The Official Manchester City Thread

[owl sees all]

8 hours ago, mrbojangles said:

Sane's a great player (not as good this year as he was last year) and we'll be worse off without him, depending who we get in I suppose. Agree the manager has a part to play in sorting out attitude's. Pep will undoubtedly have tried but he won't put the togetherness of the whole squad at risk for one player 

Great player!!!!!!!!!!!!!????????  A good player; yes. But great? Only a handful of great players in the EPL and Sane is not one. Don't want to lose him though. And I've full confidence in Pep to do the right thing if he needs AA (attitude adjustment). But! If he wants to go then thanks, but bye bye.

[mrbojangles]

2 hours ago, owl sees all said:

Great player!!!!!!!!!!!!!????????  A good player; yes. But great? Only a handful of great players in the EPL and Sane is not one.

Defining somebody's skill level is mainly based on a personal opinion and depends on what/who you are using as your datum line and where you are setting your bar. Yes, you could use an objective stance and gather all the stats that are out there but I prefer the more gut feel. A great player to me, is a player who is well above average and I think Sane is well above average. Getting the Young Player of the Year last year would support that.

 

Looking at it from wider view point, in Dec 2018 a panel of 225 experts from 69 nations voted for their top 100 players in the world. Sane came out at number 57 in the world. That to me says he is well above your average player. You may disagree with this Top 100 list and you probably will but that's the great thing about football, we are all allowed an opinion

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2018/dec/18/the-100-best-male-footballers-in-the-world-2018-nos-100-71

[owl sees all]

1 hour ago, mrbojangles said:

Defining somebody's skill level is mainly based on a personal opinion and depends on what/who you are using as your datum line and where you are setting your bar. Yes, you could use an objective stance and gather all the stats that are out there but I prefer the more gut feel. A great player to me, is a player who is well above average and I think Sane is well above average. Getting the Young Player of the Year last year would support that.

 

Looking at it from wider view point, in Dec 2018 a panel of 225 experts from 69 nations voted for their top 100 players in the world. Sane came out at number 57 in the world. That to me says he is well above your average player. You may disagree with this Top 100 list and you probably will but that's the great thing about football, we are all allowed an opinion

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2018/dec/18/the-100-best-male-footballers-in-the-world-2018-nos-100-71

For me there are only 3 'world class' players in the EPL. Virgil van dijk, Mohammed Salah and Kevin de Bruyn. There are a few knocking on the door of greatness IMO. Hazard, Alison, Aguero. A couple of others.

 

I had a good look at the list and thought it utter nonsense. I reckon the list was constructed straight after the world cup. Lukaku at no 41 and no Vardy. Jorginho at 52 and Dzeko at 54; no way. What about the Scot who plays for the Reds; Robertson? Should be in top 25. And Benzema, only at 48; top 10 man.

 

Totally agree with you Mr Bo; game of opinions.  Good to be chatting about footy and not some other rubbish.

[Bredbury Blue]

Sane has the talent of a world class player but he lacks consistency; some games he's a 5 or 6 out of 10 and others an 8 or 9. Needs to play for the full 90 minutes like Bernardo, who is at least an 8/10 every game. If Sane can do that he will be world class but i don't think he has that application in every game in him. And that is why Pep doesn't start Sane in most games but brings him off the bench when defenders are tiring and the game stretched.

 

[mrbojangles]

8 hours ago, owl sees all said:

For me there are only 3 'world class' players in the EPL. 

This is where our Barometers may not be calibrated with each other.

 

Mine has 5 markers:- She-ite-----Average------Good------Great-----World Class

 

I class Sane as a great player

[RickG16]

1 hour ago, mrbojangles said:

This is where our Barometers may not be calibrated with each other.

 

Mine has 5 markers:- She-ite-----Average------Good------Great-----World Class

 

I class Sane as a great player

Name who you consider world class.

[mrbojangles]

15 minutes ago, RickG16 said:

Name who you consider world class.

What. Everybody? Or just the prem? Or just at City?

[RickG16]

30 minutes ago, mrbojangles said:

What. Everybody? Or just the prem? Or just at City?

PL

[champers]

3 minutes ago, RickG16 said:

PL

You have to take a global view, but the creme de la creme gravitates to Europe, namwly Barca, Real Madrid, PSG, top 6 in the EPL, Juve and Bayern Munich. Anybody top notch in the rest of Europe ; at Ajax perhaps; will inevtably move on to the above named.

[mrbojangles]

11 minutes ago, RickG16 said:

PL

Nah. I'll just do City.

 

Ederson, Sterling, Bernardo Silva, David Silva, Kevin De Bruyne and Aguero. You may argue about Ederson in particular but I watch him every week and he is world class.

 

Edit. Think I'll throw Fernandinho in the mix as well

[RickG16]

2 minutes ago, mrbojangles said:

Nah. I'll just do City.

 

Ederson, Sterling, Bernardo Silva, David Silva, Kevin De Bruyne and Aguero. You may argue about Ederson in particular but I watch him every week and he is world class.

 

Edit. Think I'll throw Fernandinho in the mix as well

I wouldn't disagree too much... If Sterling can have a good Euros he would really confirm his place in the elite....

 

Maybe you should add another level...top 5 or 10. Can a player be considered that level until they've performed at the highest level in the World Cup or Champs League. Talking about Bale, Mbappe, Ronaldo level.

 

Could we actually consider Pogba at that level going off the WC alone? After all it is the highest stage.

[mrbojangles]

17 minutes ago, RickG16 said:

Maybe you should add another level...top 5 or 10. Can a player be considered that level until they've performed at the highest level in the World Cup or Champs League. Talking about Bale, Mbappe, Ronaldo level.

 

Could we actually consider Pogba at that level going off the WC alone? After all it is the highest stage.

Suppose you could add a "Gifted" or "Elite" level but I wouldn't put Bale or Pogba that high. World class but not at the very top IMO of course

[jellydog]

40 minutes ago, mrbojangles said:

Nah. I'll just do City.

 

Ederson, Sterling, Bernardo Silva, David Silva, Kevin De Bruyne and Aguero. You may argue about Ederson in particular but I watch him every week and he is world class.

 

Edit. Think I'll throw Fernandinho in the mix as well

Laporte might make the list as well. If not now then not far away.

[RickG16]

1 hour ago, mrbojangles said:

Suppose you could add a "Gifted" or "Elite" level but I wouldn't put Bale or Pogba that high. World class but not at the very top IMO of course

I like players who can do it week after week at club level, and turn it on for a one month international tournament when the stakes are higher.

 

It's why some people, myself and Shaka Hislop on ESPN included, believe that you can't put Messi above Maradona or Pele.

 

Pogba just needs to learn the week by week bit ???? 

[mrbojangles]

 

   

1 hour ago, jellydog said:

Laporte might make the list as well. If not now then not far away.

Agreed and he is improving weekly but he's got to also pin a place down in the France team as well.

[mrbojangles]

20 minutes ago, RickG16 said:

It's why some people, myself and Shaka Hislop on ESPN included, believe that you can't put Messi above Maradona or Pele.

Maradona and Pele where different era's and it's always hard to compare past and present but for me, Messi is definitely in the Special or Gifted class

[RickG16]

22 minutes ago, mrbojangles said:

Maradona and Pele where different era's and it's always hard to compare past and present but for me, Messi is definitely in the Special or Gifted class

The comparison is between Pele and Maradona owning World Cups and Messi bottling it. It must be a mental thing, but it has to be a black mark next to his name when considering the ATGs.  

[owl sees all]

20 hours ago, mrbojangles said:

This is where our Barometers may not be calibrated with each other.

 

Mine has 5 markers:- She-ite-----Average------Good------Great-----World Class

 

I class Sane as a great player

Good exchange this.

 

I'd like to promote another view although it has been touched upon by other respected posters.

 

All the players that play in the PL are good players (for that matter the Championship too). We are talking EPL only.

 

This is how i would rate them.

 

Steady; rarely flamboyant, can be relied on; Milner, Noble, Drinkwater etc.

With flair; not top notch but can have their moments; Wallcott, Ozil, Lakuku etc.  

Well above average; can turn on the style when in the mood; Erickson, Pogba, Sane. Mane, Kane, Robertson etc.

Great/world class; show their class virtually every game; Kevin de Bruyn, Virgil van Dijk, Mo Salah.

 

For me a great, or world class player, would be on the pitch or on the bench if the two great teams were playing each other. Players have the odd fantastic season, but that doesn't make them great. And if the selection criteria was the world Cup or Euros then Nobby Styles gets a shout but not George Best.

[Kadilo]

2 hours ago, owl sees all said:

Good exchange this.

 

I'd like to promote another view although it has been touched upon by other respected posters.

 

All the players that play in the PL are good players (for that matter the Championship too). We are talking EPL only.

 

This is how i would rate them.

 

Steady; rarely flamboyant, can be relied on; Milner, Noble, Drinkwater etc.

With flair; not top notch but can have their moments; Wallcott, Ozil, Lakuku etc.  

Well above average; can turn on the style when in the mood; Erickson, Pogba, Sane. Mane, Kane, Robertson etc.

Great/world class; show their class virtually every game; Kevin de Bruyn, Virgil van Dijk, Mo Salah.

 

For me a great, or world class player, would be on the pitch or on the bench if the two great teams were playing each other. Players have the odd fantastic season, but that doesn't make them great. And if the selection criteria was the world Cup or Euros then Nobby Styles gets a shout but not George Best.

Drinkwater relied upon? Clearly Chelsea don’t think so, he’s not even a bit player. Relied upon to get a round in possibly. 

Lakuku with flair? You are talking about the one at Man U?

 

[sanemax]

2 hours ago, owl sees all said:

Good exchange this.

 

I'd like to promote another view although it has been touched upon by other respected posters.

 

All the players that play in the PL are good players (for that matter the Championship too). We are talking EPL only.

 

This is how i would rate them.

 

Steady; rarely flamboyant, can be relied on; Milner, Noble, Drinkwater etc.

With flair; not top notch but can have their moments; Wallcott, Ozil, Lakuku etc.  

Well above average; can turn on the style when in the mood; Erickson, Pogba, Sane. Mane, Kane, Robertson etc.

Great/world class; show their class virtually every game; Kevin de Bruyn, Virgil van Dijk, Mo Salah.

 

For me a great, or world class player, would be on the pitch or on the bench if the two great teams were playing each other. Players have the odd fantastic season, but that doesn't make them great. And if the selection criteria was the world Cup or Euros then Nobby Styles gets a shout but not George Best.

Hasnt Salah just had one good season though ?

[BangrakBob]

14 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Hasnt Salah just had one good season though ?

Golden Boot 2 seasons in a row

[sanemax]

1 minute ago, BangrakBob said:

Golden Boot 2 seasons in a row

Although this season he scored ten goals less than the previous season 

[BangrakBob]

2 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Although this season he scored ten goals less than the previous season 

Sure, but last season was a sensational season.  

 

More often than not he was being marked by 2-3 men when in possession this season

[mrbojangles]

1 hour ago, BangrakBob said:

Golden Boot 2 seasons in a row

3 way split this year ????

[champers]

Anyone else seen the report David Silva is mulling over an opportunity to play in the Gulf? He might have played his last game for City.

Though inadvertantly, this City team does seem to be maybe breaking up.

[Kadilo]

I see a report today that Pellegrini is considering buying Delph as a utility player as it appears he could be sold. 

He clearly is not getting a look in at City but considering your squad I’m not surprised.

 

He was knocking on the England door not so long ago and seemed to be well thought off but appears to go off the radar. Injuries, lost form?

 

i can think of worse players as cover for a few positions if the price was right if he has anything like his old ability in him still. 

 

......and no we won’t be doing a straight swap with Rice before you ask ????

 

[mrbojangles]

7 hours ago, champers said:

Anyone else seen the report David Silva is mulling over an opportunity to play in the Gulf? He might have played his last game for City.

Though inadvertantly, this City team does seem to be maybe breaking up.

Yeah seen the "rumour" and summer will be full of them. Until any deals are done, I'll treat em as just that. 

 

As for the City team breaking up. We've know for ages that some would be leaving purely because of their age. That's normal in any club isn't it?

[champers]

22 minutes ago, mrbojangles said:

Yeah seen the "rumour" and summer will be full of them. Until any deals are done, I'll treat em as just that. 

 

As for the City team breaking up. We've know for ages that some would be leaving purely because of their age. That's normal in any club isn't it?

They are leaving Bolton because they aren't getting paid ... yet. 

How rich is your Sheikh's cousin, the one buying the Geordies? I know you have extensive inside knowledge to call on, or is it Bob?

[mrbojangles]

56 minutes ago, champers said:

How rich is your Sheikh's cousin, the one buying the Geordies? 

Dunno mate but we'd need a couple of abacuses (or is it abaci) to count it

[mrbojangles]

Good response from Al Mubarak yesterday. Like the guy a lot, very articulate and astute.

 

Quote

La Liga president Javier Tebas on Tuesday accused City and Qatari-owned Paris Saint-Germain of "inflating the market" with their state-sponsored cash - "one-off petrol-money, one-off gas", he said.

Al Mubarak says "there is hypocrisy in this statement that is ironic" because Spain's top clubs have historically been responsible for "these huge jumps in transfer" fees. He also suggested a racist undertone to Tebas' comments.

"I think there's something deeply wrong in bringing ethnicity into the conversation," he said. "This is just ugly. I think the way he is combining teams because of ethnicity. I find that very disturbing to be honest."

Responding to the Tebas' comments on spending, he added: "Number one, let's look at the Spanish league, the time of breaking records on player acquisitions, I mean, who started that?

"Let's go back to the world records, Figo, Zidane. You know, the history, you have to look back at the history of La Liga, a league dominated by two clubs and Mr Tebas should look back at the history of that league and how distortion has happened throughout the ages.

"And then you look back at transfers. In the top 10 transfers of all time, Manchester City has not a single player in that, not a single one. So I don't really take it seriously and I ask our fans to always put it in context.

"And I think people with glass homes shouldn't be throwing rocks. I'm happy to talk to anyone as long as the conversation is about facts but once we start talking about innuendo and talking about theories I have no time for that."

Al Mubarak believes Tebas' criticism is driven by the growing success of the Premier League, with all four spots in this season's European finals occupied by English teams.

 

"You have four Premier League teams in the two European finals and that's a fact and that bothers a lot of people in many places. I find it very strange that coming back here in the UK…. we have to be protecting that," he said.

 

"We have the best league in the world, we have the most commercial league in the world, the most successful clubs in the world, economically, commercially in terms of global presence, and that's why this attack is not just on Manchester City, it's against this league.

"And I hope people start seeing that and start - I know people don't want to defend Manchester City - but for God's sake start defending this league."