Australia joins the UK and USA with withdrawal of income verification

[dallen52]

25 minutes ago, ukrules said:

Those words will come back to haunt you, just like those who accused the British Embassy of lying based on the Americans and Australians confirming that there was 100% not going to be any change whatsoever.

 

In time all will be revealed.

It's being glossed over in all the hype.

And waffle about which countries do it better for the people. 

 

But the economic bottom line is how much you spend here.

Not the amount in a Bank account. 

That's just stagnant money. 

 

It's the pay wages, the drinks, the bar fines, the tourism, the family support, the whole thing that takes your money.

 

Even tea money contribution are going to be affected. 

 

250,000 police and immigration will be reduced to non active.

 

Thailand has made an industry out of immigration and the spin offs.

Edited November 2, 2018 by dallen52

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, wgdanson said:

And in the case of UK, cost the NHS a good few thousand pounds to look after those re-patriated guys.

Not to take this thread too far off topic but based on the accelerated demise of two loving but aging parents under the watch of the wonderful NHS, that much vaunted institution has all the mechanisms in place to ensure that any returnees with pre-existing conditions won't be hanging about for too long.

[Mac98]

The government is going to have to convince the banks to make it easier to open an account. Difficult to import retirement funds into a bank who won't accept your business.

[nickmondo]

Not a problem for any farang here with money due to 800k being easy enough.

Generally, i am not sure what is so great about Thailand anyway, so will probably bugger off next June anyway, and take my money with me.  ha ha

go somewhere else where there is some sort of intelligence.

Yes, I know, shut the door on my way out.........chortle, chortle.

 

[robblok]

2 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

Fair enough.  It certainly explains your lack of concern about those who can't afford an elite visa....

 

Forgive me for not understanding that you are 'important' because you are more wealthy. 

 

I'd only add that the very wealthy people I know here spend their money on 1) foreign goods 2) expat contractors that employ cheap locals, and so they consequently end up complaining about the poor product delivered!

I have an elite visa because I am not yet 50.. otherwise I would be on retirement visa. Before I was on a marriage visa with 400k in a Thai bank.  I don't have an elite visa for fun... there was no other option. 

 

This has nothing to do with wealthy or not, but with a system that is almost made to accommodate fraud. Just swearing to something without proof an no chance of getting caught.. what could possible go wrong..  (now we know what can go wrong )

 

On the other hand the Dutch embassy IS checking documents and trying to make sure that the data is correct and they now incorporate the tax office. That is the Dutch for you always innovating trying to stay ahead of things. So are other embassies that ask for proof its just the UK and their former colonies that have a system in place that is easy to fool. Instead of changing their procedures and helping their fellow countrymen they took the easy way out. 

 

But what is the big problem with moving money to a Thai bank.. sure you might get less interest or not.. but that is then the cost of living here.

 

 

[zydeco]

1 minute ago, robblok said:

On the other hand the Dutch embassy IS checking documents and trying to make sure that the data is correct and they now incorporate the tax office. That is the Dutch for you always innovating trying to stay ahead of things. So are other embassies that ask for proof its just the UK and their former colonies that have a system in place that is easy to fool. Instead of changing their procedures and helping their fellow countrymen they took the easy way out. 

Maybe it's because other countries have privacy laws that prohibit and protect their citizens' data.  Unlike the Dutch, who, it seems from your post, would be quite happy in China, where facial screening technology could watch what they are doing 24/7.  And just in case you didn't notice this topic concerns the US, the UK, and Australia.  Not the Netherlands.

[jimn]

4 hours ago, glegolo said:

When you gives the empression that you are confirming somthing, that is a stunt

 

glegolo

Your self serving attitude towards the subject will come back to haunt you when your embassy declares they will no longer issue letters. I am assuming you are from the Netherlands. Just wait and see all the others will follow now that the main countries have declared their intentions.

[giddyup]

1 hour ago, Billthekiwi said:

I would not expect Australia to help it's retirees living in Thailand.

They can't do it at home so why be different here?

What do you expect them to do, lend you the 800K?

[robblok]

1 minute ago, zydeco said:

Maybe it's because other countries have privacy laws that prohibit and protect their citizens' data.  Unlike the Dutch, who, it seems from your post, would be quite happy in China, where facial screening technology could watch what they are doing 24/7.  And just in case you didn't notice this topic concerns the US, the UK, and Australia.  Not the Netherlands.

No the Dutch are just more advanced them others, as the embassy uses statements from the tax office and that works. People can just ask their tax office for an income statement and with it the embassy has enough proof. How does that invade privacy ?

[Joe Mcseismic]

5 minutes ago, malt25 said:

Good bit of info there Russ, thanks. Maybe you could ask Cleverman to get intouch with the Phuet IO & ask if this is acceptable.

If it's anything like the British version, it's just to authenticate new passports so that visas can be transferred from the old passport to the new. The Thai IO won't do it without the letter.

[Pib]

37 minutes ago, zydeco said:

Okay, I've been doing the letter for several years.  The question now is about Chaeng Wattana.  If I now need the notarized bank statement showing my income and/or 800,000 deposited, do I need that done the day I get my extension or the day before?  If the day of, that means waiting in line at Bangkok Bank in the morning for the statement and then only being able to go to immigration in the afternoon.  Would be nice if I could do it the day before.

The day before should be fine.  I've using the Bt800K bank letter method for years at Chaeng Wattana.  I've used both Bangkok Bank and Krungsri Bank.  Issue of bank letter at Krungsri costs Bt100....a few years back when still using Bangkok Bank their letter was Bt200....but maybe it's Bt100 now.  

 

I show-up just before the banks and immigration open their doors at 8:30am.   I "first" go into the bank downstairs when they open their doors....within minutes I'm asking a bank teller for the letter....they make a copy of your passport main page and passbook pages....then tell you the letter will be ready in approx 30 minutes. 

 

I then go up to immigration and get a queue number....but this time the l......o........n.........g queue line outside the immigration doors has cleared....I get a queue number.   Or a person wanted to they could first get their queue number at immigration and then go to the bank....as mentioned getting the bank letter only takes around 30 minutes.

 

I then go back to the bank and pickup up the letter...this is usually around 9am.  Backup to immigration to await my queue number to be called.   I'm usually walking out of immigration with a renewed extension of stay around 11am, but this year in late August I walked out at 9:58am....done...finished....for another year.  

 

Issue of bank letter at Krungsri costs Bt100....a few years back when still using Bangkok Bank their letter was Bt200....but maybe it's Bt100 now.  

[Gold Star]

FWIW, I just got my income letter from my affidavit at the Canadian Embassy on Oct 23 last week, as my Visa renewal is in January 2019. I asked if there were plans for Canada to stop the service, and the lady said no, it is business as usual. At least there were no plans to scrap the service as of yet.

 

[zydeco]

1 minute ago, robblok said:

No the Dutch are just more advanced them others, as the embassy uses statements from the tax office and that works. People can just ask their tax office for an income statement and with it the embassy has enough proof. How does that invade privacy ?

Ah, so you're talking about an "unvarified statement."  The Dutch embassy does not actually contact the tax office themselves and verify the document they received is not counterfeit.  I'd say get ready for your letters to be cancelled soon, too.

[Media1]

7 hours ago, ezzra said:

The question is why now and whether the Thai government is behind it to force expats to bring more money into the country or is it a cahoot of the US, UK and the aussie governments for reasons that are know only to them...

NEW government soon. Team watches are behind this.

[Joe Mcseismic]

5 minutes ago, malt25 said:

Good bit of info there Russ, thanks. Maybe you could ask Cleverman to get intouch with the Phuet IO & ask if this is acceptable.

If it's anything like the British version, it's just to authenticate new passports so that visas can be transferred from the old passport to the new. The Thai IO won't do it without the letter.

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, ThaiFelix said:

I may be being paranoid (and I am sure some here will agree) but I wonder if this move by Thai Immigration is related to the survey done a few months ago where the results showed that most expats surveyed were living here on (or less than?) 45,000 baht a month.  Maybe someone from Big Brother reads these surveys (and everything on Thaivisa, Facebook etc) and wonders how there are so many on retirement visas here when most only have an income of approx. 45,000 per month, not 65,000 as required. Sure there are many with the 800k or 400k in the bank like myself but there are also a lot who believe I am an idiot for tying up these funds. 

 

This result may also worry some in Govt that many expats may not have the funds to cover themselves in the event of a serious accident or illness.  It seems to me that every time I complete a survey it comes back to bite me, so now I refuse to partake.  What do you think?

I don't think an extra 20K Baht/mo in income would make much difference "in the event of a serious accident or illness."  Money in the bank is better, but only to the extent the ill/injured just topped-up for their next extension. 

 

A "stabilize and send home" type medical-insurance scheme for all foreigners as a pre-requisite for a "permitted-stay" stamp would be the only way to end that potential liability.

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, soalbundy said:

of course it's been accepted, in conjunction with the embassy letter, now the step forward has to be, without the embassy letter but only TI can decide that and as of yet they have said nothing.

I am talking about the police order that says they will accept proof of qualifying monthly income in a Thai bank account in the name of the applicant.

 

AFAIK, the embassy letters/affidavits/stat decs were only needed to prove a qualifying income that was NOT domiciled in a Thai bank account, ie. funds or income in an overseas bank.

 

Why would one need a letter from your embassy to verify locally banked income?

[robblok]

2 minutes ago, giddyup said:

What do you expect them to do, lend you the 800K?

How about they just set up a good way to check the income so they can keep on going giving those statement instead of taking the easy way out ?

 

Other countries seem to check data, the Dutch do and others too according to Glegolo (he is not Dutch). So instead of blowing up the system why not see if an other system can be set up.

 

I agree with them that the current system is faulty.. but to blow it up without trying to find replacement first is bad.

[dallen52]

32 minutes ago, DavisH said:

The Aussie OAP is nowhere near 65K a month, so if that is their only source of income then it could be a problem or some. 

Ditto.

But we do spend our money here. 

And support the local economy. 

[zydeco]

3 minutes ago, Pib said:

The day before should be fine.  I've using the Bt800K bank letter method for years at Chaeng Wattana.  I've used both Bangkok Bank and Krungsri Bank.  Issue of bank letter at Krungsri costs Bt100....a few years back when still using Bangkok Bank their letter was Bt200....but maybe it's Bt100 now.  

 

I show-up just before the banks and immigration open their doors at 8:30am.   I "first" go into the bank downstairs when they open their doors....within minutes I'm asking a bank teller for the letter....they make a copy of your passport main page and passbook pages....then tell you the letter will be ready in approx 30 minutes. 

 

I then go up to immigration and get a queue number....but this time the l......o........n.........g queue line outside the immigration doors has cleared....I get a queue number.   Or a person wanted to they could first get their queue number at immigration and then go to the bank....as mentioned getting the bank letter only takes around 30 minutes.

 

I then go back to the bank and pickup up the letter...this is usually around 9am.  Backup to immigration to await my queue number to be called.   I'm usually walking out of immigration with a renewed extension of stay around 11am, but this year in late August I walked out at 9:58am....done...finished....for another year.  

 

Issue of bank letter at Krungsri costs Bt100....a few years back when still using Bangkok Bank their letter was Bt200....but maybe it's Bt100 now.  

Thanks a lot.  Appreciate all the information you provide. Detailed and to the point. 

[Russell17au]

2 minutes ago, Gold Star said:

FWIW, I just got my income letter from my affidavit at the Canadian Embassy on Oct 23 last week, as my Visa renewal is in January 2019. I asked if there were plans for Canada to stop the service, and the lady said no, it is business as usual. At least there were no plans to scrap the service as of yet.

 

Yesterday morning on the Australian Embassy website it stated that Australia's system was different and that there was no plans to change it and this morning on the same website the notice that I posted to start this thread was there. So things changed overnight, so anything can happen at anytime. I have been keeping a check on the Australian website every morning since the UK pulled the pin

[robblok]

Just now, NanLaew said:

I am talking about the police order that says they will accept proof of qualifying monthly income in a Thai bank account in the name of the applicant.

 

AFAIK, the embassy letters/affidavits/stat decs were only needed to prove a qualifying income that was NOT domiciled in a Thai bank account, ie. funds or income in an overseas bank.

 

Why would one need a letter from your embassy to verify locally banked income?

Yes they should accept it if on average 65k gets deposited into those accounts on a monthly basis.  I dont see why that would be a problem. Would be a good solution for many if the Thais accepted this.

[esqy]

More than 10,000 Thais deported from South Korea for overstaying their visa

national November 02, 2018 14:24

By The Nation

More than 10,000 Thais have been arrested and deported from South Korea for overstaying their visa during the first nine months of this year, the Thai labour attache in Seoul has reported.

 

Pinyuda Chaemchan, the labour attache to the Thai embassy in Seoul, updated the figures after she was briefed on the latest situation by the South Korean Immigration Office.

Pinyuda met the South Korean Immigration Office chief on Thursday.

During the meeting, she was informed that up to September, there are 192,163 Thais living in South Korea and up to 128,520 of them were overstaying their visa.

 Looks like Thailand is tightening up their standards to save face.

[Media1]

7 hours ago, giddyup said:

It's designed to force expats to actually prove they can meet the financial criteria instead of signing a possibly fraudulent stat dec.

It's designed to make it as difficult as possible because the current non Englsh speaking watch brigade don't speak English and don't like farang. China is the future

[Pattaya46]

2 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

A "stabilize and send home" type medical-insurance scheme for all foreigners as a pre-requisite for a "permitted-stay" stamp would be the only way to end that potential liability.

Looks like a "stabilize and sent him die abroad" to me 

How will people be able to pay hospital in their home country (usually more expensive!) if they are already not able to pay a Thai hospital ?

[giddyup]

38 minutes ago, alzack said:

its going to be 1 Million Baht next year they o not want us, they never did . just our money BUT one day the bottom is going to fall out of this country and back to buffaloes and sticky rice for them

We aren't propping up the Thai economy, we're just a drop in the bucket. Most of us need them a lot more than they need us.

[dallen52]

2 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

I don't think an extra 20K Baht/mo in income would make much difference "in the event of a serious accident or illness."  Money in the bank is better, but only to the extent the ill/injured just topped-up for their next extension. 

 

A "stabilize and send home" type medical-insurance scheme for all foreigners as a pre-requisite for a "permitted-stay" stamp would be the only way to end that potential liability.

Why not make it that all people entering Thailand have to demonstrate proof of insurance?

 

I for one have never been asked wrtthe 20,000 baht on entry.

 

Same with undesirables. 

Put an ankle tag in them.

 

But still let them spend their money here.

[DavisH]

4 minutes ago, dallen52 said:

Ditto.

But we do spend our money here. 

And support the local economy. 

Of course....I'm not a pensioner (yet), but think owning a condo/paid off a car, etc, one could easily live on 30K a month here. 

[Media1]

3 minutes ago, Russell17au said:

Yesterday morning on the Australian Embassy website it stated that Australia's system was different and that there was no plans to change it and this morning on the same website the notice that I posted to start this thread was there. So things changed overnight, so anything can happen at anytime. I have been keeping a check on the Australian website every morning since the UK pulled the pin

A election will rectify this 

[DavisH]

1 minute ago, giddyup said:

We aren't propping up the Thai economy, we're just a drop in the bucket. Most of us need them a lot more than they need us.

The real cash is from tourists....come, spend a lot and leave. I think allowing us to live here is more an act of goodwill between countries, rather than any real need for the presence of retirees.