Thai PM calls for peaceful end to political crisis

[Maha Sarakham Marty]

today I asked a PAD friend of Anchalee Paireerak about the possibility of such a shut down, the answer: "there 's not a real plan for that, any move by the PDCR can change from day to day, the paralysing of Bangkok... not sure either"

[smutcakes]

well just go away along with rest of your evil clan hardly wanting peace when they put up all clan members as MP's in party list and stuff every important post with their own family members and cronies

I just hope whole rotten evil lot would sink into slime they came from

Wow, that was a really constructive and useful comment.

Let's see, Puea Thai won the last elections, meaning that most Thais still wanted this government.

Just because a minority who has lost elections for the past 23 years, well before Thaksin ever came to power, wants to overthrow an elected government, doesn't mean that the whole country has to follow it.

My suggestion, go to the polls if you want to change something. It's what grown ups in civilized countries do.

yes lets have another 4 years of this vile corrupt government who's only care is one mans megalomaniac desire to turn Thailand into his own one party dictatorship. When will people like you understand their is no democracy when elections are bought and when just because Taksin manages to buy most votes its fine to do whatever he wants irrespective of human rights. laws and anyone who dares oppose they better watch out or hell let loose again his red thugs.

Hitler was voted in so was Idi Amin and Poll pot and Mugabwie so I rest my case. Further ask 99% of thais how MP's are lected and they don't have a clue about party lists and anyway only care for next 500 baht.

Thank you ill take my chances with the inevitable coup and thank goodness theirs one body able to stop Taksin and his evil clan.

All peace needs is fork ne man to withdraw and take his clones and clan with him to exile wherever and at last Thailand would be rid of this curse and then many would be content with letting a new non Taksin government of whatever persuasion or colour have a chance. I also think although Abahist is by far IMO best PM he should withdraw to help heal wounds and Suphet. If that happened and Taksin went with rest then Thailand would have a chance.

As it is are you Naive enough to think an election is going to stop those totally opposed to Taksin who loathe and hate him. SO a coup for 2-3 years is best and most likely outcome which many would as before welcome.

You really think Thialand is anyway on par with Uk for instance in being able to have a proper free election. Well go back to your bubble world.

Supposing TS and his clan did retire, and lets just say 'Suthep' although it could be any of the old guard's parties are voted into power and a particular group, much like the current anti Government protesters take a dislike to this person for whatever reason and come out to 'claim' Bangkok like currently, what happens then?

Do you not think large scale protests (lets say 200K) resulting in the PM stepping down is a rather dangerous precedent to set? New party comes in, lets say Red Shirts dont like, then we have 500K protesters on the street? what then?The precedent has been set that this is what you need to do, how many people need to show up etc. Much the same way as the mass and prolonged demonstrations by the PAD set the guideline for the Red shirts to follow a few years later. It works for one party, so why not everyone else do the same thing.

[retsdon]

well just go away along with rest of your evil clan hardly wanting peace when they put up all clan members as MP's in party list and stuff every important post with their own family members and cronies

I just hope whole rotten evil lot would sink into slime they came from

Wow, that was a really constructive and useful comment.

Let's see, Puea Thai won the last elections, meaning that most Thais still wanted this government.

Just because a minority who has lost elections for the past 23 years, well before Thaksin ever came to power, wants to overthrow an elected government, doesn't mean that the whole country has to follow it.

My suggestion, go to the polls if you want to change something. It's what grown ups in civilized countries do.

yes lets have another 4 years of this vile corrupt government who's only care is one mans megalomaniac desire to turn Thailand into his own one party dictatorship. When will people like you understand their is no democracy when elections are bought and when just because Taksin manages to buy most votes its fine to do whatever he wants irrespective of human rights. laws and anyone who dares oppose they better watch out or hell let loose again his red thugs.

Hitler was voted in so was Idi Amin and Poll pot and Mugabwie so I rest my case. Further ask 99% of thais how MP's are lected and they don't have a clue about party lists and anyway only care for next 500 baht.

Thank you ill take my chances with the inevitable coup and thank goodness theirs one body able to stop Taksin and his evil clan.

All peace needs is fork ne man to withdraw and take his clones and clan with him to exile wherever and at last Thailand would be rid of this curse and then many would be content with letting a new non Taksin government of whatever persuasion or colour have a chance. I also think although Abahist is by far IMO best PM he should withdraw to help heal wounds and Suphet. If that happened and Taksin went with rest then Thailand would have a chance.

As it is are you Naive enough to think an election is going to stop those totally opposed to Taksin who loathe and hate him. SO a coup for 2-3 years is best and most likely outcome which many would as before welcome.

You really think Thialand is anyway on par with Uk for instance in being able to have a proper free election. Well go back to your bubble world.

Supposing TS and his clan did retire, and lets just say 'Suthep' although it could be any of the old guard's parties are voted into power and a particular group, much like the current anti Government protesters take a dislike to this person for whatever reason and come out to 'claim' Bangkok like currently, what happens then?

Do you not think large scale protests (lets say 200K) resulting in the PM stepping down is a rather dangerous precedent to set? New party comes in, lets say Red Shirts dont like, then we have 500K protesters on the street? what then?The precedent has been set that this is what you need to do, how many people need to show up etc. Much the same way as the mass and prolonged demonstrations by the PAD set the guideline for the Red shirts to follow a few years later. It works for one party, so why not everyone else do the same thing.

The precedent has already been set. Thailand is governed by the mob and has been since 2008. It always was a gangster country. Now it's a lawless gangster country.

[Siripon]

I think She is playing exactly the hand shes advised to, I also think that whatever people like to think about the Shins they are not stupid and are very well educated compared to a lot of the handmedown ammarts the contrast is striking.

Do you have an example of these less educated handmedown ammart to compare the Shins with?

In fact all 3 of Thaksin's children have had 'problems' with their education, either allegations of cheating or privilege

1.Oak- failed at Thammasart, moved to Ramkhamheang where he was found to be in possession of a piece of paper in his top pocket in the final exam.

2.Pinthongta- started at Kasetsart in a faculty that didn't require a university entrance exam score but then she switched to a faculty that does. She then failed the year and switched to another faculty- Political Science with a new ID number( I've never head of students being given a new ID number)

3.Paethongtan benefited from 'relaxed' rules to gain entry to a faculty at Chula

And of course there was the notorious case of the entrance exam papers being 'inspected' (leaked) the day before the exam.

So, I'm sorry Engliskoak( I do hope you haven't taken that name because of Thaksin's son, Oak ) if so I recommend changing it to a tree of high value in Thailand- payung (rosewood) , for in academic circles in Thailand the Shinawat family are not noted for academic excellence!

[boomerangutang]

I cringe when this idiot of a puppet uses the word "reconciliation". It's just another word for bringing big brother back. Doesn't matter how many votes you win, you're not there working for the people, you're just there to enrich your family and whitewash your brother's crimes.

Thailand is a democracy if you do not like it try not to slam the door

Thialand a democracy best laugh I've had this year I think

For people who tell lies for a living, like the Shinawatres, it's not odd for them to take a word, like 'reconciliation' and turn its meaning 180 degrees. If the Shinawatres had a house cleaning business, they might show up at the appointed time (oh well, they'd be tardy, as Thais always are), and toss grime all over the inside of the house.

[Bluespunk]

well just go away along with rest of your evil clan hardly wanting peace when they put up all clan members as MP's in party list and stuff every important post with their own family members and cronies

I just hope whole rotten evil lot would sink into slime they came from

Wow, that was a really constructive and useful comment.

Let's see, Puea Thai won the last elections, meaning that most Thais still wanted this government.

Just because a minority who has lost elections for the past 23 years, well before Thaksin ever came to power, wants to overthrow an elected government, doesn't mean that the whole country has to follow it.

My suggestion, go to the polls if you want to change something. It's what grown ups in civilized countries do.

But Thailand is not a civilized country ... nor is it democratic ..

A bit harsh. Not entirely incorrect, but still a tad harsh.

Edited January 1, 2014 by Bluespunk

[ikke]

The solution is very simple! Resign!!

She did resign, but it solved nothing, nadda, niente !

[Yunla]

Resume rants, and welcome to being a bit actor who will never even get a screen credit in the Puppet Show. We are not even allowed to buy a land ticket to be in the audience...so welcome to your rented space, and don't forget to clean the popcorn machine before you leave.

Happy New Year to you too!

And I agreed with your post, which I have pulled this line out of.

What is generally not appreciated on the web in these type of situations, is that there is a "middle-ground" position which is a purely scientific and logical dissection of the root problem/solution variables. And for those of us occupying said middle-ground, we are always taking monster heat from both sides, lol. If you don't have allegiance with either party, you are going to take twice as many forum scorchings as if you were actually allied to one of the corrupt self-interested parties. Who are quite possibly working for the same people anyway, but thats another story and I will save it for bedtime.

[Baerboxer]

well just go away along with rest of your evil clan hardly wanting peace when they put up all clan members as MP's in party list and stuff every important post with their own family members and cronies

I just hope whole rotten evil lot would sink into slime they came from

Wow, that was a really constructive and useful comment.

Let's see, Puea Thai won the last elections, meaning that most Thais still wanted this government.

Just because a minority who has lost elections for the past 23 years, well before Thaksin ever came to power, wants to overthrow an elected government, doesn't mean that the whole country has to follow it.

My suggestion, go to the polls if you want to change something. It's what grown ups in civilized countries do.

In grown up civilized countries, political parties are not openly controlled by a convicted criminal fugitive and his close family,

Really? The American Bushes come to mind, having been in control of arguably the most powerful country in the world....so 100,000 dead Iraqi civilians do not count as evidence, and Bush was found guilty of war crimes by more than one country. Wow, you have a rusted scale that can't measure anymore!

Which countries found Bush guilty of war crimes? Links to trial and verdict please.

I'm not defending Bush or any other politician - but trial by media or political correctness of the self appointed "educated" ones is not an alternative to a judicial process.

You are basing your comments on your idea of America as a civilized country, therefore you form your own scale. Yet, neither Bush was impeached or charged, fairly tried and convicted of any crime. But Kennedy and Lincoln were assassinated.

You previously ridicule people for taking sides - yet here you clearly are against the Bush family. That's your view, which you are free to express, as are others with differing views.

[Baerboxer]

Surprised the Western democracies haven't yet waded into this fiasco.

The last thing the world wants is another unelected committee - especially under the control of a crazed fanatic such as Suthep and his glove-puppet (commonly known as Mark Abhisit) running a strategic South-Eastern country.

Just my two-penn'orth.

What, and be a successful as they were in Vietnam, Laos, Iraq, Afghanistan, Kosovo, etc etc.

Western democracy - the universal panacea!

[mikemac]

well just go away along with rest of your evil clan hardly wanting peace when they put up all clan members as MP's in party list and stuff every important post with their own family members and cronies

I just hope whole rotten evil lot would sink into slime they came from

Wow, that was a really constructive and useful comment.

Let's see, Puea Thai won the last elections, meaning that most Thais still wanted this government.

Just because a minority who has lost elections for the past 23 years, well before Thaksin ever came to power, wants to overthrow an elected government, doesn't mean that the whole country has to follow it.

My suggestion, go to the polls if you want to change something. It's what grown ups in civilized countries do.

So for you it doesn't matter how corrupt the government might be or how they try to twist the constitution for their own aims! Just as long as they were democratically elected. May I suggest your post is equally constructive, NOT alt=wai2.gif pagespeed_url_hash=1722055545 width=20 height=20>

Thanks ggold, you saved me the trouble of responding to yet another ridiculous comment which misuses the term "democratically elected".

I am beginning to think if you rounded up all the posters (many of them are posting under multiple names) who used this anal argument regarding the Shinawatra Party being "democratically elected" and how the majority of the population just love Thaksin, you would have the collective mentality of a watermelon !

[wellred]

Honestly can people stop with the Russian doll quoting? Just leave the start and end bits and trim out the middle.

[Jawnie]

well just go away along with rest of your evil clan hardly wanting peace when they put up all clan members as MP's in party list and stuff every important post with their own family members and cronies

I just hope whole rotten evil lot would sink into slime they came from

Wow, that was a really constructive and useful comment.

Let's see, Puea Thai won the last elections, meaning that most Thais still wanted this government.

Just because a minority who has lost elections for the past 23 years, well before Thaksin ever came to power, wants to overthrow an elected government, doesn't mean that the whole country has to follow it.

My suggestion, go to the polls if you want to change something. It's what grown ups in civilized countries do.

You are so right. Any evidence that the Democrat Party is working on a reform platform to put forward for people vote on? It seems not - they are only trying to obstruct the election. The best way forward for the Democrat Party is to propose a better agenda and platform and run a campaign with real alternatives for change.

Yingluck continues to handle this difficult situation extremely well and has guided her responses and those under her in a way that has minimized violence and destruction. Bravo and hats off to her!

The Democrat Party already has a black eye from its handling of the 2010 protests. Suthep's current escapades are going to be another black eye for them when history looks back at today.

[khunsiam]

I think She is playing exactly the hand shes advised to, I also think that whatever people like to think about the Shins they are not stupid and are very well educated compared to a lot of the handmedown ammarts the contrast is striking.

Do you have an example of these less educated handmedown ammart to compare the Shins with?

Pathompong Charoenwut.

[Baerboxer]

In grown up civilized countries, political parties are not openly controlled by a convicted criminal fugitive and his close family, several of whom have also been convicted of fraud.

Civilized countries don't have a legal system doing the bidding of the military or anti-Shin elites for bribes.

Civilied countries don't remove democraticly elected governments (TS's in 2006).

The military should apologize to TS & arrange for him to return to his rightful position of being PM in LOS.

Your joking!

DSI, RTP, and AG - who do they work for? The entire legal and enforcement system here is a joke. But the Shins openly defy the law, as do all the rich elite.

Thaksin had formally resigned his position and was not the legal or elected PM when the military were forced to remove him from illegally holding on to power in 2006. Try researching the actual facts before posting drivel.

Your last sentence is probably the most idiotic comment on the current situation I've read. You want to return and convicted criminal, presumably whitewashing his conviction and nullifying outstanding charges, into a position that he resigned from, took back illegally, and had to be removed from?

Why do you think the Yingluck government's attempted whitewash amnesty bill caused so much conflict? (Clue, it has to do with the person you think is the rightful PM).

[englishoak]

I think She is playing exactly the hand shes advised to, I also think that whatever people like to think about the Shins they are not stupid and are very well educated compared to a lot of the handmedown ammarts the contrast is striking.

Do you have an example of these less educated handmedown ammart to compare the Shins with?

My opinion based on the feudal system in Thailand the impact made and the rapid change in power demographics that the Shin business model had on Thailand. Love it or hate it it changed the country in a few years and took the ammart by surprise. International business use of outside policy and knowledge completely rewrote the way popularity and politics could be done.

In contrast with the ammart an education in the US or UK with a piece of paper impressed, after Thaksin you had to deliver as well. Education isnt just about a degree it is knowledge and business acumen. Thaksin treated Thailand like a business. and for some time and not in a minor way put Thailand back on the map. Right or wrong it worked.... for a time

Edited January 1, 2014 by englishoak

[whybother]

The solution is very simple! Resign!!

She did resign, but it solved nothing, nadda, niente !

She didn't resign. She dissolved parliament. If she had resigned, she wouldn't be the care-taker PM.

[whybother]

I think She is playing exactly the hand shes advised to, I also think that whatever people like to think about the Shins they are not stupid and are very well educated compared to a lot of the handmedown ammarts the contrast is striking.

Do you have an example of these less educated handmedown ammart to compare the Shins with?

My opinion based on the feudal system in Thailand the impact made and the rapid change in power demographics that the Shin business model had on Thailand. Love it or hate it it changed the country in a few years and took the ammart by surprise. International business use of outside policy and knowledge completely rewrote the way popularity and politics could be done.

In contrast with the ammart an education in the US or UK with a piece of paper impressed, after Thaksin you had to deliver as well. Education isnt just about a degree it is knowledge and business acumen. Thaksin treated Thailand like a business. and for some time and not in a minor way put Thailand back on the map. Right or wrong it worked.... for a time

I don't think you realise that Thaksin actually used the feudal system to gain his power. He bought off the power players in the North and North East. The people didn't change their vote when Thaksin came along. They voted for the same people / the same families. It's just that Thaksin now had control of these families.

[khunsiam]

I think She is playing exactly the hand shes advised to, I also think that whatever people like to think about the Shins they are not stupid and are very well educated compared to a lot of the handmedown ammarts the contrast is striking.

Do you have an example of these less educated handmedown ammart to compare the Shins with?

Pathompong Charoenwut.

Earlier this month, a well-educated Thai by the name of Pathonpong Charoenwut wrote this widely spread message in English on his Facebook page.http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/691655-anti-govt-forces-have-a-new-bogeyman-the-western-media/

Edited January 1, 2014 by metisdead
Bold font removed.

[smutcakes]

I think She is playing exactly the hand shes advised to, I also think that whatever people like to think about the Shins they are not stupid and are very well educated compared to a lot of the handmedown ammarts the contrast is striking.

Do you have an example of these less educated handmedown ammart to compare the Shins with?

My opinion based on the feudal system in Thailand the impact made and the rapid change in power demographics that the Shin business model had on Thailand. Love it or hate it it changed the country in a few years and took the ammart by surprise. International business use of outside policy and knowledge completely rewrote the way popularity and politics could be done.

In contrast with the ammart an education in the US or UK with a piece of paper impressed, after Thaksin you had to deliver as well. Education isnt just about a degree it is knowledge and business acumen. Thaksin treated Thailand like a business. and for some time and not in a minor way put Thailand back on the map. Right or wrong it worked.... for a time

I don't think you realise that Thaksin actually used the feudal system to gain his power. He bought off the power players in the North and North East. The people didn't change their vote when Thaksin came along. They voted for the same people / the same families. It's just that Thaksin now had control of these families.

And as part of the Democrat Govt, Newin was given an open cheque book to buy these votes back for them, but he failed because as per the crux of this whole issue. PEOPLE PREFER THAKSIN, so they vote for him regardless of the money.

[englishoak]

Oh i do I know he used it, to his advantage and youd expect a savvy businessman to do exactly that, he saw a gap in the market, ( the farmers )and those they cowed down to and employed it to great effect.

im not saying it was great im just saying he used the system and a wide gap that had been ignored until he came along

Edited January 1, 2014 by englishoak

[Bignose]

I think She is playing exactly the hand shes advised to, I also think that whatever people like to think about the Shins they are not stupid and are very well educated compared to a lot of the handmedown ammarts the contrast is striking. This is how politics is really done.

Say what you like but Suthep has been both frustrated and out manoeuvred at every turn and continues to be. This lot are rank amateurs, when it comes to politics, having an eye and brain for business is a distinct advantage, only one group has that and international advise and experience. Even though the funding for the mob is massive in both backup and cash smart is the balancer,

Another call for peace and continued restraint on the PMs side very smart

She is garnering more and more respect internationally than i think some here realise, you can spit all you like but this is not a stupid led or advised party. Interesting and more turbulent times ahead

There have been some excellent and pertinent posts raised along this thread, as much as it may be anathema to some they are very probably spot on.

The present PM (until the election) YS does indeed appear at times to be an unwilling participant, yes she eloquently reads the statements and repeats the glib comments, but she never (to me any way) show real passion or burning commitment to the role. While obviously never having met her I believe there could be some truth in the comments of her being a totally different person away from the political arena. I find it credible that she was only meant to be in the top job for a short time, just long enough for the convicted criminal to be pardoned and return to take his place at the front of the trough. Given that political office does extract a huge toll (did you ever notice how quickly Obama, Clinton and Blair aged?) If this current struggle continues then it is not inconceivable that YS will pull the pin and leave her brother to find his own way back to the top job!

As englishoak stated previously there is a down side to all of this, this is a very well oiled political machine. They obviously have huge financial backing, they will have the very best political advice, both from within Thailand AND abroad. The opposition appear to be no way near as astute and in some respects are floundering, the present government seem to be two steps ahead at all times.

This present situation will not change anytime soon as the system has been loaded and corrupted to ensure it does not. As with the Marcos's, Aquino's and the Mugabe dynasty's (and countless others) it is not just the high profile head of the party who is feeding. There are layer upon layer of family, crony, acquaintance and friends standing in line waiting to dip their snout. As I have said in other posts until the arrival of that "special person" who has the qualities required to lead this country down a new and more inclusive road, then a government wearing uniforms and loyal only to the Monarch, may not be a bad thing...

[monkeycountry]

The solution is very simple! Resign!!

She did resign, but it solved nothing, nadda, niente !

Well, she was the boss, she is still the boss, and she will still be the boss after the election. Most people do not consider that resigning :-)

[englishoak]

I guess im saying the ammart have to modernise and step up their game, which includes far more than they have been willing to give to before. In that it is good for many reasons.

[Baerboxer]

To many on TV seem to be buying the 'cult of personalities' argument.

I do not buy into that at all, or believe it when both sides conveniently forget what their picked favorites have done in the past. That is a BS argument, in short and simple.

Of course the government is corrupt. The last government was corrupt, and the next and the next...and the one before that, and the one before that.... I refuse to forget the accusations agauinst Suthep that, well, just went away. Nor will I condone late night amendments to whitewash people of their crimes.

What both sides hate is the other is being smart and equally dishonest and darn the cruelty and uinfairness of life when people can rape the rules better than I can! Stop the game (until I can catch up somehow).

In short, picking a side here is like saying, "my excrement stinks less than yours does." These are laughable ad hominem attacks masquerading as justification because posters think they can get in the last word.

I for one hope the Thais find a unique solution to sharing power, but since they are human beings I am not holding my breath.

This is about power, and one side is really ticked off they have not had the power for quite some time. The current group that has power will hold on with cold dead hands if needs be. If you really want to spout an opinion I would respect, care about the people caught in the middle here. Some of them are being killed, and every one of them for the wrong reasons.

Like the West, they love the cult of personalities, and we have taught their leaders some nasty tricks! As someone once said, ten thousand dead lawyers in the bottom of the ocean is...a pretty good start. That has a deep problem too -- what else do we have but an imprecise system of laws? Language is not math, and sometimes one plus cube equals green.

Farang that jump to speak out and support their favorite sides are comical here. Not only do our 'opinions' not count, they are being read by Thais here who think most of us are happy to go along with the 'us-or-them' Puppet Show. Most of us are not. Lots of posts, and very little intelligible content between one viewpoint or the other rushing to hijack every new thread.

We're not important here. Number of posts is not number of votes. It just means some people have lots of time on their hands.

Resume rants, and welcome to being a bit actor who will never even get a screen credit in the Puppet Show. We are not even allowed to buy a land ticket to be in the audience...so welcome to your rented space, and don't forget to clean the popcorn machine before you leave.

H appy New Year!

Feel better now? Had some spare time to fill? That's the ticket!

I'm sure there are a myriad of motivations behind the posts on these threads. One thing for sure is the country needs to change or regress. Democracy requires the rule of law, fairly and impartially applied to all. Here we have feudal clans battling with a newer upstart gang for control of the spoils. The losers will always be the people and the country.

There is no real free press, investigative journalism, sound legal system, or effective checks and balances to protect the people. They have had successive corrupt governments and will continue to, unless there is significant change. At the moment, neither sides wants that change, they just want control for themselves.

I hope many posters would be critical of which ever side were in power if they were as openly corrupt, inept and lying like the last regime. Sadly the current choice seems to be a Thaksin controlled PTP dictatorship, that simply ignores rules and laws they don't like, or a Suthep led dictatorship that may or may not find the reforms necessary and return the country to democracy. What a great choice !

"and we have taught their leaders some nasty tricks!" - do you really think that ? Blame the foreigners - those evil Western imperialist lackeys ! How very politically correct to blame everything on the West.

Happy New Year!

[culicine]

It would be east to say that with 18 coups and several mass killings of students and killings of other protesters over the last 80 years and a south Thailand in a state of terror with guerilla bombings for 12 years that THailand has been in a constant state of terror and protest. They've double talked and bullied their way around it, stifled media, arrested for writing, thousands of extrajudicial killings in 2003 to fight a drug problem never solved.

I laughed when a Thai teacher said Thailand was a 'developing country'. I haven't seen a lot of development here in the past 14 years, perhaps only buildings and roads. I don't see any trend towards what most of us would call a 'democracy'.

[monkeycountry]

I think She is playing exactly the hand shes advised to, I also think that whatever people like to think about the Shins they are not stupid and are very well educated compared to a lot of the handmedown ammarts the contrast is striking.

Do you have an example of these less educated handmedown ammart to compare the Shins with?

My opinion based on the feudal system in Thailand the impact made and the rapid change in power demographics that the Shin business model had on Thailand. Love it or hate it it changed the country in a few years and took the ammart by surprise. International business use of outside policy and knowledge completely rewrote the way popularity and politics could be done.

In contrast with the ammart an education in the US or UK with a piece of paper impressed, after Thaksin you had to deliver as well. Education isnt just about a degree it is knowledge and business acumen. Thaksin treated Thailand like a business. and for some time and not in a minor way put Thailand back on the map. Right or wrong it worked.... for a time

I don't think you realise that Thaksin actually used the feudal system to gain his power. He bought off the power players in the North and North East. The people didn't change their vote when Thaksin came along. They voted for the same people / the same families. It's just that Thaksin now had control of these families.

And as part of the Democrat Govt, Newin was given an open cheque book to buy these votes back for them, but he failed because as per the crux of this whole issue. PEOPLE PREFER THAKSIN, so they vote for him regardless of the money.

Not saying that you are wrong, but is there any evidence to this - other than red shirt radio?

[Mackie]

I guess im saying the ammart have to modernise and step up their game, which includes far more than they have been willing to give to before. In that it is good for many reasons.

Abject nonsense. As expected from you. One sided argument.

How about red shirt villages and considerable amount of brainwashed population who is stuck in the Khmer Rouge frame of mind? Those guys see everything black and white. From political point of view, those guys are still in 70's. Don't you think they should be educated first?

[smutcakes]

I think She is playing exactly the hand shes advised to, I also think that whatever people like to think about the Shins they are not stupid and are very well educated compared to a lot of the handmedown ammarts the contrast is striking.

Do you have an example of these less educated handmedown ammart to compare the Shins with?

My opinion based on the feudal system in Thailand the impact made and the rapid change in power demographics that the Shin business model had on Thailand. Love it or hate it it changed the country in a few years and took the ammart by surprise. International business use of outside policy and knowledge completely rewrote the way popularity and politics could be done.

In contrast with the ammart an education in the US or UK with a piece of paper impressed, after Thaksin you had to deliver as well. Education isnt just about a degree it is knowledge and business acumen. Thaksin treated Thailand like a business. and for some time and not in a minor way put Thailand back on the map. Right or wrong it worked.... for a time

I don't think you realise that Thaksin actually used the feudal system to gain his power. He bought off the power players in the North and North East. The people didn't change their vote when Thaksin came along. They voted for the same people / the same families. It's just that Thaksin now had control of these families.

And as part of the Democrat Govt, Newin was given an open cheque book to buy these votes back for them, but he failed because as per the crux of this whole issue. PEOPLE PREFER THAKSIN, so they vote for him regardless of the money.

Not saying that you are wrong, but is there any evidence to this - other than red shirt radio?

No, no proper evidence, like there is no proper evidence about much of the last few years going on, just heresay and speculation. However i think it is extremely viable that Newin a well known politician who seems to work well in the dark arts of vote canvassing (buying-previously used by TS) be given 3 of the most powerful and lucrative ministries. I have heard from many sources, including comments from within the Democrat party of how disillusioned people were with the corruption of the Bhumjum party, but it was seen as a necessary evil to 'get the job done'.

[Prbkk]

I think She is playing exactly the hand shes advised to, I also think that whatever people like to think about the Shins they are not stupid and are very well educated compared to a lot of the handmedown ammarts the contrast is striking.

Do you have an example of these less educated handmedown ammart to compare the Shins with?

Pathompong Charoenwut.

Earlier this month, a well-educated Thai by the name of Pathonpong Charoenwut wrote this widely spread message in English on his Facebook page.http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/691655-anti-govt-forces-have-a-new-bogeyman-the-western-media/

The same guy runs a company producing scented candles for export to foreign countries, including Australia, USA, Canada, EU, UK ( as well as selling them and related products in Hi-So malls in bangkok. IE, the same guy who uses the pronoun for animals to refer to foreigners. He has closed his facebook page now and possibly regrets his comments, maybe not. In any event, I would like to see him insert one of his candles, preferably sideways, where the sun don't shine