool fan for goodness' sake!

and i'd be happy, ecstatic in fact, to see the european cup go back to its old format of a knockout tournament featuring just the champions of each country, one team from each, even if that meant liverpool not being in it. it was a more interesting and emotionally rich competition in those days, and felt more special winning it. but the financial landscape of football the business these days means that those days are long gone and never to return.

[Plus]

Five years ago I thought English teams were <deleted>, mostly because Man U fans had this attitude that they deserve to win CL every year and every other team was shit scared of them.

Things have changed.

Man U certainly looks capable of winning two in a row, but it's all temporary, who knows if Sir Alex can keep it up for another five years.

[bkkjames]

Stevie you know what i think your problem is? You don't like the fact that you're having to share the limelight four ways. Had Liverpool been the only team to go through this week from England, you would no doubt have been basking in the adulation of the English press - they would have been going crazy about your demolition of Real Madrid. As it is though - your feat impressive though it was - it is just one of four pretty impressive displays. What's more, you fancy your chances much better playing a team from outside the Premiership. You are scared stiff of getting beaten on the big stage by your nearest and biggest enemy. That's what this is really all about - not some high and mighty sense of injustice at the way other European clubs are struggling to compete.

you're definitely beginning to get it, rix. . . .i'd be more than happy to see just liverpool from the english clubs in the last eight but i would never expect the 'adulation of the english press'. liverpool have never had that in my lifetime and frankly i don't want it. of course i want united, chelsea and arsenal to lose, i'm a liverpool fan for goodness' sake!

and i'd be happy, ecstatic in fact, to see the european cup go back to its old format of a knockout tournament featuring just the champions of each country, one team from each, even if that meant liverpool not being in it. it was a more interesting and emotionally rich competition in those days, and felt more special winning it. but the financial landscape of football the business these days means that those days are long gone and never to return.

yep, good idea, not only would not have Premiership title in the last how many decades, we wouldn't have to listen to you drone on about how good you are in Europe.

[StevieH]

Five years ago I thought English teams were <deleted>, mostly because Man U fans had this attitude that they deserve to win CL every year and every other team was shit scared of them.

Things have changed.

Man U certainly looks capable of winning two in a row, but it's all temporary, who knows if Sir Alex can keep it up for another five years.

ferguson has put in place such an empire at united, complete with youth player production line, scouting network and financial security, that bkkjames could take over as manager three seasons from now and they'd still be favourites for the league and european cup. it isn't always temporary, while liverpool and chelsea's fortunes may be somewhat built on sand, united's isn't.

[StevieH]

yep, good idea, not only would not have Premiership title in the last how many decades, we wouldn't have to listen to you drone on about how good you are in Europe.

forgive me, i forgot that you would never have seen united play in that tournament being as the last time they did george best and bobby charlton were in the team. it was champions versus champions over two legs, which essentially meant the national sides of each country plus the odd international superstar here and there, and was just a more interesting competition.

know what else irks me, the bloody name of the thing. the 'champions league'. it isn't even a <deleted> league f'chrissakes, total marketing misnomer.

[MSingh]

Nitpicky, are we?

Chelsea were 0-1 down, then 1-2 down in the second leg.

0-1 down = Level in the Tie - 1-2 = Ahead on Away Goals, exactly how Porto went through last night so that's not nitpicky, just a fact..

I just watched 90 min at Old Trafford, if you want to see my opinion on the first leg, I posted it somewhere, probably in Man U thread.

In that case, you understand that Inter were nowhere near equal to Man Utd..

It's just one result in the knockout stages. Don't read too much into it. Both Uve and Roma had reasonable chances and that would have left two clubs for both coutnries.

Who'd call penalty shootout win a sign of world dominance? Don't get ahead of yourself.

Don't read too much into it

There were AHEAD of that 1 team in England not long time ago and it has been downhill ever since. They have never lost a home game then, things have certainly changed.

Hardly downhill, one place in the League is hardly downhill, give me/them a break..

They don't have a stable manager, btw, Hiddink still works for Russia, and it's a third manager in two seasons. Way to go. Grant took them to CL finals but that wasn't good enough.

Look at Real if that's what you're thinking..

I don't see them challenging Alex Ferguson again any time soon. Abramovich and Maurinho both didn't have enough discipline to stay on top. That time has passed, Chelsea needs to build a new team but no one is in charge.

I have to agree but no one in their right mind, with a Team with as much quality as Chelsea have, could rule them out completely just on the off chance they may get some stability, which i believe they will in the Summer but if they don't & they do go backwards, i'd be amongst the first to laugh my t*ts off...

[bkkjames]

yep, good idea, not only would not have Premiership title in the last how many decades, we wouldn't have to listen to you drone on about how good you are in Europe.

forgive me, i forgot that you would never have seen united play in that tournament being as the last time they did george best and bobby charlton were in the team. it was champions versus champions over two legs, which essentially meant the national sides of each country plus the odd international superstar here and there, and was just a more interesting competition.

know what else irks me, the bloody name of the thing. the 'champions league'. it isn't even a <deleted> league f'chrissakes, total marketing misnomer.

but what might make it more interesting would be the top 2 from each league goes into the CL. Financially, though, they wouldn't go for it because of lost TV revenue due to less games.

[StevieH]

as a serious suggestion, and away from my sense of myopic nostalgia and idealism, a very sensible and fair change that uefa could make would be to remove the seeding process and also the country barriers from the group and knockout stages. have a proper, open and fair draw of the initial group stages so that in theory all four english clubs could end up in the same first round group. that would immediately make it a better and fairer competition.

[bkkjames]

as a serious suggestion, and away from my sense of myopic nostalgia and idealism, a very sensible and fair change that uefa could make would be to remove the seeding process and also the country barriers from the group and knockout stages. have a proper, open and fair draw of the initial group stages so that in theory all four english clubs could end up in the same first round group. that would immediately make it a better and fairer competition.

but knocking out the big guns in the first round doesn't make for good TV. Won't happen.

[StevieH]

but what might make it more interesting would be the top 2 from each league goes into the CL. Financially, though, they wouldn't go for it because of lost TV revenue due to less games.

that used to be the case not that long ago, james. then it became three, then uefa used the success of a country's clubs to give them additional places, so england ended up with four.

the catch-22 that uefa finds itself in is that what used to be called the G14 of clubs holds the threat of a breakaway european super league over uefa's head, so it has to keep the 'big' clubs happy with the guaranteed revenues. which is why platini and blatter are trying to move the goalposts through the back door with the 6+5 quota system. they know full well that if they cut places tomorrow the clubs would band together and form their own competition.

[StevieH]

as a serious suggestion, and away from my sense of myopic nostalgia and idealism, a very sensible and fair change that uefa could make would be to remove the seeding process and also the country barriers from the group and knockout stages. have a proper, open and fair draw of the initial group stages so that in theory all four english clubs could end up in the same first round group. that would immediately make it a better and fairer competition.

but knocking out the big guns in the first round doesn't make for good TV. Won't happen.

the group stages now don't make for good tv. they're boring and predictable. imagine a 'group of death' like you get in world cups featuring united, liverpool, chelsea and arsenal - how much drama do you want?

Edited March 12, 2009 by StevieH

[rixalex]

as a serious suggestion, and away from my sense of myopic nostalgia and idealism, a very sensible and fair change that uefa could make would be to remove the seeding process and also the country barriers from the group and knockout stages. have a proper, open and fair draw of the initial group stages so that in theory all four english clubs could end up in the same first round group. that would immediately make it a better and fairer competition.

but knocking out the big guns in the first round doesn't make for good TV. Won't happen.

the group stages now don't make for good tv. they're boring and predictable. imagine a 'group of death' like you get in world cups featuring united, liverpool, chelsea and arsenal - how much drama do you want?

So when United, Liverpool, Chelsea and Arsenal meet in the Quarters, Semis and in the Final, you find that boring, but match them up at the start of the competition and all of a sudden it's exciting and dramatic??

[StevieH]

So when United, Liverpool, Chelsea and Arsenal meet in the Quarters, Semis and in the Final, you find that boring, but match them up at the start of the competition and all of a sudden it's exciting and dramatic??

yes, of course. because not only does it make for a fairer, more interesting first round group stage it also means that there could be another group featuring levski sofia, sparta prague, fc copenhagen and lille, meaning two of them advance through to the lucrative knockout stages and a fairer redistribution of the wealth that the champions league (spit, cough) generates.

when the same 16 teams progress to the knockout stages every season and as a result have a monopoly on the snowball of money, how are other clubs ever supposed to improve? short of finding a sugar daddy like man city, hoffenheim and a couple of the russian clubs have?

[rixalex]

You are scared stiff of getting beaten on the big stage by your nearest and biggest enemy.

you're definitely beginning to get it, rix. . . .

Like your honesty Stevie.

[StevieH]

You are scared stiff of getting beaten on the big stage by your nearest and biggest enemy.

you're definitely beginning to get it, rix. . . .

Like your honesty Stevie.

oi, don't take me out of context fuc_knuts.

[bkkjames]

So when United, Liverpool, Chelsea and Arsenal meet in the Quarters, Semis and in the Final, you find that boring, but match them up at the start of the competition and all of a sudden it's exciting and dramatic??

yes, of course. because not only does it make for a fairer, more interesting first round group stage it also means that there could be another group featuring levski sofia, sparta prague, fc copenhagen and lille, meaning two of them advance through to the lucrative knockout stages and a fairer redistribution of the wealth that the champions league (spit, cough) generates.

when the same 16 teams progress to the knockout stages every season and as a result have a monopoly on the snowball of money, how are other clubs ever supposed to improve? short of finding a sugar daddy like man city, hoffenheim and a couple of the russian clubs have?

Stevie, like your Fan vs Supporter position, sorry to say but Rix is way ahead on points on this one.

[StevieH]

So when United, Liverpool, Chelsea and Arsenal meet in the Quarters, Semis and in the Final, you find that boring, but match them up at the start of the competition and all of a sudden it's exciting and dramatic??

yes, of course. because not only does it make for a fairer, more interesting first round group stage it also means that there could be another group featuring levski sofia, sparta prague, fc copenhagen and lille, meaning two of them advance through to the lucrative knockout stages and a fairer redistribution of the wealth that the champions league (spit, cough) generates.

when the same 16 teams progress to the knockout stages every season and as a result have a monopoly on the snowball of money, how are other clubs ever supposed to improve? short of finding a sugar daddy like man city, hoffenheim and a couple of the russian clubs have?

Stevie, like your Fan vs Supporter position, sorry to say but Rix is way ahead on points on this one.

balls he is. the fan vs supporter thing was a good discussion but rix is missing the bigger picture here. besides, he can speak for himself, manc.

[rixalex]

So when United, Liverpool, Chelsea and Arsenal meet in the Quarters, Semis and in the Final, you find that boring, but match them up at the start of the competition and all of a sudden it's exciting and dramatic??

yes, of course. because not only does it make for a fairer, more interesting first round group stage it also means that there could be another group featuring levski sofia, sparta prague, fc copenhagen and lille, meaning two of them advance through to the lucrative knockout stages and a fairer redistribution of the wealth that the champions league (spit, cough) generates.

I'd rather watch Barcelona take on a Bayern or a United in the final, than watch a team like Levski Sofia get rolled over in a one-sided mis-match.

Save your romance for Mrs H mate, i'm sure she'd appreciate it more than we do.

[StevieH]

So when United, Liverpool, Chelsea and Arsenal meet in the Quarters, Semis and in the Final, you find that boring, but match them up at the start of the competition and all of a sudden it's exciting and dramatic??

yes, of course. because not only does it make for a fairer, more interesting first round group stage it also means that there could be another group featuring levski sofia, sparta prague, fc copenhagen and lille, meaning two of them advance through to the lucrative knockout stages and a fairer redistribution of the wealth that the champions league (spit, cough) generates.

I'd rather watch Barcelona take on a Bayern or a United in the final, than watch a team like Levski Sofia get rolled over in a one-sided mis-match.

Save your romance for Mrs H mate, i'm sure she'd appreciate it more than we do.

haha. if only she did man. invariably you would get two big teams in the final through the law of averages, you always did in years gone by. but a less biased seeding system would redistribute the money throughout the european leagues and clubs more fairly and evenly. and make the group stages more than just a mere formality.

[bkkjames]

So when United, Liverpool, Chelsea and Arsenal meet in the Quarters, Semis and in the Final, you find that boring, but match them up at the start of the competition and all of a sudden it's exciting and dramatic??

yes, of course. because not only does it make for a fairer, more interesting first round group stage it also means that there could be another group featuring levski sofia, sparta prague, fc copenhagen and lille, meaning two of them advance through to the lucrative knockout stages and a fairer redistribution of the wealth that the champions league (spit, cough) generates.

when the same 16 teams progress to the knockout stages every season and as a result have a monopoly on the snowball of money, how are other clubs ever supposed to improve? short of finding a sugar daddy like man city, hoffenheim and a couple of the russian clubs have?

Stevie, like your Fan vs Supporter position, sorry to say but Rix is way ahead on points on this one.

balls he is. the fan vs supporter thing was a good discussion but rix is missing the bigger picture here. besides, he can speak for himself, manc.

if you added me as friend too , perhaps I would stick up for you from time to time - scouse

[StevieH]

if you added me as friend too , perhaps I would stick up for you from time to time - scouse

'added you as a friend'? what does that mean? are you grooming me? i've heard about you internet weirdos.

[rixalex]

if you added me as friend too , perhaps I would stick up for you from time to time - scouse

What was this all about yesterday then mate?

I am a little bit with Stevie on this one.

I spat out my lunch. You owe me half a cheese and ham sandwich mate.

[StevieH]

chunky monkey frank lampard helps me to make my 'boring' point.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/...ons-League.html

Frank Lampard has admitted that he wants to avoid Liverpool in next week's Champions League quarter-final draw after being paired with the Premier League rivals in each of the last four seasons.

In three of those four meetings, the teams have met in the semi-finals, with Liverpool winning in 2004 and 2007, while Chelsea succeeded in last year's last four, in dramatic fashion.

Lampard helped Chelsea to a 2-2 draw against Juventus in Turin on Tuesday - and 3-2 aggregate win - but the England midfielder admitted the players were 'fed up' with what has become an annual Champions League clash.

"When you look around at who is left in the competition there is not a team you would say you fancy playing," said Lampard. "Maybe Liverpool don't want to play us either and, to be honest, we are all a bit fed-up of that one. If fate says it should happen then so be it, but I think we would all be happy avoiding it.

[bkkjames]

if you added me as friend too , perhaps I would stick up for you from time to time - scouse

What was this all about yesterday then mate?

I am a little bit with Stevie on this one.

I spat out my lunch. You owe me half a cheese and ham sandwich mate.

It's all mind games Rix but they are supposed to confuse the Kop heads not ourselves

[StevieH]

if you added me as friend too , perhaps I would stick up for you from time to time - scouse

What was this all about yesterday then mate?

I am a little bit with Stevie on this one.

I spat out my lunch. You owe me half a cheese and ham sandwich mate.

It's all mind games Rix but they are supposed to confuse the Kop heads not ourselves

it's 'kopites' not 'kop heads' soft lad.

[bkkjames]

it's 'kopites' not 'kop heads' soft lad.

do you know the difference between a kopite and copper?

One thinks he is god's gift to football and other carries a big stick.