Smoke, Smog, Dust 2014 Chiang Mai

[Mapguy]

PM<2.5 accounts for 40 - 60% of the PM<10 pollution. Research posted last year that was done in Thailand found that agricultural burning accounted for more than the average found in general research. That, of course, means we get a worse dose of microparticles than more "balanced" environments.

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[naboo]

Today, 10:00, worst of the year. My estimate based on comparison of visibility to previous years is that it was about 250+. Don't trust the readings after seeing the photo of them being hosed down.

[TimFrance]

Interesting to note that when Paris got to a PM10 of 150 during the past week, an automatic car ban (every other day for each vehicle) came into force so the PM10 will be reduced.

What a contrast: When it gets to a PM10 of 300 in CM, they put up another downtown poster of Shinluck saying "Stop the burning" (in English). Worse than useless local government.

[Awk]

Today, 10:00, worst of the year. My estimate based on comparison of visibility to previous years is that it was about 250+. Don't trust the readings after seeing the photo of them being hosed down.

You are not the first to mention that I think, but was there anyone with any knowledge who came forward and said there was something sinister behind that?

Surly somebody with the power to order something like that would find it much easier and more safe to just let the equipment "malfunction" during the desired period. Or just doctor the information they publish; if one can order somebody to stand outside and hose things down in order to fake things in a non-obvious way, considering they make the hourly average available, one can probably order somebody to change the published data also.

A simpler explanation would be that they were simply cleaning things.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Right. Also the data is consistent with observations. Not to mention that the data is actually #$)(*^ bad. This is not a phenomena you can just doctor and present all is rosy even if you wanted to. And if you did want to then you wouldn't push out PM-10 data of 200 (daily average).

So overall I think the record keeping is pretty good. In recent years they added lots more measuring stations which means we finally closed the discussion on it being a city problem as opposed to regional problem. And they switched to real-time (hourly) data as opposed to daily, that was also an improvement.

Next improvement hopefully is to add a PM2.5 count at more stations.

Interesting to note that when Paris got to a PM10 of 150 during the past week, an automatic car ban (every other day for each vehicle) came into force so the PM10 will be reduced.

What a contrast: When it gets to a PM10 of 300 in CM, they put up another downtown poster of Shinluck saying "Stop the burning" (in English). Worse than useless local government.

Right, except that the Asian regional haze is caused primarily by forest fires and agricultural burning. You could ban all cars and you wouldn't significantly dent the problem.

Death penalty for anyone starting any kind of fire in a forest sounds like a good path forward. And disowning land from anyone who sets a rice field fire. This in addition to making machinery freely available to plough rice fields over.

That still wouldn't solve the issue entirely because you don't control neighbouring countries, but at least that will likely cause some improvement, while setting the right example.

Edited March 19, 2014 by WinnieTheKhwai

[valdor]

Right. Also the data is consistent with observations. Not to mention that the data is actually #$)(*^ bad. This is not a phenomena you can just doctor and present all is rosy even if you wanted to. And if you did want to then you wouldn't push out PM-10 data of 200 (daily average).

So overall I think the record keeping is pretty good. In recent years they added lots more measuring stations which means we finally closed the discussion on it being a city problem as opposed to regional problem. And they switched to real-time (hourly) data as opposed to daily, that was also an improvement.

Next improvement hopefully is to add a PM2.5 count at more stations.

Interesting to note that when Paris got to a PM10 of 150 during the past week, an automatic car ban (every other day for each vehicle) came into force so the PM10 will be reduced.

What a contrast: When it gets to a PM10 of 300 in CM, they put up another downtown poster of Shinluck saying "Stop the burning" (in English). Worse than useless local government.

Right, except that the Asian regional haze is caused primarily by forest fires and agricultural burning. You could ban all cars and you wouldn't significantly dent the problem.

Death penalty for anyone starting any kind of fire in a forest sounds like a good path forward. And disowning land from anyone who sets a rice field fire. This in addition to making machinery freely available to plough rice fields over.

That still wouldn't solve the issue entirely because you don't control neighbouring countries, but at least that will likely cause some improvement, while setting the right example.

According to the US diplomatic cables, the Thai government actually records PM2.5 measurements in Chiang Mai but do not publish them.

https://www.wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/09CHIANGMAI38_a.html

I really don't get their logic...

[Awk]

I originally sent this to another member via private message today, but then thought it might be of more general interest to some other people here too.

-----

...

But I was too surprised (and disapointed) that the Filtrete did not improve things more. On the other hand I was also surprised the stock AC filter worked so well, as I assume it is only intended to protect the AC itself from dust and dirt in the air.

I wonder if the result would be different if I did the measurements again today. When I did the comparison between the same type of AC, but one with 3M's Filtrete, and one without, the pm2.5 readings on my DC1700 were around 3000-5000 for the outside air most of the time. I haden't done any readings outside at home for a while, but was a little shocked when I sampled the air outside this morning and got readings in the range up to 30,000, almost ten times what it was a month ago. It has never affected me personally much, but I was curious since the air had been smelling different the last couple of weeks. It would certainly warrant repeating the measurements again since the change in air quality is so enormous.

I btw did not include measurements for my Blueair 650E in the living room, as it showed very little improvement over the room with the AC and 3M. I initially thought this was due to the living room being huge, with no doors closing of the kitchen or the second floor, as well as huge ceilings and very poor isolation. Thus overwhelming the Blueair 650E. But after sampling the air this morning, I carried one unit down from the bedroom, and noticed the particle readings in the living room dropping to a fifth of what they were before (they were above 20,000 before). A fifth is still "very poor" according to Dylos' guidelines, but an obvious improvement, so no doubt carrying the unit down in the morning and up in the evening will now have to be part of the routine.

[rendos]

quick question, how is the air today? I found the live webcams site, looks ok. people not wearing masks walking passby the gate.

[Tywais]

quick question, how is the air today? I found the live webcams site, looks ok. people not wearing masks walking passby the gate.

From the aqmthai site.

Yupparaj school:

City Hall:

[Cheesekraft]

They sell some 3m P95 masks at the home improvement section of central department stores, wear those at all times outside. Grab some NAC to help your lungs deal with the poisonous air, and take vitamin C and if you can afford it acetylglutathione will help as well.

[scotinsiam]

Whats NAC?

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[rendos]

chiangmai will have to wait next time, I just cancelled my tickets. I hope the refund procedure with airasia goes well.

[Damoxemus]

Much like Newbie my wife and I are planning to come to Chiang Mai right after Songkran (April 16th). I was told that it might be smoggy but not too bad after Songkran, is this, historically speaking, correct? For those of you who have lived there for awhile does it indeed get better after the Holiday? Or is it just "when it rains, if it rains, then it';s not too bad"?

I have already booked tickets to and from there (2 weeks later), as we planned to meet family there. It's very expensive to change tickets for everyone at this point,so any info would be greaty appreciated.

ps -

is there anywhere to get good craft beer in CM?

[Tywais]

Much like Newbie my wife and I are planning to come to Chiang Mai right after Songkran (April 16th). I was told that it might be smoggy but not too bad after Songkran, is this, historically speaking, correct? For those of you who have lived there for awhile does it indeed get better after the Holiday? Or is it just "when it rains, if it rains, then it';s not too bad"?

I have already booked tickets to and from there (2 weeks later), as we planned to meet family there. It's very expensive to change tickets for everyone at this point,so any info would be greaty appreciated.

ps -

is there anywhere to get good craft beer in CM?

The norm is that it does get significantly better after Songkran and usually it will rain very near Songkran.

Craft beers, there is a CM sponsor on TV for does them. Not sure of specific locations where they are delivered.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/651359-the-bottle-shop-for-beers/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/644178-craft-beer-has-landed-in-chiang-mai/

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Much like Newbie my wife and I are planning to come to Chiang Mai right after Songkran (April 16th). I was told that it might be smoggy but not too bad after Songkran, is this, historically speaking, correct? For those of you who have lived there for awhile does it indeed get better after the Holiday? Or is it just "when it rains, if it rains, then it';s not too bad"?

I have already booked tickets to and from there (2 weeks later), as we planned to meet family there. It's very expensive to change tickets for everyone at this point,so any info would be greaty appreciated.

ps -

is there anywhere to get good craft beer in CM?

Yes, it typically clears by Songkran. (Or before). Doesn't really need regular rain though, for some reason it just clears.

That's when the real heat kicks in though.

[Chicog]

Much like Newbie my wife and I are planning to come to Chiang Mai right after Songkran (April 16th). I was told that it might be smoggy but not too bad after Songkran, is this, historically speaking, correct? For those of you who have lived there for awhile does it indeed get better after the Holiday? Or is it just "when it rains, if it rains, then it';s not too bad"?

I have already booked tickets to and from there (2 weeks later), as we planned to meet family there. It's very expensive to change tickets for everyone at this point,so any info would be greaty appreciated.

ps -

is there anywhere to get good craft beer in CM?

Yes, it typically clears by Songkran. (Or before). Doesn't really need regular rain though, for some reason it just clears.

That's when the real heat kicks in though.

It probably clears because everyone is on the lash instead of starting fires.

[MESmith]

A bit of wind late yesterday afternoon cleared the air & could see the mountains east of us. No such luck today

Edited March 20, 2014 by MESmith

[T_Dog]

I don't remember who was the first to recommend 3M Filtrete material on the yearly smoke thread, but a big Thank You to that person and all the others that provided information. Installed it on a powerful blower and on the AC unit here and it has made a world of difference on the air in the house in the last week. Apparently the air going through it creates an electrostatic charge that attracts those small 1 micron to 10 micron particles so it works as well as an electrostatic filter. No way is the geometry of that fabric fine enough to capture them without that effect. Here are some FAQs for those interested:

http://www.filtrete.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/FiltreteNA/Filtrete/Resources/FAQs/

[puukao]

This post will go nowhere, but I will try.

I have spent 2 "smoke seasons" in CM, so I have a clue about what you guys are going through now. I also think it would be nice if someone on the forum offered a "clean air" room/area for some period during the day. What I mean is to give an email address so TV members (maybe 10 at the most even read this post) could email for further directions so members without the ability to get rid of the smoke can get some reprieve. Who knows, maybe there is a member with a huge house, and has the ability to create "good" air. Could it save a life? well, i'm not sure about that, but might help some a lot.

i know, crazy idea.

[naboo]

PM10 at 300 early morning. Shaping up to be the worst day of the year.

[T_Dog]

PM10 at 300 early morning. Shaping up to be the worst day of the year.

naboo.... Which website are you getting that from? It is bad today for sure.

[Tywais]

PM10 at 300 early morning. Shaping up to be the worst day of the year.

naboo.... Which website are you getting that from? It is bad today for sure.

This is from aqmthai.com and shows 311 at 0800 this morning.

[Cheesekraft]

Whats NAC?

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N-Acetyl-L-Cysteine (NAC), a powerful antioxidant amino acid and a precursor to the critical antioxidant glutathione. Fights off free radicals especially from environemntal pollution. Glutathione exerts a variety of protective effects, including detoxification and intracellular defense against oxidative stress. Glutathione is the bodies natural antixodiant and it gets depleted under these conditions. It is useful for treating lung diseases and restoring lung health and lung function. Its great temporarily to help under these conditions. Vitamin C is also great and very cheap. I recommend Iherb for supplements in thailand, the supplements available here locally are absolute garbage and many times more expensive, this is what I use http://goo.gl/uF6VY6 and this is the kind of masks everyone should be wearing at all times while outside, available at central department stores: http://goo.gl/KcazNK (3M P95 particulate respirators), they fit under helmets.

Edited March 21, 2014 by Cheesekraft

[dave2]

re

Shaping up to be the worst day of the year

its not looking good

pic 1 .. 8 30 this morning

pic 2 .. last nights sunset !

dave2

[naboo]

PM10 at 300 early morning. Shaping up to be the worst day of the year.

naboo.... Which website are you getting that from? It is bad today for sure.

As Tywais said above.

www.aqmthai.com/public_report.php

[John Clarke]

Pai this morning.... the worst yet I have seen.... % (

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[T_Dog]

Interesting wiki leaks article valdor posted ( http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/692704-smoke-smog-dust-2014-chiang-mai/page-10#entry7580912 ) on the fact that the government knows how bad the PM-2.5 data is but doesn't want to disclose it. With a PM-10 reading of 311, I wonder what the PM-2.5 count is running? Yikes!

[Tywais]

Drove in to CMU on the canal road from Mae Hia and visibility was the worse I've seen this year at around 500-600 meters.

[mania]

Wow 11am already & still thick on ChangKlan

Ah well stay inside today I guess.

Btw: Samoeng was ablaze a couple days ago ( 3/17 ) during the day too.

Large areas & of course unattended. Be careful if on motorcycles

as the road is quite dusty too from ash etc.

Edited March 21, 2014 by mania

[T_Dog]

Very bad up here in Mae Taeng, as trees around 200 feet away are becoming obscured. This is the first day this smog season where the wind has not come up by this time of day to start providing some relief.