Apparently, Catholics look more and more like us all the time...

In my experience, the only way to distinguish them was the different school uniform. and even that only worked up to a certain age.

SC

Most of us don't have horns these days. Cloven hooves would be difficult to hide in Thailand, but in UK it would be easy. Perhaps that's why there aren't many Catholics in Thailand.

But when it's Celtic vs. Rangers, you can tell the Catholics easily.

I don't think Rangers fans care whether Celtic fans go to chapel or not. They took to Ally McCoist, in the end...

And I don't think that football hooligans are a good example of the values within our culture, though I suppose they can perhaps highlight some of the deficiencies or shortcomings in it.

SC

Most of us don't have horns these days.

unfortunately some of them have become rather limp

...I would prefer to take pride in our belief in tolerance yet I can't help but feeling that's simply a lie. Especially when sitting on the 0940 from Perth to Glasgow on a Saturday morning.

Or when I feel like buying a pack of beers to enjoy on a Sunday morning with the newspaper.

Mind you this freedom was won by the people...a grassroots revolution...so perhaps I shouldn't grumble quite so much.

I was told this by a Polish chap I worked with in England.

I think he was meaning tolerance of outsiders, rather than the futile internecine bigotry that divides Scotland and Ireland, but, in Scotland at least, I think that is just an excuse for misbehaviour rather than any real theologically-based or culturally-based difference.

Apparently, Catholics look more and more like us all the time...

In my experience, the only way to distinguish them was the different school uniform. and even that only worked up to a certain age.

SC

That's the nub of it. We are proud of our nationality first and foremost. If you had a visitor from New York who arrived wearing a Celtic shirt and told you he was looking forward to tracing his Irish/Scottish roots would you take offence?

I'm willing to guess you wouldn't...out of a sense of him being your guest...and one of our country, as such you would overlook any such bigotry (which you may or may not hold of course).

The football thing is lower down on the food chain than the religious aspect in my personal experience. I was once offered a job based solely upon the latter I'm sad to admit.

Edit: For the sake of any continental colonialists reading this my use of "you" refers to any Scot.

...

Edit: For the sake of any continental colonialists reading this my use of "you" refers to any Scot.

A Chinese girl from our office had studied in Scotland, and came back with an outrageous Glasgow accent. More a Connolliast than a colonialist.

SC

Apologies for the digression...

EDIT: and to be fair, Billy Connolly's accent has faded greatly in recent years. In the Hollywood films I've seen him in, he was neither dubbed nor subtitled.

...I would prefer to take pride in our belief in tolerance yet I can't help but feeling that's simply a lie. Especially when sitting on the 0940 from Perth to Glasgow on a Saturday morning.

Or when I feel like buying a pack of beers to enjoy on a Sunday morning with the newspaper.

Mind you this freedom was won by the people...a grassroots revolution...so perhaps I shouldn't grumble quite so much.

I was told this by a Polish chap I worked with in England.

I think he was meaning tolerance of outsiders, rather than the futile internecine bigotry that divides Scotland and Ireland, but, in Scotland at least, I think that is just an excuse for misbehaviour rather than any real theologically-based or culturally-based difference.

Apparently, Catholics look more and more like us all the time...

In my experience, the only way to distinguish them was the different school uniform. and even that only worked up to a certain age.

SC

That's the nub of it. We are proud of our nationality first and foremost. If you had a visitor from New York who arrived wearing a Celtic shirt and told you he was looking forward to tracing his Irish/Scottish roots would you take offence?

I'm willing to guess you wouldn't...out of a sense of him being your guest...and one of our country, as such you would overlook any such bigotry (which you may or may not hold of course).

The football thing is lower down on the food chain than the religious aspect in my personal experience. I was once offered a job based solely upon the latter I'm sad to admit.

Edit: For the sake of any continental colonialists reading this my use of "you" refers to any Scot.

" Hey sony , Is this the road to lock lomaund ?"

Edit ; Smokie , de ye ken Fatty Pete Chan fae China China ?

Edit ; Smokie , de ye ken Fatty Pete Chan fae China China ?

<sigh> Yet another sinner. Decent film director I'm told.

Edit ; Smokie , de ye ken Fatty Pete Chan fae China China ?

<sigh> Yet another sinner. Decent film director I'm told.

I thought he was baw deep in curry sauce .

Koheesti, do you explain in detail all parts of the American system when you refer to them? I don't think so. No more can you expect Endure (or other English posters) to explain all details of the English system.

I'm not asking anyone to constantly explain anything. In this case I accepted that he knew what he was talking about being from the UK and it turns out that he does, but he just felt like spinning and misleading.

I didn't feel like 'spinning and misleading' at all. I was answering a post made by isanbirder knowing that he'd know what I was talking about being a fellow Brit. The fact that you don't understand the British system of government doesn't allow you to accuse me of lying, spinning or misleading. I wouldn't dream of accusing you of spinning if you posted about some arcane part of the US system of government. I did think that you'd offer me the same courtesy. Apparently not.

It's just like that bit in the zombie films, where the earth in cemetery starts to shake and crack, and you can just see the zombie's fingers coming up through the earth, and all the other characters are saying "oh no, what did he do that for, he's brought the thread back to life... but worse than before, its come back as a personal slanging match! WE'RE DOOMED"

"this calls for quick thinking - get a holy cleric; only they can save us - get the moderator of the Church of Scotland!"

The point is that Britain IS a Christian country, even if the only Christians are monarchs and their advising Bishops in the House of Lords, and nothing you or I do - in terms of converting to other faiths - is going to change that. James VI, the first king of England and Scotland (hence sometimes referred as James I) firmly believed that as monarch he was appointed by God to lead the country. Others may be able to advise when that opinion was formally rejected by the Crown or its government, if ever.

SC

I think the last king who believed in the divine right of kings was Charles I. Cromwell rather chopped the head off that belief!

I think the last king who believed in the divine right of kings was Charles I. Cromwell rather chopped the head off that belief!

I suspect Charles II had similar views but was more intelligent than his father. His brother, James II, was a full-on absolutist, but not too bright, and aroused substantial opposition. William of Orange was his nemesis - the last invader of England, though by invitation.

I think the last king who believed in the divine right of kings was Charles I. Cromwell rather chopped the head off that belief!

I suspect Charles II had similar views but was more intelligent than his father. His brother, James II, was a full-on absolutist, but not too bright, and aroused substantial opposition. William of Orange was his nemesis - the last invader of England, though by invitation.

Charles II may have believed in it, but was far more interested in being 'the Merry Monarch" than in running a kingdom (read Pepys' Diary passim). James II was absolutist, all right, but whether or not he believed in the Divine Right of Kings, I couldn't say; it's not quite the same thing.

It's just like that bit in the zombie films, where the earth in cemetery starts to shake and crack, and you can just see the zombie's fingers coming up through the earth, and all the other characters are saying "oh no, what did he do that for, he's brought the thread back to life... but worse than before, its come back as a personal slanging match! WE'RE DOOMED"

My apologies. It's becoming increasingly difficult to have a conversation in Bedlam that doesn't turn into a competition.

Let me turn the tone down a little by wishing everybody a very Merry Christmas and a prosperous and Happy New Year.

my wishes to all bedlamites is health, a loving partner and peace of mind. everything else can be bought with money.

Thanks Chuck and Naam. I hope you both and all the rest of the regulars have a Merry Christmas and a prosperous New Year with many more to come.

Best to all.

Merry Christmas, one and all!

Best wishes to all of you for Christmas and the New Year. May you be well and happy.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year folks.