Brexit has created chaos in Britain – nobody voted for this

[aright]

2 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

sorry, I clicked send by mistake while doing an alteration, my keyboard is up the spout so I am using a screen keyboard, have to get used to it first, can't have an important sender like mine to be offline.

 Was it made by VW? Bloody German keyboards  

[soalbundy]

1 minute ago, aright said:

 Was it made by VW? Bloody German keyboards  

I don't think so, it has a sticker with MD tech on it and a few orange keys, I bought it because my step daughter thought it was cool and my son agreed, what I want doesn't count.

[simoh1490]

10 minutes ago, Airbagwill said:

there is no tract or text on democracy anywhere ever that claims "majority rules" as a tenet.

That's very interesting and even more useful to understand.

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, evadgib said:

Following a highly competitive recruitment process, the Department for International Trade (DIT) today (Thursday 12 April) appoints John Mahon as the UK’s first Director General for Exports. Reporting to the Permanent Secretary, John will lead the implementation of the government’s emerging Export Strategy as the UK prepares to leave the European Union.

A former Head of Barclays Corporate Bank, John brings a strong track record to DIT and is being hailed across Whitehall as a key hire. His appointment is the latest step in a major capability-building programme underway at DIT, across exports and investment promotion and the trade policy and negotiation businesses.

The new Director General for Exports is at the heart of the government’s post-Brexit trading plan, and is tasked with ensuring that new and existing exporters can access the right financial, practical and promotional support to sell overseas.

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/city-chief-appointed-to-lead-uk-export-drive

Are you being ironic? Or are you the town cryer now? Stop giggling you at the back

[soalbundy]

I see May wants us to join the Americans in bombarding Syria, unfortunately the EU can't stop her.

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, aright said:

The question was what it was and it satisfied the needs of at least 52% of voters. You seem to feel the result was too close to be authoritative and as a result status quo. I believe status quo would give victory to the minority Remainers. My question was, is this your definition of democracy? A simple yes or no will do. 

A while ago you told us you were a qualified social anthropologist? Historian? Please excuse me if I have misunderstood. Anyway, I would expect better from and educated man. To not specify a super majority was an appalling error by Cameron. He knows it, you know it really. Even 60/40 would have been just about adequate. I'll leave it to you to explain from a PPE point of view the underpinnings of representative parliamentary democracy 

[aright]

11 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

 what I want doesn't count.

It's a bugger when you're part of the 48% isn't it. 

[soalbundy]

2 minutes ago, aright said:

It's a bugger when you're part of the 48% isn't it. 

not even that, I wasn't able to vote, the one time in my life when I would have voted and I'm not allowed to.

[CG1 Blue]

14 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Silly comment. Right now we NEVER need join the Euro. If we leave and rejoin, that opt out will be gone. Better remain until end 2020 and then decide. Don't Brexiteers know anything?

The general direction of travel is further integration, militarily and fiscally. Those running the EU would have preferred the UK to be in the Euro. What makes you so sure they would not have imposed the Euro on the UK sometime soon if we had not voted to leave?

[aright]

27 minutes ago, Airbagwill said:

there is no tract or text on democracy anywhere ever that claims "majority rules" as a tenet.

Is there one that claims majority rules is a skepticism.

[Grouse]

Just now, CG1 Blue said:

The general direction of travel is further integration, militarily and fiscally. Those running the EU would have preferred the UK to be in the Euro. What makes you so sure they would not have imposed the Euro on the UK sometime soon if we had not voted to leave?

The law

[dunroaming]

2 hours ago, tebee said:

Oddly enough, although I'm a committed remainer, I'm more sad than angry now.

 

The Brexit we are heading for is much nearer to remaining that anything that was ever promised on the leave side - it's just going to be a bad version of EU membership. May and the rest of her team are such useless negotiators that all the red lines are dissolving before our eyes. Lack of any  ideas on our side just means we capitulate to the EU time after time.

 

So I'm sad that the pyrrhic victory of leaving the EU will leave the country worse off with no benefit. I still would prefer we stay, but if we don't so be it.    

Looking that way.  I am still angry though.  Not because Brexit is going ahead (well that as well) but because of how May and the Brexit boys are screwing it up.  They are not delivering what the leavers voted for but there are still many Brexiteers who are in denial over that.  They should be screaming at the top of their voices.  This Brexit scenario is bad for all of us!

[nong38]

In 1975 I voted to join the EEC, nobody told me it would turn out like the EU! But I had to accept until I got the chance to right the wrong. I am sure there were people back in the 70's and before who knew what the grand plan was, the trouble was they did not bother to tell the people. Tell the people what they have gradually seen the EEC evolve into, an undemocratic body that wishes to become the United States of Europe and satisfy the ego's of the people who run the commission, well I don't want to be a European and I don't think a lot of the members do either, they want to keep their identity.

We have voted to leave there will be no going back.

[nong38]

4 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

The general direction of travel is further integration, militarily and fiscally. Those running the EU would have preferred the UK to be in the Euro. What makes you so sure they would not have imposed the Euro on the UK sometime soon if we had not voted to leave?

2024 I think is the date all members will have to adopt the Euro so maybe Sweden and Denmark might be watching events closely.

[CG1 Blue]

6 minutes ago, Grouse said:

The law

Laws change

[soalbundy]

3 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Looking that way.  I am still angry though.  Not because Brexit is going ahead (well that as well) but because of how May and the Brexit boys are screwing it up.  They are not delivering what the leavers voted for but there are still many Brexiteers who are in denial over that.  They should be screaming at the top of their voices.  This Brexit scenario is bad for all of us!

Well not all of us, we can just watch the chaos from here. It is going to be a very soft brexit anyway, May and Davis are only just beginning to realize where the real power lies, Frarage is swallowing his dummy in rage, maybe he will throw a porpoise in the Thames next time.

[dunroaming]

16 minutes ago, nong38 said:

In 1975 I voted to join the EEC, nobody told me it would turn out like the EU! But I had to accept until I got the chance to right the wrong. I am sure there were people back in the 70's and before who knew what the grand plan was, the trouble was they did not bother to tell the people. Tell the people what they have gradually seen the EEC evolve into, an undemocratic body that wishes to become the United States of Europe and satisfy the ego's of the people who run the commission, well I don't want to be a European and I don't think a lot of the members do either, they want to keep their identity.

We have voted to leave there will be no going back.

I understand your viewpoint completely.  Everything evolves over time and not everyone will like the way that happens.  Even though the UK were instrumental in much of that evolution.  However I am afraid you will always be European because we live in Europe.  Not much can be done about that.

 

In your last sentence you say "We have voted to leave there will be no going back."  May I ask if you think we should leave no matter what the deal is?  Even if we are still subject to EU rules and regulations and there is still free movement of people, with no seat at the table and therefore no voice?  If you do then fair enough.  We all have our view.

Edited April 12, 2018 by dunroaming

[tebee]

49 minutes ago, Grouse said:

..... Don't Brexiteers know anything?

On most of the existing evidence - probably not.... :)

[dunroaming]

45 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

I don't think so, it has a sticker with MD tech on it and a few orange keys, I bought it because my step daughter thought it was cool and my son agreed, what I want doesn't count.

That's what being a parent is all about 

 

I believe Trump has one with a big red button on it.  Can't think what that would be for 

[soalbundy]

3 minutes ago, tebee said:

On most of the existing evidence - probably not.... :)

but,but,but, the general population will get their country back, the majority of which they don't own anyway and the bit that they do is controlled by a very kind bank who will be very understanding about their inability to make mortgage payments due to unemployment and maxed out credit cards.

[malagateddy]

In 1975 I voted to join the EEC, nobody told me it would turn out like the EU! But I had to accept until I got the chance to right the wrong. I am sure there were people back in the 70's and before who knew what the grand plan was, the trouble was they did not bother to tell the people. Tell the people what they have gradually seen the EEC evolve into, an undemocratic body that wishes to become the United States of Europe and satisfy the ego's of the people who run the commission, well I don't want to be a European and I don't think a lot of the members do either, they want to keep their identity.
We have voted to leave there will be no going back.

Just google jean monnet..one of the " founding fathers " of what is now a fraudulent corrupt autocratic eu.
Read his infamous statement..how lies and deceit etc etc

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[dunroaming]

4 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

Just google jean monnet..one of the " founding fathers " of what is now a fraudulent corrupt autocratic eu.
Read his infamous statement..how lies and deceit etc etc

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

1975 was over forty years ago.  Everything changes with time, even my flairs are in the bin now 

[soalbundy]

43 minutes ago, nong38 said:

In 1975 I voted to join the EEC, nobody told me it would turn out like the EU! But I had to accept until I got the chance to right the wrong. I am sure there were people back in the 70's and before who knew what the grand plan was, the trouble was they did not bother to tell the people. Tell the people what they have gradually seen the EEC evolve into, an undemocratic body that wishes to become the United States of Europe and satisfy the ego's of the people who run the commission, well I don't want to be a European and I don't think a lot of the members do either, they want to keep their identity.

We have voted to leave there will be no going back.

you can't go back to something you haven't left, don't jump the gun. This will be like something women do a lot (hello May) when leaving friends you have visited don't just walk out of the door, no, stand for hours on the porch chatting while the husband sits in the car waiting and then perhaps decide not to leave yet after all.

[nauseus]

8 hours ago, Airbagwill said:

It's interesting as the Federalists in the went to war with the Confederates to bring them back in line  which resulted in a stronger USA I wonder if the same could have the same result on the EU.

Eventually Brexit will fail, whether in a year a decade of 40 years, but it really depends on how soon the aging population of Brexiteers disappears.

Just S the civil war be and about slavery and human rights, so Brexit will  become a struggle against  fascism and despotism.

I don't agree with the American comparison but I do agree about the comment about the struggle against fascism and despotism; this ongoing struggle has hopefully been won at last....with Brexit.

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, soalbundy said:

I think he is an old 'die hard' who has been watching too much history channel

Worth repeating: The pedants revolt was led by Which Tyler ?

[nong38]

47 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

I understand your viewpoint completely.  Everything evolves over time and not everyone will like the way that happens.  Even though the UK were instrumental in much of that evolution.  However I am afraid you will always be European because we live in Europe.  Not much can be done about that.

 

In your last sentence you say "We have voted to leave there will be no going back."  May I ask if you think we should leave no matter what the deal is?  Even if we are still subject to EU rules and regulations and there is still free movement of people, with no seat at the table and therefore no voice?  If you do then fair enough.  We all have our view.

Yes whatever the deal is. If for some reason the deal was not acceptable and we then consider staying, Barnier says we can change our mind up to the end of the transition period, it would be a mistake, our influence would be less than now and its not much now, we would be treated like a naughty little boy who belongs in the corner, they would still want our money and our armed forces though. 

We have decided to leave and we now have to make the best of it, I am optimistic that we can, although no one knows what tomorrow will bring.

 

Interesting little rider is that in 1975 I voted to join for he future of my children, in the recent referendum my children voted to leave. I don't know it was the Song Contest or the Champions League that swayed them!!

[nauseus]

8 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

Indeed, I get a far better class of debate that way. 

I'm sure that will suit many of us. Keep up, commenting on your own posts as much as you like.

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, nong38 said:

2024 I think is the date all members will have to adopt the Euro so maybe Sweden and Denmark might be watching events closely.

Wrong. The UK has an opt out. Not sure about Denmark; I'll check

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opt-outs_in_the_European_Union

 

Yes, totally incorrect.

Edited April 12, 2018 by Grouse

[soalbundy]

3 minutes ago, nauseus said:

I don't agree with the American comparison but I do agree about the comment about the struggle against fascism and despotism; this ongoing struggle has hopefully been won at last....with Brexit.

You don't see the far right and racism in the UK then, Jesus, even the Scots have a bad time over there, serves them right, the cross dressing perverts  .

[nauseus]

6 hours ago, sandyf said:

Same again - For someone so vocal I find it hard to believe you asked that question.

Private forum, no media allowed. Media is briefed and kept out side the venue. Next?

It was reported, how private is that?