Video: Freak accident as cyclist killed in tour bus accident at Cha-Am beach.

[foxboy]

59 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Yes, I would agree with what you say, but in this instance there is no footpath its a shared space, to a certain extent the cyclist is riding on the pavement and the pedestrian is on the road, in a shared space they both have a duty of care to avoid each other, appropriate speed etc.

The bike hits the pedestrian, not the other way round.

what speed do you estimate she was doing that would not be "appropriate"? Others here have also referred to her "speeding", "charging along"... what utter nonsense. She is going no faster than her companion and he is free-wheeling! ??

[balo]

3 hours ago, Eli1 said:

A pedestrian is not traffic especially one that just comes out on to a road with out looking

 

This is Thailand , a pedestrian is just one of the many dangers you face on the narrow roads here.  As a cyclist you need to be aware of your sorroundings at all times.

I am out with my bike almost daily and the first thing I did was to buy mirrors for my electric bicycle.  You need to focus 100% .  

If a bus comes from behind I just slow down . If I see a crowded soi with lots of people walking around I slow down .  TIT. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Eli1]

21 hours ago, balo said:

 

This is Thailand , a pedestrian is just one of the many dangers you face on the narrow roads here.  As a cyclist you need to be aware of your sorroundings at all times.

I am out with my bike almost daily and the first thing I did was to buy mirrors for my electric bicycle.  You need to focus 100% .  

If a bus comes from behind I just slow down . If I see a crowded soi with lots of people walking around I slow down .  TIT. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As you can see that cyclist was doing appropriate speed for cycling on a road she can't help it if some idiot came out on the road without even looking and pushed her on onto oncoming traffic...

[Eli1]

On 7/22/2017 at 10:34 PM, foxboy said:

We are all taking different sides as to whether the pedestrian moved/didn't move, away/towards the cyclist.. but that is irrelevant. She knocked her off her bike, we cannot dispute that. 

If the cyclist was riding on the pavement she would owe a duty of care to avoid pedestrians. A pedestrian walking in the road owes a duty of care to avoid being hit by vehicles, including cyclists. If she wandered into the path of a car and it had no time or space to avoid her, is it the driver's fault if he hits her??? Hell no!! 

The negligence of the pedestrian is to blame here, she should have had her eyes open and her wits about her. I only wish the lady had been riding a Sam-lor rather than a bicycle, to produce a very different outcome! 

Mate your on the money, I can't believe for the life of me how people can watch a video and still come up with something completely different it's just bizarre... how in the hell could you not see it's that pedestrians fault got me beat. I think a lot of people that are commenting on here have lived in Thailand for way too long.

[Eli1]

23 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

Yes, I would agree with what you say, but in this instance there is no footpath its a shared space, to a certain extent the cyclist is riding on the pavement and the pedestrian is on the road, in a shared space they both have a duty of care to avoid each other, appropriate speed etc.

The bike hits the pedestrian, not the other way round.

It's the other why around mate looked at the video and you can see perfectly well that the pedestrian just walk straight out in front of that cyclists with out even looking SHE WAS ON HER PHONE are you even denying that? Sherlock Holmes.

[moe666]

On 7/12/2017 at 2:51 AM, JamJar said:

 

Perhaps you missed the bit where I wrote that she wasn't paying attention because she was looking at her phone. Not because she was walking on the road.  It's quite possible that the cyclist had clip in pedals, so couldn't jump off the bike easily.

The lady was probably freaked out about the accident more than likely fight or run kicked in. I find it interesting how many posters her are all to prone to accuse people of being cowards when they where not at the scene and have no idea what was going on in the other persons mind. Until you experience it you do not know how you will react.

[geriatrickid]

2 hours ago, moe666 said:

The lady was probably freaked out about the accident more than likely fight or run kicked in. I find it interesting how many posters her are all to prone to accuse people of being cowards when they where not at the scene and have no idea what was going on in the other persons mind. Until you experience it you do not know how you will react.

Hello. It was Thailand. we all know how the locals and some  foreigners react to this type of event. They don't stick around because they do not wish to take responsibility. It's part of the blaming of someone else or something else behavior pattern.

[balo]

2 hours ago, geriatrickid said:

They don't stick around because they do not wish to take responsibility. It's part of the blaming of someone else or something else behavior pattern.

Nonsense , I don't know what your agenda is here on TV , but you should try to understand that not all people in Thailand think the same.   I had Thais helping me after an accident , really kind people , you would wish to meet.

 

 

[YetAnother]

On 7/12/2017 at 3:12 AM, balo said:

I use the bicycle myself almost daily but not on busy roads and always slowly .  You need to pay attention every second on Thai roads.

very much agree; that bike, altho obviously not a cheap one, does not appear to have high grade brakes; on mine i can stop so fast that i might go over the handlebars;'modern' brakes are That much better

[gk10002000]

On ‎7‎/‎23‎/‎2017 at 9:19 AM, Eli1 said:

As you can see that cyclist was doing appropriate speed for cycling on a road she can't help it if some idiot came out on the road without even looking and pushed her on onto oncoming traffic...

Appropriate speed yes.  But passing a bus on the Left.   Cycles on the road I believe are supposed to follow the same general traffic laws as autos.  Passing on the left is a no no.  You pass on the right in Thailand.  In addition, a report was that she was clipped into her pedals.  That doesn't make it easy to hop off.  And one should be very very careful being broadside of any truck or bus.  Gosh every week there are similar stories of cyclist or pedestrians, or motorbikers ending up under vehicles.  narrow streets, un foreseen lane changes, etc.  This was a confluence of bad actions and she paid the price.  Now banish to hell that coward pedestrian that immediately ran away instead of maybe lending assistance.  Although it looks like the cyclist was fatally crushed instantly and nothing could be done to help her

[eeyang wah]

On 22/07/2017 at 7:34 PM, foxboy said:

We are all taking different sides as to whether the pedestrian moved/didn't move, away/towards the cyclist.. but that is irrelevant. She knocked her off her bike, we cannot dispute that. 

If the cyclist was riding on the pavement she would owe a duty of care to avoid pedestrians. A pedestrian walking in the road owes a duty of care to avoid being hit by vehicles, including cyclists. If she wandered into the path of a car and it had no time or space to avoid her, is it the driver's fault if he hits her??? Hell no!! 

The negligence of the pedestrian is to blame here, she should have had her eyes open and her wits about her. I only wish the lady had been riding a Sam-lor rather than a bicycle, to produce a very different outcome! 

I agree with you except that in this case the pedestrian did not suddenly appear in the road giving 'no time or space to avoid her'. You can see she was walking in a straight line along the road for a good 4-5 seconds before the bike ploughed into her.

 

Not to mention she was by no means the only pedestrian walking on the road in that place. 

 

Other posters have stated that her running away is admission of guilt. I don't agree with this for a moment. She was clearly shocked by what she had just witnessed. I doubt any of us could think clearly immediately after watching someone's head go under a bus.

[foxboy]

11 minutes ago, eeyang wah said:

I agree with you except that in this case the pedestrian did not suddenly appear in the road giving 'no time or space to avoid her'. You can see she was walking in a straight line along the road for a good 4-5 seconds before the bike ploughed into her.

 

Not to mention she was by no means the only pedestrian walking on the road in that place. 

 

Other posters have stated that her running away is admission of guilt. I don't agree with this for a moment. She was clearly shocked by what she had just witnessed. I doubt any of us could think clearly immediately after watching someone's head go under a bus.

It was a few seconds, around 3-4 max. When riding my bike I often look just ahead of my front wheel and occasionally glance down at my front derailleur, especially while changing gear. If I looked up and saw someone directly in my path I would be horrified. My first thought would be 'how the hell did they not see me coming?' Walking in the road amongst vehicles is dangerous. The UK Highway Code states if there is no pavement.. "You should take extra care and.. keep close to the side of the road." She should have had her eyes wide open, and be ready to move quickly. She didn't move out of the way because it was only a bicycle. She would have leapt out of the way if it was a motorbike! 

[balo]

3 hours ago, foxboy said:

When riding my bike I often look just ahead of my front wheel and occasionally glance down at my front derailleur, especially while changing gear. If I looked up and saw someone directly in my path I would be horrified. My first thought would be 'how the hell did they not see me coming?'

 

You must be living a dangerous life in Thailand . You look at your wheel instead of the road in front of you ? Really ?  The pedestrian should be easy to spot from distance , 3-4 seconds should be enough to reduce the speed.   

 

You would be horrified if you saw someone in front of you ? Come on , this is Thailand.  Anything can happen on the roads and you need to stay focused all the time. 

 

Maybe you only ride in the UK ? 

[Eli1]

On 7/24/2017 at 0:45 AM, moe666 said:

The lady was probably freaked out about the accident more than likely fight or run kicked in. I find it interesting how many posters her are all to prone to accuse people of being cowards when they where not at the scene and have no idea what was going on in the other persons mind. Until you experience it you do not know how you will react.

Pal, you don't need to make any excuses for idiots you don't have to be there to know what was going on in the video that careless pedestrian has caused somebody's life to end.

And her lack of compassion didn't help typical Thai's they always run from an accident whether it's a car accident or whether it's something tragic like this it's in there nature so stop making excuses for her for crying out loud.

That wouldn't have happened in any normal country. This could have been one of your family, then I wonder what your outlook would have been. Thai's need to stop and be responsible for their action.

[Eli1]

On 7/24/2017 at 5:50 AM, balo said:

Nonsense , I don't know what your agenda is here on TV , but you should try to understand that not all people in Thailand think the same.   I had Thais helping me after an accident , really kind people , you would wish to meet.

 

 

Then your one of the luckey one's mate.

[foxboy]

5 hours ago, balo said:

 

You must be living a dangerous life in Thailand . You look at your wheel instead of the road in front of you ? Really ?  The pedestrian should be easy to spot from distance , 3-4 seconds should be enough to reduce the speed.   

 

You would be horrified if you saw someone in front of you ? Come on , this is Thailand.  Anything can happen on the roads and you need to stay focused all the time. 

 

Maybe you only ride in the UK ? 

I do only ride in UK. I am merely suggesting that the lady cyclist could have taken her eyes off the road ahead, for a couple of seconds, as I often do.

You seem to be allowing the pedestrian's ignorant behaviour because 'this is Thailand'. I'm sorry but I don't see it that way, that a cyclist on the road should be the one who stops to allow a daydreaming pedestrian to walk past. 

As I have said before, if the lady was riding a motorbike or sam-lor instead, the pedestrian would NOT have walked into her path. Or if she had, she would be the one coming off worst.

You have every right to see it differently, but this is how I see it

[mommysboy]

I think the pedestrian was at fault, but because she was already in the road sometime before the accident then the cyclist should have been aware.  Is it me or did the pedestrian stumble out a bit just before?  Absolutely tragic.  It highlights the need to go very slow in busy built up areas.  Awful event.

[Eli1]

On 26/07/2017 at 5:27 AM, foxboy said:

I do only ride in UK. I am merely suggesting that the lady cyclist could have taken her eyes off the road ahead, for a couple of seconds, as I often do.

You seem to be allowing the pedestrian's ignorant behaviour because 'this is Thailand'. I'm sorry but I don't see it that way, that a cyclist on the road should be the one who stops to allow a daydreaming pedestrian to walk past. 

As I have said before, if the lady was riding a motorbike or sam-lor instead, the pedestrian would NOT have walked into her path. Or if she had, she would be the one coming off worst.

You have every right to see it differently, but this is how I see it

Your on the money foxboy I wouldn't worry about what anyone says that pedestrian was a bloody idiot she caused the death of that cyclist and run away like a little gutless dog she was.

[Nowisee]

I don't see how it was the pedestrian fault totally.  even if she did wonder out another 6".. the cyclist riding in that area has to be alert and able to yield left or right.  It looked like the cyclist had room between the bus and the pedestrian.  I would not have ridden so close to a pedestrian...or at least a verbal alert as I was doing so.  
Total freak accident and I would not put absolute blame on either person.  
I feel for the friend... coming back and seeing your riding partner wreathing on the ground dying would be tough.

Never been in that area, but big buses IMO are a PITA and should not be allowed in many areas.  Those areas were never designed for them.  
Anyway, sad situation for the cycling community.

 

[Eli1]

On 13/08/2017 at 4:09 PM, Nowisee said:

I don't see how it was the pedestrian fault totally.  even if she did wonder out another 6".. the cyclist riding in that area has to be alert and able to yield left or right.  It looked like the cyclist had room between the bus and the pedestrian.  I would not have ridden so close to a pedestrian...or at least a verbal alert as I was doing so.  
Total freak accident and I would not put absolute blame on either person.  
I feel for the friend... coming back and seeing your riding partner wreathing on the ground dying would be tough.

Never been in that area, but big buses IMO are a PITA and should not be allowed in many areas.  Those areas were never designed for them.  
Anyway, sad situation for the cycling community.

 

Oh really you didn't see pedestrian just walking out without looking?

I'm just wondering if you watching the same video we are...lol

I'd say the cyclist was alert the whole time but when you got somebody that just pops out in front of you it's a bit hard to avoid.... the funny thing is we can all see the video but we are all coming up with different thoughts I mean you can see clearly that the pedestrian bumped into the cyclist.

When your on a bicycle and somebody pops out in front of you like that it's a bit hard to react really quick that's why she came off the bike do you think she really wanted to go under a bus.

[Nowisee]

19 hours ago, Eli1 said:

Oh really you didn't see pedestrian just walking out without looking?

I'm just wondering if you watching the same video we are...lol

I'd say the cyclist was alert the whole time but when you got somebody that just pops out in front of you it's a bit hard to avoid.... the funny thing is we can all see the video but we are all coming up with different thoughts I mean you can see clearly that the pedestrian bumped into the cyclist.

When your on a bicycle and somebody pops out in front of you like that it's a bit hard to react really quick that's why she came off the bike do you think she really wanted to go under a bus.

You can interpret it the way you want.  I do not see the person "popping" out.  The  bumping into the cyclist is the same as the cyclist bumping into the person.  The angle of the camera does not let me see the distance, but it does not look like the person moved very much.. and IMO, as a cyclist I just would not ride that close to a person and if I did, certainly not at speed with traffic around.  It also comes down to experience.    
My riding experience I have never plowed into a person.

Your last question is just stupid.
 

[balo]

19 hours ago, Eli1 said:

I'd say the cyclist was alert the whole time but when you got somebody that just pops out in front of you it's a bit hard to avoid...

If we could watch a video of the cyclist starting 200 meters before the accident it would be easier to prove that the cyclist was speeding and did not slow down enough , the visibility should not be a problem  .   

 

 

 

[Eli1]

On 19/08/2017 at 8:40 PM, balo said:

If we could watch a video of the cyclist starting 200 meters before the accident it would be easier to prove that the cyclist was speeding and did not slow down enough , the visibility should not be a problem  .   

 

 

 

Honestly what are you talking about cyclists speeding are you kidding me this whole topic is just getting to wacky for me the administrator needs to get rid of it some pretty stupid questions been asked and said.

[Eli1]

On 19/08/2017 at 8:22 PM, Nowisee said:

You can interpret it the way you want.  I do not see the person "popping" out.  The  bumping into the cyclist is the same as the cyclist bumping into the person.  The angle of the camera does not let me see the distance, but it does not look like the person moved very much.. and IMO, as a cyclist I just would not ride that close to a person and if I did, certainly not at speed with traffic around.  It also comes down to experience.    
My riding experience I have never plowed into a person.

Your last question is just stupid.
 

My last question is stupid? but your hole  answer is even more pathetic and who you trying to kid that you're a cyclist because if you're a cyclist you would see what was going and make a better judgement I think the last time you where on a bike is when youre 5 year-old.

You can just tell by the way you've perceived the whole thing. And why did she look back and then she run away like the guilty coward she was, explain that, then again her action Explains It all no need cheers.

[473geo]

The other day I read all the posts I this topic, I found the differences of opinion to be expected. The interesting point about the comments is there are indeed many cyclists who are prepared attribute part of the cause to the cyclist and do not lay it all on the pedestrian.

I have been brought down by a pedestrian who simply stepped across a path as I was almost alongside. He was wearing a headset listening to what I don't know. I was going very gently, there was minimum contact, but yes over I went. So I have experience.

 

In this case the pedestrian was already on the road when the cyclist approached, cyclists need to give a pedestrian as wider berth as possible, they are an unknown quantity, and yes I have on many occasions seen pedestrians play chicken with me on my cycle moving at the last possible moment to prove they have a right to walk where they want. Ignorant yes, but unfortunately quite common to see 3 or more people spread across a pedestrian/cycle path and just hold their ground, many times I have been forced to go off the path surface to avoid these inconsiderate individuals. During school term I travel against the traffic flow in a cycle lane, many children crossing between the traffic and not expecting me in a contraflow cycle lane coming the other way. People just step out. I have done so many emergency stops I have lost count. But I an aware of the danger and travel at a steady speed where I can stop.

 

To evaluate the contributory causes to this unfortunate accident one has to remove the result.

 

The lady on the bicycle got too close to the pedestrian, in turn the pedestrian misjudged how close the cyclist was coming. Perhaps the cyclist was unnerved by the proximity of the bus or just misjudged the space required to pass freely. If the cyclist was unnerved by the proximity of the bus she should have stopped and allowed the pedestrian to move past or clear the way.

 

But then hindsight cannot fix the unfortunate outcome, I for one have had a valuable cycling lesson re-enforced by this this tragic accident, which will stay in my mind for a long long time.

Pedestrians are an unknown, no different to a buffalo on the road, do not assume they are aware of your approach, they can easily step across a cyclist, change direction in an instant.....give them loads of room. Stop if it could be unsafe to squeeze past.

 

 

[David Walden]

On 7/12/2017 at 2:38 AM, Jingthing said:

Yes, it was a horrible accident but I think you're jumping to an unfair conclusion that the pedestrian was really at fault. This is a horribly unfriendly nation for pedestrians and people do walk in the roads, sometimes without choice. Yes, her running away was not admirable but that's not the same thing as saying it was her fault. You didn't even consider that maybe the cyclist was going too fast for the road conditions considering she was riding on the edge where it was entirely predictable that there would be pedestrians, even if just stepping out to cross the road.  

Yes it was in some way the girl pedestrian's fault but as is the case in many places in Thailand they don't give a hoot about people.  On most days and in particularly in Cha-am the footpaths are just so blocked full of street vendors that all the pedestrians have to walk on the street among the traffic.  At weekends the traffic along the beach strip is almost grid-locked with pedestrians walking alongside vehicles most of the time.  This accident was an accident waiting to happen.  The cause of this accident is mostly the Local Government's fault by not keeping footpaths for pedestrians.

 

I am glad to see that Thai Visa has taken down the original movie clip of the accident which was not at all good...say no more.

[David Walden]

On 7/25/2017 at 4:38 AM, gk10002000 said:

Appropriate speed yes.  But passing a bus on the Left.   Cycles on the road I believe are supposed to follow the same general traffic laws as autos.  Passing on the left is a no no.  You pass on the right in Thailand.  In addition, a report was that she was clipped into her pedals.  That doesn't make it easy to hop off.  And one should be very very careful being broadside of any truck or bus.  Gosh every week there are similar stories of cyclist or pedestrians, or motorbikers ending up under vehicles.  narrow streets, un foreseen lane changes, etc.  This was a confluence of bad actions and she paid the price.  Now banish to hell that coward pedestrian that immediately ran away instead of maybe lending assistance.  Although it looks like the cyclist was fatally crushed instantly and nothing could be done to help her

I really don't think this comment is from anyone who has ever been to Thailand.   It is very common and very often the case that bicycle or motor bikes passes cars on the left hand side that is the near side not the offside (correct side), there are really no road rule books in Thailand.  Even for me (from Australia we drive on the left also) where it is a serious offence to pass a vehicle on the left (near side) unless it is a marked lane.  I almost always pass on the left in Thailand as is the way of Thais especially where traffic is gridlocked like in Cha-am and that is most weekends (no problem Mon to Fri).   Now if you happen to be riding on a busy road on a motor bike in Thailand it will often happen that you will meet a motorbike coming the other way completely on the wrong side of the road,  you pass this motorbike on the right side if you want to stay alive ( not the left side).  The motor bike coming the wrong way always stays as close to the edge of the road as far as possible ( helps them to stay alive?)...these are Thai Rafferty's Rules.  It is good idea to stick to Rafferty's Rules sometimes if you want to stay alive on the roads in Thailand...TIT

 

[gk10002000]

Just now, David Walden said:

I really don't think this comment is from anyone who has ever been to Thailand.   It is very common and very often the case that bicycle or motor bikes passes cars on the left hand side that is the near side not the offside (correct side), there are really no road rule books in Thailand.  Even for me (from Australia we drive on the left also) where it is a serious offence to pass a vehicle on the left (near side) unless it is a marked lane.  I almost always pass on the left in Thailand as is the way of Thais especially where traffic is gridlocked like in Cha-am and that is most weekends (no problem Mon to Fri).   Now if you happen to be riding on a busy road on a motor bike in Thailand it will often happen that you will meet a motorbike coming the other way completely on the wrong side of the road,  you pass this motorbike on the right side if you want to stay alive ( not the left side).  The motor bike coming the wrong way always stays as close to the edge of the road as far as possible ( helps them to stay alive?)...these are Thai Rafferty's Rules.  It is good idea to stick to Rafferty's Rules sometimes if you want to stay alive on the roads in Thailand...TIT

 

nutty.  I have been over a dozen times, 14 I think since 2004.   Passing on the left or right when up against a bus that probably has limited view of you and doesn't leave much room for margin in case something goes wrong as it did here, is very dangerous.  Even a casual scan of posts on line here or on youtube will show so many accidents occurring while passing, legit or not. 

[David Walden]

2 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

nutty.  I have been over a dozen times, 14 I think since 2004.   Passing on the left or right when up against a bus that probably has limited view of you and doesn't leave much room for margin in case something goes wrong as it did here, is very dangerous.  Even a casual scan of posts on line here or on youtube will show so many accidents occurring while passing, legit or not. 

 As I've said in another post it is the local govt fault in Cha-am as it allows street vendors to use the footpath extensively, this requires  pedestrians to walk on the road among the traffic (TIT).  The proximate cause of this accident is just that...get the vendors off the footpaths ( not likely in Thailand)

[gk10002000]

7 hours ago, David Walden said:

 As I've said in another post it is the local govt fault in Cha-am as it allows street vendors to use the footpath extensively, this requires  pedestrians to walk on the road among the traffic (TIT).  The proximate cause of this accident is just that...get the vendors off the footpaths ( not likely in Thailand)

No. The proximate cause of the accident is the girl on the bike I believe was determined to be pegged into the pedals, so she could not dismount quickly, and she did not exercise sufficient caution and she was just speeding along.  The pedestrian lowered her shoulder a little bit too, perhaps instinctively, perhaps vindictively.