Arsenal

[carmine]

43 minutes ago, jellydog said:

Just caught the replay. As entertaining a match as I've seen this season. A draw seemed the just result. Immense effort from Courtois.

 

Now on to see what Arsenal and Wenger do with the Sanchez/Ozil mess.

I do wonder whether they'f be better off if they had just sold Sanchez.  Reports of major friction in the dressing particularly between him and Koscielny.

[jellydog]

7 minutes ago, carmine said:

I do wonder whether they'f be better off if they had just sold Sanchez.  Reports of major friction in the dressing particularly between him and Koscielny.

Quite a dilemma for Wenger. Sell now and throw away any chance for top 4 and CL competition, or keep them and lose them for nothing after the season. And, no guarantee for CL play even with both Sanchez and Ozil.

 

Were I a Gunner I would hope that those new additions in the Arsenal personnel department are involved in the decision making.

[mrbojangles]

Sounds like I missed a good game. Caught the first 15 minutes after half time, whilst in transit in Abu Dhabi and it was pretty end-to-end of what I saw 

[SantiSuk]

Best bet is that Ozil stays - needs to continue to impress to cement his Germany world cup slot (which is why he is playing better now than before for us. Meanwhile I doubt he will want to risk hiccups from adjusting to a new club set-up - unless Barca, Bayern or PSG come calling with sweet whispers. Wenger will be prepared to pay the price of losing him for nowt in Summer - he's implied as much. Maybe Mezzer can even be persuaded to sign a new contract if Wenger is prepared to break his wage guidelines and if we happen to show some promise for the succeeding season in the second half (a big if).

 

Sanchez should have been sold in Summer and should be sold now, unless no team is prepared to jump in early with some money for Arsenal (20m?). I don't believe Sanchez has his heart in playing hard for us, particularly if things don't go well in the Prem. I do believe Wenger (when he says he) has plenty of money for the window - sufficient presumably to get a handy left side replacement who can keep that side of the pitch as a goals source. I don't however believe there is any club out there prepared to sell a decent asset at say 40-60m in the January window and we'll probably end up with a 20m dud  That or worse - a Wenger misguided belief he can cover off Sanchez's departure with Wellbeck, who shows not enough current signs of returning to the heights of his ManU form, or Iwobi, who is cr&p.

[evenstevens]

11 minutes ago, SantiSuk said:

Best bet is that Ozil stays - needs to continue to impress to cement his Germany world cup slot (which is why he is playing better now than before for us. Meanwhile I doubt he will want to risk hiccups from adjusting to a new club set-up - unless Barca, Bayern or PSG come calling with sweet whispers. Wenger will be prepared to pay the price of losing him for nowt in Summer - he's implied as much. Maybe Mezzer can even be persuaded to sign a new contract if Wenger is prepared to break his wage guidelines and if we happen to show some promise for the succeeding season in the second half (a big if).

 

Sanchez should have been sold in Summer and should be sold now, unless no team is prepared to jump in early with some money for Arsenal (20m?). I don't believe Sanchez has his heart in playing hard for us, particularly if things don't go well in the Prem. I do believe Wenger (when he says he) has plenty of money for the window - sufficient presumably to get a handy left side replacement who can keep that side of the pitch as a goals source. I don't however believe there is any club out there prepared to sell a decent asset at say 40-60m in the January window and we'll probably end up with a 20m dud  That or worse - a Wenger misguided belief he can cover off Sanchez's departure with Wellbeck, who shows not enough current signs of returning to the heights of his ManU form, or Iwobi, who is cr&p.

In my view   IF    Wenger was given   the   big shove,  say five  to  ten  seasons  ago, your above  very  honest  apprasial, would not have been needed

.Wenger is  why Arsenal is in  free fall,   nuffin else!!!!!

[SantiSuk]

70% posession and going nowhere but out. Pathetic performance in front of goal from the Cup B team - without Giroud there is no fire power and all the cleverness on the wings from the promising youngsters is of no avail when you have a lacklustre Walcott and Welbeck up front.

 

Looks like an embarrassing drubbing for the cup holders. Big mistake to put all yer eggs in the Milk Cup basket, which is presumably why there are no first teamers in sight tonight. Wenger desperate for any cup (and the [insert sponsor of the moment] Cup is just such an any cr@p cup) to save his season? 

 

Woops - they just gifted Welback one!

[SantiSuk]

Walcott obviously playing for the next team he wants to play for, whoever that is, certainly not trying for us. He needs to play for someone else and I can't understand Wenger's apparent obssesive desire to keep him.

[SantiSuk]

Another nail in the final knockings of a decent career (that was great in its first third). Play a B team maybe ok, but not without a striker who can be relied on to get goals and not with an entire bench C team - surely??! Ridiculous misjudgement from the old fellah - can't imagine any other manager in the Prem doing that and says everything about cussedness rather than experience.

 

I'd take some solace from the removal of distractions from winning the important stuff, but I don't see us getting the Top 4 Trophy or the Secondary Europe Cup in any event.

[smokie36]

Perhaps Wenger is trying to show the depth of your squad to the  board Santi? 

[carmine]

7 hours ago, SantiSuk said:

Another nail in the final knockings of a decent career (that was great in its first third). Play a B team maybe ok, but not without a striker who can be relied on to get goals and not with an entire bench C team - surely??! Ridiculous misjudgement from the old fellah - can't imagine any other manager in the Prem doing that and says everything about cussedness rather than experience.

 

I'd take some solace from the removal of distractions from winning the important stuff, but I don't see us getting the Top 4 Trophy or the Secondary Europe Cup in any event.

You're still very much in the top four race, but, if this wasn't achieved do you think Wenger would go, almost on the basis of a gentleman agreement that this was the requirement of the first year of his two year contract?

[SantiSuk]

Clearly he should do Carmine, whether there is a gentleman's agreement or not (was that a confirmed statement or usual press-rumouring?).

 

Whether we are still in the running for top 4 is very much down to the Alexis gone-or-not gone situation, his attitude if staying and the quality of his replacement if gone.

 

Whatever - Top 4 Trophy is a 35% possibility at best for Arsenal - 25% given the race for the one remaining place with Spurs and ManU (City/Chelsea/newly properly re-inforced 'Pool are shoe-ins to my mind). An additional 10% for the Secondary European Trophy back passage entrance. Goes up to 50% overall if Alexis stays and is not already tied to a big name until later on.

 

At least we will still get some very watchable football second half out of the Arsenal! That's the one thing I'll give him even in his dotage!

[smokie36]

You've been involved in some good battles this season I have to say.

 

Is fag end Jack getting a new deal?

[SantiSuk]

According to John Cross in the Mirror (well connected at Arsenal and usually gets stuff right), yes. Whether his injury last night affects that we wait and see. Reports this morning say Wenger thinks its just a sprain to the non-glass ankle. Here's hoping.

 

Dunno whether he dived in recklessly to get the injury. Didn't watch the match and will not watch any Milk Cup matches (didn't watch the v Birmingham final several years ago) cos I think it's a waste of space competition that Prem teams should go nowhere near unless they volunteer for it. Some lower end teams might want to but in general there's far too many games crowded into a season as it is and this competition is just commercial opportunism by the FA and a historical hangover form days when Prem and Europe was much lower impact physically.

 

At least respect to Wenger for playing mostly the Cup team in it (Chelsea mostly 1st teamres) - but this time with a couple of 1st teamers on the bench. So it mystifies me even more what the ... he was playing at in the FA Cup match at Notts F.

 

 

[SantiSuk]

Says it all when waste-of-space Theo has to be brought on as your impact forward. Lacazette, Iwobi and Welbeck - probably the limpest forward line up that Arsenal started a Prem league game with in living memory!

 

I was apparently incorrect in my assertion that at least we'll get interesting football to watch in an ultimately fruitless second half of the season.

 

Wenger Out banners unnecessary. Surely he can see he's heading for his blankest season and surely he'll do the decent thing?

[jellydog]

Snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. Methinks with Ozil and Sanchez that would have been a 3 or 4-1 win.

[Bredbury Blue]

Only plus was Jack was decent; Pep likes him and will be round soon.

[carmine]

8 hours ago, Bredbury Blue said:

Only plus was Jack was decent; Pep likes him and will be round soon.

He's made of glass and ill disciplined.  Pep wouldn't go anywhere near him.  

[carmine]

I'm expecting Arsenal Fan TV to be nothing short of spectacular this morning.  

 

To add to the horror of last nights second half display Wenger insists he won't change and is going nowhere!!  

 

His selfishness and arrogance is quite mind boggling!!

[mrbojangles]

15 minutes ago, carmine said:

He's made of glass and ill disciplined.  Pep wouldn't go anywhere near him.  

God, I hope your right. Never rated the little (insert any expletive you wish)

[jellydog]

7 minutes ago, mrbojangles said:

God, I hope your right. Never rated the little (insert any expletive you wish)

Amen to that.

[smokie36]

28 minutes ago, jellydog said:

Amen to that.

 

Is he getting a new six year contract from Arsene?

[jellydog]

12 minutes ago, RonniePickering22 said:

 

Is he getting a new six year contract from Arsene?

Anything to keep him away from City. I give him no more than five more games before he breaks a leg or stubs a fag out on someone's forehead.

[StevieH]

1 hour ago, carmine said:

I'm expecting Arsenal Fan TV to be nothing short of spectacular this morning.  

 

To add to the horror of last nights second half display Wenger insists he won't change and is going nowhere!!  

 

His selfishness and arrogance is quite mind boggling!!

 

they are baffling though. they're not really going to allow sanchez to go to man united are they? one of their rivals for a CL finish this season? last time they did that with their best player van persie won united the league.

 

can't remember a team more in need of a change of manager than arsenal.

[carmine]

1 minute ago, StevieH said:

 

they are baffling though. they're not really going to allow sanchez to go to man united are they? one of their rivals for a CL finish this season? last time they did that with their best player van persie won united the league.

 

can't remember a team more in need of a change of manager than arsenal.

I heard he's going to United during my morning gloat on Arsenal fanTV.  Some of those fans appear to have decent connections inside the club.  read it in other places too.

 

If they do sell him to United it would be a dreadful reflection on the deterioration of a club under current management /ownership.  

[SantiSuk]

I think most fans are realistic enough to recognise that Sanchez is just another hired gun of the modern game and was asking way more than the club is prepared to pay. The bottom line is probably that noone trusts him to try hard for us if he is kept for the remainder of the season.

 

Arsenal are doomed to sell-on any brilliant conversions like Sanchez and Van Persie with its present ownership structure coming from value-investing cautious side of  private equity. It will not change until the ownership changes and removal of Wenger and his geriatric behaviour is not going to be totally solve the real problem. 

 

Notwithstanding that fans are probably resigned to Sanchez going (and some even demand it) the thought that he gets replaced by Mickey-tarian - an obvious failure - is going to go down like a lead balloon and will cause great rage if true and if that's all that's happening to a currently woeful attack line-up.

 

Wenger has promised a 'harsh review' of the Bournemouth game. I presume that means he's going to blame the team! Always the last knockings of a manager on his last legs.

 

On the broader picture the blame for Arsenal's graceless fall is widely distributed. I also blame the faithful of 2-4 years ago, who seemed blind to the failing gentleman and preferred to look backwards than forwards. That must have encouraged the board to stick in its comfort zone.

[StevieH]

points taken santi, but that being the case, why not sell him in the summer when you could have got more money for him? because arsenal let sanchez run his contract down they're now going to get about £20m for a £100m level player. it's bad management/running of the club all over.

[carmine]

7 minutes ago, StevieH said:

points taken santi, but that being the case, why not sell him in the summer when you could have got more money for him? because arsenal let sanchez run his contract down they're now going to get about £20m for a £100m level player. it's bad management/running of the club all over.

Absolutely right and they've now basically lost control of the situation.  This whole Sanchez business has had an adverse effect on the squad i'm sure and they would have been better selling him in the summer when they could have squeezed a lot more money out of City.  Another example of Wenger being stubborn and out of touch.

[StevieH]

27 minutes ago, carmine said:

Absolutely right and they've now basically lost control of the situation.  This whole Sanchez business has had an adverse effect on the squad i'm sure and they would have been better selling him in the summer when they could have squeezed a lot more money out of City.  Another example of Wenger being stubborn and out of touch.

 

i think it's more a sign that wenger has become weak. players don't seem to respect him any longer and they know that even if they have a crap or lazy game they're still going to get picked next match. he can't seem to see any fault or dropoff in his own performance though, otherwise he'd surely walk away and give a new manager a chance to reinvigorate the place.

[carmine]

18 minutes ago, StevieH said:

 

i think it's more a sign that wenger has become weak. players don't seem to respect him any longer and they know that even if they have a crap or lazy game they're still going to get picked next match. he can't seem to see any fault or dropoff in his own performance though, otherwise he'd surely walk away and give a new manager a chance to reinvigorate the place.

I have a gut feeling Arsenal are waiting for Max Allegri to become available.  We"ll see.

[StevieH]

7 minutes ago, carmine said:

I have a gut feeling Arsenal are waiting for Max Allegri to become available.  We"ll see.

 

could be. weren't they supposed to be all over thomas tuchel? he's without a club as far as i remember.