British man assassinated in gangland hit in Pattaya

[lungnorm]

For once it appears the RTP are on the ball, possibly because of the amateurish way this hit was carried out. They found the mike and the idiots rented it in their own names and seems they didn't take long to cross into Cambodia. The two suspects named before seem to be the ones involved. Nice CCTV pic of them up the road fleeing the crime scene.  

[JonnyF]

2 hours ago, Stanley78 said:

The thing is that in online gambling we don't try to shutdown competitors and we don't care where our competitors are based. If we did care then the entire island of Malta, which is stacked with online gambling operators, would turn into a bloodbath. You can't go to lunch there without seeing 10 other gambling operators in the same restaurant.

 

The only way it would be an issue, would be if say Tony worked for/with a gambling operator. And then he decided to branch out on his own and stole their customer data or other business secrets. That has happened a number of times in online gambling. Even with millions of customers. And guess what, no one was shot.

 

But that sounds like a long shot compared to boiler room/other fraud activities.

 

Maybe the RTP doesn't want it to be related to boiler rooms and prefer to pick a smaller target and say it's gambling instead?

I think you're right. Very unlikely to be online gambling, but it might be in the interests of some influential people for the Pattaya boiler room scene to be kept well off the radar and out of the news. Don't want any government crackdowns that stop the flow.

[LandOfWiles]

6 hours ago, pegman said:

A guy on a Cambodia forum stated he knew Kenway years ago and he had told him he was planning to open a business in Phnom Penh. The Portuguese/South African guy lived in Phnom Penh as did his mother and sister. Maybe he or his family got ripped off there. That could explain some of the amateurness.

 

I guess we will know more soon enough, but the above seems to be most likely explanation.

 

If I were to speculate I would say this:

 

- The web business partner dispute thing is just a red herring.

- The two suspects were not criminals (they are now) but victims looking to get their cash back

- The two suspects probably didn't even know each other until recently (it would be easy to find people online that had been victims of a similar scam)

- They were probably able to track Kenway down after his recent arrest

 

I very much doubt these three were business partners. More likely, the two meetings to resolve the dispute as mentioned by Kenway's wife, were meetings where the victims were demanding their monies back. Turner was in Thailand during November for a day and then returned with Calderia on January 19th. After two meetings with an unsatisfactory outcome it seems that they chose the nuclear option.

 

Purely speculation of course but it seems more plausible than any of the other explanations I've heard so far. 

[Briggsy]

There's online gambling and then there are fraudster operations in which customers are prevented from making any withdrawals from their accounts. The latter being effectively a boiler room operation using an online gambling front. Usually these latter operations are based in Eastern Europe, Bulgaria, Moldova, Ukraine. They can only last a few months before having to reinvent themselves under a different name. In the short term these are very profitable. Customers deposit money in their account and the owner steals it.

[walterego]

What kind of a Porsche is it? Cayenne? Macan?

A Used Cayenne say 2012 with 50ks on the clock is only about $60k USD If looking good in a car is a priority for you (and it is mentioned he is a petrol head) or if you are the type of guy who thinks a car represents status (I dont, but many do) then this is NOT an outlandishly expensive car.

Get a life ..... Or if you think the vehicle is too expensive perhaps...... get a job.

[elgordo38]

47 minutes ago, LandOfWiles said:

 

I guess we will know more soon enough, but the above seems to be most likely explanation.

 

If I were to speculate I would say this:

 

- The web business partner dispute thing is just a red herring.

- The two suspects were not criminals (they are now) but victims looking to get their cash back

- The two suspects probably didn't even know each other until recently (it would be easy to find people online that had been victims of a similar scam)

- They were probably able to track Kenway down after his recent arrest

 

I very much doubt these three were business partners. More likely, the two meetings to resolve the dispute as mentioned by Kenway's wife, were meetings where the victims were demanding their monies back. Turner was in Thailand during November for a day and then returned with Calderia on January 19th. After two meetings with an unsatisfactory outcome it seems that they chose the nuclear option.

 

Purely speculation of course but it seems more plausible than any of the other explanations I've heard so far. 

Sherlock Holmes has nothing on you. It all sounds plausible. 

[roo860]

What kind of a Porsche is it? Cayenne? Macan?
A Used Cayenne say 2012 with 50ks on the clock is only about $60k USD If looking good in a car is a priority for you (and it is mentioned he is a petrol head) or if you are the type of guy who thinks a car represents status (I dont, but many do) then this is NOT an outlandishly expensive car.
Get a life ..... Or if you think the vehicle is too expensive perhaps...... get a job.

Walter the one he had for sale on Baht sold website was a white Cayenne Hybrid price 5.4 million baht. The one he was shot in was a Cayenne as well, but a different model, there are plenty of pics of it.

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[pegman]

50 minutes ago, LandOfWiles said:

 

I guess we will know more soon enough, but the above seems to be most likely explanation.

 

If I were to speculate I would say this:

 

- The web business partner dispute thing is just a red herring.

- The two suspects were not criminals (they are now) but victims looking to get their cash back

- The two suspects probably didn't even know each other until recently (it would be easy to find people online that had been victims of a similar scam)

- They were probably able to track Kenway down after his recent arrest

 

I very much doubt these three were business partners. More likely, the two meetings to resolve the dispute as mentioned by Kenway's wife, were meetings where the victims were demanding their monies back. Turner was in Thailand during November for a day and then returned with Calderia on January 19th. After two meetings with an unsatisfactory outcome it seems that they chose the nuclear option.

 

Purely speculation of course but it seems more plausible than any of the other explanations I've heard so far. 

Good point about the possible mutual victim tie in. As for finding him online everything you needed to know was on his FaceBook. He couldn't have been too concerned about being tracked down with how open his net footprint was.

[pegman]

24 minutes ago, walterego said:

What kind of a Porsche is it? Cayenne? Macan?

A Used Cayenne say 2012 with 50ks on the clock is only about $60k USD If looking good in a car is a priority for you (and it is mentioned he is a petrol head) or if you are the type of guy who thinks a car represents status (I dont, but many do) then this is NOT an outlandishly expensive car.

Get a life ..... Or if you think the vehicle is too expensive perhaps...... get a job.

Are you talking the Thai luxury car market?

[elgordo38]

10 minutes ago, roo860 said:

 

 

Walter the one he had for sale on Baht sold website was a white Cayenne Hybrid price 5.4 million baht. The one he was shot in was a Cayenne as well, but a different model, there are plenty of pics of it.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Thaivisa Connect mobile app
 

 

 

Yes I can remember when I was 39 I also owned 4 large properties and drove a Porsche and was under police investigation. Sounds like a stalwart citizen to me. 

[tropo]

5 hours ago, YeahSiam said:

Nope that's not what I said.

I responded to your suggestion that driving a Porsche is "asking for trouble".

It's not "asking for trouble" - foreigners are generally perceived to have more money anyway so by your logic, just having a white face is enough to get you smoked, kidnapped or jacked here and, sorry, but most farangs report feeling safer here than in their own countries.

 

Look, maybe you live in a backwater with loads of people getting around 4 or 5 to a moped.

I see that shit once in blue moon around here

I see lots of people - Thai and non-Thai - driving BMWs, Mercs or Porsches and they aren't in mortal danger.

OK, I've got it. Your rationale is that because you've seen lots of non-Thais driving around in expensive sports cars and you haven't personally witnessed any problems, it must be safe.

 

Unfortunately there'll never be sufficient non-Thai exotic sports car owners to prove your point or mine, so let's just leave it at that.

 

Happy motoring!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[juice777]

I am not into cars but that looks like a pretty poor excuse for a porschse to me.

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[Rimmer]

Some posts have removed, this is private information that has not so far as we know been released to the public so best it is removed also the source is not approved as a news  source by Thai Visa.

[Pat in Pattaya]

This topic has turned into a thread about Porsche's and the merits of owning one, or otherwise. Can't say I'm surprised.

Edited January 26, 2017 by Pat in Pattaya

[juice777]

This thread has turned into a thread about Porsches' and the merits of owning one, or otherwise. Can't say I'm supried.

is it a bit odd how all the press are saying man shot dead in his Porsche. If it was a Ford I don't think they would say man shot dead in his ford.

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[lungnorm]

2 minutes ago, juice777 said:

is it a bit odd how all the press are saying man shot dead in his Porsche. If it was a Ford I don't think they would say man shot dead in his ford.

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It just supports what they assume he was a Mr Rich crook. Anyway Fords are not cool.

[juice777]

It just supports what they assume he was a Mr Rich crook. Anyway Fords are not cool.

To Me it's a bit like haha you got a Porschse but you are still Dead. Quite sad if you ask me even the BBC are guilty of it.

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[AlexRich]

1 minute ago, juice777 said:

is it a bit odd how all the press are saying man shot dead in his Porsche. If it was a Ford I don't think they would say man shot dead in his ford.

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Not really, the fact that he appears to have some wealth whilst living in Pattaya, a city known for having it's fair share of criminal sorts, gives readers sufficient "read between the lines" opportunities to speculate on the motives of the assailants ... revenge, jealousy, etc. By the look of things he wasn't murdered because he drove a Porsche, as many have pointed out. But it symbolises a 'bling' lifestyle, not an issue in Monaco, but a tad suspect in Pattaya.

 

[juice777]

 

Not really, the fact that he appears to have some wealth whilst living in Pattaya, a city known for having it's fair share of criminal sorts, gives readers sufficient "read between the lines" opportunities to speculate on the motives of the assailants ... revenge, jealousy, etc. By the look of things he wasn't murdered because he drove a Porsche, as many have pointed out. But it symbolises a 'bling' lifestyle, not an issue in Monaco, but a tad suspect in Pattaya.

 

Maybe on this site but dose the average BBC reader think like that. I bet most don't know anything about Pattaya. Just a cheap headline if you ask me.

Are you Rich or is it you name?

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[AlexRich]

Just now, juice777 said:

Maybe on this site but dose the BBC reader think lime that. I met must don't know anything about Pattaya. Just a cheap headline if you ask me.

Are you Rich or us it you name?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
 

 

The name is a short chuu len (nick name). As for wealth, you'd never know by looking at me ... which is recommended if you reside in Thailand. The BBC are just linking expensive car, expat and Pattaya ... which sounds a bit dodgy in itself ... I suspect they know more than they print, but they are more likely to be sued than you or I, so use words and phrases that allude to 'dodgy' rather than saying it outright.

 

[juice777]

 
The name is a short chuu len (nick name). As for wealth, you'd never know by looking at me ... which is recommended if you reside in Thailand. The BBC are just linking expensive car, expat and Pattaya ... which sounds a bit dodgy in itself ... I suspect they know more than they print, but they are more likely to be sued than you or I, so use words and phrases that allude to 'dodgy' rather than saying it outright.
 

I was thinking that myself but If you read it just goes on about him being a family man and all that . And NO links to boiler rooms or anything. Or how Pattaya is famous for being a wild west type place. So I think they just love to add the word Porsche to a headline. I am sure if it was anywhere else in the world they would have done the same. But that's just the way I see it.

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[YeahSiam]

1 hour ago, tropo said:

OK, I've got it. Your rationale is that because you've seen lots of non-Thais driving around in expensive sports cars and you haven't personally witnessed any problems, it must be safe.

 

Unfortunately there'll never be sufficient non-Thai exotic sports car owners to prove your point or mine, so let's just leave it at that.

 

Happy motoring!

 

Have you seen direct evidence that a foreigner driving an expensive sportscar is more likely to have problems?

Isn't it more likely that you're imposing some sort of bias acquired, perhaps, in your home country where someone might realistically been more susceptible to a beating or a robbery?

 

A guy driving a Porsche in parts of England would likely have it keyed by jealous louts when he parked it overnight.

Thais tend to respond positively to nice things, not sneer in envy like Westerners do

 

[AlexRich]

56 minutes ago, YeahSiam said:

 

Have you seen direct evidence that a foreigner driving an expensive sportscar is more likely to have problems?

Isn't it more likely that you're imposing some sort of bias acquired, perhaps, in your home country where someone might realistically been more susceptible to a beating or a robbery?

 

A guy driving a Porsche in parts of England would likely have it keyed by jealous louts when he parked it overnight.

Thais tend to respond positively to nice things, not sneer in envy like Westerners do

 

I don't think anyone is claimimg that the guy was killed because he drove a Porsche, but they are, in my view, correct to point out that drawing attraction to yourself in Pattaya ... with Police or other expats ... is not a great idea. You're right that ordinary Thai's are not an issue, but Pattaya has a greater share of crooks, mafia, corruption, etc than most other places in Thailand. If you are up to no good, and have a decent brain, you keep the lowest of low profiles.

[sanemax]

The assassin flew in a few days before from South America .

I wonder which South American Country

Columbia, perchance ?

[LandOfWiles]

20 minutes ago, sanemax said:

The assassin flew in a few days before from South America .

I wonder which South American Country

Columbia, perchance ?

Are you sure about that, mate? Caldeira came across the land border from Cambodia according to most reports. His family live there and he appears to have spent time there in 2016 (source: Facebook). 

[zorro1]

This settles my only question on how they got to Trat after the hit. They had to return the motorbike and then get nearly 400kms to Trat in roughtly 4 hours to cross the border at around 3pm.

How long would the journey normally take?

[lungnorm]

1 minute ago, zorro1 said:

How long would the journey normally take?

Its approx 400kms the bus timetables say 4-5hrs  but by car/van should be done in 3.1/2 to 4hrs

 

[petermik]

7 hours ago, lungnorm said:

Its approx 400kms the bus timetables say 4-5hrs  but by car/van should be done in 3.1/2 to 4hrs

 

what if it had a police "escort" though

[lungnorm]

2 minutes ago, petermik said:

what if it had a police "escort" though

Well would be under 3hrs I think.

[BruceMangosteen]

20 minutes ago, zorro1 said:

How long would the journey normally take?

In a hired van/car, about four hours to Trat and another hour to the border itself in Had Lek.

 

Worth mentioning is the idea they rented and returned the motorcycle to the vendor, for the deposit? and were in town for several days casing it all out we can assume.