Thailand Takes The Rap In U S Fake Goods Review

[IAMSOBAD]

What about the fake government and fake search for overseas people convicted of crimes and fake police and fake newspaper reporting and the list goes on.

Sent from Me to You.

[kblaze]

You're not serious right? You don't understand the economic division between a rich mans goods and a poor mans goods. That's the whole principle behind luxury goods. It's purely a status symbol and unfortunately we live in a world where we don't want to be perceived as the 'poor man', so people who can't afford the real deal want to at least appear to be of 'similar class'. This is a product of society, if there wasn't such a huge gap between classes, then this type of thing wouldn't exist. So there IS a reason/need for counterfeit goods, because society dictates it.

I also agree that copies don't devalue the original brand, otherwise chanel, LV bags etc would be worthless, but they aren't, hold re-sale value very well, even with copies of high quality around. So it's a mute point.

The whole argument on copies is that it takes profit away from the companies that produce the originals, which is rubbish. 99% of the people buying the copies would never buy or afford the original, so there is no loss of profit for them.

Same goes with music, DVDs etc, where they have made millions, if not 100's of millions from cinema releases and then charge ridiculous prices for a DVD/Blueray.

Drugs and products are very different things. One only gives you the appearance of having something that has some inflated value, the other can kill you. Don't compare them.

"Society dictates it" - What a cop-out.

I guess by "society" you are referring to people who will pay for copied/fake/imitation products.

I guess people who direct movies, design bags, produce music, create new shirts styles, develop and test new drugs, etc, etc, as well as the millions who buy their "real" (not copied) products are not part of society too.

You have zero business acumen if you believe that copies/fakes have no effect on the profits of the company who created the original product.

For example, a colleague of mine tells me she only buys Coach bags when she goes to Europe (for the tax savings) and that she would never buy and bring back a LV because everyone would think it was fake. Apparently there are less fake Coach bags.

There are many products here that Thais won't buy because people might think it is fake.

[kblaze]

The greed of copy rights are the result of fake goods. Most designers have their product in the cheap producing countries to increase their profits, and never pass this saving down to the customer. Having witnessed the quality of some of the fake products; there is not a lot of difference. I have a fake tag watch, which was custom built, buy a small watch maker in Thailand; it is dive proof tried and tested; it has kept perfect time and now in it's 12th year, the only thing it needs is a battery like all watches. I know a guy who has deliveries of trainers every week from China; they sell like hot cakes. The current demand of kids wanting designer brands and the state of the global economy, no wonder there is a huge demand for fake goods. Obviously I feel sorry for the poor old designer, as he drives by in his roller on his way to his motor cruiser, and not let us for get the good old Government, they lose out big time "VAT and company tax" but wait a minute our Government's give big concessions to companies to limit their tax liabilities - so why should the public pay.

"the greed of copyrights are the result of fake goods"

Wait, how does greed come from fake goods?

Now Mr. Brit I believe you meant to say;

"fake goods are a result of the greed of copyrights"

Now let me tell you how dumb that statement is.

You see these evil "copyrights" are what people who invent things want. You see when you invent something cool and want to be paid for your work and you want people to know your cool thing came from YOU, you seek a copyright. A copyright says its illegal for people to use your thing to make money (if they don't ask/pay you first).

Sooo...if we have less copyrights, people are less likely to want to invent cool stuff, because it will be just copied and they won't make as much money.

make sense now?

[BradinAsia]

What about the fake government and fake search for overseas people convicted of crimes and fake police and fake newspaper reporting and the list goes on.

Sent from Me to You.

I assume your talking about my country... but can't disagree.

[kblaze]

People selling knockoffs, fakes, or copies need to make a living too. The creaters of the original products are still making boat-loads of money.

Many people can't afford to purchase the real thing.....it's okay to offer a cheaper version. Knockoffs, fakes, copies...........whatever you want to call it allow low-income people to enjoy what upper class people can easily get.

Please remove the "half American, half amazing" thing. You are an embarrasment to Americans.

Doontp;

What if you created a T-shirt company called "Ed Cardy" where you drew pictures (each picture took 5 hours to draw) and printed them on high quality cotton that you have specially created, then sold them at 50 dollars each (lets say it cost about 20 dollars to make each shirt).

Your shirts became hugely popular as people like your drawings and high quality cotton. You expand your factory and start pumping out shirts as orders from other countries come in.

You then begin noticing your shirt designs and even your name "Ed Cardy" being sold at markets around Bangkok for 200 baht (6$). You feel the shirt and notice that the cotton is shit-quality. You watch as the shop selling the shirt with your business name "Ed Cardy" and your exact drawing that you spent 5 hours on take 200 baht from a customer.

Now, be honest, would you look at that shop, smile, and say "Im so happy these poor people get to buy a shirt that has my name, uses my drawing that I spent hours doing, and is made from cotton that is of much poorer quality. Im happy these copies of my shirt will flood the market, and Im happy that when people think about "Ed Cardy", they think about a 200 bt shirt that they can get at a Thai market."

[Billy The Kid]

I buys 30 T-Sirt every trip, 150 bt for each T-shirt but the cost will be the same back home now due to the strong baht, so i wont be bothering to buy them anymore.

[dominique355]

People selling knockoffs, fakes, or copies need to make a living too. The creaters of the original products are still making boat-loads of money.

Many people can't afford to purchase the real thing.....it's okay to offer a cheaper version. Knockoffs, fakes, copies...........whatever you want to call it allow low-income people to enjoy what upper class people can easily get.

Some really strange arguments you got there. With this train of thoughts you should ban locks on all house doors to make it easier for theives to clean out your house. Very clever indeed. Every Thai farmer should have a Rolex and a his wife a Dior bag, genuine of course, or made by the Thai government after inflicting a compulsory licence on the watchmakers and fashionmakers so that their products can be officially copied here in Thailand.

Just think of the long term effects of such thinking.

[doontp]

People selling knockoffs, fakes, or copies need to make a living too. The creaters of the original products are still making boat-loads of money.

Many people can't afford to purchase the real thing.....it's okay to offer a cheaper version. Knockoffs, fakes, copies...........whatever you want to call it allow low-income people to enjoy what upper class people can easily get.

Please remove the "half American, half amazing" thing. You are an embarrasment to Americans.

Doontp;

What if you created a T-shirt company called "Ed Cardy" where you drew pictures (each picture took 5 hours to draw) and printed them on high quality cotton that you have specially created, then sold them at 50 dollars each (lets say it cost about 20 dollars to make each shirt).

Your shirts became hugely popular as people like your drawings and high quality cotton. You expand your factory and start pumping out shirts as orders from other countries come in.

You then begin noticing your shirt designs and even your name "Ed Cardy" being sold at markets around Bangkok for 200 baht (6$). You feel the shirt and notice that the cotton is shit-quality. You watch as the shop selling the shirt with your business name "Ed Cardy" and your exact drawing that you spent 5 hours on take 200 baht from a customer.

Now, be honest, would you look at that shop, smile, and say "Im so happy these poor people get to buy a shirt that has my name, uses my drawing that I spent hours doing, and is made from cotton that is of much poorer quality. Im happy these copies of my shirt will flood the market, and Im happy that when people think about "Ed Cardy", they think about a 200 bt shirt that they can get at a Thai market."

I respect peoples' opinions even if they differ from mine, but you lost me with the personal attack.

Maybe later I'll take time and read your point of view. Perhaps I'll agree with it or not.

Edited May 2, 2013 by metisdead
30) Do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes, added emoticons, or altered wording.

[Bob12345]

You're not serious right? You don't understand the economic division between a rich mans goods and a poor mans goods. That's the whole principle behind luxury goods. It's purely a status symbol and unfortunately we live in a world where we don't want to be perceived as the 'poor man', so people who can't afford the real deal want to at least appear to be of 'similar class'. This is a product of society, if there wasn't such a huge gap between classes, then this type of thing wouldn't exist. So there IS a reason/need for counterfeit goods, because society dictates it.

...

I don't think that the insecurity people feel because they cannot effort everything they would like means there is a NEED for counterfeit goods (there is a demand for it, but is it also a need???). And it is very weak to blame something like that on "society" since there are billions of people in this world who are not ashamed of not having the most expensive brand products. So how can society dictate this so clearly in your view?

And do you really think people buy counterfeit goods to "appear to be of similar class (as upper class people)"? Because everybody who owns a real LV bag can spot a fake from a mile away, while most people who have never owned one have no clue how to distinguish between a real and a fake one. And I can tell you that most people will respect you less in case you wear fake goods because it makes you look fake as a person and as a person who only cares about brand names and not the content. Same goes with watches or other expensive brand items.

Counterfeit goods are therefore mostly used to "appear of a higher class than the people around you". It is about people deceiving others by faking their wealth for their own personal gain (to get respect, admiration, or status).

[Gnasher328]

People selling knockoffs, fakes, or copies need to make a living too. The creaters of the original products are still making boat-loads of money.

Many people can't afford to purchase the real thing.....it's okay to offer a cheaper version. Knockoffs, fakes, copies...........whatever you want to call it allow low-income people to enjoy what upper class people can easily get.

That is a rather unique view.

Using that logic, the jetski mafias need to make a living, too, as do the drug dealers on Soi 0.

I can't afford a Ferrari, so I doubt I will ever get to "enjoy what upper class people can easily get," but you know, I'm OK with that.

You could always buy a 'kit car'. I took my Ferrari to a Kcar show and someone said 'wow, that's a nice one, what engine does it use, a Rover V8?'.

Back to the knockoffs, I was told a good proportion, especially clothes simply come out of the back door of the factory after a midnight run.

[Bob12345]

I have a fake tag watch, which was custom built, buy a small watch maker in Thailand; it is dive proof tried and tested; it has kept perfect time and now in it's 12th year, the only thing it needs is a battery like all watches.

What a waste that you have a custom build watch and then disgrace it by making it a fake tag. I would have respected you a lot more if you were not so insecure that you needed a brand name on there to boost your self-confidence. I guess you would have scored a lot better in any society by having an interesting story how you got the watch and why you are proud of it. People like genuine stories and feelings, they normally dislike fake people who try to pretend to own a real tag watch.

Obviously I feel sorry for the poor old designer, as he drives by in his roller on his way to his motor cruiser, and not let us for get the good old Government, they lose out big time "VAT and company tax" but wait a minute our Government's give big concessions to companies to limit their tax liabilities - so why should the public pay.

Strange reasoning. So because someone is successful or rich means you have the right to try to take it from them in any way possible?

I guess you own a house, while many people in Africa cannot effort that. Does that mean they can rob you if they like and then post sarcastically "i feel sorry for him walking back to his big house in a country where he pays tax and gets a lot back from his government for it"?

Or goes your reasoning only one way (the way where you profit and others pay the price)?

[OzMick]

The volume of copyrighted material available on the torrent sites (I prefer kickass) is incredible. As I can transfer to my DVD player with a memory stick, who needs to buy dubious quality pirated DVDs?

They are very god quality, and offer both english and thai soundtracks. Not so on Torrent files.

Sorry if I'm affecting business, but there are many, many dodgy versions for sale, and you don't know until you get home. Torrent sites usualy offer a comment facility, and poor downloads are easily avoided.

BTW it seems there is no word in Thai equivalent to "refund" and "I want my money back" is a disgusting insult.

.. seems to me your using Laverda with our there approval, " is this a case of the pot calling the kettle black", just noticing not blind ..

Am I trying to sell you a cheap motorcycle with a Laverda badge? As a long term customer of their quality products, (including a range of stickers, badges and cloth patches) I feel that there is little chance that there will be a complaint that I continue to show my loyalty.

[melrocks50]

Only losers buy counterfeit products. If you can't afford it, tough luck. Stop lying to yourself.

[doontp]

People selling knockoffs, fakes, or copies need to make a living too. The creaters of the original products are still making boat-loads of money.

Many people can't afford to purchase the real thing.....it's okay to offer a cheaper version. Knockoffs, fakes, copies...........whatever you want to call it allow low-income people to enjoy what upper class people can easily get.

Please remove the "half American, half amazing" thing. You are an embarrasment to Americans.

Doontp;

What if you created a T-shirt company called "Ed Cardy" where you drew pictures (each picture took 5 hours to draw) and printed them on high quality cotton that you have specially created, then sold them at 50 dollars each (lets say it cost about 20 dollars to make each shirt).

Your shirts became hugely popular as people like your drawings and high quality cotton. You expand your factory and start pumping out shirts as orders from other countries come in.

You then begin noticing your shirt designs and even your name "Ed Cardy" being sold at markets around Bangkok for 200 baht (6$). You feel the shirt and notice that the cotton is shit-quality. You watch as the shop selling the shirt with your business name "Ed Cardy" and your exact drawing that you spent 5 hours on take 200 baht from a customer.

Now, be honest, would you look at that shop, smile, and say "Im so happy these poor people get to buy a shirt that has my name, uses my drawing that I spent hours doing, and is made from cotton that is of much poorer quality. Im happy these copies of my shirt will flood the market, and Im happy that when people think about "Ed Cardy", they think about a 200 bt shirt that they can get at a Thai market."

I respect peoples' opinions even if they differ from mine, but you lost me with the personal attack.

Maybe later I'll take time and read your point of view. Perhaps I'll agree with it or not.

Okay....I read your point of view and I get it.

I owned a business in America for 10 yrs and other people illegally copied and provided my service and products. It didn’t bother me one bit because I was making a damn good living……enough for me to now comfortably live and work in LOS as an English teacher.

Next time...stick to your opinions and do away with the personal attacks. I'm proud to be American and Thai and there is absolutely no one ashamed of me. Good luck with yourself.

[Billy The Kid]

Only losers buy counterfeit products. If you can't afford it, tough luck. Stop lying to yourself.

I dont mind to be a loser with more money in my pockets,,,,lol

[kblaze]

People selling knockoffs, fakes, or copies need to make a living too. The creaters of the original products are still making boat-loads of money.

Many people can't afford to purchase the real thing.....it's okay to offer a cheaper version. Knockoffs, fakes, copies...........whatever you want to call it allow low-income people to enjoy what upper class people can easily get.

Please remove the "half American, half amazing" thing. You are an embarrasment to Americans.

Doontp;

What if you created a T-shirt company called "Ed Cardy" where you drew pictures (each picture took 5 hours to draw) and printed them on high quality cotton that you have specially created, then sold them at 50 dollars each (lets say it cost about 20 dollars to make each shirt).

Your shirts became hugely popular as people like your drawings and high quality cotton. You expand your factory and start pumping out shirts as orders from other countries come in.

You then begin noticing your shirt designs and even your name "Ed Cardy" being sold at markets around Bangkok for 200 baht (6$). You feel the shirt and notice that the cotton is shit-quality. You watch as the shop selling the shirt with your business name "Ed Cardy" and your exact drawing that you spent 5 hours on take 200 baht from a customer.

Now, be honest, would you look at that shop, smile, and say "Im so happy these poor people get to buy a shirt that has my name, uses my drawing that I spent hours doing, and is made from cotton that is of much poorer quality. Im happy these copies of my shirt will flood the market, and Im happy that when people think about "Ed Cardy", they think about a 200 bt shirt that they can get at a Thai market."

I respect peoples' opinions even if they differ from mine, but you lost me with the personal attack.

Maybe later I'll take time and read your point of view. Perhaps I'll agree with it or not.

You really should, maybe you will learn about how business works.

edit: Glad you read my post. Now please tell me what business you were in? I would like to know what kind of business lets people copy and use their "service and products".

Edited May 2, 2013 by kblaze

[doontp]

From a previous post:

Its quite a accomplishment to know what profits the Rolex
corporation makes since they do not report or publish their results; its a
private company, and for your information, they donate a large part of their
profits to charities. But I do agree that they probably make some serious
profits, but what kind of argument is that for allowing fakes? What if you
would be the owner of the company or you had a private business, would you also
allow others to copy your stuff just because you make a profit?

Do a google search on Rolex…..they are worth close to $5b…..

The argument for allowing fakes is that they don’t put these large corporations out of business. These corps are still making a lot of money. Civil court awards are based on what damages are done and not on what laws are broken. These millionaire corps must prove that counterfeiters are putting them out of business versus not making as many millions as they would withoutcounterfeiters.

I owned a company, I cared less about others copying my product, because I was making a good living. Spread the joy. On the other hand, I would have had a problem if they put me out of business. Note: My definition of a good living is quite different than most. I’m not greedy. Many rich people do not want to
see poor people better their lives. The rich want the poor to stay down, beause the rich can’t be rich without poor people.

[kblaze]

doontp, on 02 May 2013 - 16:10, said:

From a previous post:

Its quite a accomplishment to know what profits the Rolex

corporation makes since they do not report or publish their results; its a

private company, and for your information, they donate a large part of their

profits to charities. But I do agree that they probably make some serious

profits, but what kind of argument is that for allowing fakes? What if you

would be the owner of the company or you had a private business, would you also

allow others to copy your stuff just because you make a profit?

Do a google search on Rolex…..they are worth close to $5b…..

The argument for allowing fakes is that they don’t put these large corporations out of business. These corps are still making a lot of money. Civil court awards are based on what damages are done and not on what laws are broken. These millionaire corps must prove that counterfeiters are putting them out of business versus not making as many millions as they would withoutcounterfeiters.

I owned a company, I cared less about others copying my product, because I was making a good living. Spread the joy. On the other hand, I would have had a problem if they put me out of business. Note: My definition of a good living is quite different than most. I’m not greedy. Many rich people do not want to

see poor people better their lives. The rich want the poor to stay down, beause the rich can’t be rich without poor people.

LOL...you continue to astonish me..

*personal attack removed

I still want to know what kind of business you were in. One piece of advice; the 5 billion dollar figure you googled for Rolex is not profits or revenue, it is their "brand value". Companies can have positive brand value and negative profits.

Edited May 2, 2013 by kblaze

[Bob12345]

From a previous post:

Its quite a accomplishment to know what profits the Rolex

corporation makes since they do not report or publish their results; its a

private company, and for your information, they donate a large part of their

profits to charities. But I do agree that they probably make some serious

profits, but what kind of argument is that for allowing fakes? What if you

would be the owner of the company or you had a private business, would you also

allow others to copy your stuff just because you make a profit?

Do a google search on Rolex…..they are worth close to $5b…..

The argument for allowing fakes is that they don’t put these large corporations out of business. These corps are still making a lot of money. Civil court awards are based on what damages are done and not on what laws are broken. These millionaire corps must prove that counterfeiters are putting them out of business versus not making as many millions as they would withoutcounterfeiters.

I owned a company, I cared less about others copying my product, because I was making a good living. Spread the joy. On the other hand, I would have had a problem if they put me out of business. Note: My definition of a good living is quite different than most. I’m not greedy. Many rich people do not want to

see poor people better their lives. The rich want the poor to stay down, beause the rich can’t be rich without poor people.

I can do a lot of searches on google, but that does not make worth the same as profit.

And it is nice of you to not stop counterfeiters since you made a good living anyways. Unfortunately it is rather hard to appose this standard on the rest of the world, since what is a good living? And you would not allow it if you didn't make a good living? You only spread the joy after you have taken care of yourself to a soft-standard?

[kimbathewhitelion]

So very true, the 3 worst countries for pirating. But, I'd rather torrent than pay those greedy corporations for way overpriced goods. No doubt in question, corporations run America with the politicians as their immediately to be Rich, puppets.

[Locationthailand]

I thought this was a classic comment...

"... The somewhat toothless committee, it has no powers but makes a lot of noise, makes annual waves as it reviews production of fake goods in many industries such as software, clothing, movies and fashion accessories, overlooking the fact that its own nations form a large portion of the population that continues to support the cloned market."

[rubl]

I missed something, too busy sorry. Does all this mean Thailand is still on various black / grey lists after all the special effort government ministers and other officials put into profiling Thailand as a nice country?

[melrocks50]

Only losers buy counterfeit products. If you can't afford it, tough luck. Stop lying to yourself.

I dont mind to be a loser with more money in my pockets,,,,lol

An inconsiderate and selfish loser though, I must say.

[kimamey]

That Rolex picture up top is 1 of the worst examples I have ever seen, whoever wears that rubbish will look a total pratt and have a green wrist to boot. I fail to see how copied Rolex watches effect the real market, totally different customers, people who want quality and will pay for it versus tasteless chavs.

Well I suppose the guy mentioned in post #5 might be concerned.

To those who say what difference does it make as the people who buy the fakes can't afford the real ones. Ask yourself why don't they just sell watches and clothes ect. without the fancy names?

[kimamey]

I missed something, too busy sorry. Does all this mean Thailand is still on various black / grey lists after all the special effort government ministers and other officials put into profiling Thailand as a nice country?

No I don't understand it either after all the assurances and crackdowns that we've seen. All fake of course.

[MyFriend You]

Fake goods, organised crime control this market. They have even found fake military aircraft parts. Just think of this next time you fly. It effects all of society!

Taiwan is the largest developer of counterfeit military aircraft parts, they have bought our aircraft, but develop their own parts for them, then sell them overseas at premium prices.

[jimbeam1]

People selling knockoffs, fakes, or copies need to make a living too. The creaters of the original products are still making boat-loads of money.

Many people can't afford to purchase the real thing.....it's okay to offer a cheaper version. Knockoffs, fakes, copies...........whatever you want to call it allow low-income people to enjoy what upper class people can easily get.

That is a rather unique view.

Using that logic, the jetski mafias need to make a living, too, as do the drug dealers on Soi 0.

I can't afford a Ferrari, so I doubt I will ever get to "enjoy what upper class people can easily get," but you know, I'm OK with that.

You can always buy a replica Ferrari.

jb1

[belg]

just my 2 satang

we pay a lot for true tv and we get series that are 1,2,3,4,5 years old ....

[bkkbwb]

The volume of copyrighted material available on the torrent sites (I prefer kickass) is incredible. As I can transfer to my DVD player with a memory stick, who needs to buy dubious quality pirated DVDs?

I await the Thai government to block torrents on the basis that it is putting fake DVD sellers out of business.

Very few of the copied DVD's you will find on street are from torrents. There aren't many torrent sites or files around that cater to Thai language content, and from my experience, and speaking to Thai friends, their use of torrents isn't nearly as common as in the west.

Edited May 2, 2013 by bkkbwb

[doontp]

You're not serious right? You don't understand the economic division between a rich mans goods and a poor mans goods. That's the whole principle behind luxury goods. It's purely a status symbol and unfortunately we live in a world where we don't want to be perceived as the 'poor man', so people who can't afford the real deal want to at least appear to be of 'similar class'. This is a product of society, if there wasn't such a huge gap between classes, then this type of thing wouldn't exist. So there IS a reason/need for counterfeit goods, because society dictates it.

I also agree that copies don't devalue the original brand, otherwise chanel, LV bags etc would be worthless, but they aren't, hold re-sale value very well, even with copies of high quality around. So it's a mute point.

The whole argument on copies is that it takes profit away from the companies that produce the originals, which is rubbish. 99% of the people buying the copies would never buy or afford the original, so there is no loss of profit for them.

Same goes with music, DVDs etc, where they have made millions, if not 100's of millions from cinema releases and then charge ridiculous prices for a DVD/Blueray.

Drugs and products are very different things. One only gives you the appearance of having something that has some inflated value, the other can kill you. Don't compare them.

"Society dictates it" - What a cop-out.

I guess by "society" you are referring to people who will pay for copied/fake/imitation products.

I guess people who direct movies, design bags, produce music, create new shirts styles, develop and test new drugs, etc, etc, as well as the millions who buy their "real" (not copied) products are not part of society too.

You have zero business acumen if you believe that copies/fakes have no effect on the profits of the company who created the original product.

For example, a colleague of mine tells me she only buys Coach bags when she goes to Europe (for the tax savings) and that she would never buy and bring back a LV because everyone would think it was fake. Apparently there are less fake Coach bags.

There are many products here that Thais won't buy because people might think it is fake.

LV corp is not hurting. They're worth a few billion.

The gap between the rich and poor is too great.