UK pensions

[billd766]

I worked 6 years in England before moving to Australia from age 16 to 22 and 3 years was as a apprentice, I will get a Australian pension as I have 35 years of working there, my question is would I be entitled to a pension from England even tough it would be very small, and would it be worth while applying.

Every year of NI contributions count.

Depends when you are able to claim state pension. Currently you need 30 NI contributions for full pension, and 35 from April next year.

You should receive 6/30ths or 6/35ths.

Make the buggers work and pay you! It's rightfully yours as you paid in.

What about old buggers like me who paid 44 years contributions. By your figures I should get 44/30ths or 44/35ths as that was the ruling at the time.

As it is I get 44/44ths of the pension rate in 2009 when I retired, NOT index linked because I live in Thailand.

Come back Guido Fawkes, and try again, all is forgiven.

[loppylugs1]

Think you will find its £148 per week.

The guy is already on OAP so he will stick with that rate he is on now...13 weeks? hardly worth it flying backwards and forwards

I am registered in LOS and my basic was topped up to 135 quid......

I know someone who's friend lives in LOS but pension wise lives in the UK , was caught out and is now having to pay money back.

Pray tell,how is the money being paid back?

Remember this is a story I was told, so I cannot confirm it, but was told his payments were reduced to get "their" money back, perhaps he was claiming health benefits too as he "lives" in the UK .

I was told a large figure which to me sounds not only pension stuff. The story comes from a Thai wife of a farang, the guy is married to a Thai where the story comes from, a Thai lady.

Always the problem "someone knows someone" not it is the actual truth or comes within the bounds of the this thread. The OAP cannot be adjusted amended or stopped.

Pension credits will be heavily monitored,bank accounts scrutinised,even people living with you will be monitored ie renting

[transam]

Strange a Thai tells a Thai about her hubbies problem....

[transam]

When I was in the UK, self employed, I claimed sickness benefit for a few weeks, they paid me a few days over, they asked for it back.

[loppylugs1]

When I was in the UK, self employed, I claimed sickness benefit for a few weeks, they paid me a few days over, they asked for it back.

Probably will ,but not exactly Old Age Pension

[transam]

When I was in the UK, self employed, I claimed sickness benefit for a few weeks, they paid me a few days over, they asked for it back.

Probably will ,but not exactly Old Age Pension

I did include, it was a large sum, so could include benefits as well as pension.

[Rajab Al Zarahni]

build 766: I agree, this amounts to the most pernicious injustice. I paid 47/44 contributions and their are others out there who may even have paid 49/44 !

[Liquorice]

Resident or not in the UK,he will still get his rises,if say for example an accommodation address is used in Benidorm (cheap enough), .,or anywhere unfrozen ,and face it the Spanish telephone system is nothing but atrocious if concern regarding contact

Solly the pension credit will have to be in UK and the DWP do check on that one. The other they cannot be bothered Just your private pension provider make sure they do not have the address here,or any address for that matter,register for pay/pension slips for on-line

Certain benefits are affected if you go abroad for longer than 4 weeks.

In the case of Pension Credits you can live abroad for up to 13 weeks without loss of entitlement.

moving-to-and-returning-from-abroad.pdf

The OP can claim Pension Credits whilst he is in the UK and as long as he doesn't reside in Thailand for longer than 13 weeks in any one period he will not lose that benefit. (90 days to be on the safe side)

If the OP visits Thailand for 2 periods of up to 13 weeks in a year he will get Pension Credits, annual increase in his Pension and still be classed as resident in the UK. (2 x 90 days =180 days abroad. 185 days in UK)

Note that from 2016 Pension Credits are being scrapped and the new Flat Rate Pension will be introduced.

If the OP then gets the estimated £155 a week from 2016, as long as he follows the above his Pension payments will not be affected.

Think you will find its £148 per week.

The guy is already on OAP so he will stick with that rate he is on now...13 weeks? hardly worth it flying backwards and forwards

Those already receiving State Pension before 2016 will remain on the old scheme, meaning on top of their basic pension they can get credits like serps or Pension Credits to top up their income.

Those retiring after 2016 will get the new flat rate pension without entitlement to top ups.

https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/overview

According to this link the new rate pension is expected to start at £151.25pw.

Edited June 21, 2015 by Faz

[evadgib]

I worked 6 years in England before moving to Australia from age 16 to 22 and 3 years was as a apprentice, I will get a Australian pension as I have 35 years of working there, my question is would I be entitled to a pension from England even tough it would be very small, and would it be worth while applying.

Every year of NI contributions count.

Depends when you are able to claim state pension. Currently you need 30 NI contributions for full pension, and 35 from April next year.

You should receive 6/30ths or 6/35ths.

Make the buggers work and pay you! It's rightfully yours as you paid in.

What about old buggers like me who paid 44 years contributions. By your figures I should get 44/30ths or 44/35ths as that was the ruling at the time.

As it is I get 44/44ths of the pension rate in 2009 when I retired, NOT index linked because I live in Thailand.

Come back Guido Fawkes, and try again, all is forgiven.

The '30 or 35' bracket applies to the generation born around 1958-62 (exact dates should be on their website). It was a carrot and stick approach enabling HMG to slide the age by which claimants became eligible to draw their OAP's from 65 to 67 at 3 month intervals depending on their actual date of birth. Anyone capped at 30 years of NI cont are advised to contact HMRC after Apr 16 for details re topping up (if passed by Parliament) to 35.

HTH

[evadgib]

build 766: I agree, this amounts to the most pernicious injustice. I paid 47/44 contributions and their are others out there who may even have paid 49/44 !

How was it possible to pay beyond the full compliment of 44 without triggering some sort of red flag @ HMRC?

(It was HMRC who advised me to stop paying after 30 years and have since advised me to contact them after Apr 16 if/when the extra 5 years are voted in!)

Edited June 21, 2015 by evadgib

[Liquorice]

I worked 6 years in England before moving to Australia from age 16 to 22 and 3 years was as a apprentice, I will get a Australian pension as I have 35 years of working there, my question is would I be entitled to a pension from England even tough it would be very small, and would it be worth while applying.

You are entitled to a state pension of 6/30 of £115 before 2016.

Even as an apprentice you were credited with NI stamps.

After April 2016 you can claim 6/35 of £155 (or whatever the rate starts at).

Whatever rate you receive will be frozen at that rate until death.

As long as you remember your NI number nev, your due a little extra pension in retirement

[prakhonchai nick]

I worked 6 years in England before moving to Australia from age 16 to 22 and 3 years was as a apprentice, I will get a Australian pension as I have 35 years of working there, my question is would I be entitled to a pension from England even tough it would be very small, and would it be worth while applying.

Every year of NI contributions count.

Depends when you are able to claim state pension. Currently you need 30 NI contributions for full pension, and 35 from April next year.

You should receive 6/30ths or 6/35ths.

Make the buggers work and pay you! It's rightfully yours as you paid in.

What about old buggers like me who paid 44 years contributions. By your figures I should get 44/30ths or 44/35ths as that was the ruling at the time.

As it is I get 44/44ths of the pension rate in 2009 when I retired, NOT index linked because I live in Thailand.

Come back Guido Fawkes, and try again, all is forgiven.

I too am an old bugger,- been in Thailand for almost 30 years and made 44 contributions, 15 of those through voluntary payments. Then they changed it to 30!!!

Note that for bereavement benefits (being severed from 6th April next year for widows not UK resident), 44 NI contributions have always been required for maximum benefits. Anything less is pro-rata.

[Lite Beer]

I worked 6 years in England before moving to Australia from age 16 to 22 and 3 years was as a apprentice, I will get a Australian pension as I have 35 years of working there, my question is would I be entitled to a pension from England even tough it would be very small, and would it be worth while applying.

You are entitled to a state pension of 6/30 of £115 before 2016.

Even as an apprentice you were credited with NI stamps.

After April 2016 you can claim 6/35 of £155 (or whatever the rate starts at).

Whatever rate you receive will be frozen at that rate until death.

As long as you remember your NI number nev, your due a little extra pension in retirement

Sorry but it looks like he is not entitled to anything.

5. Your National Insurance record and your State Pension

Your new State Pension is based on your National Insurance record when you reach State Pension age.

You’ll usually need to have 10 qualifying years on your National Insurance record to get any new State Pension.

https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/your-national-insurance-record-and-your-state-pension

[Liquorice]

build 766: I agree, this amounts to the most pernicious injustice. I paid 47/44 contributions and their are others out there who may even have paid 49/44 !

How was it possible to pay beyond 44 without some sort of red flag from HMRC?

(It was they who advised me to stop @ 30!)

I paid NI for 42 years when my qualifying period was only 30 years, so I would have got an additional pension bring my state pension up to nearly £200 when I reach retirement age in 2018.

However as I'll retire after 2016, I'll be eligible to get the new rate pension.

I read that under my circumstances I should receive the higher of the two when I retire, so I don't lose out by the introduction of the new scheme, but it's still a grey area at the moment with no certainties.

There is so much speculation over what might or might not happen yet, that I'm just keeping my fingers crossed, and hoping for the best at the moment.

[prakhonchai nick]

I worked 6 years in England before moving to Australia from age 16 to 22 and 3 years was as a apprentice, I will get a Australian pension as I have 35 years of working there, my question is would I be entitled to a pension from England even tough it would be very small, and would it be worth while applying.

You are entitled to a state pension of 6/30 of £115 before 2016.

Even as an apprentice you were credited with NI stamps.

After April 2016 you can claim 6/35 of £155 (or whatever the rate starts at).

Whatever rate you receive will be frozen at that rate until death.

As long as you remember your NI number nev, your due a little extra pension in retirement

Sorry but it looks like he is not entitled to anything.

5. Your National Insurance record and your State Pension

Your new State Pension is based on your National Insurance record when you reach State Pension age.

You’ll usually need to have 10 qualifying years on your National Insurance record to get any new State Pension.

https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/your-national-insurance-record-and-your-state-pension

A very valid point Lite Beer -one I overlooked.

The solution is to top up to 10 with voluntary contributions.

[Rajab Al Zarahni]

build 766: I agree, this amounts to the most pernicious injustice. I paid 47/44 contributions and their are others out there who may even have paid 49/44 !

How was it possible to pay beyond the full compliment of 44 without triggering some sort of red flag @ HMRC?

(It was HMRC who advised me to stop paying after 30 years and have since advised me to contact them after Apr 16 if/when the extra 5 years are voted in!)

If you are employed NI is automatically deducted from your salary from the age of 16 until you qualify for your state pension. You cannot elect not to pay it and you receive no refund of contributions paid after you have reached the maximum years required ( in my case:44). That is why some people can end up having paid 49 years contributions.

Edited June 21, 2015 by Rajab Al Zarahni

[prakhonchai nick]

build 766: I agree, this amounts to the most pernicious injustice. I paid 47/44 contributions and their are others out there who may even have paid 49/44 !

How was it possible to pay beyond 44 without some sort of red flag from HMRC?

(It was they who advised me to stop @ 30!)

I paid NI for 42 years when my qualifying period was only 30 years, so I would have got an additional pension bring my state pension up to nearly £200 when I reach retirement age in 2018.

However as I'll retire after 2016, I'll be eligible to get the new rate pension.

I read that under my circumstances I should receive the higher of the two when I retire, so I don't lose out by the introduction of the new scheme, but it's still a grey area at the moment with no certainties.

There is so much speculation over what might or might not happen yet, that I'm just keeping my fingers crossed, and hoping for the best at the moment.

I doubt anyone gets any more just because they paid over 30 or 35 contributions. Currently you get extra on top of the basic rate for GRP and for not having contracted out (SERPS). Dont think extra contributions come into it.

[JetsetBkk]

I worked 6 years in England before moving to Australia from age 16 to 22 and 3 years was as a apprentice, I will get a Australian pension as I have 35 years of working there, my question is would I be entitled to a pension from England even tough it would be very small, and would it be worth while applying.

You are entitled to a state pension of 6/30 of £115 before 2016.

Even as an apprentice you were credited with NI stamps.

After April 2016 you can claim 6/35 of £155 (or whatever the rate starts at).

Whatever rate you receive will be frozen at that rate until death.

As long as you remember your NI number nev, your due a little extra pension in retirement

Sorry but it looks like he is not entitled to anything.

5. Your National Insurance record and your State Pension

Your new State Pension is based on your National Insurance record when you reach State Pension age.

Youll usually need to have 10 qualifying years on your National Insurance record to get any new State Pension.

https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/your-national-insurance-record-and-your-state-pension

Thieving rat finks.

[Liquorice]

How was it possible to pay beyond 44 without some sort of red flag from HMRC?

(It was they who advised me to stop @ 30!)

I paid NI for 42 years when my qualifying period was only 30 years, so I would have got an additional pension bring my state pension up to nearly £200 when I reach retirement age in 2018.

However as I'll retire after 2016, I'll be eligible to get the new rate pension.

I read that under my circumstances I should receive the higher of the two when I retire, so I don't lose out by the introduction of the new scheme, but it's still a grey area at the moment with no certainties.

There is so much speculation over what might or might not happen yet, that I'm just keeping my fingers crossed, and hoping for the best at the moment.

I doubt anyone gets any more just because they paid over 30 or 35 contributions. Currently you get extra on top of the basic rate for GRP and for not having contracted out (SERPS). Dont think extra contributions come into it.

SERPS was replaced by the State Second Pension Scheme (S2P) in 2002.

If you pay over and above the qualifying years you get S2P based on your contributions.

On my Pension forecast it is referred to as Additional Pension.

[loppylugs1]

Resident or not in the UK,he will still get his rises,if say for example an accommodation address is used in Benidorm (cheap enough), .,or anywhere unfrozen ,and face it the Spanish telephone system is nothing but atrocious if concern regarding contact

Solly the pension credit will have to be in UK and the DWP do check on that one. The other they cannot be bothered Just your private pension provider make sure they do not have the address here,or any address for that matter,register for pay/pension slips for on-line

Certain benefits are affected if you go abroad for longer than 4 weeks.

In the case of Pension Credits you can live abroad for up to 13 weeks without loss of entitlement.

moving-to-and-returning-from-abroad.pdf

The OP can claim Pension Credits whilst he is in the UK and as long as he doesn't reside in Thailand for longer than 13 weeks in any one period he will not lose that benefit. (90 days to be on the safe side)

If the OP visits Thailand for 2 periods of up to 13 weeks in a year he will get Pension Credits, annual increase in his Pension and still be classed as resident in the UK. (2 x 90 days =180 days abroad. 185 days in UK)

Note that from 2016 Pension Credits are being scrapped and the new Flat Rate Pension will be introduced.

If the OP then gets the estimated £155 a week from 2016, as long as he follows the above his Pension payments will not be affected.

Think you will find its £148 per week.

The guy is already on OAP so he will stick with that rate he is on now...13 weeks? hardly worth it flying backwards and forwards

Those already receiving State Pension before 2016 will remain on the old scheme, meaning on top of their basic pension they can get credits like serps or Pension Credits to top up their income.

Those retiring after 2016 will get the new flat rate pension without entitlement to top ups.

https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/overview

According to this link the new rate pension is expected to start at £151.25pw.

Is this the one that I have to pump in £20.000 to receive whatever and the break even age is 89 ,no think not.

I'm on periphery of some high powered chat between DWP and national lawyers on past superannuation schemes, the quote for 2016 is £148

Anyway the name of the game is "how can I get the full OAP living in Thailand" depending who you talk to in DWP there ,will depend on how sympathetic he/she is. Tell them they act,do not and they are not interested. No penalty,no Judge Dread,no nothing,just frozen at that point

anyway off to spend some ill gotten gains on a tart or two

...and further pps(es) most if not all that got a good SERPS slice will be on a figure on well above the minimum OAP starting 2016 oh! the hell of it bleeding the country dry and the other whatever as well

Edited June 21, 2015 by loppylugs1

[nong38]

Whilst back in the UK recently doubt was being cast over the HMG being able to sustain the 2.5% pension increase over the run of the current Parliament as inflation is low and many people joining the scheme, I expect that it will see out its duration but not into after the next General Election in 2020. I know this is of little comfort to us out here but at least our loss will not be so great.

I was amazed in that the HMG rushed through the wonderful idea of giving working mums extra for child care, at a cost of 1/2 a billion GBP, mums must have been very happy about that, but where did that money come from? Where do they suddenly find that amount bearing in mind that the cost of our re-instatement of increases costs just 53.3million more! which was deemed to expensive and there was no money to fund it. Where is Steve Webb when you need him? Doing a bit of childcare perhaps?

For those of you like me who think Foreign Aid should be coming to us rather than a bunch crooks and others who either dont need it or dont serve it, I read in the papers today that Immigrant workers are annually sending home to the flock at home 11 billion gbp per annum, which curiously enough is exactly the same amount as the Foreign Aid budget, what a funny world we live.

Edited June 21, 2015 by nong38

[nontabury]

When I was in the UK, self employed, I claimed sickness benefit for a few weeks, they paid me a few days over, they asked for it back.

Probably will ,but not exactly Old Age Pension

Are you saying that a person that has over claimed on the state pension, and it comes to the attention of the authorities, that they cannot claw back that money from you somehow. Surely not.

[transam]

When I was in the UK, self employed, I claimed sickness benefit for a few weeks, they paid me a few days over, they asked for it back.

Probably will ,but not exactly Old Age Pension

Are you saying that a person that has over claimed on the state pension, and it comes to the attention of the authorities, that they cannot claw back that money from you somehow. Surely not.

The pension form you fill out is quite extensive, the form you fill out if living abroad has a whole bunch of strange questions, after filing it out with the truth you sign it. If one has told porkies on that signed "claim" form I would suggest the gov can do what they like, if they want.

The story I was told was by an old farang guys wife that came to my house for advice as her husband has been living here for years but not, he has been on all sorts of health benefits and pension for years. After their friend got nabbed they are quite distraught with the thought of paying back a lot of cash. I could not advise anything.

Edited June 22, 2015 by transam

[loppylugs1]

When I was in the UK, self employed, I claimed sickness benefit for a few weeks, they paid me a few days over, they asked for it back.

Probably will ,but not exactly Old Age Pension

Are you saying that a person that has over claimed on the state pension, and it comes to the attention of the authorities, that they cannot claw back that money from you somehow. Surely not.

Hard to see how you can "overclaim" on OAP but no they cannot Look on the rules previous page Has to come to recipient cannot be stopped reduced or whatever

But can be frozen if you are idiot enough to tell them

Edited June 22, 2015 by loppylugs1

[Rajab Al Zarahni]

When I was in the UK, self employed, I claimed sickness benefit for a few weeks, they paid me a few days over, they asked for it back.

Probably will ,but not exactly Old Age Pension

Are you saying that a person that has over claimed on the state pension, and it comes to the attention of the authorities, that they cannot claw back that money from you somehow. Surely not.

Hard to see how you can "overclaim" on OAP but no they cannot Look on the rules previous page Has to come to recipient cannot be stopped reduced or whatever

But can be frozen if you are idiot enough to tell them

" Look on the rules previous page"

What rules ? Where can we find them ?

[transam]

If you tell porkies on a claim form ie: saying you are in the UK but living in LOS , you are over claiming when a % rise is given. You have told porkies on your claim form...

Gawd, can't believe some of you don't understand....... ........Or are you making excuses cos your worried about something.......

[transam]

Read part 11.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/426250/ipc-br1-dec-2013.pdf

[MaeJoMTB]

The '30 or 35' bracket applies to the generation born around 1958-62 (exact dates should be on their website). It was a carrot and stick approach enabling HMG to slide the age by which claimants became eligible to draw their OAP's from 65 to 67 at 3 month intervals depending on their actual date of birth. Anyone capped at 30 years of NI cont are advised to contact HMRC after Apr 16 for details re topping up (if passed by Parliament) to 35.

HTH

April 16 ..... 2016 ??? or what ???

I stopped paying NI after 30 years contributions, would have kept paying but they wouldn't let me.

[transam]

I think I will have an update about the worried farang "living" in the UK. Just been told his wife is popping in to show me a demand repayment letter. ...........See what happens when I read it and I will report here who it is from etc....

[Rajab Al Zarahni]

Read part 11.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/426250/ipc-br1-dec-2013.pdf

Thanks for the link. Notably Part 11 includes in the terms of the declaration:" I understand that if I fail to promptly notify the Department of a change in circumstances, I may be liable to prosecution or other action.

I can find no reference to any rule which appears to restrict or otherwise constrain the DWP from recovering over-payments from future scheduled payments.