If Trump’s Fundraising Numbers Are Any Clue, He’s in Serious Trouble

[rooster59]

Trump widens demands in wall standoff, threatens Mexico border closure

By David Morgan and James Oliphant

 

U.S. President Donald Trump speaks during a signing ceremony for H.R. 2, the "Agriculture Improvement Act of 2018" in Washington, U.S., December 20, 2018. REUTERS/Jim Young/Files

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Donald Trump threatened on Friday to close the southern U.S. border with Mexico unless he gets the money he wants for a wall, raising the stakes in a standoff that will present an immediate test next week for the new U.S. Congress.

 

When Nancy Pelosi and the Democrats take control of the U.S. House of Representatives on Thursday, they plan to quickly approve a spending measure meant to end a partial government shutdown that began on Dec. 22, triggered by Trump's demand for $5 billion in funding for his proposed wall.

 

Democrats have made clear that the House measure, which would then have to go to the Republican-controlled Senate, will not include $5 billion Trump says is needed for the wall, a central part of his tougher positions on immigration than his predecessors.

 

"Democrats are united against the president's immoral, ineffective and expensive wall ... that he specifically promised that Mexico would pay for," Pelosi spokesman Drew Hammill said in a statement, referring to a Trump 2016 presidential campaign pledge.

 

Trump has previously threatened to close the border to prevent Central American immigrants reaching the United States. Asked about Trump's threat on Friday, Mexican President Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador told reporters it was an internal U.S. government matter.

 

Lopez Obrador added, however: "Of course we will always defend our sovereignty ... We will always protect migrants, defend their human rights."

 

Whether Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell, Pelosi and Trump can find a way forward to fully reopen the government will say a lot about the next two years of divided government.

 

A close congressional ally of Trump's on Friday sent a tweet suggesting more partisan confrontation lies ahead. "To Nancy Pelosi and the House Democrats: No Wall Money, No Deal," Republican Senator Lindsey Graham wrote on Twitter.

 

The dispute over Trump's wall has led to the shutdown of "non-essential" operations at numerous agencies because of lack of funding, including the departments of Agriculture, Homeland Security, Interior, Transportation, Commerce and Justice.

 

Trump is demanding that Congress include his $5 billion in legislation that must be passed to restore funding to the agencies that expired at midnight on Dec. 21.

 

Firing off angry tweets from the White House early on Friday, the president widened his demands.

 

"We will be forced to close the Southern Border entirely if the Obstructionist Democrats do not give us the money to finish the Wall & also change the ridiculous immigration laws that our Country is saddled with," Trump tweeted. "Either we build (finish) the Wall or we close the Border."

 

'PROUD' TO SHUT DOWN

 

Earlier this month, Trump said he would be "proud" to shut down the government over border security.

 

But since the shutdown started, he has tried to blame Democrats. In television interviews on Friday, Trump aides said Democrats have refused to negotiate over the matter.

 

"We're here, and they know where to find us," White House Chief of Staff Mick Mulvaney said in an interview with Fox News Channel. "Where is Chuck Schumer? Where is Nancy Pelosi? They're not even talking right now," he said.

 

Schumer is the top Democrat in the Senate. Pelosi's spokesman said the White House has not reached out formally to her since Dec. 11, when she and Schumer had a contentious, televised Oval Office meeting with Trump.

 

Pelosi is expected to become speaker of the House on Jan. 3 because Democrats won a House majority in November's elections.

 

Since their victory, House Democrats have talked about seeking common ground with Republicans, while also promising numerous investigations of Trump, who has painted himself and Republicans in the Senate into a political corner.

 

Rejecting next week's spending measure from House Democrats would put a Republican stamp on the shutdown. But accepting it would mean backing away from Trump's proposed wall.

 

THREE OPTIONS

 

Pelosi and Schumer have been discussing three options for Democratic legislation, according to a senior Democratic aide.

 

One is a stop-gap funding bill that would run through Feb. 8. Another is six full 2019 appropriations bills for all but the Department of Homeland Security, which would be funded through a measure known as a continuing resolution maintaining current funding through Sept 30. The third is a continuing resolution for all shuttered agencies that would expire on Sept 30.

 

The aide said the legislation expected for a full House vote on Jan. 3 could be a variation on any of the three options.

 

According to a Reuters/Ipsos poll released on Thursday, 47 percent of Americans hold Trump responsible for the shutdown, while 33 percent blame Democrats in Congress.

 

The shutdown affects about 800,000 employees. Most of the federal government, which directly employs almost 4 million people, is unaffected. Even agencies that are affected never totally close, with "essential" workers still on the job.

 

Trump, who scrapped plans to spend Christmas at his private resort in Florida and stayed in Washington, has now also cancelled his New Year's plans, Mulvaney said.

 

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-12-29

[simple1]

7 minutes ago, rooster59 said:

Trump tweeted. "Either we build (finish) the Wall or we close the Border."

Is trump claiming he would close the border for trade? If so he has a screw loose.

[mikebike]

14 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Is trump claiming he would close the border for trade? If so he has a screw loose.

I believe that is the implication. 45 is so far up his own butt on this he believes it is a winning strategy. 

[EVENKEEL]

I heard on the news this morning there's another caravan forming up, they're putting the number at 15,000 people. This is getting ridiculous. Get ready Tijuana for another invasion. How anyone can not think erecting barriers at strategic locations along the border is a good idea is beyond me. Folks hatred of POTUS is getting in their way of rational thinking. 

 

[mikebike]

13 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

I heard on the news this morning there's another caravan forming up

Pavlov's base heard from.

 

Tweet - drool - anger - type.

[TopDeadSenter]

They should make the wall with Russian collusion, people can't get over that. But big walls work well. The Chinese built one over 2000 years ago and still don't have any Mexicans.

[Chomper Higgot]

3 minutes ago, Zombies said:

 

Visa overstayers are not the same as illegal aliens that cross the southern border unvetted, and the other side of the argument is the drugs, crime, human trafficking, child abuse, that comes almost exclusively through our porous southern border. 

If Americans stopped buying illegal drugs that would fix one of the problems.

 

Trump himself has employed illegal immigrants at his businesses, perhaps he could lead by example to fix that problems.

 

Trump’s open support for men accused of child abuse suggests he’ll not offer any help on that front.

 

 

[Bluespunk]

1 hour ago, EVENKEEL said:

I heard on the news this morning there's another caravan forming up, they're putting the number at 15,000 people. This is getting ridiculous. Get ready Tijuana for another invasion. How anyone can not think erecting barriers at strategic locations along the border is a good idea is beyond me. Folks hatred of POTUS is getting in their way of rational thinking. 

 

Which news outlet did you hear that on?

[Zombies]

2 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

Which news outlet did you hear that on?

Quote

Another migrant caravan will soon be making its way north from Honduras with an estimated 15,000 people, according to new reports. 

As the thousands of migrants who fled the Central American country in October remain stranded at the Mexico border waiting to enter the US, the even larger group is prepared is preparing to depart for the north on January 15.  

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6536565/Another-migrant-caravan-15-000-people-set-depart-Honduras-month.html

Quote

Another migrant caravan — with estimates of as many as 15,000 participants — is preparing to leave Honduras on January 15, according to migrant rights advocates and Spanish-language media.

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/migrant-caravan/sd-me-another-caravan-20181227-story.html

[Scott]

Off-topic posts removed.

 

[Bluespunk]

4 minutes ago, Zombies said:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6536565/Another-migrant-caravan-15-000-people-set-depart-Honduras-month.html

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/migrant-caravan/sd-me-another-caravan-20181227-story.html

Both those articles say they are not heading to the USA. 

 

Both of which are are based on one person’s quoted statement. 

Edited December 29, 2018 by Bluespunk

[keemapoot]

2 hours ago, simple1 said:

Is trump claiming he would close the border for trade? If so he has a screw loose.

Sure, Trump is great at escalating conflicts to a nuclear level. This is one of the principal reasons he is so dangerous to the US and world. He just goes ballistic and someone with as much power as the US President can do a lot of damage by himself, even in a well-designed tripartite government of checks and balances.

[EVENKEEL]

5 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

Both those articles say they are not heading to the USA. 

You're right it does say that. We'll see.

[attrayant]

I found a few local outlets reporting this and they all source foreign media, such as Mexico News Daily: Another caravan on the way: 15,000 heading north but destination is Chiapas:

 

"Another large migrant caravan is on its way to Mexico but unlike those that came before it, this one isn’t headed for the United States’ southern border, according to a migrants’ advocate." 

 

I bet Trump and his followers won't mention that last part.

[Scott]

Troll posts removed.  

 

[mikebike]

36 minutes ago, Zombies said:

the drugs, crime, human trafficking, child abuse, that comes almost exclusively through our porous southern border

Except that home-grown 'murican criminals and abusers far outnumber those entering from elsewhere by orders of magnitude. The problem isn't "the others"... it's your neighbours!!

 

45's supporters heads explode when reality creeps in...

[EVENKEEL]

7 minutes ago, mikebike said:

Except that home-grown 'murican criminals and abusers far outnumber those entering from elsewhere by orders of magnitude. The problem isn't "the others"... it's your neighbours!!

 

45's supporters heads explode when reality creeps in...

I'm sure the wife and baby of slain police officer in Newman, Ca. by the illegal alien will consoled by your comment.

Edited December 29, 2018 by EVENKEEL

[Joe Mcseismic]

52 minutes ago, Zombies said:

 

Visa overstayers are not the same as illegal aliens that cross the southern border unvetted, and the other side of the argument is the drugs, crime, human trafficking, child abuse, that comes almost exclusively through our porous southern border. 

No, they come via shipping containers (only 4% physically checked), by plane, ship, trucks  and boat.

Edited December 29, 2018 by Joe Mcseismic

[mikebike]

3 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

I'm sure the wife and baby of slain police officer in Newman, Ca. by the illegal alien will consoled by your comment.

Do you REALLY want me to start listing random acts of violence, against police and civilians, perpetrated by home-grown criminals which resulted families needing consolation?

 

Why does anyone think that random, subjective, stories - from either side - prove anything?

[attrayant]

11 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

I'm sure the wife and baby of slain police officer in Newman, Ca. by the illegal alien will consoled by your comment.

 

Are you advocating politically correct language?

[mikebike]

7 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

This is about the need for increased border security.

Incorrect.

 

The thread is about the wall and the govt shutdown.

 

My point is both are entirely unnecessary as there are far more pressing threats born in the USA.

 

Increased border security is another issue. 45 has shown no interest in border security. If he had, he would have prioritized border security when he had the Senate AND Congress and introduced POLICY.

[keemapoot]

13 minutes ago, attrayant said:

 

The government is shut down, thanks to Trump.  Where do you think people should be?

Probably like Trump himself, who has "retreated from public view." His absence means he has probably taken another "secret trip," this time to his Florida resort/compound/golf course. At least there he won't be tweeting compromising pics of SEAL teams.

[simple1]

5 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

This is about the need for increased border security. The story about the police officer is merely one current incident.

Border control policy decisions should be based upon statistical analysis of the pros and cons, current domestic law, signed and ratified international agreements. It has been demonstrated by US government agencies that refugees, illegals and so on actually are a net benefit to the US, including a lower level of violent criminality than US nationals. IMO it is long overdue for US government to articulate funded policies to address the high level of crime and violence in the US. So far trump has failed to prove a Wall to be the answer for the US context, only fog horn misinformation and outright lies.

 

 

 

[keemapoot]

1 minute ago, simple1 said:

Border control policy decisions should be based upon statistical analysis of the pros and cons, current domestic law, signed and ratified international agreements. It has been demonstrated by US government agencies that refugees, illegals and so on actually are a net benefit to the US, including a lower level of violent criminality than US nationals. IMO it is long overdue for US government to articulate funded policies to address the high level of crime and violence in the US. So far trump has failed to prove a Wall to be the answer for the US context, only fog horn misinformation and outright lies.

 

 

 

Trump's insistence on the Wall is symbolic, and he knows it. Having an edifice, a monument to him, with his name on it, would be the ultimate capstone to a life of self-adulation. He understands that this physical "accomplishment" would be much more visible to his base for re-election and posterity purposes than some fuzzy numbers of decreased crime, etc..  Nobody can knock down his physical legacy, whereas he has been able to deconstruct Obama's legislative legacy, Obamacare.

[Scott]

Off-topic posts removed.   Continued off-topic trolling will get you a suspension.  

 

[Dumbastheycome]

2 minutes ago, keemapoot said:

Trump's insistence on the Wall is symbolic, and he knows it. Having an edifice, a monument to him, with his name on it, would be the ultimate capstone to a life of self-adulation. He understands that this physical "accomplishment" would be much more visible to his base for re-election and posterity purposes than some fuzzy numbers of decreased crime, etc..  Nobody can knock down his physical legacy, whereas he has been able to deconstruct Obama's legislative legacy, Obamacare.

Likely true in essence. But only in addition to the various failed "towers" he has never paid for either.

Once  again he egotistically is abusing people on both sides of  his "fence" .

Now gone from "waiting it  out" to stamping his feet.

Next step will involve lashing out viciously.

[EVENKEEL]

21 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Border control policy decisions should be based upon statistical analysis of the pros and cons, current domestic law, signed and ratified international agreements. It has been demonstrated by US government agencies that refugees, illegals and so on actually are a net benefit to the US, including a lower level of violent criminality than US nationals. IMO it is long overdue for US government to articulate funded policies to address the high level of crime and violence in the US. So far trump has failed to prove a Wall to be the answer for the US context, only fog horn misinformation and outright lies.

 

 

 

Is it unreasonable to say that there is a percentage of violent crime committed in the US by illegals? I think not, now we have the repercussion of sanctuary cities. A lot of other issues need to be addressed but the "Border Bead Curtain" is a start in the right direction. 

[bristolboy]

Just now, EVENKEEL said:

Is it unreasonable to say that there is a percentage of violent crime committed in the US by illegals? I think not, now we have the repercussion of sanctuary cities. A lot of other issues need to be addressed but the "Border Bead Curtain" is a start in the right direction. 

Is it unreasonable to say that there is a percentage of violent crime committed by American citizens?

[helpisgood]

Keemapoot

41 minutes ago, keemapoot said:

Trump's insistence on the Wall is symbolic, and he knows it. Having an edifice, a monument to him, with his name on it, would be the ultimate capstone to a life of self-adulation. He understands that this physical "accomplishment" would be much more visible to his base for re-election and posterity purposes than some fuzzy numbers of decreased crime, etc..  Nobody can knock down his physical legacy, whereas he has been able to deconstruct Obama's legislative legacy, Obamacare.

 

Your comment reminds me of part of routine by a Chinese-American comic named Joe Wong who said that, being ethnic Chinese, he could provide some good advice about the wall. 

 

As best as I can recall, he said:

 

1- It does not work regarding invaders.  (And he was referring to guys much more formidable than destitute people with women and little kids from Central America who endured a long walk through Mexico with its narco gangs.)

 

2- But, you can make lots of money with it as a tourist attraction. 

 

So yes, you are right!  Trump could put his name on it and bill it as the "world's biggest boondoggle."  A great tribute to his past business "successes." 

 

He can also eventually build his presidential library next to it, although it will be filled with mostly videos of Hannity, Fox & Friends, The Apprentice, his bankruptcy papers and maybe, just maybe, finally his tax returns. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 29, 2018 by helpisgood
grammar

[garyk]

1 hour ago, mikebike said:

Except that home-grown 'murican criminals and abusers far outnumber those entering from elsewhere by orders of magnitude. The problem isn't "the others"... it's your neighbours!!

 

45's supporters heads explode when reality creeps in...

Yea I live in southern Texas,, it is my Mexican neighbors! If second and third generation ok, but most are thugs.