Health insurance - Half in and half out approach

[stevenl]

8 hours ago, KKr said:

hi, good post.
have been looking into similar idea for the Netherlands, but the government requires 8 months per year spending there in order to maintain the registration as a resident that is compulsory for the government sponsored health insurance.
Some insurances were prepared to write the cover anyway, but risk is that they annul the cover in case of a large claim and no 100 % compliance with the regulations concerning registration, (no way around that as passport gets stamped in TH.)
Also, in such case it will be difficult to get cover from another government plan insurer because insurance companies maintain an official register of terminated policies, and moreover due to the underwriting process in Private health insurance.
If it works in the UK for now, the savings are obviously gigantic.

Not true. The country you spend 8 months per year in is seen as country of residence, nowhere is it said you need to spend 8 months per year in the Netherlands to maintain residency.

[KKr]

1 hour ago, stevenl said:

Not true. The country you spend 8 months per year in is seen as country of residence, nowhere is it said you need to spend 8 months per year in the Netherlands to maintain residency.

you are correct in that it is FOUR months only, my error, so two months more advantageous than the UK.
Other than that, the regulation is quite clear:
""
You must deregister as a resident of the Basic Registration Persons (BRP) if you stay abroad for more than 8 months in a year. This period does not have to be consecutive. Even if you keep your house in the Netherlands, you must also deregister from the BRP.
""
(https://www.rijksoverheid.nl/onderwerpen/persoonsgegevens/vraag-en-antwoord/uitschrijven-basisregistratie-personen)

[trevoromgh]

The British government were going to increase the time beyond 6 months but that policy change has gone into the long grass as the 'B' word has every ones attention for the foreseeable future.  Shame really because 8 months would be even better 

[theguyfromanotherforum]

20 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

I was doing the same, 6 months UK, 6 months Thailand but i wanted to spend more time in Thailand, there is the flaw in the plan. If reasonably healthy, self insure and/or get personal accident medical insurance

 

Another reason for spending 6 months at least in Canada is that if you still have some time until retirement, you'd be eligible for pension during the years you were a resident.

 

I have lost 4 years of free government money and also the privilege of selling my primary residence tax free by living in Thailand.

Edited February 2, 2018 by theguyfromanotherforum

[scubascuba3]

 
Another reason for spending 6 months at least in Canada is that if you still have some time until retirement, you'd be eligible for pension during the years you were a resident.
 

Not in the UK unless paying NI or on certain benefits. The state pension is pretty poor anyway in the UK so not worth holding my breath over

[hugh mckee]

How does the UK authorities know? of course your in and out records at immigration but do they check this? what if one year you stay 7 months instead of 6, do they get you for this? is your lifetime's contribution to N.I get lost so easily, what I'm asking is their flexibility or is this a strict rule? and what about your uk property, doesn't the fact you maintain a property in the UK mean you can stay longer than 6 months, of course from reading your post it doesn't but I kinda hoped/wished that as long as I have a UK property and registered with same GP I always had that I'd be ok for UK health treatment even if I did stay more than 6 months

[topt]

1 hour ago, hugh mckee said:

How does the UK authorities know? of course your in and out records at immigration but do they check this? what if one year you stay 7 months instead of 6, do they get you for this? is your lifetime's contribution to N.I get lost so easily, what I'm asking is their flexibility or is this a strict rule? and what about your uk property, doesn't the fact you maintain a property in the UK mean you can stay longer than 6 months, of course from reading your post it doesn't but I kinda hoped/wished that as long as I have a UK property and registered with same GP I always had that I'd be ok for UK health treatment even if I did stay more than 6 months

Not commenting on the legality or otherwise but I would guess it really depends on your GP/practice and what, if any, checks they make. Some posters have mentioned in the past that they do that or more........

 

I would suggest that If it happened once then you would be unlucky to be caught out but over a longer period the risks would rise and in the future who knows how joined up the systems may become.

[hugh mckee]

51 minutes ago, topt said:

Not commenting on the legality or otherwise but I would guess it really depends on your GP/practice and what, if any, checks they make. Some posters have mentioned in the past that they do that or more........

 

I would suggest that If it happened once then you would be unlucky to be caught out but over a longer period the risks would rise and in the future who knows how joined up the systems may become.

GP practices make no checks and get paid for every patient on their books so they're not at all interested in removing long term patients from their lists just because they've been out of the country and with a permanent UK address then only way I can see if that the authorities know if you're out of the country longer than 6 months  if immigration systems are flagging it and here in the UK we are always being told immigration are under staffed and underpaid, are they really bothered about making sure you stick to the 6 month rule?.....I doubt it.

 

yes if you have no uk address to use then different but finding a uk address to use as your own when you are in Thailand is not difficult, any family member or friend would help you out there and this in turn could be used for the GP practice.

 

as for talking about legality, that's a bit offensive, if you've paid NI all your life then staying out of the country for longer than 6 months hardly makes you a criminal if you are bending the rules to favour you.

 

sounds like some guys on TV who choose to stay here permanently are jealous of the fact that others can go back home for medical treatment or don't have to pay expensive health insurance like they have to but that is typical of the negative posters on here who are always overly keen to type their negative BS but sadly these guys can give you the wrong impression and are difficult to ignore.

 

great and interesting topic and thankful to the OP for taking the time to post it and for the valuable comments posted on this subject

Edited February 3, 2018 by hugh mckee

[trevoromgh]

Thanks to Hugh and other posters for your comments and responses.  I agree the current law is daft as you can pay in your NI contributions for your whole life but in the eyes of the UK government that counts for nothing if you leave the country for more than 6 months a year and that is the truth (he says after writing many letters to the Minister of Health on the subject) they say you have to reside in the UK to receive healthcare (doesn't matter if you own a property and still pay taxes there).   If you are a returning UK citizen wanting to have NHS treatment again you need to tell them you are returning to the UK to live forever, whereas if you are a European citizen or an illegal immigrant you will get free NHS healthcare from day one no questions asked.  

 

Preposterous or what!  One of the reasons I am spending more time out of the UK right now.

 

Nowadays when you go to any UK hospital and check-in at the front desk for an appointment the first question they ask you is "Have you been out of the country recently?"  and I always say "No" as it should be none of their business.

 

 

[hugh mckee]

48 minutes ago, trevoromgh said:

Thanks to Hugh and other posters for your comments and responses.  I agree the current law is daft as you can pay in your NI contributions for your whole life but in the eyes of the UK government that counts for nothing if you leave the country for more than 6 months a year and that is the truth (he says after writing many letters to the Minister of Health on the subject) they say you have to reside in the UK to receive healthcare (doesn't matter if you own a property and still pay taxes there).   If you are a returning UK citizen wanting to have NHS treatment again you need to tell them you are returning to the UK to live forever, whereas if you are a European citizen or an illegal immigrant you will get free NHS healthcare from day one no questions asked.  

 

Preposterous or what!  One of the reasons I am spending more time out of the UK right now.

 

Nowadays when you go to any UK hospital and check-in at the front desk for an appointment the first question they ask you is "Have you been out of the country recently?"  and I always say "No" as it should be none of their business.

 

 

well that settles it for me,  I will own a condo  very  soon but max' in any one year I will stay is 6 months, did not know the law was so strict or rigid and anti-expat but good to know, NHS may be criticised and unfairly too I think but for me personally to cut myself off from it would be madness.........shame the rules are like this and was wanting to spend a full year in Thailand but cannot jeopardize my health care which I have contributed to all my working life!

Edited February 3, 2018 by hugh mckee

[scubascuba3]

One of the problems with 6 month and 6 months is you may eventually want a girlfriend so will need to sponsor her while in the UK and of course while you aren't there she can go with other guys which is standard

[unblocktheplanet]

On 2/1/2018 at 10:36 AM, trevoromgh said:

Hi there... have sent you a private message with details as I don't think we are allowed to advertise on the forum.  Cheers

Please PM me, too! Thanks so much.

 

CJ

[paulsingle]

A very sensible approach.

I did almost 8 months away in 2015/16 but I have a friend who lodges with me. I pay all the utility and council tax bills and of course when I'm back here in UK I work and pay NI and income tax as I have done for decades.

I'm going for 5 months in a fortnight's time and will do the same again.

I believe that my local GP practice and other practices have a rule that they will remove a patient from their practice list is that patient is abroad for more than 3 months. However, I don't think they would enforce this rule and in any case, they don't know when I'm away.

Going forward I will have to limit my trips to shorter periods as I am hoping to bring my wife to settle in the UK and she cannot be seen to be leaving the UK for extended periods or she could apparently have her visa cancelled.

Choice of backpacker insurance becomes more limited and costly with increasing age but I have just bought cover for my next trip and I'm 60 and I don't think it was expensive.

[paulsingle]

On ‎03‎/‎02‎/‎2018 at 10:22 PM, scubascuba3 said:

One of the problems with 6 month and 6 months is you may eventually want a girlfriend so will need to sponsor her while in the UK and of course while you aren't there she can go with other guys which is standard

Exactly my dilemma.

My solution is that I will do two shorter trips of about 4 to 6 weeks each year until she has indefinite leave to remain. During that time she will come out with me for 2 or 3 weeks on one trip each year.

Once she has ILR (hopefully just over 5 years from now) we can both do longer stays together.

[stament]

On 04/02/2018 at 2:22 AM, scubascuba3 said:

One of the problems with 6 month and 6 months is you may eventually want a girlfriend so will need to sponsor her while in the UK and of course while you aren't there she can go with other guys which is standard

What's standard exactly?

[meechai]

This will be our first time using travel insurance for Thailand

as we previously lived there but now instead will visit 3-4 months a year

 

Our question is with Travel Insurance does the Thai hospitals actually accept it

as payment or do you still need to pay in Thailand & later get reimbursed by the travel insurance company?

 

Have always hear it was tough getting Thai hospitals sorted on payment even with local insurers when we lived there

 

Anyone with actual experience using travel insurance on a larger claim?

[scubascuba3]

This will be our first time using travel insurance for Thailand
as we previously lived there but now instead will visit 3-4 months a year
 
Our question is with Travel Insurance does the Thai hospitals actually accept it
as payment or do you still need to pay in Thailand & later get reimbursed by the travel insurance company?
 
Have always hear it was tough getting Thai hospitals sorted on payment even with local insurers when we lived there
 
Anyone with actual experience using travel insurance on a larger claim?

It depends on the insurer, you need to check the terms. When i claimed in another country, the hospital called the insurer, i had a quick chat with them and they covered the treatment so were billed direct

[meechai]

2 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

15 minutes ago, meechai said:

This will be our first time using travel insurance for Thailand
as we previously lived there but now instead will visit 3-4 months a year
 
Our question is with Travel Insurance does the Thai hospitals actually accept it
as payment or do you still need to pay in Thailand & later get reimbursed by the travel insurance company?
 
Have always hear it was tough getting Thai hospitals sorted on payment even with local insurers when we lived there
 
Anyone with actual experience using travel insurance on a larger claim?

It depends on the insurer, you need to check the terms. When i claimed in another country, the hospital called the insurer, i had a quick chat with them and they covered the treatment so were billed direct

Thanks makes sense

That time you claimed was it in Thailand?

[scubascuba3]

Thanks makes sense
That time you claimed was it in Thailand?

It was Egypt. I always carry my insurance certificate with me so in case of accident they will find it. It's no use in the phone if I'm unconscious

[meechai]

We may start visiting again this year for 3-4 months a year rather than move back full time.

 

The travel insurances I have seen so far say submit claims within 30 days

So it seems as if they do not pay on the spot to Hospital.

 

The other things we are wondering is, does the medical coverage cover things like say a heart attack or just accident/illness?

Anyone know?

 

Thank you for any replies

 

 

 

Edited February 28, 2018 by meechai

[scubascuba3]

We may start visiting again this year for 3-4 months a year rather than move back full time.
 
The travel insurances I have seen so far say submit claims within 30 days
So it seems as if they do not pay on the spot to Hospital.
 
The other things we are wondering is, does the medical coverage cover things like say a heart attack or just accident/illness?
Anyone know?
 
Thank you for any replies
 
 
 

Travel insurance will cover for accidents and heart attacks etc but you need to disclose pre existing conditions or they will just deny the claim. Look for an insurance that only goes back 2 years. Bad ones go 5 years, sometimes from birth

[meechai]

13 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

13 hours ago, meechai said:

 

Travel insurance will cover for accidents and heart attacks etc but you need to disclose pre existing conditions or they will just deny the claim. Look for an insurance that only goes back 2 years. Bad ones go 5 years, sometimes from birth

Thanks

We do not have any pre-existing at all but wondered as most travel insurances seem to talk about accidents but not

regular medical emergency should they occur.

[scubascuba3]

Thanks
We do not have any pre-existing at all but wondered as most travel insurances seem to talk about accidents but not
regular medical emergency should they occur.

Yes covered but look at exclusions before you purchase, definitely worth scanning the small print

[trevoromgh]

Another thing to remember is to always declare if a close family member has any medical problems which could lead to you or your traveling companion cancelling or curtailing your trip.  Unless you have mentioned this in your application you are unlikely to receive any cover for such eventualities.

[stevenl]

6 hours ago, trevoromgh said:

Another thing to remember is to always declare if a close family member has any medical problems which could lead to you or your traveling companion cancelling or curtailing your trip.  Unless you have mentioned this in your application you are unlikely to receive any cover for such eventualities.

That's a cancellation insurance. If that insurance is required, answer the questions about it.

 

Mentioning these things on a travel policy application is useless.

[trevoromgh]

16 hours ago, trevoromgh said:

Another thing to remember is to always declare if a close family member has any medical problems which could lead to you or your traveling companion cancelling or curtailing your trip.  Unless you have mentioned this in your application you are unlikely to receive any cover for such eventualities.

 

9 hours ago, stevenl said:

That's a cancellation insurance. If that insurance is required, answer the questions about it.

 

Mentioning these things on a travel policy application is useless.

I beg to differ as most travel insurance policies contain cancellation or curtailment cover otherwise there would be little point in taking them out in the first place.  

 

 

[stevenl]

On 3/1/2018 at 10:58 PM, trevoromgh said:

 

I beg to differ as most travel insurance policies contain cancellation or curtailment cover otherwise there would be little point in taking them out in the first place.  

 

 

Cancellation can be part of a travel insurance policy, or it can not be. Either way, you don't mention things on an application form unless requested.