Australian, 93, Faces Sexual Assault Charges In Thailand

[DocN]

Of course we should wait, what the trial brings and if the evidence is compelling...

...but still I am (yet again) ...to say the least..."thrilled" by some comments.

Especially the ones who speak of "respect for elders" or find it funny to make comments about him, not "getting it up".

I assume, you have no children?

[edko]

After reading every post from the beginning to the end, from being swayed from one side to the other, what strikes me most was the simple reported fact that the man was released on bail of 400,000 baht which I find to be curious at best - maybe to spare the state the expense of incarcerating him in a medical facility?

As to the photographic evidence, I have seen a lot of very good photos that have been Photoshopped, and while certainly no expert and of often faulty memory, I was under the impression that due to the possibilities of Photoshopped photographic evidence, that in many jurisdictions photo evidence is not allowed.

For those reasons, as I am not privy to the evidence, I will join with those who will wait to pass judgement AFTER he has been tried and either released or sentenced. That said, I am not so naive to have been convinced that where there is smoke there is usually fire.

[Bender]

No photos have been leaked to the press? Odd again.

In fact it's highly suspicious. Remember 2-3 years ago when a french paedophile was caught in north thailand(you can found the story on this webboard).

Police did found on him, dozens and dozens of videos of him with young children. Police at the press conference did provide all the proof. Thai national press did show some blurred picture of the culprit with young boys. I saw them on television!!! It was really hard evidence.

So why they didn't show the pic of the 93 yo with the young girl? certainly because its only pure BS.

Edited October 5, 2012 by Bender

[F4UCorsair]

At 93 you would think he would know better either way considering the reputation Thailand has for these things. Guilty or not he would seem to be his own worst enemy. As for respecting your elders , i'm all for it as long as they don't have their dick in children !!

Another poster automatically assumes this guy was having intercourse with children. Talk about jumping to conclusions - there was no mention of sex.

Actually he is accused of sex crimes but one doesn't have to have intercourse to rape or molest somebody.

Except that the charge is raping four young girls

[Nisa]

3. The man's mental health is a factor.

One doesn't know as there is no statement of whether or not a mental health assessment was made. There is no indication of whether or not the man was on medication. Some medications cause very aberrant behaviour.

Warning: This medicine may cause you to become sexually attracted to children and force you to molest multiple children and amass child pornography that you will be compelled to share with your friends overseas.

[Nisa]

Actually he is accused of sex crimes but one doesn't have to have intercourse to rape or molest somebody.

Except that the charge is raping four young girls

What are you not understanding? "one doesn't have to have intercourse to rape or molest somebody"

[GentlemanJim]

3. The man's mental health is a factor.

One doesn't know as there is no statement of whether or not a mental health assessment was made. There is no indication of whether or not the man was on medication. Some medications cause very aberrant behaviour.

Warning: This medicine may cause you to Gbecome sexually attracted to children and force you to molest multiple children and amass child pornography that you will be compelled to share with your friends overseas.

The level of hysteria being displayed on here by some allegedy intelligent people is quite simply shocking.

Edited October 5, 2012 by GentlemanJim

[cbrer]

Thought it would be hard to molest someone in Thailand when you're a 90 year old who cannot walk without assistance and are in Australia receiving medical treatment at the time.

[mylk]

At 93 you would think he would know better either way considering the reputation Thailand has for these things. Guilty or not he would seem to be his own worst enemy. As for respecting your elders , i'm all for it as long as they don't have their dick in children !!

Another poster automatically assumes this guy was having intercourse with children. Talk about jumping to conclusions - there was no mention of sex.

I was refer to the act of peodophiles in a general context and not specifically at the person in question and this particular case.

[Nisa]

Thought it would be hard to molest someone in Thailand when you're a 90 year old who cannot walk without assistance and are in Australia receiving medical treatment at the time.

Interesting to note he walked just fine, lived on his own and drove a car ... that is up until the police showed up when the neighbors say he began to act feeble. I am sure he was only pretending not to be able to walk unassisted when he sneaked into Burma.

Mr Kraus entered Burma by illegally crossing a river and travelled to the Karen state capital of Pa-an where he rented a room for several weeks until his arrest on July 24.

Read more:

http://www.smh.com.a...l#ixzz28P0NuH2w

Edited October 5, 2012 by Nisa

[chooka]

Doe's anyone know where exactly this guy is being held. I mean for sure.

[theblether]

@endure

You forgot the part in the process that states " Suspect jumps bail and flees the country "

Don't be cherry picking the bits out of the legal process that suit your argument now eh?

Comprende?

@ GK

What a load of waffle.

[bridge2bridge]

Pity these immigrants are able to call themselves Australians, with a name like karl Krause i would say german or belgium or austrian.

They give decent people from OZ a bad name.

93 or not i hope he rots in prison.

NO time for phedophiles.

[GentlemanJim]

Thought it would be hard to molest someone in Thailand when you're a 90 year old who cannot walk without assistance and are in Australia receiving medical treatment at the time.

Interesting to note he walked just fine, lived on his own and drove a car ... that is up until the police showed up when the neighbors say he began to act feeble. I am sure he was only pretending not to be able to walk unassisted when he sneaked into Burma.

Mr Kraus entered Burma by illegally crossing a river and travelled to the Karen state capital of Pa-an where he rented a room for several weeks until his arrest on July 24.

Read more:

http://www.smh.com.a...l#ixzz28P0NuH2w

Everything you are stating is hearsay. Was he fit driving a car, was he feeble we don't know do we, so why are you relying on media reports. The newspapers are not exactly renowned for accuracy are they. One thing is for sure, if the BiB knocked on your door and said they were arresting you for an offence that was the kind that would see you in jail for the rest of your natural life then most of us on here would suddenly be overcome by 'feebleness'! He was bailed to await trial in this country and clearly unable to go back to his home. Bank accounts sucked dry and hotel bills to pay with zero support, its no easy thing with 3 months at a time between court hearings.

If many of us here had been stitched up I imagine we would be tempted to get the hell out of the country at the earliest opportunity. Now none of that is stating Kraus has been stitched up but the message many of us is trying to get over is that we do not know. With that in mind, the vindictive hang em high attitude is all the more nauseating. We will find out in due course, maybe in 8 weeks, is that so long to wait before screaming for blood?

This is how many posters are coming over on this thread!!

[belg]

this man might have been an active pedo for over the last 70 years... just imagine how many lifes he ruined

[smokie36]

Thought it would be hard to molest someone in Thailand when you're a 90 year old who cannot walk without assistance and are in Australia receiving medical treatment at the time.

Interesting to note he walked just fine, lived on his own and drove a car ... that is up until the police showed up when the neighbors say he began to act feeble. I am sure he was only pretending not to be able to walk unassisted when he sneaked into Burma.

Mr Kraus entered Burma by illegally crossing a river and travelled to the Karen state capital of Pa-an where he rented a room for several weeks until his arrest on July 24.

Read more:

http://www.smh.com.a...l#ixzz28P0NuH2w

Everything you are stating is hearsay. Was he fit driving a car, was he feeble we don't know do we, so why are you relying on media reports. The newspapers are not exactly renowned for accuracy are they. One thing is for sure, if the BiB knocked on your door and said they were arresting you for an offence that was the kind that would see you in jail for the rest of your natural life then most of us on here would suddenly be overcome by 'feebleness'! He was bailed to await trial in this country and clearly unable to go back to his home. Bank accounts sucked dry and hotel bills to pay with zero support, its no easy thing with 3 months at a time between court hearings.

If many of us here had been stitched up I imagine we would be tempted to get the hell out of the country at the earliest opportunity. Now none of that is stating Kraus has been stitched up but the message many of us is trying to get over is that we do not know. With that in mind, the vindictive hang em high attitude is all the more nauseating. We will find out in due course, maybe in 8 weeks, is that so long to wait before screaming for blood?

This is how many posters are coming over on this thread!!

If I was a 93 year old innocent man being threatened with a stitch up...running low on funds...fearful of the outcome...well I would be talking to my embassy...friends and the press in my home country.

The Australian media have shown thwmselves to be interested in such cases in the past haven't they?

What I wouldn't do is sneak off like a guilty paedophile would be likely to..

[Nisa]

Everything you are stating is hearsay. Was he fit driving a car, was he feeble we don't know do we, so why are you relying on media reports. The newspapers are not exactly renowned for accuracy are they. <snip > He was bailed to await trial in this country and clearly unable to go back to his home. Bank accounts sucked dry and hotel bills to pay with zero support, its no easy thing with 3 months at a time between court hearings.

Interesting you say you can't believe the media but then go on to believe what is reported in the media and add further facts (speculation) not reported.

If you believe the police are lying to screw this guy then why have the police not chose to charge him with bail jumping and illegally exiting Thailand into Burma? If you believe the media is lying then why do you believe this is even a real story and that this man exists, has been arrested and is on trial?

Nothing wrong with questioning things but a bit silly when you ignore the over all picture and reports and only focus on tiny things and extrapolate possibilities to help support your position.

Edited October 5, 2012 by Nisa

[Nisa]

As to the photographic evidence, I have seen a lot of very good photos that have been Photoshopped, and while certainly no expert and of often faulty memory, I was under the impression that due to the possibilities of Photoshopped photographic evidence, that in many jurisdictions photo evidence is not allowed.

That would be like saying that because some people lie, the courts have deemed witness testimony inadmissible. The difference being is experts can tell if a photo has been manipulated .... especially ones that shows an old man photographed with naked children in his home. Not to mention that to believe the photos are faked, you have to believe the police are lying (for some strange reason to go after an old man) or somebody else went through the trouble of not only editing photos but then planting hundred of child porn pics in this guys house without him knowing, got to the maid to have her lie about seeing him looking at child porn on the computer, got to the kids to have them make up the story, got to the parents to make sure the kids stuck with the story ....

He deserves a fair trial before being convicted but people also deserve the right to express their opinions based on the obvious and logic (or even not).

[GentlemanJim]

Everything you are stating is hearsay. Was he fit driving a car, was he feeble we don't know do we, so why are you relying on media reports. The newspapers are not exactly renowned for accuracy are they. <snip > He was bailed to await trial in this country and clearly unable to go back to his home. Bank accounts sucked dry and hotel bills to pay with zero support, its no easy thing with 3 months at a time between court hearings.

Interesting you say you can't believe the media but then go on to believe what is reported in the media and add further facts (speculation) not reported.

If you believe the police are lying to screw this guy then why have the police not chose to charge him with bail jumping and illegally exiting Thailand into Burma? If you believe the media is lying then why do you believe this is even a real story and that this man exists, has been arrested and is on trial?

Nothing wrong with questioning things but a bit silly when you ignore the over all picture and reports and only focus on tiny things to help support your position.

Well to answer one of your points, perhaps you shouldn't have 'sniped' my post quite as much. I said in my text

Now none of that is stating Kraus has been stitched up but the message many of us is trying to get over is that we do not know.

So with that how can you ask if I believe the police are trying to stitch him up?

Your last line is yet again failing to see what the non-hang em high brigade are saying to you. I am NOT focusing on 'tiny' things to support my position. I have no position one way or the other for Kraus because the real position I have is clear cut, and that is (yet again!!) Until the man has been through the legal process and judged guilty by a court of law then he is presumed innocent. If he is subsequently guilty then I am happy, lock him up, I have said nothing other than 'wait for the court case'. However if he is found innocent then there are quite a few people on here need to take a close look at themselves for the hysterical way in which they have rushed to pre judge. Now, if you can't understand the stance that some of us are adhering to in that the law states someone is innocent until proven guilty then please don't bother to respond because we are saying the same thing over and over again and it's still not getting through, so there's no point saying it anymore.

Edited October 5, 2012 by GentlemanJim

[chooka]

this man might have been an active pedo for over the last 70 years... just imagine how many lifes he ruined

I can assure 100% that he wasn't even a person of interest at anytime whilst in Australia. In Australia he is a clean skin.

[cbrer]

Thought it would be hard to molest someone in Thailand when you're a 90 year old who cannot walk without assistance and are in Australia receiving medical treatment at the time.

Interesting to note he walked just fine, lived on his own and drove a car ... that is up until the police showed up when the neighbors say he began to act feeble. I am sure he was only pretending not to be able to walk unassisted when he sneaked into Burma.

Mr Kraus entered Burma by illegally crossing a river and travelled to the Karen state capital of Pa-an where he rented a room for several weeks until his arrest on July 24.

Read more:

http://www.smh.com.a...l#ixzz28P0NuH2w

I have to presume you've never crossed one of the bridges into Burma.

Next time you do, take a look over the side at all the boats and rafts taking people across. Many of them old and unable to walk with out assistance.

Interesting to note he walked just fine, lived on his own and drove a car ... that is up until the police showed up when the neighbors say he began to act feeble.

Are you making things up now Nisa?

All your says is:

"Neighbours say that, until recently, Mr Kraus drove a car and appeared spritely"

You do know that people who cannot walk unaided are able to drive cars?

Though of course the neighbours who apparently gave this quote to the reporter couldn't be part of the neighbouring family alledegedly extorting the old man for everything he has, eh.

[Baerboxer]

Just because he has been accused, doesn't mean he actually did anything. Any TV members remember the Ausi girl, about a month back, that accused a man of raping her, she made it up. Imagine if you were accused of this and you didn't actually do any of it.

Very good point, People are innocent until proven guilty in any civilized society. Not the mob rule and lynchings we see in some areas of the world. I heard that someone I once worked with was accused of touching two girls at the school where he as a governor. He'd taken early retirement and spent his time working for the community in a number of ways. By the time this happend he was 68ish. He'd been a POW of the Japs in WW2 and couldn't stand the thought of inprisonment and more torture. So he walked in front of a train. Several weeks late the two girls admiited they'd made the story up as a prank. No suggestion of corruption or extortion here, just a silly prank that went horribly wrong.

I've always been an advocate of appropriate punishment for murder, rape, peadophiles etc. But, not until their guilt has been proven. If gulity he deserves the full severity of the law. The big word in "if".

Edited October 5, 2012 by Baerboxer

[cbrer]

@endure

You forgot the part in the process that states " Suspect jumps bail and flees the country "

He may be in his 90s but it seems that he hasn't completely lost his marbles.

Fleeing from a police force renown for torture, murder, and extortion, where just a few months ago scores of applicants were caught paying 300,000thb to cheat on the entrance exams in order to become a police officer for a salary under 8000thb p/m, where a gang of them were just convicted of torturing a teenager to death, found guilty, were sentenced to death and then walked out of the courtroom on 'appeal'.

Seems like fleeing from this gang would certainly be the wise thing to do for any innocent being who's accused of crimes here (especially if, as he says, they are fabricated against him in order to extort him')

[theblether]

@endure

You forgot the part in the process that states " Suspect jumps bail and flees the country "

He may be in his 90s but it seems that he hasn't completely lost his marbles.

Fleeing from a police force renown for torture, murder, and extortion, where just a few months ago scores of applicants were caught paying 300,000thb to cheat on the entrance exams in order to become a police officer for a salary under 8000thb p/m, where a gang of them were just convicted of torturing a teenager to death, found guilty, were sentenced to death and then walked out of the courtroom on 'appeal'.

Seems like fleeing from this gang would certainly be the wise thing to do for any innocent being who's accused of crimes here (especially if, as he says, they are fabricated against him in order to extort him')

I'm waiting for you to take your argument to it's logical conclusion...........

[Nisa]

Interesting to note he walked just fine, lived on his own and drove a car ... that is up until the police showed up when the neighbors say he began to act feeble.

Are you making things up now Nisa?

All your says is:

"Neighbours say that, until recently, Mr Kraus drove a car and appeared spritely"

Neighbours say that, until recently, Mr Kraus drove a car and appeared spritely, but he has appeared in a wheelchair at his most recent court appearances.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/accused-child-abuser-93-caught-fleeing-into-burma-20120804-23ma8.html#ixzz28PhVKVNS

[Nisa]

Everything you are stating is hearsay. Was he fit driving a car, was he feeble we don't know do we, so why are you relying on media reports. The newspapers are not exactly renowned for accuracy are they. <snip > He was bailed to await trial in this country and clearly unable to go back to his home. Bank accounts sucked dry and hotel bills to pay with zero support, its no easy thing with 3 months at a time between court hearings.

Interesting you say you can't believe the media but then go on to believe what is reported in the media and add further facts (speculation) not reported.

If you believe the police are lying to screw this guy then why have the police not chose to charge him with bail jumping and illegally exiting Thailand into Burma? If you believe the media is lying then why do you believe this is even a real story and that this man exists, has been arrested and is on trial?

Nothing wrong with questioning things but a bit silly when you ignore the over all picture and reports and only focus on tiny things to help support your position.

Well to answer one of your points, perhaps you shouldn't have 'sniped' my post quite as much. I said in my text

Now none of that is stating Kraus has been stitched up but the message many of us is trying to get over is that we do not know.

So with that how can you ask if I believe the police are trying to stitch him up?

Your last line is yet again failing to see what the non-hang em high brigade are saying to you. I am NOT focusing on 'tiny' things to support my position. I have no position one way or the other for Kraus because the real position I have is clear cut, and that is (yet again!!) Until the man has been through the legal process and judged guilty by a court of law then he is presumed innocent. If he is subsequently guilty then I am happy, lock him up, I have said nothing other than 'wait for the court case'. However if he is found innocent then there are quite a few people on here need to take a close look at themselves for the hysterical way in which they have rushed to pre judge. Now, if you can't understand the stance that some of us are adhering to in that the law states someone is innocent until proven guilty then please don't bother to respond because we are saying the same thing over and over again and it's still not getting through, so there's no point saying it anymore.

He is presumed innocent by the courts -- you are confusing things. People are legally allowed to express their opinions and it happens all the time ... you say you simply want to tell people he has a right to a fair trial and I haven't seen anybody arguing with this. So, if that is your only point then you have made it but if you want to debate if he likely did it or not that is great and can be entertaining but stop going back to something that nobody is suggesting in terms of people believing accused should not be allowed a fair trial. Yes some people make over the top statements because they are convinced he is guilty (in their opinion) but they certainly are not saying people are not entitled to a fair trial and lets not pretend that this kind of debate and statements are not made in the west in news worthy crime stories. Nobody here is legally prejudging anybody because nobody here is a judge in the case.

If the guy is convicted will then be okay for people not involved with the case to express their opinions about his guilt or will we need to wait for the appeals process to be complete? Is it wrong to say OJ killed his exwife because he was not found guilty? (rhetorical)

Edited October 5, 2012 by Nisa

[TPI]

It doesn't matter to the child if the paedophile assailant is 33, 63, or 93.......the child is just as damaged and traumatised.

This guy knew what he was doing, age is no barrier to justice. Also well done to the Thai and Mynamar authorities for pursuing him and bringing him to justice, they need to send out a message loud and clear........the time of predatory paedophiles flying into South East Asia unencumbered is over. The law is waiting for you.

Age is no barrier to being a scumbag, this guy is a 93 year old paedophile scumbag, jail him for the rest of his days. End of.

You obviously din't engage your thinking gear when you exploded onto the page! Read what "cber" has inserted then we'll all sit around and wait for the apology?? Fat chance!

[candid]

this man might have been an active pedo for over the last 70 years... just imagine how many lifes he ruined

And he might not have. where you dig that one up from?

[candid]

I can only wonder about theblether's attitude on this thread. It is certainly far removed from his normal, well thought out posts. Maybe this will help. There have been times when my lifestyle ie coming to Thailand about 6/7 times a year has caused raised eyebrows back home in Scotland. There is some kind of train of thought over there that all visitors to Thailand might be paedophiles. Indeed, a workmate of mine, who had a gf and baby in Thailand had a helluva job getting his mother to visit because of this. Nothing beats old fashioned Scottish ingrained opinionated hatred. Rights or wrongs do not matter, it is just there and always will be

[Sing_Sling]

It sounds both plausible and implausible . . .

Plausible that he is a paedophile, implausible that he could overpower girls of that age when he is a frail 90-year old.

Plausible that the police and parents had proof

Plausible that the police and parents made it all up

Edited October 5, 2012 by Sing_Sling