Thai Immigration Introduces New TM-card

[Humphrey Bear]

I came in yesterday and used the old form. No problems.

The old form has a place where you state your desired period of stay - in my case 90 days. The new form has nothing of this, so be very careful to make sure that the Immigration Officer is aware of your status.

With regard to the income statement, I would tick the box for 'No Income'. Don't really know why Immigration are interested in this matter - it is surely something for the tax boys to find out.

[Humphrey Bear]

The income question is to be replied by "non-Thai resident only".

Perhaps I am too slow this morning, but who is such a resident? Certainly not a tourist or somebody entering on a visa exempted stay?

How about non-immigrants? They are not residents although they are  non-Thai.

Puzzled.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This threw me as well. We were given the new forms on the flight yesterday, but I had already filled in the old one, so I stuck with that. As my companions were non-English they considered that having a business visa / work permit meant that they were 'resident' and did not fill in the back page. Nothing was said at Immigration.

But to me that is not a definition of 'resident'. One should have the year-extension / renewal to regard oneself as resident.

[Shrednyneas]

Well, there is a new arrival card and that's pretty much it. Just a little form, a &lt;deleted&gt;' piece of paper to fill in and surely no reason to get your blood steaming.

Here, how I see the entire subject:

- For non-Thai resident only

Don't just guess but read the Thai script instead. It translates "exclusively for foreigners". A foreigner is a person that does not hold citizenship of the country he is about to enter and/or resides in. So all of us non-Thais are concerned whether we are going to be on a short term (tourist, business trip) or long term (pensioner, supporter of family etc. - the holders of non-immigrant visas). Under these circumstances the term "non-Thai resident" is not so bad at all. An abbreviation for "staying (= residing) in Thailand as a foreigner (= not holding Thai citizenship = non-Thai) independant from the mission.

- Income

Income is not necessarily just a salary/wage obtained for work but money someone obtains by all kind of means to make a living (it can be a salary, wage, pension, money from renting out property, interest, dividends etc.)

- Question about yearly income

Most likely of interest for statistical reasons (for example of some value to TAT)  only and very unlikely for use of putting some stones into a foreigners attempt to enter Thailand or reside here.  The issue may, however, be brought up if a person gets into conflict with the law or features severe misbehaviour while in town. There are rumours that Thailand is not just a magnet to the Vienna Choir Boys but also to a lot of f...-ups of all kinds of nationalities but guess these are just  rumours particularly in a city that bears the name "City of Angels".    Under these circumstances let us just take it for granted that the information about income is for statistical reasons only.  A question, by the way, that is quite often raised may it be when you get surveyed on the street, apply for a credit card, fill in a questionaire by a hotel, a theme park, maybe even a McDonald restaurant when they asked their patrons whether they are satisfied with the service.

The modern world just loves statistics for whatever reasons and pulls out figures on any occasion whether it is approprate or not.

Conclusion: RELAX. Rather have a Singh or a Chang to flush down your paranoia and enjoy your time of residing in Thailand. Adopt an occasional "mai pen rai" or even a little bit of Thai "mag ngai" and the sky appears to get a little more pink colored shine.

Just my two tiny little satang.

Richard

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I completely agree with Richard. Sometimes you get tired of the paranoid and anti-Thai stuff you read here.

Shrednyneas

[Humphrey Bear]

I see the card has the ASEAN logo on it.  Do other ASEAN countries have similar cards?  Is it perhaps an attempt to get some sort of consistency amongst the documentation for the different countries?

Or is that just a daft question to ask in Thailand? 

G

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Different forms in Singapore, Malaysia, Indonesia and Vietnam. Some of the same questions, but no co-ordination yet.

[thaihome]

Sometimes you get tired of the paranoid and anti-Thai stuff you read here.

Shrednyneas

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It is indeed amazing to have 5 pages now on a new arrival form. Just fill it out, leave the income question blank and go on with life.

TH

[Axel]

Well, since the new form is introduced I think it is fair enough to discuss it here.

Sure many questions came up, wether in practice relevant nor not is another point, the average traveller just fills it in, feeling it to be a bit of a nuisance as often the airline staff decides to hand the forms out just before landing, i.e. you write your details during the usually bumpy descend.

Richard cleared the no-Thai residents up for us, "exclusively for foreigners", although I doubt that many visitors are able to read both, Thai and English.

Last time I returned to LoS, January 8, I carried the old form with me, and got supplied with old form as well in Emirates, coming from Dubai. As everybody mentioned, no problem at immigration, and this is positive. I recall 2-3 years ago, new forms in VietNam, effective first of the month. Arriving on the 1st with old form, some 200 passengers were refused and had to rewrite their declarations in the arrival hall. What a mess.

Another questions, tongue in cheek: Why to declare income in US$?

Wouldn't the Baht be appropriate, or perhaps the Euro?

Others mind prefer the mighty PStlg.

[Sunny Valentine]

I completely agree with Richard. Sometimes you get tired of the paranoid and anti-Thai stuff you read here.

Shrednyneas

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So there are some people on this forum who really believe in the benevolence of governments in general, no questions asked?

Maybe they also believe in Santa Claus?

Sunny

[smokie]

Here we go again -- several failures of logic and of English --

DO YOU SPEAK THAI ????

[george]

Please keep on topic!

/Admin

[h90]

The income question is to be replied by "non-Thai resident only".

Perhaps I am too slow this morning, but who is such a resident? Certainly not a tourist or somebody entering on a visa exempted stay?

How about non-immigrants? They are not residents although they are  non-Thai.

Puzzled.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

you are exactly right, resident means just that people living in residence

but then is staying in a hotel also classified as being in residence or as visitor?

and where should the income be made, i suggest you should fill in the lowest amount at any time, which is bt 800.000, easier to verify and is a decent sum by thai standards anyway

in any case this is a grave abuse of intrusion of privacy

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

verify the income?? How shall I verify my income, that would be 2 kg paperwork in different languages

I'll just checkmark something in the middle....

[WilliamIV]

A true tourist would not be staying for more than 90 days.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I know lots of tourists who stay for longer than 90 days (of course they have to jump inot Laos, Combodia or Myanmar to renew their Visa) Thailand is an amazing place with so much to offer and so much to see. To say that you can see it in 90 days is wrong. Going to Phuket and Pattaya is NOT seeing Thailand.

The last time I was at the Mai Sai Border they had a sign up saying that all Tourist must carry 20,000 Baht on their person. This is crazy to me. If I was into mugging people I think I know where I would hang out!

I really think thailand is trying to do away with tourists (like myself) who aren't wealthy, who don't spend a lot of money in the Kingdom, and who aren't actively chipping in to Thaksinomics. I wish they could see that some of us are chipping in to Thailand in other ways, i.e. volunteering during the Tsunami crisis, teaching english at rural Thai schools for nothing, workingo n organic farms, and doing sustainable building in the north.

I am worried that at some point I am going to go to the boarder, and they are going to tell me that I am not wealthy enough to have the privaledge of traveling in Thailand. This already happens systematically to those people from non-first world countries. My friend who is mexican had a terrible time trying to get into this country. Whereas, because I am american I get no questions asked (up till now).

Trouble in the Kingdom.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

CS

If they are jumping to other Countries to renew their visas then they are NOT "staying in Thailand for more than 90 days".

and "teaching english at rural Thai schools for nothing," requires a Work Permit.

It would be better if you knew the Regulations before pontificating.

Bill

[Baaksida]

Another questions, tongue in cheek: Why to declare income in US$?

Wouldn't the Baht be appropriate, or perhaps the Euro?

Others mind prefer the mighty PStlg.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good question! It might be a good idea (not only for promotional purposes) to hand out a cheap calculator to each visitor together with the arrival card... (You don't want to give wrong information to TAT and the Thai government, do you??)

[dr_Pat_Pong]

A true tourist would not be staying for more than 90 days.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I know lots of tourists who stay for longer than 90 days (of course they have to jump inot Laos, Combodia or Myanmar to renew their Visa) Thailand is an amazing place with so much to offer and so much to see. To say that you can see it in 90 days is wrong. Going to Phuket and Pattaya is NOT seeing Thailand.

The last time I was at the Mai Sai Border they had a sign up saying that all Tourist must carry 20,000 Baht on their person. This is crazy to me. If I was into mugging people I think I know where I would hang out!

I really think thailand is trying to do away with tourists (like myself) who aren't wealthy, who don't spend a lot of money in the Kingdom, and who aren't actively chipping in to Thaksinomics. I wish they could see that some of us are chipping in to Thailand in other ways, i.e. volunteering during the Tsunami crisis, teaching english at rural Thai schools for nothing, workingo n organic farms, and doing sustainable building in the north.

I am worried that at some point I am going to go to the boarder, and they are going to tell me that I am not wealthy enough to have the privaledge of traveling in Thailand. This already happens systematically to those people from non-first world countries. My friend who is mexican had a terrible time trying to get into this country. Whereas, because I am american I get no questions asked (up till now).

Trouble in the Kingdom.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

CS

If they are jumping to other Countries to renew their visas then they are NOT "staying in Thailand for more than 90 days".

and "teaching english at rural Thai schools for nothing," requires a Work Permit.

It would be better if you knew the Regulations before pontificating.

Bill

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm with you Bill. We are talking to poverty packing illegals. Tourists do not stay for ever in ANY country on earth

[turbog]

Childish response removed

Edited January 13, 2005 by dr_Pat_Pong

[turbog]

Try another

[sriracha john]

Hey;

if this is to only serve to verify their idea that RICH tourists and farangs visit. lets all agree that we are all the highest income . 

What they going to do ask us to verfiy it????

I'm torn between agreeing that EVERYONE should check the "US$80,001 and over" box in order to give TAT the desired response they seek.... and that is that ALL 13 million arrivals to Thailand are extremely rich. They would be so pleased.

...but I'm also wondering that if ALL 13 million arrivals to Thailand checked the "no income" box, perhaps TAT would have to re-think everything they do. Perhaps if we were ALL paupers, maybe they would seek to get lower entrance fees to National Parks, advocate that Thai businesses go easy on visitor's prices, etc.

Edited January 13, 2005 by sriracha john

[Pi Sua]

my reading of 'non-thai resident' means anybody who is not a Thai residing in thailand on any long term visa, B, O etc. What does 'non-thai' means? To me, it refers to nationality

.

I take the reading like that too. This means that it concerns only the non-Thai citizens who are resident ! So not the tourists at all!

if it reads 'Non Thai Resident', without the hyphen, it will mean all those who are not residing in Thailand, regardless they are citizens or not.

the statement is clear to me, not sure why it's confusing to others. The hyphen makes a difference.

The Hyphen

I agree that this small detail makes the difference. It creates a contradiction and as well a disturbance...This hyphen shouldn't be here.

For non-Thai resident

Although that I'm not a native English speaker, it seems to be very simple to understand even I agree there could be few ways to take it and surely they should better have written "For non resident" or "For non resident in Thailand" or "For non Thai resident (again without the hyphen)"

I also feel it may concern the Thais who are resident abroad because most of the TM is translated in Thai.

I take this new TM card like that:

For people non resident (officially) in Thailand

It concerns all the people who are travelling in Thailand for a short or long period and even those who are working but without the status of "resident in Thailand" officially recognized by Thai authorities which means having been a few year tax payer and applied for residency and of course, have been granted it.

Just have look at the section "purpose of visit: holiday, education, employment, business and others " to understand that all these categories of people are subject to fill the form...and there is not any place to mark in if you are resident.

But at the end, the immigration officer will be here to ask you to fill in at the right place.

Edited January 13, 2005 by Pi Sua

[kenken]

I heared other farangs talking together, they seemd wondering ,dont know true or false.

If you stay thailand totally more than 6 months in a year,

If you have income in your country, but

you must be regarded as a residents, you have to pay income tax here.

true or false?

[chuckygobyebye]

I got a new one last time I came in, didn't notice anything on the back and just handed it in. The immigration office also didn't notice anything missing on the back and handed me back my passport.

I'd suggest that the question on income is for STATISTICAL purposes since it asks the RANGE of income and not your EXACT income.

Tourism is Thailand's second-biggest currency earner and they take it very seriously. If you look at the TAT website you'll find they keep huge amount of data on tourist numbers and activates.

[paully]

I suspect there is less here than meets the eye, although the English usage is very ambiguous,I think the objective is for the Thai Government or TAT to get a handle on visitor demographics including income to asist in planning tourist infrastructure.Not in itself so silly an idea but just inefficiently implemented by bureaucrats.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think you're right, Boris. The TAT already use the TM6s for visitor statistics: how many, where from, first time in Thailand, on group or individual holidays, how long you're staying, etc. I expect that they want to know how many rich/middle/poor tourists are entering the country so that they can see what sort of tourists are being attracted. With these new boxes they will also be able to calculate how many tourists return to their home countries and how many go on to other tourist destinations.

[steve9145]

Re new tourist visa

I would like to see what we in the west would produce in the Thai language !!!!

We produce many stupid and incorrect forms in English that have to be completed by native English speakers.........as in all things , critisism is easy !!!

Regarding statement of income.......not difficult if your affairs are in order P60 ...pension book.....etc. Surely unemployment benefits are certifiable.

I think the 30 day visa should be seen for what it is.... a TOURIST visa for holidaymakers and business travellers and not as an end in itself.

I have been told that to go to the states you may now be fingerprinted....On my only visit there I was interrogated as to the purpose of a three day visit.

I also wonder what would be the response would be if the new airport fell down...as happened in France...........and an office block at heathrow airport London because the tunnel below was not supported

Come on everyone...moan by all means but try to be a little more understanding !!!!

Lets not forget the reasons we are here !!!!!

Please do not correct any spellig or gramer erors.

[george]

Are you guys on topic here?

We will move off toipic mpost and members!

Thanks for making this forum a great place!

/Admin

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Re new tourist visa

I would like to see what we in the west would produce in the Thai language !!!!

We produce many stupid and incorrect forms in English that have to be completed by native English speakers.........as in all things , critisism is easy !!!

Regarding statement of income.......not difficult if your affairs are in order  P60 ...pension book.....etc.  Surely unemployment benefits are certifiable.

I think the 30 day visa should be seen for what it is.... a TOURIST visa for holidaymakers and business travellers and not as an end in itself.

I have been told that to go to the states you may now be fingerprinted....On my only visit there I was interrogated as to the purpose of a three day visit.

I also wonder what would be the response would be if the new airport fell down...as happened in France...........and an office block at heathrow airport London because the tunnel below was not supported

Come on everyone...moan by all means but try to be a little more understanding !!!!

Lets not forget the reasons we are here !!!!!

Please do not correct any spellig or gramer erors.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Just to clear you up. A business visitor is NOT entitled to that permit on arrival. That one is available only to a tourist or transit visitor.

[Darkling]

a government is a government is a government.  every year at US tax time i get the same feeling, "none of their god#mn business" and "why do i have to hook up with these nosey mother fcukers everyyear"? it all boils down to greed, money, sex and ego and threats to the livelihood of greed, money, sex and ego.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I know if it was`nt for the Greed, Sex and Money i woudn`t bother coming here.

[Zoltan]

More papaer work just what people need.

[khunlungphudhu]

This, and other recent threads, have only served to indicate to me just how many people there are living 'close to the cusp' in LOS.

[bob a job]

A couple of points I would like to add.

Firstly backpackers are the top level tourist of tomorrow. Most back packers are university students or similar on a gap year. Give them a good time and they will come back next time as a high earner. Also backpackers save for their trips and are therefore properly funded and will move on when they should.

Ok. Right on man.

Top level tourist, loads of money.

[samran]

Ok.  Right on man.

Top level tourist,    loads of money.         

Actually, yeah they are. Check out the Australian Tourism Commission webpage for a study that was done on this topic a couple of years ago. The average smelly backpacker stays longer and spends more money than the average 'high end tourist'. Due to the nature of their travel activities, the money they spend benefits the the economy more, as it is fed into small businesses, rather than multinational companies.

Edited January 13, 2005 by samran

[Guest fj2003]

i arrived on the 2nd from frankfurt and on the 12th from shianghai both time i asked the lady at the immi for the card and she was even so nice to fill the old form with my details for me both times so that i had only to sign it no new card no question and the line behind me had to wait for her until she put my 90 day stemp in my passport i love this nice lady i meet her now the 5th time maybe she fall in love to me would be nice for the future to get that service always

[Potter]

Look on the bright sides. We are now promoted from Aliens to turists