Thai Banks To Start Charging For Atm Withdrawals ...

[knortyboy]

I've recently used my Nationwide Flex account card in Ayudhya, it's got 'Visa' sysmbol on the front and 'Link' on the back and it was completely fee free. Long may it last.

[jfchandler]

Knortyboy, thanks for posting the clear, useful details of that transaction..

That's of course a UK card, but is that account denominated in pounds or Euros???

Also, I have some U.S. debit cards (both VISA logo and only ATM variety) with the text on the back that says "Interlink" and then a graphic that looks a bit like a pentagon (five-sided) symbol. Is that the same as yours, or is your just "Link"??

That could explain why Brits and Germans are getting fee-free withdrawals at BofA, but Americans by all reports are not.

Edited December 5, 2009 by jfchandler

[kosh]

That could explain why Brits and Germans are getting fee-free withdrawals at BofA, but Americans by all reports are not.

The 150 b fee is not the whole problem...

My italian maestro card added also 1% exchange rate fees....

It is more expensive than a credit card

[jfchandler]

Don't feel too bad Kosh...

For U.S. banks, and their customers using U.S. debit cards abroad, a 1% surcharge on foreign transactions is probably the general norm... because that's the rate that VISA and MC card networks pass along for processing international transactions.

Some U.S. banks charge up to 3% for foreign transactions, including for credit card purchases abroad, and take the extra cut for themselves.

However, there are a few U.S. banks that don't pass along any foreign transaction surcharges at present -- Charles Schwab, E*Trade, Capital One (for credit cards) and a few others. And in the best of all worlds, some like Schwab and E*Trade don't charge any surcharge AND also reimburse for OTHER banks ATM fees like those charged by the Thai banks now.

For an American living abroad, that's the sweet spot where you want to be... no foreign currency transaction fee on your ATM withdrawals and debit card purchases, and full reimbursement for foreign banks' ATM charges should you happen to incur them.

It would be great if some of the European folks could report if there are any bank on that side of the pond that offer comparable perks to their customers....

[knortyboy]

Knortyboy, thanks for posting the clear, useful details of that transaction..

That's of course a UK card, but is that account denominated in pounds or Euros???

Also, I have some U.S. debit cards (both VISA logo and only ATM variety) with the text on the back that says "Interlink" and then a graphic that looks a bit like a pentagon (five-sided) symbol. Is that the same as yours, or is your just "Link"??

That could explain why Brits and Germans are getting fee-free withdrawals at BofA, but Americans by all reports are not.

You're welcome.

The account is in pounds and the 'Interlink' symbol you have is different to the symbol on my card. Mine just says 'Link' with a couple of interlocking circles.

[BIGTOE3]

Knortyboy, thanks for posting the clear, useful details of that transaction..

That's of course a UK card, but is that account denominated in pounds or Euros???

Also, I have some U.S. debit cards (both VISA logo and only ATM variety) with the text on the back that says "Interlink" and then a graphic that looks a bit like a pentagon (five-sided) symbol. Is that the same as yours, or is your just "Link"??

That could explain why Brits and Germans are getting fee-free withdrawals at BofA, but Americans by all reports are not.

You're welcome.

The account is in pounds and the 'Interlink' symbol you have is different to the symbol on my card. Mine just says 'Link' with a couple of interlocking circles.

knortyboy, Are you using the Visa Nationwide card or the Cirus one. ie Flexi blue, Cirus red ?

I believe the Blue Flexi Vsa has a 1% charge because of Visa and the Cirus ( red) IS FREE.

BT

[knortyboy]

knortyboy, Are you using the Visa Nationwide card or the Cirus one. ie Flexi blue, Cirus red ?

I believe the Blue Flexi Vsa has a 1% charge because of Visa and the Cirus ( red) IS FREE.

BT

I'm using the Blue one.

As a previous poster reported, I was unable to get a Red one as I already had a blue one. Would of gotten them in the other order, had I known.

I was aware of the 1% charge but as yet have never been charged it.

[BIGTOE3]

knortyboy, Are you using the Visa Nationwide card or the Cirus one. ie Flexi blue, Cirus red ?

I believe the Blue Flexi Vsa has a 1% charge because of Visa and the Cirus ( red) IS FREE.

BT

I'm using the Blue one.

As a previous poster reported, I was unable to get a Red one as I already had a blue one. Would of gotten them in the other order, had I known.

I was aware of the 1% charge but as yet have never been charged it.

The only reason that they have for refusing you a red Cirus one is that ---- Wait for it --- Your Credit rating is too GOOD.....!

I have 4 Visa Flexi blue accounts and a Red Cirus and I had the Flexi's BEFORE the Red one - WHY ? BECAUSE I just went higher up the ladder at Nationwide until I got someone with Common sense. If you use internet banking use the message system and ask for a Supervisor as refusal is ony a commom answer. As a "MEMBER" not a "CUSTOMER" you have rights.

Hope this helps.

BT

Edited December 5, 2009 by BIGTOE3

[GreenSnapper]

It would be great if some of the European folks could report if there are any bank on that side of the pond that offer comparable perks to their customers....

I give you some notes about the situation in Germany:

Most people have a "Maestro" card, which is a cash card and allows ATM withdrawels and payment at shops. It is more or less a debit card and fee-free at own ATMs and shops as well at home and European countries.

You can use a Maestro card to get money at ATMs abroad, but then a fee of approx. 4-5 EUR applies each time.

Recently, several banks have introduced credit cards (more exact: VISA debit cards), which they advertise as "get money for free at ATMs worldwide". The trick (or better: scam) is, that most of those credit cards automatically deduct 1-2% from the official VISA exchange rate if used outside the EUR-area.

Naturally, most people don't realize that having a "free" ATM card which charges 2% from a 500 EUR withdrawal, is more expensive than the "not-free" Maestro card which charges only 5 EUR but does not cheat with the exchange rates.

As far I know, there are 2 exceptions in Germany: Postbank Sparcard allows 10 free ATM-withdrawals per year and gives the correct exchange rate. You can have several of those cards, they are free and give around 2% interest on the deposit too.

DKB bank has a VISA card which gives free ATM withdrawels worldwide and does not cheat on the rates. This is currently the best deal in Germany.

Both of those cards work well with the yellow Thai Ayudhya bank.

[jfchandler]

GreenSnapper, thanks for that great bank info from a German perspective....

In the past, some European folks here have said that banks in Europe weren't offering the same kind of fee-free deals that are available from A FEW U.S. banks. But your post suggests that if some such deals are available in Germany, they're probably to be found elsewhere in Europe as well.

It's the same situation in the U.S. If one just goes to, and checks on, the big major banks...you'll typically only find accounts and cards with a lot of fees and charges for foreign debit card use. But if you're living abroad and thus it's an important issue for you, you can search around and find some deals/banks/cards that don't charge you an arm and a leg for banking outside your home country.

The trick is, and most people just don't do this, is to beat the bushes until you find the good deal among all the bad ones.

As far I know, there are 2 exceptions in Germany: Postbank Sparcard allows 10 free ATM-withdrawals per year and gives the correct exchange rate. You can have several of those cards, they are free and give around 2% interest on the deposit too.

DKB bank has a VISA card which gives free ATM withdrawels worldwide and does not cheat on the rates. This is currently the best deal in Germany.

Both of those cards work well with the yellow Thai Ayudhya bank.

Does that above mean they DO or DO NOT incur the 150 baht withdrawal fee with Ayudhya ATMs???

[GreenSnapper]

Both of those cards work well with the yellow Thai Ayudhya bank.

Does that above mean they DO or DO NOT incur the 150 baht withdrawal fee with Ayudhya ATMs???

No fees on the Thai side at Ayudhya Bank and Postbank SparCard / DKB bank visa card. So as those cards a fee free at home too, you will get the best rates available, equivalent to the TT-rate (or slightly better) on a SWIFT-transfer.

Edited December 6, 2009 by GreenSnapper

[knortyboy]

knortyboy, Are you using the Visa Nationwide card or the Cirus one. ie Flexi blue, Cirus red ?

I believe the Blue Flexi Vsa has a 1% charge because of Visa and the Cirus ( red) IS FREE.

BT

I'm using the Blue one.

As a previous poster reported, I was unable to get a Red one as I already had a blue one. Would of gotten them in the other order, had I known.

I was aware of the 1% charge but as yet have never been charged it.

The only reason that they have for refusing you a red Cirus one is that ---- Wait for it --- Your Credit rating is too GOOD.....!

I have 4 Visa Flexi blue accounts and a Red Cirus and I had the Flexi's BEFORE the Red one - WHY ? BECAUSE I just went higher up the ladder at Nationwide until I got someone with Common sense. If you use internet banking use the message system and ask for a Supervisor as refusal is ony a commom answer. As a "MEMBER" not a "CUSTOMER" you have rights.

Hope this helps.

BT

It does, thanks. I'll contact them and give it a try. Never hurts to have more cards than one needs, just in case.

[jfchandler]

So Knorty and Big Toe, can you recap this subject for the rest of us mere mortals, re Nationwide U.K.'s cards..

They have a blue Visa debit card and a red non-VISA ATM card.

If I'm following you right, you're saying both of these Nationwide cards DO NOT get the 150 baht ATM fee at Bank of Ayudhya....

But, the blue VISA card does carry a 1% foreign transaction fee, and the red card does not???

So does that mean the red card is totally fee free? But does that also mean you can't use it for purchases, only for ATM withdrawals...

Please make it simple and clear for the rest of folks here...

PS - What about using these two cards at other Thai banks ATMs? They get the 150 baht fee elsewhere, or do not???

[barhopper]

So Knorty and Big Toe, can you recap this subject for the rest of us mere mortals, re Nationwide U.K.'s cards..

They have a blue Visa debit card and a red non-VISA ATM card.

If I'm following you right, you're saying both of these Nationwide cards DO NOT get the 150 baht ATM fee at Bank of Ayudhya....

But, the blue VISA card does carry a 1% foreign transaction fee, and the red card does not???

So does that mean the red card is totally fee free? But does that also mean you can't use it for purchases, only for ATM withdrawals...

Please make it simple and clear for the rest of folks here...

PS - What about using these two cards at other Thai banks ATMs? They get the 150 baht fee elsewhere, or do not???

jfchandler, i tried to explain most of your questions in this post

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Thai-Banks-S...50#entry3186117

[jfchandler]

Barhopper, thanks for the referral.. I'm assuming you're pointing to this prior post of yours...re Nationwide UK

Types of account

FlexAccount - offers customers a Visa debit card with a chequebook, cheque guarantee and overdraft facilities or a cash card with a chequebook.

Cash Card Account - offers customers a cash card without a chequebook, Visa debit card, cheque guarantee or overdraft facility.

The Flex/Debit Card is issued by Visa and the Cash card is Issued by Cirrus

The big difference when withdrawing cash from the two cards at an ATM abroad is initially, only Visa debit card transactions will have a fee applied. Your cash card is run by a different provider(Cirrus) and is only available for withdrawing cash (it does not have facilities to make purchases online or at retailers). The Cash Card Account is a Basic Bank Account and is available/suitable for customers who meet the Basic Bank Account criteria.

Unfortunately, at least for me, it's not clear on the subject of fees, and the distinction between the 1% VISA fee charged by the card networks and the 150 baht fee charged by the Thai banks...

The red card doesn't charge the 1% foreign transaction fee. But the blue VISA debit does...

But, what about both cards in terms of the 150 baht Thai banks fee, both at Bank of Ayudhya and other Thai banks???

[barhopper]

Barhopper, thanks for the referral.. I'm assuming you're pointing to this prior post of yours...re Nationwide UK

Types of account

FlexAccount - offers customers a Visa debit card with a chequebook, cheque guarantee and overdraft facilities or a cash card with a chequebook.

Cash Card Account - offers customers a cash card without a chequebook, Visa debit card, cheque guarantee or overdraft facility.

The Flex/Debit Card is issued by Visa and the Cash card is Issued by Cirrus

The big difference when withdrawing cash from the two cards at an ATM abroad is initially, only Visa debit card transactions will have a fee applied. Your cash card is run by a different provider(Cirrus) and is only available for withdrawing cash (it does not have facilities to make purchases online or at retailers). The Cash Card Account is a Basic Bank Account and is available/suitable for customers who meet the Basic Bank Account criteria.

Unfortunately, at least for me, it's not clear on the subject of fees, and the distinction between the 1% VISA fee charged by the card networks and the 150 baht fee charged by the Thai banks...

The red card doesn't charge the 1% foreign transaction fee. But the blue VISA debit does...

But, what about both cards in terms of the 150 baht Thai banks fee, both at Bank of Ayudhya and other Thai banks???

I wouldn't know about the Cirrus issued card as i don't have one,i only have the Blue Visa Debit.But in regards to the 150 Baht fee well that's up to the bank/ATM in Thailand,as i thought you already know it's them that is charging the 150 Baht fee and nothing to do with the card issuing bank in your home country.

[jfchandler]

Sorry, you're missing the point and not correct re the 150 baht fee....

Posters earlier in this thread have been talking about being able to use their Nationwide cards at Bank of Ayudhya ATMs without getting charged the 150 baht fee. But those posters have been sparse on details. Some German bank card holders also claim to be avoiding the fee at BofA.

It would be very useful to know, for Nationwide UK card holders who are NOT getting charged the 150 baht fee at Bank of Ayudhya, are you using the blue card, the red card, or both to get NO 150 baht fee???

And what about those same Nationwide cards at other Thai banks, in terms of the 150 baht fee??? Charged or not?

Yes, it is the Thai banks that are assessing the 150 baht fee. But for unknown reasons, particularly at BofA based on posts here, some cards seem to be avoiding it. I'm trying to understand and establish some pattern of what banks and what kind of cards are getting that break.

[barhopper]

Sorry, you're missing the point and not correct re the 150 baht fee....

Posters earlier in this thread have been talking about being able to use their Nationwide cards at Bank of Ayudhya ATMs without getting charged the 150 baht fee. But those posters have been sparse on details. Some German bank card holders also claim to be avoiding the fee at BofA.

It would be very useful to know, for Nationwide UK card holders who are NOT getting charged the 150 baht fee at Bank of Ayudhya, are you using the blue card, the red card, or both to get NO 150 baht fee???

And what about those same Nationwide cards at other Thai banks, in terms of the 150 baht fee??? Charged or not?

Yes, it is the Thai banks that are assessing the 150 baht fee. But for unknown reasons, particularly at BofA based on posts here, some cards seem to be avoiding it. I'm trying to understand and establish some pattern of what banks and what kind of cards are getting that break.

Ok as i said in my previous post i can only give my experience on using the Blue Nationwide Visa debit card(as i don't have the Red/Purple Cirrus based Nationwide Cash card).When i was last in Los(Pattaya) 6 weeks ago i did not get charged the fee at the ATM at the Bank of Ayudhya exchanges(no fee whatsoever at the Thai end ) however Nationwide deducted 0.84% from the Exchange rate(done through Visa http://www.visaeurope.com/fxcalculator/main.jsp The fee now is 1% as stated on the Nationwide BS Website.In regards to other banks(ATM's) i didn't try any as i had read on here and various Thai Forums that the 150 baht was being incurred on Foreign issued Cards,however i did get a cash advance from a Kasikorn Money exchange booth on Soi Buakaow in Pattaya in which i had to show my passport and fill out a form stating where i was residing along with my signature.I withdrew 10K Cash with no charges(from the Thai end) but when i checked my online banking statement a few days later i had incurred the 0.84% deduction from Visa in the exchange rate exactly the same as you would if you had withdrawn the cash from an ATM(which still worked out better than cash).So i felt that apart from using the Ayudhya ATM's which had no 150 ATM fee that the way forward in getting cash from any other banks/money exchange booths was doing an over the counter withdrawal thus avoiding the ATM 150 Baht charges.In saying that i never tried getting a cash advance over the counter in any of the other Banks/exchanges so don't have first hand knowledge of any other Banks/Money exchanges accepting this practice,apart from reading posts on many Thai forums that some BM's have had success in Various banks/exchanges in Thailand(thus avoiding the 150 baht charge) and some BM's have posted as being told by banking tellers to use the ATM affiliated to the Bank.

[Captain Haddock]

I have just tried to use my blue visa debit card from Nationwide in Thung Song, NST, south Thailand, and while the 2 ATMs I used next to the Bank of Ayutaya both told me there would be a fee charged of 0.00 baht, neither ATM would give me any money, telling me to check my bank. So a fee of zero would be charged (!) if I could get my money, but I guess (being nice here) that it's a bank holiday today and there's no cash left in the machines!

Until tomorrow...

[BIGTOE3]

Sorry, you're missing the point and not correct re the 150 baht fee....

Posters earlier in this thread have been talking about being able to use their Nationwide cards at Bank of Ayudhya ATMs without getting charged the 150 baht fee. But those posters have been sparse on details. Some German bank card holders also claim to be avoiding the fee at BofA.

It would be very useful to know, for Nationwide UK card holders who are NOT getting charged the 150 baht fee at Bank of Ayudhya, are you using the blue card, the red card, or both to get NO 150 baht fee???

And what about those same Nationwide cards at other Thai banks, in terms of the 150 baht fee??? Charged or not?

Yes, it is the Thai banks that are assessing the 150 baht fee. But for unknown reasons, particularly at BofA based on posts here, some cards seem to be avoiding it. I'm trying to understand and establish some pattern of what banks and what kind of cards are getting that break.

No 150 BT fee at all using Bank of Ayudhya with Red Cirus Nationwide account and only the 1% Visa charge using the Blue Visa Nationwide Card but again NO 150 BT fee.

The 150 BT FEE is being charged at the SCB bank using the Blue Visa card - will check if being charged using the Red Cirus card and report back.

Hope this clears it up.

BT

Edited December 7, 2009 by BIGTOE3

[jfchandler]

Thanks BT.... Very grateful for the clear, concise answer....

That's really interesting.... using the same Nationwide UK VISA debit card at Ayudhya draws no 150 baht fee, but using the same Nationwide card at Siam Commercial draws the 150 baht fee.

I'm assuming your accounts/cards mentioned here are denominated in pounds???

[BIGTOE3]

Thanks BT.... Very grateful for the clear, concise answer....

That's really interesting.... using the same Nationwide UK VISA debit card at Ayudhya draws no 150 baht fee, but using the same Nationwide card at Siam Commercial draws the 150 baht fee.

I'm assuming your accounts/cards mentioned here are denominated in pounds???

JF not sure what you mean sorry " denominated in pounds???" ?????

BT

[jfchandler]

Sorry, denominated means....when you have funds in your home account, they are held in what currency... pounds or Euros???

BofA handles some MC logo debit cards differently if the accounts are denominated in pounds or Euros....not the same as they handle all other currency type accounts.

And yes, I know yours is a VISA, not MC account.

Thanks BT.... Very grateful for the clear, concise answer....

That's really interesting.... using the same Nationwide UK VISA debit card at Ayudhya draws no 150 baht fee, but using the same Nationwide card at Siam Commercial draws the 150 baht fee.

I'm assuming your accounts/cards mentioned here are denominated in pounds???

JF not sure what you mean sorry " denominated in pounds???" ?????

BT

[BIGTOE3]

JF my accounts are in UK pounds as account in Scotland NOT in Euro currency Zone...

BT PS still not been yet to test SCB with red cirus card.

Sorry, denominated means....when you have funds in your home account, they are held in what currency... pounds or Euros???

BofA handles some MC logo debit cards differently if the accounts are denominated in pounds or Euros....not the same as they handle all other currency type accounts.

And yes, I know yours is a VISA, not MC account.

Thanks BT.... Very grateful for the clear, concise answer....

That's really interesting.... using the same Nationwide UK VISA debit card at Ayudhya draws no 150 baht fee, but using the same Nationwide card at Siam Commercial draws the 150 baht fee.

I'm assuming your accounts/cards mentioned here are denominated in pounds???

JF not sure what you mean sorry " denominated in pounds???" ?????

BT

[califdann]

Following is an exerpt from the Citibank online "Home Page". The reason that I present it here, is that I am looking for an ability to use a credit card in LOS, without the added 4% cost, and the added "finance charge" on my bill from the credit card each month. It would seem to me that if Citibank, which has lots of outlets in the U.S. has branches in LOS, than I could additionally avoid the 150 baht charge for using their ATM while in LOS. Any comments, advice, etc...??

Califdann

===============

Dear Customer,

In light of the recent and unprecedented volatility in the world's financial markets, I am writing to update you on Citi's continuing financial strength and our commitment to serve your financial needs.

Much has happened during the last year as the global financial crisis has unfolded. At Citi, we took decisive and early action to prepare ourselves to weather these tough times through significantly strengthening our capital and liquidity positions. Governments around the world have also responded to the financial crisis by providing explicit support to the banking systems. So you should rest assured that your deposits are safe with us.

•Our Capital and Agreement with the U.S. Government: Recently, the U.S. Government provided an additional US$20 billion to Citi’s already strong capital base, which together with other provisions, increases our capital by an additional US$40 billion. As a result, when added to the earlier US$85 billion increase in our capital, this places our Tier 1 Capital Ratio at an expected 14.8%. This makes Citi one of the most well capitalized banks in the world.

As a locally licensed bank here, Citibank NA, Thailand Branch is regulated by the Bank of Thailand and is subject to all prudential and requirements applicable to banks. We are well capitalised with over Bht 13 billion of Capital Funds and an additional Bht 7.9 billion in retained earnings.

[BIGTOE3]

My advice would be - Don't use a Credit Card for ATM withdrawals BUT there are more guys on here who will advise you re USA accounts.

BT

[jfchandler]

Califdann...you're talking about two different things in your post...

1. a U.S. credit card that doesn't charge you an excessive (or any) foreign currency transaction charge on purchases made abroad.

2. the ability to withdraw funds using a U.S. card from Thai ATMs without paying the Thai banks' 150 baht foreign card withdrawal fee.

Re the first, U.S. Citibank almost certainly is going to charge you a foreign currency transaction charge on credit card purchases in Thailand... Some banks charge 3%, some charge 1%, a relatively few charge 0%. Among those with no (0%) extra charge, Capital One and Charles Schwab VISA are among the better options.

2. You NEVER want to use a U.S. credit card with withdraw cash from ATMs in Thailand or elsewhere, except as a last resort or in an emergency. The reasons are, almost all credit card companies will charge you 3% or similar cash advance fee....even if you do it in the U.S., ...and then they'll start charging interest from the day of the withdrawal...no grace period.

As for using a U.S. debit card in Thailand that will not incur the 150 baht Thai bank withdrawal fee...I don't know of any. But you can get to the same result in one of two ways...

a. use only AEON ATMs with any U.S. VISA or MC logo debit card in Thailand, and you''ll pay no fee, and/or

b. have a U.S. bank account/card that reimburses you either in full or up to some amount per month for other banks' ATM fees. Some U.S. banks only reimburse other banks' domestic ATM fees. A few reimburse other banks' ATM fees worldwide. E*Trade and Charles Schwab checking accounts are examples of cards that reimburse worldwide in full... There are a variety of mostly smaller banks that reimburse like up to $10 or $25 per month worldwide.

You can find more about these kinds of options by doing some searching on the Internet...or even here on ThaiVisa.

PS - For the record, I should have also added you can obtain cash here from Thai banks by doing what's called a counter withdrawal, where you go to the teller and present your U.S. debit card and passport, and ask them to withdraw funds from your account and give you the proceeds in baht. Of course, up to the limit of funds in your account. Not all Thai banks make this easy...some will tell you to go to their ATM. But probably most of the time, if you're willing to bring along your passport, you can do it. And counter withdrawals do not incur the 150 baht fee, unlike ATM withdrawals.

Edited December 7, 2009 by jfchandler

[alphason]

Another confirmation...

UK Sterling demoninated Nationwide Flexaccount, blue VISA DEBIT card used in Bank of Ayudhya ATM, Chaofa Road Branch (Near Villa 3 entrance) - Phuket.

No fee - screen displays "Service Fee 0.00" .

Nationwide charge 1% visa fee, so the exchange rate stopped on my account is 53.696 to the pound @9.30am 08th Dec.

Edited December 8, 2009 by alphason

[johng]

Went to the Ayudthaya ATM in Tukcom ( Pattaya ) today

and used my Nationwide Visa Debit card ( blue )

there was a warning screen advising transaction charge of 0 baht.

[jesimps]

Just got 10,000 baht from Bank of Ayudthaya atm at Central Festival Shopping centre, Pattaya. Used my UK Nationwide, blue, sterling denominated, Visa/debit card and there was no charge at this end. That's three separate Bank of Ayudthaya atms that haven't charged me so far; Tuk Com, Tesco Lotus and Central Festival.