Expat group launches online petition calling for TM.30 to be scrapped

[steve654]

34 minutes ago, jackdd said:

I told you already that this is wrong.

Maybe you should start reading the law, you claim to be a lawyer

You're  saying that if one enters Thailand "legally", then no need for the 24 hour report? If so, what is all the fuss about then?

[RBOP]

14 minutes ago, CaptainJack said:

This morning's Bangkok newspaper. Perhaps there will be a reaction? Wait and see....

Outstanding!!!!????????????????????????

[Peterw42]

19 minutes ago, lkv said:

How exactly does TM30 deter foreign investment or tourism.

 

Could you please enlighten me?

 

Go to Jomtien immigration, 90% of the people doing TM30s and paying fines are tourists extending their stay. After a 2 hour wait and a fine, they are not happy campers. 

[steve654]

2 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Go to Jomtien immigration, 90% of the people doing TM30s and paying fines are tourists extending their stay. After a 2 hour wait and a fine, they are not happy campers. 

Why do they have to pay a fine if they entered legally?  I don't get it.

[lannarebirth]

4 minutes ago, steve654 said:

You're  saying that if one enters Thailand "legally", then no need for the 24 hour report? If so, what is all the fuss about then?

And even more humorously, someone who crossed an international border illegally will be filling out a form to let the authorities know just where they can find them. No, I don't think so.

[lkv]

1 minute ago, Peterw42 said:

Go to Jomtien immigration, 90% of the people doing TM30s and paying fines are tourists extending their stay. After a 2 hour wait and a fine, they are not happy campers. 

Hehehe.

 

So the average duration of stay of a tourist in Thailand is about 10 days, based on reports.

 

People being fined there at Jomtien are long term tourists. Some probably not exactly tourists.

 

Had they stayed in hotels and had the hotels reported their stay, they would not be fined.

[jackdd]

5 minutes ago, steve654 said:

You're  saying that if one enters Thailand "legally", then no need for the 24 hour report? If so, what is all the fuss about then?

I say there is no requirement to do a report under section 37 (TM28) as the description of the petitition says.

The fuss is about the report which the landlord or possessor has to do under section 38 (TM30)

[Peterw42]

Just now, steve654 said:

Why do they have to pay a fine if they entered legally?  I don't get it.

They are getting fined for not having a TM30 submitted 24 hours after arrival.

TM30 and fines for not doing one, has nothing to do with legal/illegal entry .

[lkv]

11 minutes ago, RBOP said:

In 2006 after the coup the junta imposed a limit of 90 days total in any 6 months period. I was working in Malaysia and coming gome on weekends and holidays.  Airport IO used a calculator to see if I used up my quota every entry. That's when I moved the family to Malaysia temporarily.  I was too young for a retirement visa and family is not Thai. 

Right, so you and your foreign wife wanted to visit Thailand for long term tourism and it was not possible at the time.

 

Correct?

[ThomasThBKK]

26 minutes ago, lkv said:

How exactly does TM30 deter foreign investment or tourism.

 

Could you please enlighten me?

 

i stopped several investments, so did others, one of the reason this tm30 bs.

People see it's getting worse here, it's simply hostile and they don't want their money in here anymore.

Thailand is currently so foreigner unfriendly for multiple reasons that many people simply stopped their projects here. Not sure what's there not to understand? 

 

26 minutes ago, jackdd said:

No, you don't.

Section 37 (4) says foreigners have to report. But below it says subsection 3 and 4 do not apply to foreigners who entered under section 34. If you entered Thailand legally, you entered under 34.

So only foreigners who entered Thailand illegally have to report if they stay somewhere else for 24 hours.

 

2. Shall stay at the place as indicated to the competent official. Where there is proper reason that he cannot stay at the place as indicated to the competent official, he shall notify the competent official of the change in residence , within 24 hours from the time of removing to said place.

 

And this still applys anyway? You can interpret it as you want, so will they. It's written extremely unclear. No mention of permanent residence anywhere as some here interpret it, i don't interpret it as that at all - residence is simply where you stay atm and may also be a hotel even if you have a condo rented.

[lkv]

3 minutes ago, ThomasThBKK said:

stopped several investments

Whilst you stopped your several investments, the Chinese have purchased the whole of Thailand.

Edited July 30, 2019 by lkv

[RBOP]

3 minutes ago, lkv said:

Right, so you and your foreign wife wanted to visit Thailand for long term tourism and it was not possible at the time.

 

Correct?

Yep. Had to pull our child out of school too. 

[BobbyL]

Good idea, but this is such a nice earner for immigration.

 

Apparently at CW alone there are 100s of people queuing daily in the TM30 area. If a lot of those are paying an 800b fine then immigration are pulling in hundreds of thousands a week. 

[Peterw42]

1 minute ago, lkv said:

Hehehe.

 

So the average duration of stay of a tourist in Thailand is about 10 days, based on reports.

 

People being fined there at Jomtien are long term tourists. Some probably not exactly tourists.

 

Had they stayed in hotels and had the hotels reported their stay, they would not be fined.

There is a huge percentage of tourists come for a couple of month stay. Are you suggesting they should limit their stay to 10 days and not stay in condos, with friends, at their holiday house.

Tourists are the main group impacted by TM30s and fines.

[ThomasThBKK]

Just now, lkv said:

Whilst you stopped your several investments, the Chinese have purchased the whole of Thailand.

If you think so....

[steve654]

7 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

And even more humorously, someone who crossed an international border illegally will be filling out a form to let the authorities know just where they can find them. No, I don't think so.

Makes perfect sense now.  Someone enters Thailand illegally and then right away fills out a TM30 form to let immigration know where they are ????

[lkv]

Just now, RBOP said:

Yep. Had to pull our child out of school too. 

So you wanted to establish yourself in Thailand on visa exempt, and sent the kid to the local school while you were doing that?

 

Do you consider that proper planning? Not being funny.

[steve654]

7 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

They are getting fined for not having a TM30 submitted 24 hours after arrival.

TM30 and fines for not doing one, has nothing to do with legal/illegal entry .

If I come to Thailand legally with my passport, are you saying that 24 hours after arrival I need to fill out a TM30 still?

[lkv]

3 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

There is a huge percentage of tourists come for a couple of month stay. Are you suggesting they should limit their stay to 10 days and not stay in condos, with friends, at their holiday house.

Tourists are the main group impacted by TM30s and fines.

For 2 MONTHS?

 

A huge percentage?

 

Out of the 38 million?

[BestB]

22 minutes ago, RBOP said:

Outstanding!!!!????????????????????????

 Noticed the last paragraph ? Admitted it’s problematic????

[RBOP]

5 minutes ago, lkv said:

So you wanted to establish yourself in Thailand on visa exempt, and sent the kid to the local school while you were doing that?

 

Do you consider that proper planning? Not being funny.

No, I was working in Thailand with a work permit then took a job in Malaysia so when I quit my Thai job our visas were cancelled and only option was tourist visa at the time. I'm not going to share anymore. Thanks. Is that you Steve?

[RBOP]

1 minute ago, BestB said:

 Noticed the last paragraph ? Admitted it’s problematic????

Yes, that the outstanding part.

[Peterw42]

Just now, steve654 said:

If I come to Thailand legally with my passport, are you saying that 24 hours after arrival I need to fill out a TM30 still?

The owner, house master, possessor of a property needs to do a TM30 within 24 hour, to report an alien staying. For most that is a hotel doing the reporting and you dont need to do anything.

If its other than a hotel then the owner/possessor reports. Most expats or longer stay tourists are not staying in hotels so the owner/possessor of the property needs to report within 24 hours. Most owners and long term renters are the owner/possessor and are reporting themselves as the alien.

 

[lkv]

10 minutes ago, ThomasThBKK said:

If you think so....

Well I'd rather not think so, but yeah, the reality is, foreign investment is BOI projects, not buying condos.

 

The Chinese took care of that already without any visas just to rent on AirBnb. They are buying in bulk.

[steve654]

2 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

The owner, house master, possessor of a property needs to do a TM30 within 24 hour, to report an alien staying. For most that is a hotel doing the reporting and you dont need to do anything.

If its other than a hotel then the owner/possessor reports. Most expats or longer stay tourists are not staying in hotels so the owner/possessor of the property needs to report within 24 hours. Most owners and long term renters are the owner/possessor and are reporting themselves as the alien.

 

Thanks for clearing that up Peter, I get it now.

[RBOP]

1 minute ago, Peterw42 said:

The owner, house master, possessor of a property needs to do a TM30 within 24 hour, to report an alien staying. For most that is a hotel doing the reporting and you dont need to do anything.

If its other than a hotel then the owner/possessor reports. Most expats or longer stay tourists are not staying in hotels so the owner/possessor of the property needs to report within 24 hours. Most owners and long term renters are the owner/possessor and are reporting themselves as the alien.

 

And if its not done within 24 hours when you go to immigration for extension or what ever reason they can reject you until the TM30 is filed and fine paid.

[ThomasThBKK]

Just now, lkv said:

Well I'd rather not think so, but yeah, the reality is, foreign investment is BOI projects, not buying condos.

 

The Chinese took care of that already without any visas just to rent on AirBnb. They are buying in bulk.

You have no idea what you are talking about, Foreign investments have nothing to do with BOI companies. Every influx of foreign money into Thailand is a foreign investment, i invested in a bunch of thai companies all thai limited obviously as the founders are Thais, makes absolutely no sense for them to be a BOI company. 

all RE sales are down hard this year, many developers stopped developing at the pace they had last year ... Numbers don't lie.

There are good reasons Singapore is rich and foreign business friendly while Thailand isn't.

 

 

[puck2]

21 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Go to Jomtien immigration, 90% of the people doing TM30s and paying fines are tourists extending their stay. After a 2 hour wait and a fine, they are not happy campers. 

 

That's the reason why article 37 suddenly is enforced, not only in Pattaya. Nowadays this article is an absolute nonsense, but a money-maker!  Squeeze the falangs.

 

 

[Peterw42]

3 minutes ago, lkv said:

For 2 MONTHS?

 

A huge percentage?

 

Out of the 38 million?

Most of the people I know in Thailand are exactly that, Europeans who come to thailand for European winter. There would be 200 in my condo block alone.

These are the people that are directly impacted by TM30, 

[steve654]

3 minutes ago, RBOP said:

And if its not done within 24 hours when you go to immigration for extension or what ever reason they can reject you until the TM30 is filed and fine paid.

 

Sounds like a bit of a money grab to me.  How would I know if the hotel where I stayed filed a TM30 24 hours after I arrived there?  I wouldn't really know until I go to immigration 30 days later to extend my stay and then they tell me I owe them 2,000 baht.