Floating lanterns a threat to aviation in Northern Thailand

[webfact]

Floating lanterns a threat to aviation



LAMPANG: -- Lampang airport today reported that more than 100 floating lanterns have fallen onto its runway during the past two days when people celebrated the Loy Krathong festival with the launch of thousands of floating lanterns into the sky.

Acting chief of the airport Mrs Tanasra Singhakul said that airport workers have collected more than 123 remnants of the floating lantersn which fell on a 2-kilometer stretch of the runway.

She said in just a single day on Sunday, more than 100 floating lanterns fell on the runway ground.

She also expected more floating lanterns to fall on the runway in the last day of the Loy Krathong festival last night.

Meanwhile Chiang Mai international airport also reported more than 900 floating lanterns falling on the runway ground Sunday night.
It was believed that the wind blew the floating lanterns to fall on the airport compound.

The airport has special teams to collect the falling lanterns immediately to prevent them from affecting landing and take-off and has also sought cooperation from all airlines to put off landing or take-off.

Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/floating-lantern-threat-aviation/

-- Thai PBS 2013-11-19

[KRaymond]

It was believed that the wind blew the floating lanterns to fall on the airport compound.

Now I know how these things go floating around. Mystery solved!!

[Lobo4819]

The revelation that it was the wind was probably a great relief to the many who thought that evil spirits put them there.

It was believed that the wind blew the floating lanterns to fall on the airport compound.

Now I know how these things go floating around. Mystery solved!!

[wooloomooloo]

On a serious note, I'd hate to see a Chinese Lantern bring an airliner down. It could obviously quite easily happen.

[tjhorner]

On a serious note, I'd hate to see a Chinese Lantern bring an airliner down. It could obviously quite easily happen.

Yeah, I don't see it really happening. Even if ingested into a engine doubt it would cause any damage and most likely would go unnoticed....

Edit: Realized some are made with metal frame, although still not certain it could bring down a plane, but the metal frame could cause damage if ingested through a turbine.

Edited November 19, 2013 by tjhorner

[carvets]

Around coastal areas like Phuket , depending on the wind, they can be blown out to sea and become a hazard for marine life. I always see these things go up and they look great at night , but never used to spend a thought for where they land.

[bigbamboo]

Anyone know how high these lanterns can go?

[bushman1666]

One of these lanterns caused a huge blaze at a plastics recycling plant in England a few months ago. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/10151959/Smethwick-blaze-caused-by-Chinese-lantern-could-burn-for-days.html

[chrissables]

On a serious note, I'd hate to see a Chinese Lantern bring an airliner down. It could obviously quite easily happen.

Please explain how?

[chrissables]

Around coastal areas like Phuket , depending on the wind, they can be blown out to sea and become a hazard for marine life. I always see these things go up and they look great at night , but never used to spend a thought for where they land.

A hazard to marine life? How?

[Chalard]

Anyone know how high these lanterns can go?

More than a kilometre. Depends on how long the candle burns for?

[wooloomooloo]

On a serious note, I'd hate to see a Chinese Lantern bring an airliner down. It could obviously quite easily happen.

Please explain how?

A bird can bring down a plane. A Chinese Lantern could have the same effect. It's alight and it can be made of a metal wire structure.

In the right circumstances it could easily end in catastrophe.

[LawrenceN]

Anyone know how high these lanterns can go?

I'm not an expert, but I had the same question, so watched closely at a big (thousands) gathering Saturday night north of Chiang Mai. I know they didn't go higher than 1000 meters, and no farther than about two kilometers. I watched as they reached a drop-off point about two km from the launch point. You could see them burning a little less brightly, and beginning to descend all close to the same point. I was watching from a vantage point perpendicular to the lanterns' line of travel, so not fooled by watching them float directly away from me.

The implication is that, with some coordination, maybe radio announcements, it wouldn't be that hard to keep them away from flight paths and airports. Of course there would be no enforcement, because the cops are busy with crowd control, so it would be a matter of getting the public's cooperation. Maybe the village headmen, with their PA systems that blast the national anthem every morning, could be enlisted to announce to the public something like, "Hey, our area is downwind of the airport and flight paths, so please go to the other side of the airport, or five kilometers upwind, or wait until tomorrow." Yeah, I know, I'm dreaming. Did you laugh?

[Mosha]

Anyone know how high these lanterns can go?

More than a kilometre. Depends on how long the candle burns for?

That's nothing when you consider the claims for some of the Issan SAMs

[jackflash]

Last time I walked to the top of the Pattaya "mountain", I was surprised to see how many lanterns are tangled up in the thick foliage.

There must be millions of them across the country side.

Edited November 19, 2013 by jackflash

[evadgib]

One of these lanterns caused a huge blaze at a plastics recycling plant in England a few months ago. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/10151959/Smethwick-blaze-caused-by-Chinese-lantern-could-burn-for-days.html

I had no idea they traveled that far!

[evadgib]

On a serious note, I'd hate to see a Chinese Lantern bring an airliner down. It could obviously quite easily happen.

The main launch sites on Samui are directly under the flight path each end of the runway!

Edited November 19, 2013 by evadgib

[wooloomooloo]

On a serious note, I'd hate to see a Chinese Lantern bring an airliner down. It could obviously quite easily happen.

The main launch sites on Samui are directly under the flight path each end of the runway!

I really don't want to be a passenger, either landing or taking off, with lanterns floating about.

[MaxYakov]

On a serious note, I'd hate to see a Chinese Lantern bring an airliner down. It could obviously quite easily happen.

Yeah, I don't see it really happening. Even if ingested into a engine doubt it would cause any damage and most likely would go unnoticed....

Edit: Realized some are made with metal frame, although still not certain it could bring down a plane, but the metal frame could cause damage if ingested through a turbine.

Regardless of what you think or believe, according to the article:

The airport has special teams to collect the falling lanterns immediately to prevent them from affecting landing and take-off and has also sought cooperation from all airlines to put off landing or take-off.

They are probably increasing costs as well as potentially interfering with flight schedules. I wonder what would happen if the airport ceased operations until the lantern falls stopped.

[peterpop]

On a serious note, I'd hate to see a Chinese Lantern bring an airliner down. It could obviously quite easily happen.

Actually, and as an ex transport pilot, I doubt very much that a modern jet engine would be put out of action by the ingestion of one of these lanterns. If you witnessed the testing of the robustness of turbofan engines, which includes deliberate firing of large dead birds into the intake when at normal operating speeds and altitudes.

Nonetheless the fare paying public, not privy to this information, will be reasonably somewhat disturbed.

[khaosai]

Came close to a lantern departing Hong Kong a few years back. Watched as it passed down the left side of the aircraft at an altitude of around 500 feet.

Would it cause some engine problems. I honestly don't know, but would rather be informed about these things so could delay departure until the potential threat had passed.

[evadgib]

On a serious note, I'd hate to see a Chinese Lantern bring an airliner down. It could obviously quite easily happen.

Actually, and as an ex transport pilot, I doubt very much that a modern jet engine would be put out of action by the ingestion of one of these lanterns. If you witnessed the testing of the robustness of turbofan engines, which includes deliberate firing of large dead birds into the intake when at normal operating speeds and altitudes.

Nonetheless the fare paying public, not privy to this information, will be reasonably somewhat disturbed.

- Bird strikes are accidental & none are on fire at the time.

- Wouldn't it be better to have either a 'no fly' or 'below 10k feet' time of say 1800hrs until midnight during Loy Kratong?

Edited November 19, 2013 by evadgib

[davehowden]

Simple solution would be to stop all flights into and out of CNX during Loi Krathong, let the tourist use the train, oh no, wait a minute!

[jacko45k]

Well Loy Kratong is over.

I checked the news this morning and no reports of aircraft being brought down.

How about those micro-lites that buzz around over my house invading my privacy.

[eloigorri]

The regular lanterns are less of a threat to larger aircraft, than a bird strike, but as a pilot of small aircraft I am very wary flying during this period, not so much because of these smaller normal lanterns, but due to the much larger ones launched during the day from the temples. These are more like blimp barrage balloons often several meters in diameter and sturdier by far. Getting tangled with one of these close to the ground would be interesting to say the least.

http://www.demotix.com/photo/bulkuploadphoto-56189

Also agreed the Issan rockets pose a greater threat and no way to avoid them.

[hookedondhamma]

One of these lanterns caused a huge blaze at a plastics recycling plant in England a few months ago. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/10151959/Smethwick-blaze-caused-by-Chinese-lantern-could-burn-for-days.html

I had no idea they traveled that far!

lol good one :-D

[kamahele]

As a US Air jet was brought down by a flock of birds (thankfully no casualties as the aircraft landed in the river in NYC), I would say that it would be possible to at least damage an aircraft with one of these contraptions. I've seen the damage that just one bird can do when it hits the windshield. Now this is a flaming piece of metal attached to a large plastic bag. Not as solid as a sea gull but still a hazard.