Rejected at the airport, what is next?

[Gilsh]

4 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

First of all I wish to apologize to you and TV generally. I 100% thought this op was a wind up. You are very lucky you were not returned to Vietnam, only to maybe refused entry there (as per recent thread on TV from other member)

You have lot of advice already from members "ways to get around things". Fact is you haven't really come clean as to why your in Thailand 75% over last 4 years. If I was an io you would be sent back. Lucky for you got to avoid returning to Vietnam. Can you give us a tip how you managed that. Mainly because I have never heard of that concession

I am staying for most of the year in Thailand because I like it there, I don't need to work as I have passive income from online projects. all the advice are great, still, need a clarification for the few questions I wrote 2-3 messages ago. I called the embassy - they have an emergency line. They told me the consul will call me back - she did. i told her the whole story. she called them and tried to convince them to let me in. it didn't work so she convinced them to let me fly home. she was amazing. I guess its a really good idea to call your embassy when things go wrong like this. I almost didn't get any explanations and i didn't know what is going on. It was amazing to have someone that knows contacting me and help me.

 

also, she told me that they already had 3 similar cases this week. 

[DrJack54]

18 minutes ago, Gilsh said:

I am staying for most of the year in Thailand because I like it there, I don't need to work as I have passive income from online projects. all the advice are great, still, need a clarification for the few questions I wrote 2-3 messages ago. I called the embassy - they have an emergency line. They told me the consul will call me back - she did. i told her the whole story. she called them and tried to convince them to let me in. it didn't work so she convinced them to let me fly home. she was amazing. I guess its a really good idea to call your embassy when things go wrong like this. I almost didn't get any explanations and i didn't know what is going on. It was amazing to have someone that knows contacting me and help me.

 

also, she told me that they already had 3 similar cases this week. 

Happy you made it home. As for your next entry read advice from JT. Your one of the genuine people wishing to visit Los much of the year. Genuine tourist but sadly not an easy category for visiting Thailand so often. Not many countries allow 75% of 4 years live in thwir country on tourist visas. Many folk think its a right. Also bang on about how much xpats spend here in Thailand. 555. Nonessential

Edited December 1, 2018 by DrJack54
Error

[elviajero]

2 hours ago, Gilsh said:

ok, found this in my passport. I think it is related, anyone knows what it means?

This -- and the explosion notice -- confirm that you were denied entry under section 12 of the immigration act for two reasons (2) & (9).

 

12.2. Is rejection because you haven't demonstrated the means for living in the country for so long as a tourist. Anyone staying long term should have a long term visa or permit to stay, and in most cases have proved to immigration they have the means to provide a living; like a job, money in a Thai bank or a certified foreign income.

 

12.9 Is rejection because you didn't have the required 20K in cash.

 

 

[elviajero]

3 hours ago, Gilsh said:

Do you think that if now I change to ed visa it will make a difference? 

Unfortunately there is no definitive answer, as the decision on entry is completely down to the border officers on the day. You could turn up next time with a METV/SETV and be stamped in without question. Entering with a non-immigrant 'ED' visa could be a better option than trying to enter as a tourist again, but it doesn't guarantee anything.

 

You don't say how old you are, but if you're 20/30 something that will have been one of the contributing factors in being denied entry. Profiling definitely comes into their decision making. 

Edited December 1, 2018 by elviajero

[balo]

9 hours ago, Gilsh said:

All my stuff is in Thailand and I want to go back. what is the best option for me?

This is also something to think about if you leave the country.   

If you rent a condo and signed for a 1 year contract , maybe you bought a fridge , TV , furniture, a bike or a car. All on a tourist visa. 

Then I would bring all the documents with me , take pictures of your condo to show immigration that you have invested a lot. 

 

It might not help you in this case anyway , but they should show some consideration , as long as the visa is valid. 

 

 

[sanemax]

23 minutes ago, balo said:

This is also something to think about if you leave the country.   

If you rent a condo and signed for a 1 year contract , maybe you bought a fridge , TV , furniture, a bike or a car. All on a tourist visa. 

Then I would bring all the documents with me , take pictures of your condo to show immigration that you have invested a lot. 

 

It might not help you in this case anyway , but they should show some consideration , as long as the visa is valid. 

 

Showing a one year Condo rental contract isnt going to convince the I.O. that you are a tourist .

[dcnx]

New passport will work. Or fly into Chiang Mai.

 

Get your stuff and go somewhere that welcomes you. 

[AlexRich]

You could spend 9 months in the Phillipinnes without any hassle whatsoever. Go to Cebu City and it has all the modern conveniences of any Thai city. Then go back to Thailand.

[balo]

29 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Showing a one year Condo rental contract isnt going to convince the I.O. that you are a tourist .

No it won't , but it will show them you have invested here and maybe they will feel pity on you and let you in one last time so you have time to sell your stuff and leave Thailand in a normal way . 

 

If you are denied entry and have assets here worth 2 million the problem is not going away, you would have to return to sort things out. 

  

 

[Gilsh]

1 hour ago, elviajero said:

This -- and the explosion notice -- confirm that you were denied entry under section 12 of the immigration act for two reasons (2) & (9).

 

12.2. Is rejection because you haven't demonstrated the means for living in the country for so long as a tourist. Anyone staying long term should have a long term visa or permit to stay, and in most cases have proved to immigration they have the means to provide a living; like a job, money in a Thai bank or a certified foreign income.

 

12.9 Is rejection because you didn't have the required 20K in cash.

 

 

Wow, that's sucks. I had papers with me showing my passive income from my project but she didn't want to see them. thank you very much for the explanation 

[Gilsh]

anyone knows if it is also relatively safe to fly to Samui or Phuket?

[Gilsh]

9 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

BTW. OP, why do you keep mentioning you have never stayed more than 9months in any given year. I am not familiar with that "law". I don't expect a response. Hasn't been any so far to any advice.

Good to know, I thought that was the law

[Gilsh]

9 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

BTW. OP, why do you keep mentioning you have never stayed more than 9months in any given year. I am not familiar with that "law". I don't expect a response. Hasn't been any so far to any advice.

Good to know, I thought that was the law

[elviajero]

1 hour ago, Gilsh said:

Wow, that's sucks. I had papers with me showing my passive income from my project but she didn't want to see them. thank you very much for the explanation 

Unfortunately people on forums have been giving duff advice for years. Waving bank statements or claiming you have an income is going to be of little interest to border officers intent on denying entry for long term tourism.

[mvdf]

12 hours ago, edwardandtubs said:

If it was that easy, don't you think he would have done it? There are no cash machines before immigration. This has been explained many times on this forum.

BRING CASH! Why is it so difficult for English-speaking expats to understand this!? Tourists bring cash with them. No bona fide tourist travels totally cashless! Maligning the Kingdom's border watchdogs for performing their duties is plain wrong. If you all want to avoid problems, follow the rules, instead of challenging them!

[onera1961]

28 minutes ago, mvdf said:

BRING CASH! Why is it so difficult for English-speaking expats to understand this!? Tourists bring cash with them. No bona fide tourist travels totally cashless! Maligning the Kingdom's border watchdogs for performing their duties is plain wrong. If you all want to avoid problems, follow the rules, instead of challenging them!

I think it becomes a habit. When people have access to cash anywhere in the world, they don't think about keeping cash with them. It is just a ploy by the immigration not to install at least one ATM machine before entry. They have currency conversion booth before immigration but no ATM machine. And I bet banks will compete to install ATM machines (because of their ridiculous ATM fee) to have their machines before immigration.

Edited December 2, 2018 by onera1961

[fruitman]

9 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Interesting. That sounds like you think immigration officers basically want to deny entry to some people and just have to find a reason why they can do this, correct?

Do you know why this happens or do you have maybe an unconfirmed idea?

I know traffic police officers have some quota of how many tickets they have to write. So they write those tickets any way they can do it. But I can't imagine that the immigration officers have some quote to deny entry to people.

They should know that they upset people and they should know that people talk about this.

And it seems they also don't do it to collect bribes (at least I didn't see it mentioned).

So what is their motivation? Just to show that they are powerful and can do it?

In my latest passport are only official multiple non-o visa's for entering thailand....but when i arrive at the airport they always read all pages and check stamps ....Takes about a minute or so. I'm European if that matters.

 

I also got the impression they are searching for something to refuse me entry...i never did anything wrong though, never overstayed or anything. They have asked me if i work in Thailand which i don't and won't.

[elviajero]

18 minutes ago, onera1961 said:

I think it becomes a habit. When people have access to cash anywhere in the world, they don't think about keeping cash with them. It is just a ploy by the immigration not to install at least one ATM machine before entry. They have currency conversion booth before immigration but no ATM machine. And I bet banks will compete to install ATM machines (because of their ridiculous ATM fee) to have their machines before immigration.

There are no ATM’s because they aren’t needed by 99.99% of visitors, and the lack of certainly isn’t anything to do with an immigration ploy!

 

If immigration are asking about cash they are almost certainly thinking about denying entry even if the person has the requisite cash. Even if ATM’s existed they’d be of little use to someone in that situation.

Edited December 2, 2018 by elviajero

[onera1961]

23 minutes ago, elviajero said:

There are no ATM’s because they aren’t needed by 99.99% of visitors, and the lack of certainly isn’t anything to do with an immigration ploy!

But they have a currency conversion booth. And I had seen a few people at the counter most of the time when I came to BKK airport. 

[tifino]

27 minutes ago, onera1961 said:

But they have a currency conversion booth. And I had seen a few people at the counter most of the time when I came to BKK airport. 

 ... and if one claims to have a foreign card that one claims has funds in it, then simply attend the currconvcounter to convert some of that out to cash! Where is the problem? 

[Lovethailandelite]

3 hours ago, Gilsh said:

anyone knows if it is also relatively safe to fly to Samui or Phuket?

Your already in the immigration system as being denied entry. It makes no difference where you attempt to enter. It will be seen.

11 minutes ago, tifino said:

 ... and if one claims to have a foreign card that one claims has funds in it, then simply attend the currconvcounter to convert some of that out to cash! Where is the problem? 

They are not exchanges airside. They are banking booths for those that have accounts with them.

Edited December 2, 2018 by Lovethailandelite

[onera1961]

14 minutes ago, tifino said:

... and if one claims to have a foreign card that one claims has funds in it, then simply attend the currconvcounter to convert some of that out to cash! Where is the problem? 

I am not sure. Do you think one can get Thai baht from a currency conversion counter using credit or debit Visa/MC?I will try it out in Pattaya. If it is so, than there is no need for ATM, I agree.

[jackdd]

33 minutes ago, tifino said:

 ... and if one claims to have a foreign card that one claims has funds in it, then simply attend the currconvcounter to convert some of that out to cash! Where is the problem? 

Afaik exchange booths don't / can't do cash advances. Did you ever do a cash advance at such a place? It would also definitely not be in their interest, for exchanging the kasikorn and scb booths at the airport take 5%, when doing a cash advance they would not earn these 5%

[overherebc]

1 hour ago, fruitman said:

In my latest passport are only official multiple non-o visa's for entering thailand....but when i arrive at the airport they always read all pages and check stamps ....Takes about a minute or so. I'm European if that matters.

 

I also got the impression they are searching for something to refuse me entry...i never did anything wrong though, never overstayed or anything. They have asked me if i work in Thailand which i don't and won't.

Malaysia, Japan and a couple of other places I noticed they do the machine scan first, quick look at you and PP photo, stamp all in about 15 seconds.

[Misty]

If the OP wants to and is able to stay in Thailand for 9 months of the year without having to work, wouldn't this be a case where the Elite card could make sense?

[poohy]

3 hours ago, onera1961 said:

I think it becomes a habit. When people have access to cash anywhere in the world, they don't think about keeping cash with them. It is just a ploy by the immigration not to install at least one ATM machine before entry. They have currency conversion booth before immigration but no ATM machine. And I bet banks will compete to install ATM machines (because of their ridiculous ATM fee) to have their machines before immigration.

i agree in my wallet on my last entrance to Thailand i had abut 300 dollars equivalent of AUD USD GBP SGD and smattering of ringit basically left over notes from recent travels luckily i am on a retirement visa because i would rarely think to have pile of cash with me at any time 

 

[Proboscis]

I think that the message the Thai authorities are trying to send to all folks coming to Thailand is that tourism visas (and visa waivers) are for genuine tourists only. If you want to stay longer without hassle, get an appropriate visa for longer stays. It is really that simple. Those persisting with back-to-back tourist visas and extenstions can expect push back - this time it will be the 20k THB requirement, next time it will be some other restriction. Until you get the message.

[Enoon]

 

"I called the embassy - they have an emergency line. They told me the consul will call me back - she did. i told her the whole story. she called them and tried to convince them to let me in. it didn't work so she convinced them to let me fly home.

I guess its a really good idea to call your embassy when things go wrong like this."

 

That's a good one.

 

I suspect I'd have better luck calling your embassy.

 

 

Edited December 2, 2018 by Enoon

[scubascuba3]

If the OP wants to and is able to stay in Thailand for 9 months of the year without having to work, wouldn't this be a case where the Elite card could make sense?

Yes if around 30, no if near to 50

[JackThompson]

11 hours ago, Gilsh said:

ok, found this in my passport. I think it is related, anyone knows what it means?

The "9" means you didn't have the 20K Baht to show

The "2" means they determined you did not have the funds to afford your stay here. 

 

Regarding the "2" - Did they look at you bank-balance and tell you it needed to be higher, or it needed to show foreign-xfers?  Did they say you needed to bring a different form of proof on this point in the future, to get a Tourist Visa entry of 60-days stay?  I am guessing not, given others have reported getting it without any questions at all about their financial situation - but those would have been relevant to that stamp.

 

Note that you were applying for a 60-day stay, so any financial issues would Only involve funds needed for that future-time, maximum.  An additional 30-days can be applied for to extend that stay, but this receives separate and independent permission-granted by immigration at a local office.  So, only 60-days of future-spending-ability was relevant when you were attempting entry.  If they didn't determine you didn't have the funds to live here for 60-days, then they lied when they put that "2" in your passport-stamp.

 

10 hours ago, Gilsh said:

fortunately, the Israeli consul helped me and convinced them to let me fly back to Israel on the same day.

10 hours ago, Gilsh said:

I called the embassy - they have an emergency line. They told me the consul will call me back - she did. i told her the whole story. she called them and tried to convince them to let me in. it didn't work so she convinced them to let me fly home. she was amazing. I guess its a really good idea to call your embassy when things go wrong like this. I almost didn't get any explanations and i didn't know what is going on. It was amazing to have someone that knows contacting me and help me.

 

also, she told me that they already had 3 similar cases this week.  

How I wish our consulates/govts cared about our well-being as much as yours cares about you and yours.  You are very fortunate, in this respect.

 

10 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Lucky for you got to avoid returning to Vietnam. Can you give us a tip how you managed that. Mainly because I have never heard of that concession

His govt exists to help and serve the interests of his people, anywhere in the world, first and foremost.  That's the primary difference.