VW: former boss faces criminal probe

[webfact]

VW: former boss faces criminal probe

WOLFSBURG: -- The former boss of under-fire motor manufacturer Volkswagen is facing a criminal investigation by the German authorities.

Martin Winterkorn quit last week saying he had no knowledge of the US emissions-rigging scandal that has shaken the world’s largest car maker to its core.

State prosecutor Julia Meyer told reporters the investigation will focus on allegations of fraud committed through the sale of vehicles with manipulated emissions data. “We will also try to clarify which persons of the Volkswagen group may have been responsible.” she added.

VW says 11 million cars may carry the software that allows emission tests to be rigged.

VW-owned Audi has said 2.1 million of its vehicles are among those affected.

VW employs 600 thousand people around the world and has an annual turnover of 200 billion euros.

Observers say the company’s image has been dealt a severe knock.

Its shares have dropped by 34 percent since news of the scandal broke, wiping 20 billion euros off the books.

-- (c) Copyright Euronews 2015-09-29

[maidee]

as long as the guy can keep is millions of euros of golden parachute , right ...

[Toany]

At last the German Government is taking some action. It maybe too late to save the reputation of German products as list of cheating companies grows longer

[Sviss Geez]

At last the German Government is taking some action. It maybe too late to save the reputation of German products as list of cheating companies grows longer

Companies such as?

[elgordo38]

as long as the guy can keep is millions of euros of golden parachute , right ...

Yes I heard it was close to 68 million which is really obscene. He can hire the best lawyer around and still keep half.

[Toany]

At last the German Government is taking some action. It maybe too late to save the reputation of German products as list of cheating companies grows longer

Companies such as?

Audio and Bosh for a start. BMW series 3

[Don Mega]

At last the German Government is taking some action. It maybe too late to save the reputation of German products as list of cheating companies grows longer

Companies such as?

Audio and Bosh for a start. BMW series 3

Ive no idea who audio is but bosch did tell VW not to use the software illegally, a warning VW obviously ignored.

http://www.themotorreport.com.au/62305/vw-dieselgate-deepens-bosch-warning-ignored

Edited September 29, 2015 by Don Mega

[uksomchai]

Evidently for some bizarre reason you cannot sue a company in Germany just a person. This reminds me of the horse meat so called scandal a while back. People have been eating these burgers that have contained traces of horse meat for years without any suffering then all of a sudden the burgers are binned. The same is happening here today. people who until a few days ago were very happy with their cars are now outraged ( The IN word today ) yet nothing has really changed. Of course you are going to have an army of Eco / Green Nazi's screaming for blood but thats about it.

If the IPCC can fiddle their figures then so can VW and if you think VW is alone in this think again. You can also bet your last Dollar that the politicians knew all about it as well but chose to say nothing to play both sides off against each other

[Grouse]

As always, there is a paucity of facts. I think most of us know that an engine ECU controls many fuel and ignition parameters according to the status of multiple inputs. Generally a "map" or look up table is used to give "optimum" inputs to engine systems according to conditions

The map will always provide different parameters for the engine accelerating on the highway to idling on a garage forecourt!

I would like to know EXACTLY what VW did? Did their map just turn down the wick when idling?

We should be told....

[up2u2]

As always, there is a paucity of facts. I think most of us know that an engine ECU controls many fuel and ignition parameters according to the status of multiple inputs. Generally a "map" or look up table is used to give "optimum" inputs to engine systems according to conditions

The map will always provide different parameters for the engine accelerating on the highway to idling on a garage forecourt!

I would like to know EXACTLY what VW did? Did their map just turn down the wick when idling?

We should be told....

My understanding is VW put in engine management software that was able to detect when pollution control equipment was monitoring the external exhaust fumes. It quickly kicked in the pollution reducing operation of the engine. Once the equipment was removed the engine software could detect it and flick the engine back to producing more pollution. The only time this particular engine ran within pollution guidelines was when external pollution equipment was attached.

It was discovered by an American University when they were commissioned to investigate the fuel economy of the vehicle. It takes the Uni guys 8 hours to actually fit all the equipment to the vehicle and it actually tests the engine whilst it is being driven. I believe the University were scratching their head and asked for another vehicle from VW because this one sucked big time lol but they came up with the same results.

You think America's EPA would have picked it up but apparently the EPA is so badly funded they have de-regulated the car industry and the actual testing is done by a 'independent' 3rd party and results are provided to the EPA.

These University tests were some 18 months ago and VW was well aware of the possibility that their deception had been exposed.

This really shows the arrogance and the level of power corporations have over governments.

The only way to put an end to this behaviour is to fund, independent from government, Authorities to oversee and enforce regulations and the confiscation of assets and prison sentences for corporate executives who are found to be intentionally acting fraudulently.

I wish the German Prosecutor luck but this CEO is out of her reach. I do agree confiscate his assets under 'profits from criminal behaviour' and pop him in a prison cell and that smile would be wiped off his face. Isn't going to happen though.

[RubbaJohnny]

as long as the guy can keep is millions of euros of golden parachute , right ...

Yes I heard it was close to 68 million which is really obscene. He can hire the best lawyer around and still keep half.

send each thai one euro think of the merit,save bonk transference fee can send to one the honest politicians

[Grouse]

Before wiping the smile off anyone's face, I would like THE FACTS!

Did they actually detect when monitoring equipment was attached? How?

More likely they sensed the vehicle operating conditions and adjusted the engine for minimised emissions

In all these tests, they don't measure emissions at 100mph with 4 passengers going up hill!

[Don Mega]

The tests are performed on a dyno.

when the obdII port was connected and the car was being run up the ECU sensed the lack of steering input and rear wheels turning.... automatically putting it into "dyno" mode for the emission test.

is basically how I understand it.

[Grouse]

Sounds pretty smart to me

Here in Phuket, you pay the garage guy 1000 Baht to put him into Farang mode.

He then traces the chassis number and gives you the certificate

Emissions? Who gives a damn....

[up2u2]

Before wiping the smile off anyone's face, I would like THE FACTS!

Did they actually detect when monitoring equipment was attached? How?

More likely they sensed the vehicle operating conditions and adjusted the engine for minimised emissions

In all these tests, they don't measure emissions at 100mph with 4 passengers going up hill!

The engines software was set to detect when pollution testing equipment was attached to the exhaust of the vehicle. The software was intentionally coded so that when 'this happens' change to 'these emission' settings. The more sophisticated university equipment did not 'trip' the software to switch to low emissions. That is how the fraud was committed. Former CEO Martin Winterkorn has admitted to the fraud. If you watch the presentation it is quite obvious he thought it all quite humorous and he is absolutely 100% correct. For him it is all a bit of a laugh as there will be no consequences for him personally.

[Grouse]

Well, the explanations so far differ

Detecting steering movement and rear wheels moving ( on front wheel drive vehicle)

Or detecting emission tester directly

Which is it?

Fact is, emissions are only checked at one or a few operating conditions

Your ECU varies the settings continuously.

Let's get some facts......

[MockingJay]

[uksomchai]

Before wiping the smile off anyone's face, I would like THE FACTS!

Did they actually detect when monitoring equipment was attached? How?

More likely they sensed the vehicle operating conditions and adjusted the engine for minimised emissions

In all these tests, they don't measure emissions at 100mph with 4 passengers going up hill!

What the software did was realise that there was no steering input and only the two wheels were turning.It also realised that there were no gears engaged or changed so just kicked into what would be called Limp mode so giving the least amount of power and as such the least amount of particulates. If by some chance they force people to remap their cars to reduce less particulates then all people will do is to get the engine remapped after the test All this software does is stop the need to get the remapping done and as I have said from the start if VW have been doing it then they all have just some have a better way of hiding it than others. You can also bet your last Dollar that the politicians knew this was going on but played both sides against each other pretending to please both

[Don Mega]

Well, the explanations so far differ

Detecting steering movement and rear wheels moving ( on front wheel drive vehicle)

Or detecting emission tester directly

Which is it?

Fact is, emissions are only checked at one or a few operating conditions

Your ECU varies the settings continuously.

Let's get some facts......

2 minutes spent on google will give you the facts you are looking for.

[up2u2]

Well, the explanations so far differ

Detecting steering movement and rear wheels moving ( on front wheel drive vehicle)

Or detecting emission tester directly

Which is it?

Fact is, emissions are only checked at one or a few operating conditions

Your ECU varies the settings continuously.

Let's get some facts......

I saw an interview with Sam Carder from West Virginia University that picked up the fraud. He mentioned a few parameters the software 'defeat devices' could monitor to establish the vehicle may be, being tested for emissions. A combination of steering wheel not be moving, ABS sensors not working, GPS showing the car is not actually moving or no GPS signal connection because the car is in a laboratory. The miniature sensors are fitted to the vehicle being tested and they go travelling about the place so the 'defeat device' software detects the vehicle is actually being driven and does not engage the emissions reduction operation of the vehicle.

[Grouse]

Before wiping the smile off anyone's face, I would like THE FACTS!

Did they actually detect when monitoring equipment was attached? How?

More likely they sensed the vehicle operating conditions and adjusted the engine for minimised emissions

In all these tests, they don't measure emissions at 100mph with 4 passengers going up hill!

What the software did was realise that there was no steering input and only the two wheels were turning.It also realised that there were no gears engaged or changed so just kicked into what would be called Limp mode so giving the least amount of power and as such the least amount of particulates. If by some chance they force people to remap their cars to reduce less particulates then all people will do is to get the engine remapped after the test All this software does is stop the need to get the remapping done and as I have said from the start if VW have been doing it then they all have just some have a better way of hiding it than others. You can also bet your last Dollar that the politicians knew this was going on but played both sides against each other pretending to please both

There we have it!

An entirely rational response to irrational tests

Let's have emission tests under real conditions

For sprung durch technik

We could have reduced emissions by sat nav

Think about it

[Don Mega]

Before wiping the smile off anyone's face, I would like THE FACTS!

Did they actually detect when monitoring equipment was attached? How?

More likely they sensed the vehicle operating conditions and adjusted the engine for minimised emissions

In all these tests, they don't measure emissions at 100mph with 4 passengers going up hill!

What the software did was realise that there was no steering input and only the two wheels were turning.It also realised that there were no gears engaged or changed so just kicked into what would be called Limp mode so giving the least amount of power and as such the least amount of particulates. If by some chance they force people to remap their cars to reduce less particulates then all people will do is to get the engine remapped after the test All this software does is stop the need to get the remapping done and as I have said from the start if VW have been doing it then they all have just some have a better way of hiding it than others. You can also bet your last Dollar that the politicians knew this was going on but played both sides against each other pretending to please both

How were the wheels turning if the no gears were engaged ?

[uksomchai]

I suppose you have never seen or heard of a Dyno then ? A rolling road ? Ever get your car tested in the UK ? Then that was a dyno / rolling road they used to test the brakes and emissions etc. The software just detects that the car isn't moving or being driven as normal so as said just kicks into emissions mode

People also don't realise that nearly all modern cars today are fitted with an aircraft style black box that records around 17 different parameters such as speed, applied brake pressure, steering input, lights etc. The car manufacturers won't tell you about this unless asked and will then tell you that the data is used for research and safety but the police in the UK and the EU have started to use it to prosecute drivers. It is nicknamed the Cube by the police and it plugs into the car and gives them access to all the recorded data. Having such a computer on the cars makes this type of scam easy really and a good software engineer would have made it nearly impossible to find. That is what is saving the other car makers up to now

Link to the cube here

http://www.scunthorpetelegraph.co.uk/New-tools-difference-life-death-8230/story-24525406-detail/story.html

Big brother really is watching and recording what you are doing

[Don Mega]

Iam very familiar with a dyno, thanks.

they need to be driven by the vehicle.

[uksomchai]

Iam very familiar with a dyno, thanks.

they need to be driven by the vehicle.

Then you don't know dynos as well as you think you do My brothers does both

[Don Mega]

Are you suggesting a chassis dyno does not require the vehicle (driven) to turn the rollers ?