State prosecutor orders police to question more before indicting the murder suspects in court

[ukrules]

I don't agree for one simple reason:

The Thai government, the Thai police and the people involved on that island

are not finished putting their feet in their mouth

and as a result, they have a far greater hole to dig for their country and its collapsing tourist trade

if it goes from 10% of GDP to 3 % while the rest of their economy is failing and debt rising,

they have not nearly begun to fee the pain of their own handiwork

when I was in BKK in Jan. they shut down the breakfast buffet at my favorite hotel restaurant, because the hotel was nearly empty

that was an international hotel, and it was empty in Jan., before martial law, before the coup, before the curfew.

it is now a full year that incomes are declining here, and then they hurt the smallest people by shutting down the street vendors, which, I actually supported in some areas as you couldnt walk on the sidewalks

there must be thousands of unreported layoffs and people now, in real trouble

I don't see a happy ending coming here, at all

Makes sense to me. I'm not a smart person when it comes to economics and all that. But i do feel that this is just the strt, the current decline will only speed up now because of the various mitigating circumstances going on politically and socially with these murders.

And now we find people are being refused tourist visas at various Thai Embassies around the world because they've been to Thailand too many times.

You couldn't make this up if you tried. It's almost like there's some kind of internal power struggle going on.

[ScubaPhuket]

Good, they might live to see another country.

[JLCrab]

If people have definite information, not just hearsay or conjecture I am sure the met would love to hear from you.

You can contact them here.

SMS: +44 20 7230 1212

email: [email protected].

It is a given that they will be in constant contact with any officers in Thailand and they will get any relevant information

very quickly.

I do not think, however, it is a good idea to inundate them with cponspiracy theories orr anything without some

substance.

The last thing they will need is to be overwhelmed with spurious information that could lead to them wasting time.

In other words, if you contact them, be responsible, please.

I hope these links are acceptable to the mods.

edited: small keyboard big fingers

I do not think, however, it is a good idea to inundate them with cponspiracy theories orr anything without some substance. In other words -- for the most part -- don't bother calling.

[SteveFong]

I don't agree for one simple reason:

The Thai government, the Thai police and the people involved on that island

are not finished putting their feet in their mouth

and as a result, they have a far greater hole to dig for their country and its collapsing tourist trade

if it goes from 10% of GDP to 3 % while the rest of their economy is failing and debt rising,

they have not nearly begun to fee the pain of their own handiwork

when I was in BKK in Jan. they shut down the breakfast buffet at my favorite hotel restaurant, because the hotel was nearly empty

that was an international hotel, and it was empty in Jan., before martial law, before the coup, before the curfew.

it is now a full year that incomes are declining here, and then they hurt the smallest people by shutting down the street vendors, which, I actually supported in some areas as you couldnt walk on the sidewalks

there must be thousands of unreported layoffs and people now, in real trouble

I don't see a happy ending coming here, at all

Makes sense to me. I'm not a smart person when it comes to economics and all that. But i do feel that this is just the strt, the current decline will only speed up now because of the various mitigating circumstances going on politically and socially with these murders.

And now we find people are being refused tourist visas at various Thai Embassies around the world because they've been to Thailand too many times.

You couldn't make this up if you tried. It's almost like there's some kind of internal power struggle going on.

You can't make this stuff up

Why wouldnt these people just get new passports?

[DennisF]

If people have definite information, not just hearsay or conjecture I am sure the met would love to hear from you.

You can contact them here.

SMS: +44 20 7230 1212

email: [email protected].

It is a given that they will be in constant contact with any officers in Thailand and they will get any relevant information

very quickly.

I do not think, however, it is a good idea to inundate them with cponspiracy theories orr anything without some

substance.

The last thing they will need is to be overwhelmed with spurious information that could lead to them wasting time.

In other words, if you contact them, be responsible, please.

I hope these links are acceptable to the mods.

edited: small keyboard big fingers

I do not think, however, it is a good idea to inundate them with cponspiracy theories orr anything without some substance. In other words -- for the most part -- don't bother calling.

Correct, they will already be fully aware of this forum, CSI etc so contact should be made with relevant information.

So, for the most part.. correct, thank you for reinforcing that :-)

[balo]

"He said that case needed to have substantial evidence as it is closely watched by people around the world."

more substantial than a dna match and confession?!

is that evidence not rock solid anymore then?

DNA evidence obtained and tested by unqualified people.

And how do you know they were unqualified people ? So you think the DNA lab in Bangkok hires unqualified people ?

[bannork]

It isn't just "these" murders

it is "many" murders and

even more rapes

the girls get raped and then told by the Thai police, to leave

forget about their blatant disregard for the female victims

do they think those girls then go home and recommend to their friends that they should try Thailand too?

seriously

what does Thailand have to offer except cheap massages and sex?[/quote

Steve, I believe you have spent a mere 6 months in Thailand, all of which was in Bangkok, am I right?

That's like going to New York and then claiming to have 'seen' the USA.

Thailand has so much to offer so many folks:

Stunning scenery, beaches in the south.

Trekking, beautiful scenery, friendly people in the north.

Beautiful temples, plenty of colourful ceremonies, a sense of fun, easy going folks

Great food and weather, plenty of markets, street vendors, night life.

And of course the most beautiful girls in the world, especially in Udon province.

Next time you come to Thailand get out of Bangkok.

[stephen terry]

"He said that case needed to have substantial evidence as it is closely watched by people around the world."

more substantial than a dna match and confession?!

is that evidence not rock solid anymore then?

DNA evidence obtained and tested by unqualified people.

And how do you know they were unqualified people ? So you think the DNA lab in Bangkok hires unqualified people ?

He means the collection of DNA at Koh Tao was not carried out by a forensic pathologist, as should be the case. So, technically they were unqualified.

[heyexile]

Hold on,, I thought the investigation was now "PERFECT"? I though they had significant evidence that definitely shows that they had arrested the right suspects? I thought that the police had been given rewards for their exceptional work? I thought that the suspects had NOT retracted their confessions and therefore a trial is not necessary?

This is now so smelly it can be detected across all continents all over the world.

Please Thailand,, please stop this charade and try and salvage some dignity, time is running out.

I don't think this will make it to court. There are so many holes and more seem to keep popping up. Even the prosecutors have shredded it. What may happen is that there is not enough evidence to indict the Burmese....they will be released.....but the real criminals will not be chased. The case will be shelved as being unsolved.

I can see that happening as well. Although I think it will be very difficult to shelve this one,,

If only someone in authority would grow some plums and do the right thing,,, instant respect gained and credibility at least partially created.

Before David Cameron personally intervened, the killers would have gotten off,

but not this time,

Anyone who thinks the Scotland Yard detectives are NOT going to investigate every aspect of this case,

also then agrees they are coming here to waste their time and allow the Thai PM to come back to the world stage a hero

BTW, what does Thailand export to the UK?

Natural fruit (ask Andy Hall), shrimp, fish, rice, spices and the odd mail order bride.

[DennisF]

"He said that case needed to have substantial evidence as it is closely watched by people around the world."

more substantial than a dna match and confession?!

is that evidence not rock solid anymore then?

DNA evidence obtained and tested by unqualified people.

And how do you know they were unqualified people ? So you think the DNA lab in Bangkok hires unqualified people ?

Try to avoid nit picking on everything you post just to shore up your collapsing opinion.

It is a matter of RTP record, confirmed by the punk pathologist that NO QUALIFIED forensic specialist was

asked, nor was present, nor was invited, nor was asked for advice or opinion when the UNQUALIFIED BiB trampled all over the crime scene,

with their friends,taking pictures and seemingly doing little else.

Sending potentially compromised evidence to a crime lab is hardly professional, or indeed ethical, is it?

Grow up.

[Bleacher Bum East]

"He said that case needed to have substantial evidence as it is closely watched by people around the world."

more substantial than a dna match and confession?!

is that evidence not rock solid anymore then?

DNA evidence obtained and tested by unqualified people.

And how do you know they were unqualified people ? So you think the DNA lab in Bangkok hires unqualified people ?

Try to avoid nit picking on everything you post just to shore up your collapsing opinion.

It is a matter of RTP record, confirmed by the punk pathologist that NO QUALIFIED forensic specialist was

asked, nor was present, nor was invited, nor was asked for advice or opinion when the UNQUALIFIED BiB trampled all over the crime scene,

with their friends,taking pictures and seemingly doing little else.

Sending potentially compromised evidence to a crime lab is hardly professional, or indeed ethical, is it?

Grow up.

If a qualified forensic pathologist had been at the crime scene and been the person gathering DNA evidence, then the pathologist most likely would have required everyone who came near to the victim's bodies to produce what is called an "elimination sample" of their own DNA--including all civilians and law enforcement personnel who were not wearing sterile clothing and masks.

The prosecution knows that the defense will use the crime scene contamination, the fact that the persons gathering evidence were not qualified to do so (according to Thailand's top criminal pathologist) and several other factors to argue the the DNA match is not reliable "beyond a reasonable doubt".

I believe this is one of the reasons why the prosecutor has sent the file back to the police and requested more circumstantial evidence. BTW DNA itself is circumstantial evidence, although if 100% reliable can be very good evidence---the question is reliability, and that is first for the prosecutor to determine when deciding whether to file charges, and later for the judge and observers in court to determine when deciding whether guilt has been proven beyond a reasonable doubt.

Edited October 22, 2014 by Bleacher Bum East

[heyexile]

This case has really brought out some Thai bashing.

It is NOT the Thai people as a nation who are responsible, it is the 0.1% (elite) who control the country and its finances.

Corruption is endemic but the recipients of the proceeds are the elite and their soldiers, NOT the general public, who are

just as likely to have to pay as any farang.

Please, dont think all Thai people are bad, in my many years here I have met very few who are not kind, generous, warm and inviting to foreigners.

As I wrote above I think it's in part that no small percentage of the people interacting with falang in Thailand have either poor character to start, i.e. got involved in tourism to exploit tourist's ignorance, or have become spoiled one way or the other. So whether it's tourists or even more long-time semi-residents who still stay in touristed areas, both get a skewed idea of how most Thais are; add the language barrier to that.

So while I think there are problems endemic to Thailand at play in this case, there would be problems endemic to any country in a similarly-flawed case. Of course, these kind of things are happening with too much regularity, it would appear, in Thailand. I believe the current PM means well and is earnest about cleaning up the corrupted parts of the gov't/police, but he's probably got an uphill battle ahead.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Which part of the police is not corrupted? The good generals are the gov`t so they would need to clean up their own act. The PM is the Supreme Commander of Police Dept and he appointed good Gen Somyot as Police Commissioner General. They both publicly pronounced this a perfect investigation.

[Johnsen]

The whole investigation has been a shame from day 1. The police have no desire to catch the real killers and Muang Muang statement would indicate why.

Now I have been very critical of BKK university and I still stand by my criticism. Nomsods lawyer is using the uni as the kids alibi. I quote

"At university and his residence 13th-15th September."

"Mr Worat also attended classes during that period of time".

"There are university documents that confirmed his class attendance and examination."

So what this lawyer has done is implicate the uni. This kid is being accused of murder. Don't you think the police would investigate this alibi. 1 horribly photo shopped photo does not confirm his whole alibi. The lawyer also says Nomsod is now getting a hard time re these accusations. Well if that's the case shouldn't the uni confirm his alibi. Why no confirmation from the university. Which classes did he attend Mr Lawyer. This is your statement to prove this kid didn't murder someone. Come on BKK uni you have been dragged into this up to your eyeballs.. The lawyer says he was there. He says there are university documents to prove this. Well...... Where are they. Help this poor kid out. Their silence tells me they are involved in the cover up which is a disgrace.. Police let's go confirm the alibi. Especially to u DavidF they didn't say afternoon of 15th they said 13th to 15th. Until we hear from the uni its stinks of a cover up and the uni's reputation is in tatters.

Edited October 22, 2014 by Johnsen

[thailandchilli]

"He said that case needed to have substantial evidence as it is closely watched by people around the world."

more substantial than a dna match and confession?!

is that evidence not rock solid anymore then?

DNA evidence obtained and tested by unqualified people.

And how do you know they were unqualified people ? So you think the DNA lab in Bangkok hires unqualified people ?

I would get off the sinking ship if I were you balo, the prosecutors have already jumped

[balo]

We dont' know all the facts yet and I doubt we ever will . Still try to have an open mind and do not think all Thais are bad people.

[Gweiloman]

We dont' know all the facts yet and I doubt we ever will . Still try to have an open mind and do not think all Thais are bad people.

"We dont' know all the facts yet and I doubt we ever will"

And yet you and some others were fairly certain right from the outset that the BIB had the real killers in custody. Even JTJ has jumped ship.

[phuketandsee]

BTW, what does Thailand export to the UK?

Natural fruit (ask Andy Hall), shrimp, fish, rice, spices and the odd mail order bride.

And quite a few cases of STD I imagine.

[sweatalot]

The whole investigation has been a shame from day 1. The police have no desire to catch the real killers and Muang Muang statement would indicate why.

Now I have been very critical of BKK university and I still stand by my criticism. Nomsods lawyer is using the uni as the kids alibi. I quote

"At university and his residence 13th-15th September."

"Mr Worat also attended classes during that period of time".

"There are university documents that confirmed his class attendance and examination."

So what this lawyer has done is implicate the uni. This kid is being accused of murder. Don't you think the police would investigate this alibi. 1 horribly photo shopped photo does not confirm his whole alibi. The lawyer also says Nomsod is now getting a hard time re these accusations. Well if that's the case shouldn't the uni confirm his alibi. Why no confirmation from the university. Which classes did he attend Mr Lawyer. This is your statement to prove this kid didn't murder someone. Come on BKK uni you have been dragged into this up to your eyeballs.. The lawyer says he was there. He says there are university documents to prove this. Well...... Where are they. Help this poor kid out. Their silence tells me they are involved in the cover up which is a disgrace.. Police let's go confirm the alibi. Especially to u DavidF they didn't say afternoon of 15th they said 13th to 15th. Until we hear from the uni its stinks of a cover up and the uni's reputation is in tatters.

All this is not necessary, I guess. This poor boy can easily make his life happy again and show his innocence by allowing a RELIABLE DNA check. Not?

[Johnsen]

Word on the internet from students at the university is that he was not there on the 15th. When he showed up on the 16th he had scratches on his arm and neck. Sure that's only here say but what police force anywhere in the world wouldn't investigate.

You really have to start to believe these young Burmese are going to jail for life at the very least. I'm curious to know if that turns out to be the case how will the expats in Thailand and regular holiday makers to Thailand respond. All those posters on here what ya gonna do if they get life. Vote with your feet n get out or never come to Thailand again. This I feel is the problem. Thailand thinks you are all all talk and will continue to live and holiday there. So what's everybody's response going to be. How strongly do you feel about this travesty...

[ukrules]

Word on the internet from students at the university is that he was not there on the 15th. When he showed up on the 16th he had scratches on his arm and neck. Sure that's only here say but what police force anywhere in the world wouldn't investigate.

You really have to start to believe these young Burmese are going to jail for life at the very least. I'm curious to know if that turns out to be the case how will the expats in Thailand and regular holiday makers to Thailand respond. All those posters on here what ya gonna do if they get life. Vote with your feet n get out or never come to Thailand again. This I feel is the problem. Thailand thinks you are all all talk and will continue to live and holiday there. So what's everybody's response going to be. How strongly do you feel about this travesty...

I'm going to do nothing regardless of the outcome. I'm not going anywhere, I'm staying in Hua Hin for the foreseeable future.

I wouldn't go to those shithole rip off islands anyway and that includes the likes of Phuket.

Edited October 22, 2014 by ukrules

[ScubaPhuket]

We dont' know all the facts yet and I doubt we ever will . Still try to have an open mind and do not think all Thais are bad people.

"We dont' know all the facts yet and I doubt we ever will"

And yet you and some others were fairly certain right from the outset that the BIB had the real killers in custody. Even JTJ has jumped ship.

[Gweiloman]

Word on the internet from students at the university is that he was not there on the 15th. When he showed up on the 16th he had scratches on his arm and neck. Sure that's only here say but what police force anywhere in the world wouldn't investigate.

You really have to start to believe these young Burmese are going to jail for life at the very least. I'm curious to know if that turns out to be the case how will the expats in Thailand and regular holiday makers to Thailand respond. All those posters on here what ya gonna do if they get life. Vote with your feet n get out or never come to Thailand again. This I feel is the problem. Thailand thinks you are all all talk and will continue to live and holiday there. So what's everybody's response going to be. How strongly do you feel about this travesty...

With all these rumours circulating on the internet and social media, you would imagine that even a marginally competent police investigator would interview him again and ask him to produce some friends who could vouch for his movements and alibi on the day of the murder and the day after.

I'm far from being a rich, popular hiso guy but I bet that even I could get witness statements (from the security guards at my apartment for example) verifying if I was indeed in Bangkok on a particular day. Failing that, I would be able to get CCTV footage from the CCTV cameras in the lift and lobby (when I go out and return from dinner). Heck, I might even be able to produce a Big C receipt if I so happened to be shopping there on that day together with the CCTV footage confirming that the receipt is genuinely mine.

Seemingly this is not being done (or at least, nothing has been reported regarding this). Could it be because no one wants to be an accessory or to commit perjury?

[Oziex1]

The whole investigation has been a shame from day 1. The police have no desire to catch the real killers and Muang Muang statement would indicate why.

Now I have been very critical of BKK university and I still stand by my criticism. Nomsods lawyer is using the uni as the kids alibi. I quote

"At university and his residence 13th-15th September."

"Mr Worat also attended classes during that period of time".

"There are university documents that confirmed his class attendance and examination."

So what this lawyer has done is implicate the uni. This kid is being accused of murder. Don't you think the police would investigate this alibi. 1 horribly photo shopped photo does not confirm his whole alibi. The lawyer also says Nomsod is now getting a hard time re these accusations. Well if that's the case shouldn't the uni confirm his alibi. Why no confirmation from the university. Which classes did he attend Mr Lawyer. This is your statement to prove this kid didn't murder someone. Come on BKK uni you have been dragged into this up to your eyeballs.. The lawyer says he was there. He says there are university documents to prove this. Well...... Where are they. Help this poor kid out. Their silence tells me they are involved in the cover up which is a disgrace.. Police let's go confirm the alibi. Especially to u DavidF they didn't say afternoon of 15th they said 13th to 15th. Until we hear from the uni its stinks of a cover up and the uni's reputation is in tatters.

He has a Lawyer, Why is he in trouble with the Police?

[ScubaPhuket]

The whole investigation has been a shame from day 1. The police have no desire to catch the real killers and Muang Muang statement would indicate why.

Now I have been very critical of BKK university and I still stand by my criticism. Nomsods lawyer is using the uni as the kids alibi. I quote

"At university and his residence 13th-15th September."

"Mr Worat also attended classes during that period of time".

"There are university documents that confirmed his class attendance and examination."

So what this lawyer has done is implicate the uni. This kid is being accused of murder. Don't you think the police would investigate this alibi. 1 horribly photo shopped photo does not confirm his whole alibi. The lawyer also says Nomsod is now getting a hard time re these accusations. Well if that's the case shouldn't the uni confirm his alibi. Why no confirmation from the university. Which classes did he attend Mr Lawyer. This is your statement to prove this kid didn't murder someone. Come on BKK uni you have been dragged into this up to your eyeballs.. The lawyer says he was there. He says there are university documents to prove this. Well...... Where are they. Help this poor kid out. Their silence tells me they are involved in the cover up which is a disgrace.. Police let's go confirm the alibi. Especially to u DavidF they didn't say afternoon of 15th they said 13th to 15th. Until we hear from the uni its stinks of a cover up and the uni's reputation is in tatters.

One of the reasons that a thai university degree is next to useless when looking for employment in any civilised nation is that the parents of unqualified and/or stupid kids can buy their way into a course & also buy their degree. Corruption in thailand is not limited to government so an assumption that money has not already changed hands in this case would not be a good one.

[Johnsen]

Here here. I fully concur. Bangkok university has been placed in an unbelievable position of importance in this case now. The kids alibi as stated by his lawyer needs to be proven. In class, which class. Bkk uni the world awaits your reply.

[Oziex1]

Word on the internet from students at the university is that he was not there on the 15th. When he showed up on the 16th he had scratches on his arm and neck. Sure that's only here say but what police force anywhere in the world wouldn't investigate.

You really have to start to believe these young Burmese are going to jail for life at the very least. I'm curious to know if that turns out to be the case how will the expats in Thailand and regular holiday makers to Thailand respond. All those posters on here what ya gonna do if they get life. Vote with your feet n get out or never come to Thailand again. This I feel is the problem. Thailand thinks you are all all talk and will continue to live and holiday there. So what's everybody's response going to be. How strongly do you feel about this travesty...

With all these rumours circulating on the internet and social media, you would imagine that even a marginally competent police investigator would interview him again and ask him to produce some friends who could vouch for his movements and alibi on the day of the murder and the day after.

I'm far from being a rich, popular hiso guy but I bet that even I could get witness statements (from the security guards at my apartment for example) verifying if I was indeed in Bangkok on a particular day. Failing that, I would be able to get CCTV footage from the CCTV cameras in the lift and lobby (when I go out and return from dinner). Heck, I might even be able to produce a Big C receipt if I so happened to be shopping there on that day together with the CCTV footage confirming that the receipt is genuinely mine.

Seemingly this is not being done (or at least, nothing has been reported regarding this). Could it be because no one wants to be an accessory or to commit perjury?

"Could it be because no one wants to be an accessory or to commit perjury?"

No because they don't wan't to get murdered by Numbnuts gangster mates and family.

[Johnsen]

Agreed, only one thing better than a dead person is a scared person.

[Gweiloman]

Word on the internet from students at the university is that he was not there on the 15th. When he showed up on the 16th he had scratches on his arm and neck. Sure that's only here say but what police force anywhere in the world wouldn't investigate.

You really have to start to believe these young Burmese are going to jail for life at the very least. I'm curious to know if that turns out to be the case how will the expats in Thailand and regular holiday makers to Thailand respond. All those posters on here what ya gonna do if they get life. Vote with your feet n get out or never come to Thailand again. This I feel is the problem. Thailand thinks you are all all talk and will continue to live and holiday there. So what's everybody's response going to be. How strongly do you feel about this travesty...

With all these rumours circulating on the internet and social media, you would imagine that even a marginally competent police investigator would interview him again and ask him to produce some friends who could vouch for his movements and alibi on the day of the murder and the day after.

I'm far from being a rich, popular hiso guy but I bet that even I could get witness statements (from the security guards at my apartment for example) verifying if I was indeed in Bangkok on a particular day. Failing that, I would be able to get CCTV footage from the CCTV cameras in the lift and lobby (when I go out and return from dinner). Heck, I might even be able to produce a Big C receipt if I so happened to be shopping there on that day together with the CCTV footage confirming that the receipt is genuinely mine.

Seemingly this is not being done (or at least, nothing has been reported regarding this). Could it be because no one wants to be an accessory or to commit perjury?

"Could it be because no one wants to be an accessory or to commit perjury?"

No because they don't wan't to get murdered by Numbnuts gangster mates and family.

No, what I meant is that if he was indeed in Bkk at the stated times, surely someone would testify to that? (other than the cousin who was apparently in Pattaya?)

Edited October 22, 2014 by Gweiloman

[SteveFong]

It isn't just "these" murders

it is "many" murders and

even more rapes

the girls get raped and then told by the Thai police, to leave

forget about their blatant disregard for the female victims

do they think those girls then go home and recommend to their friends that they should try Thailand too?

seriously

what does Thailand have to offer except cheap massages and sex?[/quote

Steve, I believe you have spent a mere 6 months in Thailand, all of which was in Bangkok, am I right?

That's like going to New York and then claiming to have 'seen' the USA.

Thailand has so much to offer so many folks:

Stunning scenery, beaches in the south.

Trekking, beautiful scenery, friendly people in the north.

Beautiful temples, plenty of colourful ceremonies, a sense of fun, easy going folks

Great food and weather, plenty of markets, street vendors, night life.

And of course the most beautiful girls in the world, especially in Udon province.

Next time you come to Thailand get out of Bangkok.

I saw the cesspool that is Pattaya, and Chiang Mai and Chaing Rai, and many other areas along the way,

and I lived near Safari world with a local girl for nearly 5 months, who drove with me all over,

I remain, unimpressed and I have plenty of beaches to choose from in Miami

[JLCrab]

So is he the guy from Miami who one asked if a hooker walks into the US Embassy for a visa interview, how could they tell?