SURVEY: Is Immigration becoming too intrusive?

[chrisinth]

I didn't check either of the boxes as my view is in between. I recognize that this is their country and to that end they have, of course, the right to be aware of where the 'visitors' are. Therefore not being too intrusive.

 

As for the bad guys finding a way around, they already have. The true bad guys are already here, established with correct permissions to stay whether that is through the elite system or a 'valid' non-O, non-B, whatever. Therefore, IMO, this extra paperwork may find a few lower rung 'bad guys' but will do nothing to upset the day of the true criminals.

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, DKA1961 said:

Nothing to worry about if you're doing the right thing...

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

[thaibeachlovers]

23 minutes ago, dominique355 said:

It is my impression that there is quite a discrepancy between what I read in the media and what happens to me personally.

I had to file the 90 days report and I just recently had to renew my visa at Bangkok's Chaeng Wattana building.

No intrusive questions were asked, all forms were the same as always and the checking of my visa renewal application took less than 5 minutes. OK, here was some waiting before, but the actual checking was lightning fast. Same for the renewal of the Re-entry visa.

 

But if in the future they really are going to ask me to fill out these infamous snooping forms, I will either refuse or put non-sense in it.

There isn't anything on it you HAVE to answer that isn't already stated on your visa extension, other than  ( if I remember correctly ) parents names. It just takes a few minutes.

For places frequently visited I put Big C.

[Caps]

1 hour ago, impulse said:

 

Unlike our own governments who will know a Thai's underwear size before they're even allowed on the plane.

 

Yes that is possible true...but at least it only happens once and you don't have to repeat yourself every 90 days, you don't get the BiB or immigration coming round to check on you just to see if you are still there.  You don't get to become a social outcast just because you are a foreigner.   You don't get a whiff of someone wanting a backhander just to make things smoother for you.  Oh and guess what, once you get there generally you can work and have access to the health care system but most of all you do get treated like a human being with rights and left alone to live your life which is more that can be said of been here.  

[thaibeachlovers]

57 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

Because people lie on the 90 day forms and 12 month workups and a visit to the home will expose the lies- and any bodies in the fridge, printing presses in the bedroom  or warehouses in the garage?

You think it includes a home check?

It doesn't. That's only for marriage extension because of scumbags and their fake marriages.

[Deepinthailand]

2 hours ago, Scott said:

90 days is a headache.   The 90 days some times has to be done at specific locations.   We have employees who must take a day off work to do the 90 day if they are married to a Thai and have a non-O visa.  

 

In Syria, I just had to show up at any police station anywhere with my passport.   I filled out nothing.   They just checked my passport and said 'thank you'.   If I was late there was no fine.  

 

I also said that it was the only place more intrusive than Thailand.  

 

 

Two things first were not in Syria so forget that comparison

Secondly do you not give your foreign empoyies time off then!!!! 2 or 3 hours every three months it's so hard or even 10 mins on computer. Wow really hard work.

[impulse]

9 minutes ago, Caps said:

 

Yes that is possible true...but at least it only happens once and you don't have to repeat yourself every 90 days, you don't get the BiB or immigration coming round to check on you just to see if you are still there.  You don't get to become a social outcast just because you are a foreigner.   You don't get a whiff of someone wanting a backhander just to make things smoother for you.  Oh and guess what, once you get there generally you can work and have access to the health care system but most of all you do get treated like a human being with rights and left alone to live your life which is more that can be said of been here.  

 

I'd be a little more convinced hearing from someone who has actually gone through that process.  It's rarely as easy as it looks to an outsider.  Just look at tax reporting requirements, for example.  When was the last time you had to fill in the long form while living in Thailand?

 

Edited October 2, 2016 by impulse

[SaintLouisBlues]

1 hour ago, impulse said:

Unlike our own governments who will know a Thai's underwear size before they're even allowed on the plane.

Ah, I was looking for an interesting job and I believe you've pointed me in the right direction - an "underwear size checker" for Thais. As a bisexual I believe I am uniquely placed to fill this role.

[impulse]

Just now, SaintLouisBlues said:

Ah, I was looking for an interesting job and I believe you've pointed me in the right direction - an "underwear size checker" for Thais. As a bisexual I believe I am uniquely placed to fill this role.

 

Is there a seminar for that?

[csabo]

Was doing a 90 in Phuket the other day, that new info form was mandatory for everyone now. Further more, the volunteer said the form must be turned it at every visit going forward including a fresh passport copy (not required before for 90 day reports) She gave me a copy to take so I could fill it out in advance in the future. I should have been in and out of there in 5 minutes but the new form confusion and the single handed copy girl who was now inundated with unnecessary copy work it took more than an hour to get through. Screw it. I'm filing by post from now on. When are they gonna lighten up and where in gods green earth do they store all of this relentless papaerwork???

[ChrisKC]

What I would like to know is why the Office is called "Immigration" at all? : The one thing we can't be is an immigrant!  Mind you, I have been into a Thai bakery where they didn't sell bread!

[CharlieK]

2 hours ago, sykray said:

It is in reality, from my perspective, asking for information that they already possess.  However, it does seem that it is bureaucracy, intrusive on my time and effort.  Having filled it in 3 months ago, I went with a photocopy when I next went for a 90 days visit.  No one asked for it and so I didn't offer it.  I will repeat this precaution next time.

On an note of empathy, I don't think that immigration staff want it.  It creates more unnecessary work for them.  I can't see how it achieves any purpose in catching "bad" people, but then, I don't think the 90 days check does either.

 

Would go one stage further, and suggest this document isn't actually an official immigration form! there is no TM number on it?

  

[DavisH]

3 hours ago, silverhawk_usa said:

It is the repetiveness that bothers me most.  Asking for the same information on multiple forms, which they already have on my visa extensions, and the fact that they now have more photos of me than I have myself.  Keyword: Computers.  Use them as they are intended.

Added to that is data security. Can Immigration be sure my address and bank details will not be displayed to all, all over the internet, as has happened in the recent past. I don't trust them one iota in this regard. 

[SaintLouisBlues]

5 minutes ago, DavisH said:

Added to that is data security. Can Immigration be sure my address and bank details will not be displayed to all, all over the internet, as has happened in the recent past. I don't trust them one iota in this regard. 

If you've nothing to hide you've nothing to fear?? 

[impulse]

46 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You think it includes a home check?

It doesn't. That's only for marriage extension because of scumbags and their fake marriages.

 

Given the recent threads about home checks, I assumed they played a part in the reason and timing for this survey.  Bad on me if I stepped out of bounds.

 

Edit:  BTW, don't sugar coat it.  How do you really feel about dodgy marriages?

Edited October 2, 2016 by impulse

[Scotwight]

1 hour ago, impulse said:

 

Because people lie on the 90 day forms and 12 month workups and a visit to the home will expose the lies- and any bodies in the fridge, printing presses in the bedroom  or warehouses in the garage?

That has nothing to do with what I posted.  I asked why get duplicate information using two forms when they already have the information on my retirement extension.  If they want to come to my house go for it.  I may be there or I may be traveling.  If they want to eliminate tourists and/or ex pats and can cope with the loss of income go for it.  Now the duplicate paperwork is harassment.  If it gets too bad I'll hire an agent who will pay the immigration a higher bribe which is the point, I think.  

[Scotwight]

15 minutes ago, SaintLouisBlues said:

If you've nothing to hide you've nothing to fear?? 

Who is afraid?  It is a nuisance - harassment nothing to do with fear.   

[impulse]

1 minute ago, Scotwight said:

That has nothing to do with what I posted.  I asked why get duplicate information using two forms when they already have the information on my retirement extension.  If they want to come to my house go for it.  I may be there or I may be traveling.  If they want to eliminate tourists and/or ex pats and can cope with the loss of income go for it.  Now the duplicate paperwork is harassment.  If it gets too bad I'll hire an agent who will pay the immigration a higher bribe which is the point, I think.  

 

Silly me.  When you used the word "harassment", I figured you meant something noteworthy.  I didn't think you were referring to a trivial inconvenience like filling out 2 forms with some overlapping info.

 

[SaintLouisBlues]

4 minutes ago, Scotwight said:

Who is afraid?  It is a nuisance - harassment nothing to do with fear.   

I'm merely quoting one of the more popular assertions in this thread so far

[jonesthebaker]

4 hours ago, DKA1961 said:

Nothing to worry about if you're doing the right thing...

Ha!  Obviously you know nothing of history or the world we inhabit:  (anyone who trusts government or higher authority is a fool - plain and simple)

 

'First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Socialist. Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Trade Unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me'.

[Scott]

1 hour ago, Deepinthailand said:

Two things first were not in Syria so forget that comparison

Secondly do you not give your foreign empoyies time off then!!!! 2 or 3 hours every three months it's so hard or even 10 mins on computer. Wow really hard work.

We have several hundred foreign employees.   They all get time off to get the 90 day reporting done.   We have a full-time, dedicated staff person to help with visas, work permits and the 90 day reporting.  

 

Since we have employees with various types of visas, some of which can only be reported in the province in which they live, it is not a 2-3 hours to get it done.   It is a full-day out of work.   That's a fair number of people away at any given time.   Oh, and since many don't have their own transportation, it means arranging for a van, driver and the visa person to take them to immigration.   That also is a lot more than a 2 to 3 hour loss of time.

 

It is virtually impossible for the visa person to keep track of the 90 day reporting because many employees will leave the country for short stints and thus the time changes.   People tend to forget, put it off, wait until the last minute and all the other things that happen with people, so it becomes a headache.   It costs employers a fair amount of time and money.  

[NongKhaiKid]

2 hours ago, impulse said:

 

And I also think some people are confused by the fact that they only get intrusive after you've pretty much settled here.  

 

Unlike our own governments who will know a Thai's underwear size before they're even allowed on the plane.

I can only speak about the British govt and while they may know about someone's underwear before they board the plane they also have a habit of ' mislaying ' new arrivals.

 

About eighteen months to two years ago the Home Office admitted there was something like 180,000 people who'd arrived on all sorts of visas and they had no idea where they were. Once in the country that seemed to be it more or less and there's little hope of tracing them.

Incidentally the Home Secretary of the day is now PM who had a habit of wriggling out of a mess or two by managing to blame others.

[55Jay]

"No, they are not and it will help to weed out the 'bad' guys."

 

Selecting "No" indicates you do not think Immi has become more intrusive.  The second half of that response cancels the first by indicating it (intrusiveness) DOES exist and will help weed out the bad guys. Huh?

 

At any rate, I haven't noticed anything new and unusual in my interactions with Immi.  Was expecting to get the Farang Survey at my last 90 day in July, but it never materialized, nobody mentioned it, so I did the deed and exited stage left.  Due again this month.  Think I'll try online this time.

[masuk]

5 hours ago, Scotwight said:

They already know everything about people on retirement extensions the form is just extra paperwork to harass the old fellow.  

I'd love to know if anyone (Immigration or other) has done any research on whether or not it's the retirees running the credit card scams, illegal gambling, and a host of other non-sociable activities.

All of the retirees I've met seem to be likeable folk, getting along well with Thais, interested in community activities, and have lived here for many years.

So I don't see what all the mindless questions are about, such as the current questionnaires are asking.

Yes, it does seem to be a form of harassment, and I wonder how many illegal activities have been uncovered amongst the information we've been asked to supply.

[impulse]

17 minutes ago, NongKhaiKid said:

I can only speak about the British govt and while they may know about someone's underwear before they board the plane they also have a habit of ' mislaying ' new arrivals.

 

Any time I feel put out by my visa situation, I get into a nice air conditioned taxi with a cold drink and have him drive by the Embassy on Wireless Road to see the poor schleppes waiting in the sun for their appointment to see if they can even get into the USA.  Not to gloat at their misery, but to pound some perspective into my little pinhead.

 

Worked even better in China where the line wrapped around the block- often in the freezing wintertime.

 

Because for every whining expat (and I have been one), there's a hundred Thais griping about the hoops they have to jump through that falangs who come to Thailand don't.  And in China, it was the lao wais that got visas sooooo easy.  Not that it felt that way to us.

[JHolmesJr]

Immigration everywhere has gotten way out of hand, creating cultural problems if not managed properly.

 

It used to be a far slower and organic process….but it is one of the key pillars of all this globalisation BS that supplies cheap labour to the MNCs who lobbied hard and spent billions to buy politicians to make it a reality.

 

Immigration based on a countries needs and a candidates excellence is one thing….just randomly allowing all sorts of dross through in the hope that they will become toilet attendants and taxi drivers is just nonsense.

[AsianExport]

Yes they are being intrusive with people who let them do ! Enjoy being a victim guys !

[louse1953]

5 hours ago, Scott said:

90 days is a headache.   The 90 days some times has to be done at specific locations.   We have employees who must take a day off work to do the 90 day if they are married to a Thai and have a non-O visa.  

 

In Syria, I just had to show up at any police station anywhere with my passport.   I filled out nothing.   They just checked my passport and said 'thank you'.   If I was late there was no fine.  

 

I also said that it was the only place more intrusive than Thailand.  

 

 

Your employees can write a letter or send an email,can't they.

[louse1953]

1 hour ago, Scott said:

We have several hundred foreign employees.   They all get time off to get the 90 day reporting done.   We have a full-time, dedicated staff person to help with visas, work permits and the 90 day reporting.  

 

Since we have employees with various types of visas, some of which can only be reported in the province in which they live, it is not a 2-3 hours to get it done.   It is a full-day out of work.   That's a fair number of people away at any given time.   Oh, and since many don't have their own transportation, it means arranging for a van, driver and the visa person to take them to immigration.   That also is a lot more than a 2 to 3 hour loss of time.

 

It is virtually impossible for the visa person to keep track of the 90 day reporting because many employees will leave the country for short stints and thus the time changes.   People tend to forget, put it off, wait until the last minute and all the other things that happen with people, so it becomes a headache.   It costs employers a fair amount of time and money.  

Why are people working so far from home and not registed locally.

[ubonjoe]

6 minutes ago, louse1953 said:

Your employees can write a letter or send an email,can't they.

Write a letter or send a email for a 90 day report?