Immigration Crackdown On Border Runners

[Time Traveller]

A poor country needs all the jobs it can get, expats, tourists, foreign investment all create jobs. Why discourage ANY of those?

cause a country needs to stop scraping the bottom of the barrel sometime...

Visa runners and backpackers contribute very little legitimately to the Thai economy and are more of a burden than an asset.

If these people were substantially of any benefit towards the economy of Thailand, than the authorities would not be creating hurdles and difficulties for those staying here.

I am sure that the powers that be have done their sums and concluded that the cost of policing these people, administration and controlling illegal activities far out ways any contributions if any, these travellers are making towards the country.

Try telling that to the ten's of thousands of Thai's that have guesthouse, villa, holiday businesses around the country.

The fact is it is not foreign tourists and backpackers, but Thai government ministers that contribute very little legitimately to the Thai economy and are more of a burden than an asset....

[MUYTHAI]

it is not good what the immigration and the country is doing to the foreigners.

first they make all the tourist visas free and now they are making border runs short to stay.

as to before they were 3 months and now they only give two months.

what will happen next???

Well any foreigner in Thailand should be happy, at least you can get in to Thailand, I am British and have an adopted Thai son and they will not even let him into the UK. Think yourselves very lucky.

R

That is odd. Seeing the many people of Middle Eastern and African descent, etc. not born in the UK, but living in the UK, one would believe it would be easy to get an adopted son into the UK. Does one have to be Madonna now to be able to get an adopted foreign child into the UK? Or does one just have to be from the Middle East, Africa, or one of the Moslem eastern European countries to easily get in to the UK?

Best wishes with your situation.

[Time Traveller]

A poor country needs all the jobs it can get, expats, tourists, foreign investment all create jobs. Why discourage ANY of those?

cause a country needs to stop scraping the bottom of the barrel sometime...

Are you suggesting that every foreigner display a bank account balance upon reaching the Thai immigration counter?

Less than 10 million euro please leave on the next plane.....frankly if thailand wants to stop scraping the bottom of the barrel they better look to their own elected officials before claiming they are superior than every foreign visitor to this country

[Maestro]

Just get a tourist visa, how hard is that?

You missed the point. A man goes to his travel agent to book his flights and the agent tells him what visas he needs based on his itinerary. For Thailand, the agent tells his client that he needs no visa for the three weeks he is going to stay there. Why would he insist on getting a tourist visa? Please consider that unlike you, the travel agent and his client do not know that the Thai authorities are fond of changing visa rules at a whim and without any prior announcement.

This is the visa requirement for Thailand the travel agent gets on his computer screen for his Swiss client:

The client might have flown tonight and when he arrives in Bangkok tomorrow the rule might have changed to only 10 days visa-exempt stay. This is the point I am making.

--

Maestro

[CRUNCHER]

A poor country needs all the jobs it can get, expats, tourists, foreign investment all create jobs. Why discourage ANY of those?

cause a country needs to stop scraping the bottom of the barrel sometime...

Well said, hit the nail right on the head.

Visa runners and backpackers contribute very little legitimately to the Thai economy and are more of a burden than an asset.

If these people were substantially of any benefit towards the economy of Thailand, than the authorities would not be creating hurdles and difficulties for those staying here.

I am sure that the powers that be have done their sums and concluded that the cost of policing these people, administration and controlling illegal activities far out ways any contributions if any, these travellers are making towards the country.

I agree Thailand does not need to scrape the bottom of the barrel, but I am not sure that includes backpackers. A few years ago Australia did a survey and found that, whist backpacker did not conribute much per head, collectively they made up about 20% of Australia's tourist dollars. Not sure how that would pan out in Thailand.

The problem here is the numbers of people who expect to live here full time when they cannot meet visa requirements and many of whom flount the law by working illegally. I have no figures, but I suspect these are a small number, buit they are a problem for Thaiand.

[venturalaw]

Just get a tourist visa, how hard is that?

You missed the point. A man goes to his travel agent to book his flights and the agent tells him what visas he needs based on his itinerary. For Thailand, the agent tells his client that he needs no visa for the three weeks he is going to stay there. Why would he insist on getting a tourist visa? Please consider that unlike you, the travel agent and his client do not know that the Thai authorities are fond of changing visa rules at a whim and without any prior announcement.

This is the visa requirement for Thailand the travel agent gets on his computer screen for his Swiss client:

The client might have flown tonight and when he arrives in Bangkok tomorrow the rule might have changed to only 10 days visa-exempt stay. This is the point I am making.

--

Maestro

Excellent point and illustration. Not only are further restrictions counter-productive financially for the country (fewer tourists as a result therefrom), but the way they are introduced at a moment's notice further exacerbates the problem. What tourists will wish to return to Thailand after being subject to restrictive immigration reforms absent warning?

[Junglejumbo]

I can't imagine who would want to run to the border every 15 days. What a waste of time. So depressing are border runs and expensive if you're doing it frequently unless you live on the border...that's the only exception I can think of.

There are options for under 50. There's no limit to tourist visas and right now you can get double entries in Laos so you're pretty much good for 6months assuming two extensions and one border run after three months.....If you hit Laos on the Tuesday before noon you can be out of Laos by 4pm the next day..OK you spend an extra day or day and half there but save on 11 border runs or 11 days.

The only people I can think of who it might impact are those coming for about 6-7 weeks who were too lazy to get the visa before but didn't mind a border run...perhaps those who work in the middle east on a 6wk on and 6wk off basis but even then they're unlikely to make the first entry by land in which case they'd get 30days first and then 15 days, or enough.

Edited June 1, 2009 by Junglejumbo

[mortenaa]

The client might have flown tonight and when he arrives in Bangkok tomorrow the rule might have changed to only 10 days visa-exempt stay. This is the point I am making.

--

Maestro

The change of rules is not that big a problem as you try to point out. The 30 days exempt has been forever. Unbelievable that some people lived here for 10-15 years on 30 days entries before.

Ofcourse Thailand has numbers for 15 days entries all ready, otherwise they wouldn't make these changes.

For normal tourists, I can't even see how this would affect them. If you know you going to stay long, you can get double entry tourist visas in your home country. For most tourists one month is enough, and if you want more, you should get a tourist visa. Some airlines won't let you on board if you have a return after 30 days and no visa.

I definitely support this changes. If you really are a long term tourist, you have money to support it. You travel by plane, getting your visas done. I think you people should be happy that Thailand accept long term tourists in the first place.

Edited June 1, 2009 by mortenaa

[venturalaw]

A poor country needs all the jobs it can get, expats, tourists, foreign investment all create jobs. Why discourage ANY of those?

cause a country needs to stop scraping the bottom of the barrel sometime...

Well said, hit the nail right on the head.

Visa runners and backpackers contribute very little legitimately to the Thai economy and are more of a burden than an asset.

If these people were substantially of any benefit towards the economy of Thailand, than the authorities would not be creating hurdles and difficulties for those staying here.

I am sure that the powers that be have done their sums and concluded that the cost of policing these people, administration and controlling illegal activities far out ways any contributions if any, these travellers are making towards the country.

You have any basis for these statements, or is just a guess? Regarding the 'powers that be' you are assuming that they have logically thought this through. I take it that you have no experience whatsoever with the 'powers that be' in Thailand. There is no logic, and nothing is ever 'thought out'.

[mortenaa]

Excellent point and illustration. Not only are further restrictions counter-productive financially for the country (fewer tourists as a result therefrom), but the way they are introduced at a moment's notice further exacerbates the problem. What tourists will wish to return to Thailand after being subject to restrictive immigration reforms absent warning?

I think about 100% would return if they are happy with the trip. Most tourists don't even notice this. They think 30 days, and ok lets go! I heard many tourists that doesn't wanna go back to the US though, after being harassed at the airport.

[moe666]

I had to stop reading this thread. The usual whine about how Thailand doesn't want us and all of that.

Try a border run in the Philippines, it's all Islands there are no borders and who would want to live in that hole any way worse than Thailand.

Guess what boys it's called Thailand it's not were you are from and they can do what they want, even if it doesn't make sense to you.

[mortenaa]

There is no logic, and nothing is ever 'thought out'.

I understand you don't think high of the immigration police, but I do know they have pretty much data about us coming here, including frequency, purpose of stay, type of residency, income etc. With all this information stored in a database, and using common data-mining tools, you can change the parameters to get rid of certain people you don't want. And I think thats exactly what they are doing.

[crocodilexp]

Like many other legit ex pats living in Thailand, I have sunk a lot of my assets into Thailand, plus have a family here.

This is my reason for being so anti visa runner. Farangs using loopholes to commit illegal activities in Thailand can only make matters worse for all us, especially knowing that the facts are such as, Thais consider us as being all tarred with the same brush and that we could be thrown out at the drop of a hat.

It's surprising that you lived here for so long and still believe this.

When it comes to loopholes, *everything* is a one big loophole in Thailand. Let's skip examples from everyday life (e.g. prostitution and indoor smoking being illegal) Thai government itself is one big loophole -- elected in parliament after making the courts disqualify two prime ministers and then paying off a bunch of defector MPs. Thai legal system... let's just mention the Consitution -- another loophole, imposed by the military and narrowly approved under silent threat of indefinite junta rule. Makes life fun...

Farang behavior (good or bad as it may be) is not a reason for tightening visa rules. In earlier times ('90s), mix of Farang in the country was possibly more naughty -- proportion of legitimate expats and tourists is increading. At that time, restrictions were being relaxed.

Restrictions have all to do with the dark age that Thailand is entering. Many murky characters are now vying for unchecked power. They could care less if they hurt ordinary Thais -- this they clearly demonstrated. Stirring up nationalist sentiment against Farang is a good way to realize their ambitions.

Edited June 1, 2009 by crocodilexp

[regfrancis]

Does the 30 day visa for airport entry and exit mean extra income from Departure tax? Well and good if it does.... but should the Thais taxation system be promoting air traffic over more environmently friendly road or sea transport?

[kurtgruen]

Ahhh, is it ever nice, to be sitting back in British Columbia, since May 4th, reading about Thailand and it's policies. Sort of like watching a horror movie and being thankful that it isn't real for you

I watched a black bear run across the road, right in the Middle of the City of Maple Ridge, yesterday. So cool, to be back in a country, where you have a voice about what is going on around you.

Did I forget to mentioned, that I kissed the ground in front of Vancouver Airport, after arriving from Thailand?

[PhootThaiMaiDai]

I know of no other country in the world where you can run to the border and get another stamp therefore allowing you to stay in the country practically indefinitely.

The authorities are only doing what they should have done years ago.

Spoken like a true cog... With all due respect.

[ukrules]

I know of no other country in the world where you can run to the border and get another stamp therefore allowing you to stay in the country practically indefinitely.

The authorities are only doing what they should have done years ago.

Peru. There are more.

[Yahooka]

I love the way that some posters feel that they can tell other posters that they are not worthy to stay in Thailand - you get a great class of humanity here, I must say.

Agree....it`s an old expression saying that the higher they`re perched,the harder they fall.If that scenario arise I will then refrain from saying "som-nam-na" !!

[sassienie]

Ahhh, is it ever nice, to be sitting back in British Columbia, since May 4th, reading about Thailand and it's policies. Sort of like watching a horror movie and being thankful that it isn't real for you

I watched a black bear run across the road, right in the Middle of the City of Maple Ridge, yesterday. So cool, to be back in a country, where you have a voice about what is going on around you.

Did I forget to mentioned, that I kissed the ground in front of Vancouver Airport, after arriving from Thailand?

I hope you didn`t get attacked by that black bear while you were kissing the ground.

The only thing I kissed recently was my bit on the side at the massage parlour. No risk of being attacked by big bears or getting road grit stuck in between my teeth.

Think I`d rather take a chance and stay in Thailand.

Black bears and road grit, yuk, nasty.

[Jingthing]

I know of no other country in the world where you can run to the border and get another stamp therefore allowing you to stay in the country practically indefinitely.

The authorities are only doing what they should have done years ago.

Peru. There are more.

People live in Argentina on visa runs but it is also common to simply overstay as long as you wish. You simply pay a small fine when leaving the airport, no criminal implications, and you can fly back in the same day.

Most countries in Central America.

Philippines (extensions in country, have to fly in and out occasionally)

Mexico (enforcement can vary)

BTW, you CAN STILL stay here for years with NO VISA. Just FLY IN instead.

Edited June 1, 2009 by Jingthing

[hardy1943]

A poor country needs all the jobs it can get, expats, tourists, foreign investment all create jobs. Why discourage ANY of those?

I just spent 5-6 million Baht building a house in Chiang Rai and paying the employees way above

most do, gave them Mayday, laborday off with pay. You know what my thanks is?

Clipping me 150Baht when I use my ATM card from the USA. Well will live of my money in local banks

included the 400,000 I kept. Will go every year from now on to my embassy

spend the $30 and give it to them. Amazing Thailand. Let be honest the Government is a joke here.

[DMasut]

HEADS UP!!! THERE IS SOMETHING IN THE WIND!

Consider how the Thai BAHT is mysteriously staying strong against the Dollar, EURO and GBP against all of the political unrest in LOS.

Consider that Chinese are now given 120 day visas

Consider that present government is removing land ownership loopholes for foreignors.

Consider foreign business investment is increasingly being required to provide much more for much less in return while countries like China with their increasing economic power are required the minimum to invest with more benefits.

Consider you are a temporary guest and tourist in the eyes of the Thai government regardless of your visa, marital or other status.

Thailand has gone over 2,000 years without the need for outsiders and Thai's can live well enough off of hte land that if they isolated themselves from the rest of the world and their economies they could still survive.

Edited June 1, 2009 by george
Formatting /mod

[Grey11]

because the free visas in the embassies are ending. they are going to have another big meeting to extend it or even not.

but i think for sure they will be taking money again for the tourist visas,

because many tourist make this to have a longer stay. it dose not mater if they would have to pay or not. but to get it they will pay anyway.

it was just an attraction to get people a longer visit to thailand for free with out the visa runs

but many longstays that do not have a lot in the pocket was a good time to save money for a about six months not to pay all the visa runs they should have been making.

but still many will say the same thing which i hear all the time.

"why do these thai make so many regulation, cambodia, and the phillipines have no strickt regulation on this."

but still i see them every time making the visa run and still live in thailand, and look for other ways to make their stay longer.

[Grey11]

One of the major reasons foreigners choose not to settle in Cambodia & the Philippines and instead choose Thailand is that those countries are not as modern as Thailand. Cambodia & the Philippines are much more dangerous. Crime is rampant. For those who say that the government of Thailand is unstable, it is very stable compared to the government of Cambodia. The military keeps the governments of Cambodia & the Philippines in power even more than is the case in Thailand. Thailand is much mored sanitary than are Cambodia & the Philippines. The food is safer in Thailand. Certainly Thailand is much farther from being a Third World country than are Burma, Laos, Cambodia & the Philippines.

[Jingthing]

Certainly Thailand is much farther from being a Third World country than are Burma, Laos, Cambodia & the Philippines

Thailand has regressed in recent years and is becoming more like the Philippines ...

[bkkbrad]

Is it just me or does this story re-appear every year. Looks like another crackdown that will be forgotten about soon enough.

[Jingthing]

Is it just me or does this story re-appear every year. Looks like another crackdown that will be forgotten about soon enough.

As crackdowns go, this one is a crackette ...

[Tjip]

I know of no other country in the world where you can run to the border and get another stamp therefore allowing you to stay in the country practically indefinitely.

The authorities are only doing what they should have done years ago.

Yes I know.....Kenya !!!

You go to Kenya as a tourist and you get a 3 month visa at the border for $50. After 3 months you get out and come back in and get another 3 months at $50 and you can do this as many times as you want !

But .... yes....Kenya .... is not like Thailand ....

[Tjip]

The client might have flown tonight and when he arrives in Bangkok tomorrow the rule might have changed to only 10 days visa-exempt stay. This is the point I am making.

--

Maestro

The change of rules is not that big a problem as you try to point out. The 30 days exempt has been forever. Unbelievable that some people lived here for 10-15 years on 30 days entries before.

Ofcourse Thailand has numbers for 15 days entries all ready, otherwise they wouldn't make these changes.

For normal tourists, I can't even see how this would affect them. If you know you going to stay long, you can get double entry tourist visas in your home country. For most tourists one month is enough, and if you want more, you should get a tourist visa. Some airlines won't let you on board if you have a return after 30 days and no visa.

I definitely support this changes. If you really are a long term tourist, you have money to support it. You travel by plane, getting your visas done. I think you people should be happy that Thailand accept long term tourists in the first place.

I totally agree with this !

30 years ago you got about 2 weeks to stay in Thailand . Those who would spend more then 15 days in the kingdom had to apply for a visa in their home country and if I remember you got no more then 30 days for a tourist visa ( or am I wrong ? ).

[Oberkommando]

yes, way too many farangs on this thread thinking 'if it wasn't for me and my pension, the Thai economy would fall in a heap'.

No but several local wage Thai JOBS for each and every retired expat is not chopped liver.

...and would be more than replaced with increased foreign investment if Thailand wasn't viewed as the knock shop of Asia....

this won't change that impression, but it is a first step....

What an absurd thing to claim.

How on Earth is capping border visa runs a first step to changing Thailand's reputation or the way this country is viewed abroad?

Again, whiners using visa rules as a red-herring for their own deficiencies.

The same goes for people using a discussion on these rules to denigrate other expats and their contribution to Thailand.

Edited June 1, 2009 by Oberkommando