Twin Bomb Explosions Shatter Boston Marathon Finish Line

[F430murci]

Who would shoot themselves in the neck to commit suicide?

Haha, I heard yesterday am he apparently tried to shoot through his mouth and it came out at the base of skull or back of neck and missed cervical spine. Exit wound . . . He also apparently had a gun shot wound to leg that came during earlier encounter. He apparently tried to off himself in the boat and said f that and gave up when it didn't work.

Edited April 22, 2013 by F430murci

[keemapoot]

I want to hear what the feds have to say about this "acted alone" part, after a thorough investigation. How can Boston authorities know that already? One perp is dead and the other has severe injuries including to the throat. I suspect he is heavily sedated in addition to the throat injuries and can't talk. Even if he can, would he tell the truth?

I have to throw the BS flag on the Boston Authorities. There's no way they can know that yet.

My hunch is that they had a lot of help and encouragement. Their equipment acquisition alone would have been difficult. That's too much gun powder to just waltz into some store and purchase. The older brother made a trip to Russia to a known hub of terrorists and spent significant time there.

I could go on, but I'm not buying it yet, and I think if "Boston Authorities" said that, they are talking out of the wrong end of their bodies, and doing it too soon.

I agree with your contention they should have had help to pull it off munitions-wise, but what puzzles me the most about this whole sordid affair, is that if they had organized help, a cell, with support from abroad or otherwise, WHY DIDN'T THEY HAVE AND UTILIZE A PLANNED QUICK EXIT??? Instead, the younger brother hangs around on campus, plays on twitter, and goes to a party? If there was a plan for a 2nd attack planned for a few days later, that could explain it, but something about this says they acted alone....

[keemapoot]

Who would shoot themselves in the neck to commit suicide?

Haha, I heard yesterday am he apparently tried to shoot through his mouth and it came out at the base of skull or back of neck and missed cervical spine. Exit wound . . . He also apparently had a gun shot wound to leg that came during earlier encounter. He apparently tried to off himself in the boat and said f that and gave up when it didn't work.

I noticed the reports of the 3 Fs he got in college, I assume one was in anatomy.

[F430murci]

I want to hear what the feds have to say about this "acted alone" part, after a thorough investigation. How can Boston authorities know that already? One perp is dead and the other has severe injuries including to the throat. I suspect he is heavily sedated in addition to the throat injuries and can't talk. Even if he can, would he tell the truth?

I have to throw the BS flag on the Boston Authorities. There's no way they can know that yet.

My hunch is that they had a lot of help and encouragement. Their equipment acquisition alone would have been difficult. That's too much gun powder to just waltz into some store and purchase. The older brother made a trip to Russia to a known hub of terrorists and spent significant time there.

I could go on, but I'm not buying it yet, and I think if "Boston Authorities" said that, they are talking out of the wrong end of their bodies, and doing it too soon.

I agree with your contention they should have had help to pull it off munitions-wise, but what puzzles me the most about this whole sordid affair, is that if they had organized help, a cell, with support from abroad or otherwise, WHY DIDN'T THEY HAVE AND UTILIZE A PLANNED QUICK EXIT??? Instead, the younger brother hangs around on campus, plays on twitter, and goes to a party? If there was a plan for a 2nd attack planned for a few days later, that could explain it, but something about this says they acted alone....

Or it was planned during his trip. The guy would not have had any contact with anyone while in US. Even his mother said the Feds were monitoring everything he did and everyone he spoke to. Right or wrong, I am sure that he shared the same though process and dud everything he could to remain under everyone's radar.

[Scott]

Numerous off-topic posts and replies have been deleted.

Please don't feed the trolls.

[jamhar]

Agreed, on the muslims that think so. But I'll go further. I believe most muslims, moderate or not, believe so also.

but it is rare, for a muslim to go against another muslim in support of the US, esp. with such conviction. and that includes muslims that currently have immigrated to the US.

There was a piece in the BBC, prior to information about the suspects being released, about how the Muslim community of Boston was hoping that the purps were not Muslim (selfish thought or not they realized). They seemed like meek and cowed groups. but that's how the fundamentalist Muslims groups work, i believe. They submit the will of any opposing groups or ideas with threats of harm or death. So yes, from what I've seen, Any Muslim that is willing to come out publicly and stand with his other fellow countrymen of the US, against the fundamentalist Islamist is rare.

If i'm wrong, please show me.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Islamic-Society-of-Boston-Cultural-Center-ISBCC/196151363757324

Islamic Society of Boston Cultural Center (ISBCC)

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:

Contact: Yusufi Vali, Tel: 617-427-2636

Imam Suhaib Webb, Tel: 617-318-1512

April 20, 2013

Boston-Muslim Community Proud of Our Law Enforcement and City; Re-opens Today

The Islamic Society of Boston Cultural Center and the Boston-Muslim Community is proud of our law enforcement officials in apprehending the second Boston bombing suspect. We are also proud of our Boston community in immediately providing tips to law enforcement officials in apprehending these suspects.

While we are all relieved for our weeklong nightmare to end, we are also deeply troubled and saddened. Yesterday, one of our police officers was brutally killed and another injured. We cannot help but feel angry that all this has happened to our city.

Details emerged yesterday that both these suspects had been known to our Boston Community - to our public schools, to their local boxing club, to one of our faith communities at the Cambridge mosque, and even to the FBI. Yet, no one inside of these institutions was able to predict these acts of terror by the alleged suspects. This hurts, and we wish we all - our faith community and all the institutions listed above - could have done something to prevent this.

...

ZZ,

I appreciate the post. and the Mosque seems to be a peaceful mosque, like i believe most are and should be. But as i'm reading their statement, i get the sense of a carefully measured reply. No condemnation of the brothers action, In fact the are just sadden that the actions couldn't have been prevented (who knew? ). They seem to accept that no one knew anything, instead of actively seeking our information from anyone, be it public or anomalously for info. The full article in their website, they ask if anyone knows anything, to call the FBI. Thats like saying if they want air, breath in. Basically dont go to the Imam for counsel, like you would normally do, ie, Instead of "if you have any information please go to the FBI or come to me if you are uncertain" it was "Go to the FBI".

In my old neighborhood, if you told someone if they have any information, go to the police, I knew what that meant.

They should be actively vetting the congregation publicly, and privately for people who had information or might have known something. Because if they exist (the extremist) in your congregation they are using your mosque to inflict one of the most severe sin's in your community. And if you chose to do nothing, you are complicit.

Thats what i meant by being cowed and such. I recall a while back, hearing one moderate Muslim say that they didn't want to speak out too much for fear their mosque could be targeted by the fundamentalist Muslims.

If the Muslims self policed, the atmosphere for extremism would be very difficult to exist. It exists because there are members of the muslim community that have extrimist views. and their numbers do not seem to be insignificant. and that population is ignored, or tolerated by the moderated community.

In that BBC piece on the Boston Muslim community hoping the perps weren't Muslim. It seem to me that the moderate population was more worried about how they would be perceived by the general population and it potential effects, than saying, if the perps were Muslim then we have a cancer in our community and needs to be ferreted and removed.

And lastly, thats why i like the perps uncle. There was no "woo is me, people will look at me funny". It was a flat out. " you are my nephews but you are scum, and deserve everything that pieces of sh*t like you deserve". and thats why i would hire that man any day. I'd also work for that man any day. and that's how you gain the respect of your community, and prevent possible retaliatory actions from the pieces of sh*ts from the other communities.

my 2 cents

[ABCer]

Stop this nonsense, please!

Lots of innocent people have been killed and injured. Sure as hell the police and FBI will get him - dead or alive!

But this will not recompense the innocent victims. What does it matter if they catch him dead or alive? If taken alive he will talk, - they will make him. And maybe some other bastards will be caught. Will this change anything? I am afraid not.

The problem can be solved only if and when terrorism is ended! Humans are a murderous species. Look back to History.

It is full of cruelty deaths and murder, BUT NEVER TERRORISM!

IRA, RED BRIGADE, BLACK SEPTEMBER, ETA, AL-QAEDA and many similar organisations are invention of 20th century.

These organisations are the answer to State terrorism in their respective countries or across the border. And we, innocent people are the meat in the sandwich (often literally).

This bastard who is responsible for bombings is washed out, dead in any case. And good riddance. But the problem is - there will be many more. And we must think how to stop their appearance. Anything else is a waste of time.

Quite agree. The root causes that create conflict need to be addressed rather than just the symptoms. And that invariably means a whole range of issues rather than just demonising one religion as some would wish to do.

Your history is a little awry as terrorism has its historical roots well pre 20 th century. See 1st century Jewish Sicari, 11th century Shiite Assassins, 19th anarchists in US and Europe ( high points murdering 1 Tsar and 1 US president). IRA origins in 1867. And in the USA both John Brown and the KKK could well be classified as terrorists.

Thanks for appreciation.

Have to disagree on "TERRORISM". Turkish genocide on Armenians, Hitlers genocide on Jews, etc. are despicable acts, but not TERRORIST ACTS. Even Lenin/Stalin killings of about 50,000,000 were not TERRORIST ACTS, but rule by terror. Neither was KKK or Holy Inquisition There is a difference. Terrorist act is applied indiscriminately to people not involved in any dispute/struggle. It is the invention of late XX Century. Cruelty in general as well as mass murder is endemic to our species and existed always, we are just improving the means.

Interesting to watch how almost 600 posters (with due respect!) are happily involved in sucking on irrelevancies, like: Will they catch him? was he Right, Left or Center? Was there a group? Is he an Islamist, Christian Jew or Atheist? Is he a Saudi, Russian, Irish, Indian, Chechen etc.? And the universal Joy when he was caught!!! - all inconsequential. This was what I meant saying 'stop this nonsense'

[Mosha]

Police fear he'll never be fit enough to be questioned.

[animatic]

I want to hear what the feds have to say about this "acted alone" part, after a thorough investigation. How can Boston authorities know that already? One perp is dead and the other has severe injuries including to the throat. I suspect he is heavily sedated in addition to the throat injuries and can't talk. Even if he can, would he tell the truth?

I have to throw the BS flag on the Boston Authorities. There's no way they can know that yet.

My hunch is that they had a lot of help and encouragement. Their equipment acquisition alone would have been difficult. That's too much gun powder to just waltz into some store and purchase. The older brother made a trip to Russia to a known hub of terrorists and spent significant time there.

I could go on, but I'm not buying it yet, and I think if "Boston Authorities" said that, they are talking out of the wrong end of their bodies, and doing it too soon.

Tamerlan had an American wife and she /they lived in New Hampshire. At least some of the time.

Nothing like the same level of gun control as Mass. Not even close.

Buying a semi-auto would not be that hard there, especially for the western wife,

and machining a part to make it full automatic is not hard in an auto shop.

Also no problem to buy 2-3 bags of nitrate fertilizer for gardening in farm country,

Mix with diesel fuel and stock with shrapnel debris from and hardware store, done.

Blasting caps are harder, but if younger brother was a decent engineer,

not hard to make something that would work.

Even heating a single 22 shell with a car lighter would work, you just lose space for the battery

But simply mechanically bursting a small phosphorus package would work.

And pressure cookers are available in all major super markets.

Also doing target practice and things as big as a 12 gauge being fired up there draws little notice.

So they could easily have tested smaller versions and gone unnoticed.

So not really difficult.

[keemapoot]

Police fear he'll never be fit enough to be questioned.

Boston Marathon bombing suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is awake and responding sporadically in writing to questions, authorities said. Investigators are asking about other cell members and other unexploded bombs, law enforcement sources told ABC News.

http://gma.yahoo.com/bombing-suspect-responding-questions-writing-182520957--abc-news-topstories.html

The Boston mayor has said he believes the older brother "brainwashed" the kid. If so, and if appears as true that he did not internalize the radicalism too much, probably this crack Presidential interrogation team has some special shrinks that can de-program him, and get him talking?

[lomatopo]

"Please exit the boat, watch your step"

[animatic]

I want to hear what the feds have to say about this "acted alone" part, after a thorough investigation. How can Boston authorities know that already? One perp is dead and the other has severe injuries including to the throat. I suspect he is heavily sedated in addition to the throat injuries and can't talk. Even if he can, would he tell the truth?

I have to throw the BS flag on the Boston Authorities. There's no way they can know that yet.

My hunch is that they had a lot of help and encouragement. Their equipment acquisition alone would have been difficult. That's too much gun powder to just waltz into some store and purchase. The older brother made a trip to Russia to a known hub of terrorists and spent significant time there.

I could go on, but I'm not buying it yet, and I think if "Boston Authorities" said that, they are talking out of the wrong end of their bodies, and doing it too soon.

I agree with your contention they should have had help to pull it off munitions-wise, but what puzzles me the most about this whole sordid affair, is that if they had organized help, a cell, with support from abroad or otherwise, WHY DIDN'T THEY HAVE AND UTILIZE A PLANNED QUICK EXIT??? Instead, the younger brother hangs around on campus, plays on twitter, and goes to a party? If there was a plan for a 2nd attack planned for a few days later, that could explain it, but something about this says they acted alone....

I think they or at least the elder, may not have expected to survive,

Tamerlan seems to have actively gone out in a blaze of gunfire and bombs.

He may have dragged 6-7 year younger brother into it, but he did not have the same zeal,

just filial devotion gone very very wrong.

Edited April 22, 2013 by animatic

[Ulysses G.]

The Boston mayor has said he believes the older brother "brainwashed" the kid.

"Brainwashed" - or not - he still made the decision to participate in maiming and slaughtering innocent people. He even placed the bomb in front of a child. He deserves what he gets and that very well may be the death penalty.

[F430murci]

Police fear he'll never be fit enough to be questioned.

Boston Marathon bombing suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is awake and responding sporadically in writing to questions, authorities said. Investigators are asking about other cell members and other unexploded bombs, law enforcement sources told ABC News.

http://gma.yahoo.com/bombing-suspect-responding-questions-writing-182520957--abc-news-topstories.html

The Boston mayor has said he believes the older brother "brainwashed" the kid. If so, and if appears as true that he did not internalize the radicalism too much, probably this crack Presidential interrogation team has some special shrinks that can de-program him, and get him talking?

Prob just basic stuff like any more bombs, any more attacks and etc. Press seems to run wild with statements that are about three levels of hearsay and this stuff apparently originated in a simple tweet from news guy at hospital and got a bit expanded earlier today. FBI was saying critical condition and non responsive around same time so take your pick.

Boston Mayor seems really determined to get some story out that cause as little public concern and finger pointing as possible. Not saying not true, but he has a bit eager to get his spin out and get Boston back to normal. Cannot say I blame him and I doubt anything else is in the works for Boston at this moment.

[keemapoot]

The Boston mayor has said he believes the older brother "brainwashed" the kid.

"Brainwashed" - or not - he still made the decision to participate in maiming and slaughtering innocent people. He even placed the bomb in front of a child. He deserves what he gets and that very well may be the death penalty.

Sure, most Americans share these views, but it does help somewhat that one of them is dead, and died violently. What is important now is what is in the National best interests and in the interests of National Security. If that means plea-bargaining, and sweet-talking the boy with Dr. Melfi to extract info, that is what we should do.

[F430murci]

Thumbs up for Sopranos reference.

[Loptr]

Who would shoot themselves in the neck to commit suicide?

Haha, I heard yesterday am he apparently tried to shoot through his mouth and it came out at the base of skull or back of neck and missed cervical spine. Exit wound . . . He also apparently had a gun shot wound to leg that came during earlier encounter. He apparently tried to off himself in the boat and said f that and gave up when it didn't work.

Suicide is only supposed to hurt for a millisecond, unless you screw it up.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nation/source-suspected-boston-marathon-bomber-dzhokhar-tsarnaev-responds-to-investigators-in-writing-1.5113586

[lomatopo]

This article suggests that the younger brother may have indeed contributed to the older one's death.

http://boston.com/metrodesk/2013/04/21/new-details-wild-shootout-with-bomb-suspects-watertown-chief-believes-older-brother-was-killed-younger-brother-desperate-getaway/jaIyrXr8fSnf5Pu4xnRbvM/story.html

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[jamhar]

Jingles, most of us do not live in Lebanon. I think the information would be more relevant if the countries surveyed were the UK, Australia, USA etc.

I want to have some reliable info before I embark on a pogrom.

Thanks.

.

Jingles

I thought your stats looked just fine. I did see some omissions tho. US and EU i could understand. Those areas are outside the Region. but how about some of the prosperous Middle Eastern Countries. SA, Kawait, UAE ect? I'm certain those countries would not want to be surveyed. but why weren't they? was it a matter of permission?

just thinking out loud.

And yes, you are now "Jingles"

Edited April 22, 2013 by Scott

[Jingthing]

The theory that he tried to kill himself makes total sense to me. The "loser" talking Uncle will have something more to crow about. He's such a loser he couldn't even shoot himself to death!

As far as plea bargaining to avoid federal death penalty level charges. I don't think so! My understanding at this stage is it is totally legal to LIE to him about anything to get this critical information and that doing so would have no impact on a later prosecution. The police see this guy as a cake walk to manipulate if they can only get him healthy enough to do so.

Edited April 22, 2013 by Jingthing

[Tywais]

This article suggests that the younger brother may have indeed contributed to the older one's death. http://boston.com/metrodesk/2013/04/21/new-details-wild-shootout-with-bomb-suspects-watertown-chief-believes-older-brother-was-killed-younger-brother-desperate-getaway/jaIyrXr8fSnf5Pu4xnRbvM/story.html Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Seems some conflicting info on that.

BOSTON (AP) — A doctor involved in treating the Boston Marathon bombing suspect who died in a gunbattle with police says he had injuries head to toe and all limbs intact when he arrived at the hospital.

Dr. David Schoenfeld said 26-year-old Tamerlan Tsarnaev was unconscious and had so many penetrating wounds when he arrived at Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center early Friday that it isn’t clear which ones killed him, and a medical examiner will have to determine the cause of death.

Source

[jamhar]

This article suggests that the younger brother may have indeed contributed to the older one's death. http://boston.com/metrodesk/2013/04/21/new-details-wild-shootout-with-bomb-suspects-watertown-chief-believes-older-brother-was-killed-younger-brother-desperate-getaway/jaIyrXr8fSnf5Pu4xnRbvM/story.html Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Seems some conflicting info on that.

BOSTON (AP) — A doctor involved in treating the Boston Marathon bombing

suspect who died in a gunbattle with police says he had injuries head to

toe and all limbs intact when he arrived at the hospital.

Dr. David Schoenfeld said 26-year-old Tamerlan Tsarnaev was unconscious

and had so many penetrating wounds when he arrived at Beth Israel

Deaconess Medical Center early Friday that it isn’t clear which ones

killed him, and a medical examiner will have to determine the cause of

death.

Source

I read an officers account of the action where he said that the younger brother looked like he deliberately tried to run over the officers trying to subdue the older brother that was lying in the street. The officers were able to jump out of the way at the last moment, but the vehicle ran over the older brothers body and dragged it some 30 feet before the body came to rest. I see that as attempted murder, several counts.

[Jingthing]

Chechen leaders have made it clear they have no beef with the USA, only with Russia. They're obviously afraid of the U.S. now getting involved in their conflict. They better be glad George W. Bush isn't still in office!

As far as charges and proof of guilt for the bombings, that is no problem. They even have a witness (the SUV driver) saying they both freely confessed to him.

[jamhar]

Any major religion you care to mention will have incidents in their history of the mass murder of innocent civilians. Communists/atheists can also be included, just have a look at the recent history of the homeland area of the Boston bombers; Chechnya, Dagestan, Ingushetia have all seen brutal massacres of civilians.

Re shrapnel bombs or nail bombs, they are hardly the preserve of jihadists. For instance the US Weathermen were keen users of such devices, as were both Loyalists and Republicans in Ulster, a right wing nut job in London also used nail bombs. Henry Shrapnel was a Napoleonic British Army officer who invented shrapnel shells and the concept continues to this day in military use, albeit using flèchettes or ball bearings rather than nails and bolts.

Even Bill Mayer is calling that apologist line Liberal Bull***t

http://dailycaller.com/2013/04/20/bill-maher-violence-islam-christianity-liberal-bullshit/#ixzz2R2St5c22

“You’re wrong about that and you’re wrong about your facts,” Maher said. “Now, obviously, most Muslim people are not terrorists. But ask most Muslim people in the world, if you insult the prophet, do you have what’s coming to you? It’s more than just a fringe element.”

If Mahar is calling "Liberal Bullsh*t", its probably liberal bullsh*t.

I started on this journey here in this TV topic because i looked at the data and i did not like the direction my assessment was going towards. So I entered into the discussions in hopes of vetting my thoughts, and hopefully find a direction that seem more palatable. but I find myself even more uncertain

[ZhouZhou]

Chechen leaders have made it clear they have no beef with the USA, only with Russia. They're obviously afraid of the U.S. now getting involved in their conflict. They better be glad George W. Bush isn't still in office!

As far as charges and proof of guilt for the bombings, that is no problem. They even have a witness (the SUV driver) saying they both freely confessed to him.

I don't think they are afraid of the USA. why should they? They are simply not involved in that terror act. even FBI said the brothers acted alone.

has nothing to do with G.W. Bush.

[Jingthing]

Chechen leaders have made it clear they have no beef with the USA, only with Russia. They're obviously afraid of the U.S. now getting involved in their conflict. They better be glad George W. Bush isn't still in office!

As far as charges and proof of guilt for the bombings, that is no problem. They even have a witness (the SUV driver) saying they both freely confessed to him.

I don't think they are afraid of the USA. why should they? They are simply not involved in that terror act. even FBI said the brothers acted alone.

has nothing to do with G.W. Bush.

Study some recent history, mate, about how the USA attacked Iraq in retaliation for 9-1-1 when Iraq had nothing to do with that attack on the USA. Based on that the Chechen people are wise to aggressively take a stand that there was no linkage with them in this case.

Edited April 22, 2013 by Jingthing

[Scott]

Troll posts and replies have been deleted.

[Pakboong]

We may have just witnessed the best and worst of America. The pulling together to get the injured help and the suspects apprehended was great. The police state look was not so great. I have read that it cost $33 million over the two days of the search. We had people locked in their homes and the likely outcome that somebody innocent would get shot all to catch a 19 year old on foot. We don't need that kind of a reaction.

Yeah 3 were murdered and many more wounded but; the crashing of the gold and silver markets that happened on the same day could ultimately kill a 100,000,000 around the world. We as Americans do have to keep things in perspective. We can just trash the Constitution whenever it pleases us. The bill for that will be unpayable.

[Jingthing]

The lockdown made sense because there was cause to think the living perp still had a BOMB.

I think the long term upshot of this event is that American cities are going to start to get as many street cameras as London.

Edited April 22, 2013 by Jingthing

[ZhouZhou]

The lockdown made sense because there was cause to think the living perp still had a BOMB.

I think it was for the safety of the people so they don't get bombed. but also that the police can work and are not disturbed by onlookers or even worse by vigilantes going on "hunt".