Unmarried Father, first post, some advice please.

[ChrisO1988]

I have a 4 month daughter with my Thai ex-girlfriend. We live separately, I am named on the Birth Certificate and I have only seen her now and then due to my ex denying access whenever the mood takes her. I paid for the birth, nappies, milk clothing, hospital check-ups and anything else my daughter has needed whenever asked. Now she is saying I must first get my daughter a UK passport, come to an agreement on an amount to give her each month BEFORE she will allow me to see her again. All I want is to see my daughter regularly and be a good father ( I live 15 minutes away) I am willing to pay and get a passport but I have been stopped so many times in her short life already I don't trust my ex. I would appreciate any advice as I am at my wits end. She is insisting I get a lawyer, I am aware as I am not the "legal Father" of my daughter I have no rights but also no obligations either.

[sanemax]

I was in a similar situation , my ex was using our Son as a means of extortion .

After a year of trying to have access to my Son, the more that I tried, the more resilient she became .

   I then blocked all contact with her and then she changed her mind and gave me full access

[onera1961]

15 minutes ago, ChrisO1988 said:

All I want is to see my daughter regularly and be a good father ( I live 15 minutes away) I am willing to pay and get a passport but I have been stopped so many times in her short life already I don't trust my ex.

I hate to say it but I think she has a genuine demand and you must comply (passport and reasonable amount every month).

[The manic]

Give her nothing. Its blackmail. Ignore her. Block all communications with her.  The child will never be in your life and does not need to be treated as a pawn in your battle. It is possible the mother planned for this by allowing you to have unprotected sex. You are being played...being manipulated. The kid will be alright without you. Leave them both alone until the women yields 100% to your requirements. 

[colinneil]

First step, get a DNA test done now.

Many women pull that trick, you are a father pay me money.

After if you are proved to be the father do your best for the child, not the mother.

[swissie]

2 hours ago, colinneil said:

First step, get a DNA test done now.

Many women pull that trick, you are a father pay me money.

After if you are proved to be the father do your best for the child, not the mother.

Quote: " First step, get a DNA test done now".

 

Depending on the result, this is what OP will do (or not do).

Cheers.

[MikeyIdea]

10 hours ago, ChrisO1988 said:

Now she is saying I must first get my daughter a UK passport, come to an agreement on an amount to give her each month BEFORE she will allow me to see her again. All I want is to see my daughter regularly and be a good father ( I live 15 minutes away) I am willing to pay and get a passport but I have been stopped so many times in her short life already I don't trust my ex. I would appreciate any advice as I am at my wits end.

Nothing much to worry about and stop being at your wits end. You went in to this ill-prepared and you have a few set backs that you now in a controlled way *patiently* can correct. Stop listening to at least half of the honourable ThaiVisa members posting, their "advice" is ill informed or wrong anyway, trust the courts but do not trust your normal Thai lawyer, I normally advice never use your lawyers interpreter but contact HappyLarry and get his wife as interpreter and her contact as lawyer, they're a good team, be *patient* and do not act until you have gathered evidence, buy a spy pen and record when she black mails you, keep money tight if money is important and politely and nicely provoke her to give you evidence that favour you in court, expect that you won't see your child once the mother know you've taken this to court and don't worry about it (if the mother is interested in money), and more than anything else, *patiently* accept that court cases should take a long time (if the mother is interested in money). Do not worry about DNA now, you'll hardly need it anyway.

Solution 6 months from now is not likely and don't worry about it

 

Michael

Edited April 18, 2018 by MikeyIdea

[colinneil]

5 minutes ago, MikeyIdea said:

Nothing much to worry about and stop being at your wits end. You went in to this ill-prepared and you have a few set backs that you now in a controlled way *patiently* can correct. Stop listening to 7 out of 10 of the honourable ThaiVisa members posting, their "advice" is ill informed or wrong anyway, trust the courts but do not trust your normal Thai lawyer, I normally advice never use your lawyers interpreter but contact HappyLarry and get his wife as interpreter and her contact as lawyer, that's a good team, be *patient* and do not act until you have gathered evidence, go to Panthip and buy a spy pen and record when she black mails you, keep money tight if money is important and politely and nicely provoke her to give you evidence that favour you in court, expect that you won't see your child once the mother know you've taken this to court and don't worry about it (if the mother is interested in money) and more than anything else, *patiently* accept that court cases should take a long time (if the mother is interested in money). Solution 6 months from now is not likely and don't worry about it

 

Michael

Sop you are saying he should not listen to advice about getting a DNA test?

If so you are talking nonsense, as that is his first/ best move.

Then agasin you think you know better than everyone else, whatever your on stop now.

Edited April 18, 2018 by colinneil

[jenny2017]

5 hours ago, colinneil said:

First step, get a DNA test done now.

Many women pull that trick, you are a father pay me money.

After if you are proved to be the father do your best for the child, not the mother.

Very well said. She might do the same trick with ten others who were on her list. 

[MikeyIdea]

6 minutes ago, colinneil said:

Sop you are saying he should not listen to advice about getting a DNA test?

If so you are talking nonsense, as that is his first/ best move.

Then agasin you think you know better than everyone else, whatever your on stop now.

Nope, it is very unlikely that DNA will be necessary. Be patient and gather evidence and then take it to court, be well prepared in court and court will support you and they will help so that no DNA will be necessary unless you want it yourself. I have been in Juvenile court in Thailand as interpreter many times, have you?

What you advice is nonsense

Edited April 18, 2018 by MikeyIdea

[jenny2017]

1 minute ago, MikeyIdea said:

Nope, it is very unlikely that DNA will be necessary. Be patient and gather evidence and then take it to court, be well prepared in court and court will support you and they will help so that no DNA is necessary. I have been in Juvenile court in Thailand as interpreter many times, have you?

What you advice is nonsense

A DNA test just to make sure that the OP is really the father. And a DNA test might be part of it anyway. 

[GarryP]

Just now, MikeyIdea said:

Nope, it is very unlikely that DNA will be necessary. Be patient and gather evidence and then take it to court, be well prepared in court and court will support you and they will help so that no DNA is necessary. I have been in Juvenile court in Thailand as interpreter many times, have you?

What you advice is nonsense

So you would take it for granted that the child is yours? Strange. What happens if you go through all that bother only to ultimately learn the child is not even yours? You would accept that? If the DNA confirms that the child is not even his, then he can happily walk away and not bother with hiring interpreters and lawyers.  

[MikeyIdea]

4 minutes ago, MikeyIdea said:

Nope, it is very unlikely that DNA will be necessary. Be patient and gather evidence and then take it to court, be well prepared in court and court will support you and they will help so that no DNA will be necessary unless you want it yourself. I have been in Juvenile court in Thailand as interpreter many times, have you?

What you advice is nonsense

Chris: You can easily read yourself and decide what is good advice and not

[colinneil]

5 minutes ago, MikeyIdea said:

Chris: You can easily read yourself and decide what is good advice and not

You have lost the plot, saying my advice to get a DNA test is nonsense !!!!

What planet are you living on??????????

Edited April 18, 2018 by colinneil

[jenny2017]

Just now, colinneil said:

You have seriouls lost the plot, saying my advice to get a DNA test is nonsense !!!!

What planet are you living on??????????

2

He doesn't get it. Would be the first concern of a "normal' person, especially when you might need it at court anyway. ( If the kid is from the OP) 

[petermik]

Sorry to say you have little or no rights here regarding parenthood,unless you have unlimited funds and patience with the thai legal system,you are at the mercy of your daughters mothers whims....you pay what she wants for as long as she wants....that,s the reality here unfortunately....

[evadgib]

Assuming this isn't a troll thread the OP should study the details re passports on 

https://www.gov.uk/browse/abroad ( not to be handed over if successful!).

He could also run it past the Embassy; the mere mention of which on this board will draw trolls from afar ...?

HTH

Edited April 18, 2018 by evadgib

[sanemax]

41 minutes ago, MikeyIdea said:

Nothing much to worry about and stop being at your wits end. You went in to this ill-prepared and you have a few set backs that you now in a controlled way *patiently* can correct. Stop listening to at least half of the honourable ThaiVisa members posting, their "advice" is ill informed or wrong anyway, trust the courts but do not trust your normal Thai lawyer, I normally advice never use your lawyers interpreter but contact HappyLarry and get his wife as interpreter and her contact as lawyer, they're a good team, be *patient* and do not act until you have gathered evidence, buy a spy pen and record when she black mails you, keep money tight if money is important and politely and nicely provoke her to give you evidence that favour you in court, expect that you won't see your child once the mother know you've taken this to court and don't worry about it (if the mother is interested in money), and more than anything else, *patiently* accept that court cases should take a long time (if the mother is interested in money). Do not worry about DNA now, you'll hardly need it anyway.
Solution 6 months from now is not likely and don't worry about it

Michael

What does he need a lawyer for ?

Are you suggesting that he should go to Court to get full parental rights ?

[Just Weird]

6 hours ago, colinneil said:

First step, get a DNA test done now.

Many women pull that trick, you are a father pay me money.

After if you are proved to be the father do your best for the child, not the mother.

How does he do that with no access?

[ChrisO1988]

Firstly thanks for all that have taken the time to offer advice, I was hoping not to incur lawyer fees as I don't have a huge income. Just to clarify, my daughter looks just like me ( everyone says this, not just a Fathers wish!) so I don't doubt she is mine, but I'd be willing to take a DNA if required.The blackmailng messages are by SMS so I have some evidence, as far as getting anything else it's not easy she is in control! I ask all the time to see her, my ex sometimes says OK, I go to the house to spend some time with my daughter and we go shopping, I pay for everything to do with my daughter (quite willingly) then I have to leave for work. Other times she doesn't reply or says NO after the passport and agreed sum each month. I could stop all contact but I'm afraid she'll interpret that as not wanting to see my daughter, I'm a straight up kind of kind and playing games is not my forte, I just want regular contact and to support my daughter. I am not against getting her a passport but what's the rush anyway, my ex may have in her mind to take her to Germany as one of her other children has a German Father that visits once a year, I really don't know, she's unpredictable. I have no choice but to be patient but the outcome seems in the hands of my ex not me. Can you tell me, Michael, you recommend contacting HappyLarry, ask for his wife as interpreter and her contact as lawyer, I'm in Chiang Mai are they in my area? Thanks again.

[MikeyIdea]

5 minutes ago, ChrisO1988 said:

Firstly thanks for all that have taken the time to offer advice, I was hoping not to incur lawyer fees as I don't have a huge income. Just to clarify, my daughter looks just like me ( everyone says this, not just a Fathers wish!) so I don't doubt she is mine, but I'd be willing to take a DNA if required.The blackmailng messages are by SMS so I have some evidence, as far as getting anything else it's not easy she is in control! I ask all the time to see her, my ex sometimes says OK, I go to the house to spend some time with my daughter and we go shopping, I pay for everything to do with my daughter (quite willingly) then I have to leave for work. Other times she doesn't reply or says NO after the passport and agreed sum each month. I could stop all contact but I'm afraid she'll interpret that as not wanting to see my daughter, I'm a straight up kind of kind and playing games is not my forte, I just want regular contact and to support my daughter. I am not against getting her a passport but what's the rush anyway, my ex may have in her mind to take her to Germany as one of her other children has a German Father that visits once a year, I really don't know, she's unpredictable. I have no choice but to be patient but the outcome seems in the hands of my ex not me. Can you tell me, Michael, you recommend contacting HappyLarry, ask for his wife as interpreter and her contact as lawyer, I'm in Chiang Mai are they in my area? Thanks again.

First of all, you are not married to the mother and the child is young so your only way of becoming recognised as a father is by court. You know that you are not even a relative of your own child and you have no rights and no obligations until you are legitimised but there is more. The mother will probably be able to get a Thai passport out for the child at the end of the day and if she does, she can be able to take the child abroad without your consent. The German Embassy may issue a visa for the child without your signature. Either legal guardian can veto that their child leave Thailand so legitimisation gives you power if the mother wants to take the child abroad

 

Thai Juvenile courts have the opinion that very young children need their mother so it's easier to get the majority of the time with the child, or at least not less than 50% if the child is not very young. You could wait a year or so as long as you ensure that you keep evidence that you care for the child (transfer money) and don't expect to see the child. Overall: You cannot stay nothing if you want something of your childs life. You'll have to take this to court within not too long unless you accept to walk away from the child

 

-- she is in control!

Yes, you must accept that for now but not forever. That she has another child with a German father would worry me in terms of money. This will get more difficult if she actually doesn't need your money, if you can't use the power of your money on her. Don't worry about court and money, They will order no more than 4,000 max 5,000 baht per month. It will be more too of course as you bargain for something in return.

 

Evidence: Keep every single receipt, even food and restaurant bills when you go shopping with the mother / child, install a CallRecorder on your mobile and record everything, buy the video spy pen, they cost less than 1,000 baht on Lazada.

 

-- the outcome seems in the hands of my ex not me.

No it is not, that's only for the time being. A Thai Juvenile court does not favour a Thai mother in front of a western father unless there's foul play involved, they favour the child's future and ignore the idiots on ThaiVisa who write differently. Now, foul play happens quite often with mothers educated in a farang bar against innocent western fathers but it can be countered by careful planning. There are other pitfalls too of course, courts can be trusted, your Thai lawyer can normally not!!!!!

 

-- I could stop all contact but I'm afraid she'll interpret that as not wanting to see my daughter. Only do that if you are prepared to walk away forever, otherwise transfer 4,000 baht per month until you are prepared to act in court. If you pay more than 4,000 baht now, adjust. I was in Juvenile court as an interpreter 6 weeks ago and couldn't stop my smile when the Thai mother said she wanted 30,000 baht per month and the head judge actually laughingly asked back - Would you be satisfied if the court orders 3,000?

 

Passport: Do absolutely not agree to sign for a Thai passport until you have been able to arrange British citizenship for your child and first after is done of course, a British passport that you keep far away from the mother in a safe place. I really don't see any reason to wait with this so although not in a rush, it should be done at the same time as "the other things" are sorted out. I'm 54 years old, you're 30. Trust me, you get more attached to your children with age, not less

 

HappyLarry's wife and her lawyer friend have been used by several ThaiVisa members, they're not Chiang Mai based but they fly in, they were in Chiang Mai for a success case in September 2017 by the way, you'd have to pay travel and accommodation and their normal fees. Contact HappyLarry, I don't know the cost

 

Got to go, late to a meeting :)

Best Regards

Michael

[sanemax]

1 hour ago, ChrisO1988 said:

my ex may have in her mind to take her to Germany as one of her other children has a German Father that visits once a year, I really don't know, she's unpredictable.

Would the German guy accept her going to Germany with another young baby and would be be willing to provide for it ?

   I very much doubt that he would 

[onera1961]

Firstly thanks for all that have taken the time to offer advice, I was hoping not to incur lawyer fees as I don't have a huge income. Just to clarify, my daughter looks just like me ( everyone says this, not just a Fathers wish!) so I don't doubt she is mine, but I'd be willing to take a DNA if required.The blackmailng messages are by SMS so I have some evidence, as far as getting anything else it's not easy she is in control! I ask all the time to see her, my ex sometimes says OK, I go to the house to spend some time with my daughter and we go shopping, I pay for everything to do with my daughter (quite willingly) then I have to leave for work. Other times she doesn't reply or says NO after the passport and agreed sum each month. I could stop all contact but I'm afraid she'll interpret that as not wanting to see my daughter, I'm a straight up kind of kind and playing games is not my forte, I just want regular contact and to support my daughter. I am not against getting her a passport but what's the rush anyway, my ex may have in her mind to take her to Germany as one of her other children has a German Father that visits once a year, I really don't know, she's unpredictable. I have no choice but to be patient but the outcome seems in the hands of my ex not me. Can you tell me, Michael, you recommend contacting HappyLarry, ask for his wife as interpreter and her contact as lawyer, I'm in Chiang Mai are they in my area? Thanks again.

Are you named as the father in birth certificate? If so and you accept her as your daughter, what is wrong giving her the UK passport? Help her whatever you can and afford. Try an amicable solution with your ex girlfriend but don't allow her to control you or put unreasonable financial demand on you. That will be my advice. Divorce custody etc when done out of spite is win- win situation for lawyers. I will give my money to a person who gave birth to my child than a complete stranger ( lawyer). Peace

Sent from my BND-L34 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[ChrisO1988]

Thanks for your comments, I have decided to continue to ask to see my daughter even when I am refused most of the time. I will keep receipts for anything I spend on her and be patient, collecting evidence of my ex's blackmailing attempts. If I can get my ex co-operation I will get my daughter a British Passport but at the same time as a Thai Passport and I will keep the British Passport and her mother can keep the Thai Passport. In due course court may be the next step. Thank you for your support and suggestions it has enabled me to feel more balanced in this difficult matter.

[The manic]

5 minutes ago, ChrisO1988 said:

Thanks for your comments, I have decided to continue to ask to see my daughter even when I am refused most of the time. I will keep receipts for anything I spend on her and be patient, collecting evidence of my ex's blackmailing attempts. If I can get my ex co-operation I will get my daughter a British Passport but at the same time as a Thai Passport and I will keep the British Passport and her mother can keep the Thai Passport. In due course court may be the next step. Thank you for your support and suggestions it has enabled me to feel more balanced in this difficult matter.

Have you had a DNA test? How do you know it is your child?

[Swimman]

1 minute ago, The manic said:

Have you had a DNA test? How do you know it is your child?

Him having DNA test would be pointless unless the child also provided a sample for testing.

[jak2002003]

7 minutes ago, Swimman said:

Him having DNA test would be pointless unless the child also provided a sample for testing.

I would insist that a DNA sample is taken from the child.  If not then I would stop all financial help until the mother agrees.  

 

Just because the child looks like him... that proves nothing.  

[TerryLH]

On 18/04/2018 at 11:50 AM, GarryP said:

If the DNA confirms that the child is not even his, then he can happily walk away and not bother with hiring interpreters and lawyers.  

Happily walk away?  I doubt that.  

[GarryP]

51 minutes ago, TerryLH said:

Happily walk away?  I doubt that.  

Okay. Just walk away.  

[BEVUP]

1 minute ago, GarryP said:

Okay. Just walk away.  

Exactly - if this is for real

So he took on a woman with another child from a German - So how was she surviving (maybe getting monthly payments from him

You can always be like a Thai man ( & I would quote her that ), she'll be real pissed knowing what it means

 

First DNA so you can go to court & proven as Father (not just on a whim & having to pay for the rest of your life )

 

Why the British PP - not going to help her unless mother gets a Englishman taking her there, it might help you latter if accepted as father