Is life hard?

[brokenbone]

25 minutes ago, sirineou said:

You forget the opportunity cost. for which you will need differential calculus, but a simple rule is the  rule of 70. Fund invested at 7% will double in 10 years

So a variable earning  2.5% will double in 40 years (did i do my math right?)

 

"The rule of 70 is used to determine the number of years it takes for a variable to double by dividing the number 70 by the variable's growth rate. The rule of 70is generally used to determine how long it would take for an investment to double given the annual rate of return."

https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/051815/what-difference-between-rule-70-and-rule-72.asp

yes, but the assumption dont hold water during recession,

or even stagnation like it is today in the west,

its not moving, the calculation and funds are already busted.

it can be plastered over by lending money,

but compounding interests will inevitably choke that solution too

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U19_OkPRggE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hsUdK70Jtmc

in particular, watch the 2nd video from 7:30,

the vast majority of pension is subsidized

 

[daveAustin]

Depends what one is born into; one of wealthy, healthy stock of sound mind would have it a lot easier than the average Somcha Bloggs. Generally, reckon it is harder nowadays since everything is more expensive, property especially... UK, eg, something like 10x average wage to buy compared with 3x just couple decades ago. Baby-boomers certainly had it easy on that score, while also missing out on WWII.

 

I've worked my ass off, av-above av intelligence and haven't 'made it', but also haven't taken any big risks. A lot of it is taking the opportunity when it presents itself (heeding intuition) + enthusiasm/drive and bit of luck. Getting back up after the knockdown and learning from mistakes is a biggie: those who say, <deleted> it, I'm done - along with the procrastinators - are usually not successful.

[Puchaiyank]

Started earning my own money at 9 years of age...there was a great deal of independence afforded a person who can fend for themselves...

 

Woke-up at 40 realizing I would be nearing retirement in a few years...devised a plan...studied books written by successful people for 3 years...worked my plan...retired at age 53...still receiving income from the hard work I did previously...more than 20 years later...????

Edited August 3, 2019 by Puchaiyank

[sirineou]

9 minutes ago, brokenbone said:

yes, but the assumption dont hold water during recession,

or even stagnation like it is today in the west,

its not moving, the calculation and funds are already busted.

it can be plastered over by lending money,

but compounding interests will inevitably choke that solution too

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U19_OkPRggE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hsUdK70Jtmc

in particular, watch the 2nd video from 7:30,

the vast majority of pension is subsidized

 

That's why I said you need differential calculus, because of the compounded interest and economic variables.

Nonetheless it is money I paid into the system. I only mentioned as a function of the difficulties our children will have in the future. 

My apologies to StreetCowboy   for taking this thread off track. 

[AlexRich]

I'm not sure about hard as such, or that simply "hard work" is the solution ... there is an unpredictable element to life that few are willing to acknowledge ... luck, good and bad, plays a part in many people's lives. If you live a long and healthy life you may have your ancestors to thank for that ... if you are unlucky in the DNA lottery you might not be so blessed. Michael Jordan has had a great life due to his prowess in Basketball ... what if he had been born in Zimbabwe? 

[Sheryl]

A troll post has been removed

[sunnyboy2018]

4 hours ago, brokenbone said:

that dont matter, if a machine or a human produce the products, we still get the products.

 

if you really wanted to, you could give every human the job of carrying a stone around in circles, give them a salary for it and then tax them, but why bother at all ?

Yes. the economist Keynes suggested that goverments should dig great mine shafts, fill them with containers of money, seal the mines then pay people to dig the money up after a few years. An AI based economy can never work just as a slave based economy can not work because capitalism requires consumers, requires a burgeoning middle class of consumers to buy products. Even if AI dominates the labour markets governments will pay people not to work. Otherwise who will buy, be able to afford the AI produced products.

[sunnyboy2018]

1 hour ago, AlexRich said:

I'm not sure about hard as such, or that simply "hard work" is the solution ... there is an unpredictable element to life that few are willing to acknowledge ... luck, good and bad, plays a part in many people's lives. If you live a long and healthy life you may have your ancestors to thank for that ... if you are unlucky in the DNA lottery you might not be so blessed. Michael Jordan has had a great life due to his prowess in Basketball ... what if he had been born in Zimbabwe? 

Or if his ancestors had not been enslaved? 

[sunnyboy2018]

2 hours ago, Puchaiyank said:

Started earning my own money at 9 years of age...there was a great deal of independence afforded a person who can fend for themselves...

 

Woke-up at 40 realizing I would be nearing retirement in a few years...devised a plan...studied books written by successful people for 3 years...worked my plan...retired at age 53...still receiving income from the hard work I did previously...more than 20 years later...????

Never bothered with a real job till.i was 39...and that was teaching in Thailand.  But good to retire early well done. I had to.work till iwas 62

[sunnyboy2018]

2 hours ago, daveAustin said:

Depends what one is born into; one of wealthy, healthy stock of sound mind would have it a lot easier than the average Somcha Bloggs. Generally, reckon it is harder nowadays since everything is more expensive, property especially... UK, eg, something like 10x average wage to buy compared with 3x just couple decades ago. Baby-boomers certainly had it easy on that score, while also missing out on WWII.

 

I've worked my ass off, av-above av intelligence and haven't 'made it', but also haven't taken any big risks. A lot of it is taking the opportunity when it presents itself (heeding intuition) + enthusiasm/drive and bit of luck. Getting back up after the knockdown and learning from mistakes is a biggie: those who say, <deleted> it, I'm done - along with the procrastinators - are usually not successful.

UK property is not expensive.  London and others cities are but you can still buy a house or small flat for 100 to 180 k.

[Tayaout]

I'm not sure if you ask about the west or Thailand. I can give you my opinion as a Canadian milllenial that don't have good education on paper.

 

All my friends in the same situation have it pretty hard. They can't buy a house forever and need to live in colocation. Basically they can't afford a family and some can't even get a girlfriend. 

 

Those who got a good education have student debt but can buy house that will be paid over a period of 30 years. They might look wealthy but they don't have $1000 in their pocket for emergency. Many would have a pretty hard time without support from their family.

 

I think the biggest difference between us and our parent is that it was probably easier for them to find a well paid job for life without much education. If it did not pay that well it was still a job for life. It's much harder to find these job now. If I had to find work in the current job market with my education I would never have been able to relocate to Thailand. 

 

In my case I made my own luck. I have always been a quick and self learner. I am very skilled with technology but did try a couple of more traditional menial job when I was 14-23. I made a fortune via the Internet if I compare where all my friends are now. I am self employed for 14 years and I don't need to work anymore. I also never felt like working when self employed because I made my own schedule and only worked on interesting project. However, I am still managing my investment and always looking for new opportunities. I am also continually learning new IT skills all the time out of interest and to stay relevant if ever needed. So I still consider myself self employed but that's not work in the traditional 9-5 model. 

 

From my point of view life can be pretty hard if you follow the herd but it might provide stability over time. If you do like me then it can be more risky but also has a potential for more wealth. 

 

So yeah life is easy. Very easy from my point of view! 

Edited August 3, 2019 by Tayaout

[sunnyboy2018]

5 hours ago, brokenbone said:

that dont matter, if a machine or a human produce the products, we still get the products.

 

if you really wanted to, you could give every human the job of carrying a stone around in circles, give them a salary for it and then tax them, but why bother at all ?

So people have money to buy products.  No consumers equals no profits...no profits = no reason to produce = poverty and anarchy. 

[brokenbone]

1 hour ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

So people have money to buy products.  No consumers equals no profits...no profits = no reason to produce = poverty and anarchy. 

clueless......if i have robots that produce everything i need,

i can use up all they produce myself,

and i dont have to work

 

 

Edited August 4, 2019 by brokenbone

[473geo]

3 hours ago, brokenbone said:

clueless......if i have robots that produce everything i need,

i can use up all they produce myself,

and i dont have to work

 

 

You will work maintaining your robots

[GinBoy2]

So I have 3 kids, two US born and my son who was born Thailand but now lives in the US.

 

My eldest daughter and my Thai son are both college graduates, and work together in the same company.

My youngest daughter is a High School graduate, college was never in her future.

So all three of them are gainfully employed, but the question of 'is life hard' is tricky.

 

I think today employment is is a lot more temporary that it was back in the day.

 

I've always told my kids to approach all employment as temporary.

 

If we had two or three employers in our working life, our kids can probably expect 10-20 employers.

 

So don't know if hard is the right word, but it's definitely more tenuous than it was for past generations  

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎8‎/‎4‎/‎2019 at 4:09 AM, StreetCowboy said:

Life is hard for young people nowadays,

Only if they are stupid, and want to be in Media as a superstar. Plumbers make big money, as do many other practical workers.

Problem is that the maniacs have subverted the apprenticeship system and make everything user pays or borrow too much and be a slave to the banks for ever.

Ever since young people have decided that they have to go to university has life become hard for them. 

Too many young people have been conditioned to think that they are special now, and so real life is shocking, plus they think they don't have to try hard to succeed with the no losers education catastrophe.

I worked 84 hours a week on a dairy farm for an actual pittance for 2 years, and then joined the military for a leg up.

Been paid to travel the world, and had an amazing life, but it wasn't easy- it was damn hard. Sookie bubs need not apply.

 

So, forget the sense of entitlement, work hard, do a job that is useful, and one can succeed in having a reasonably rewarding life.

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, GinBoy2 said:

So don't know if hard is the right word, but it's definitely more tenuous than it was for past generations  

Agree. In the past most worked for an organisation for a regular wage. With that one could plan a life, buy a house, get married and have kids.

With life being so "tenuous" now, what bank will lend them money for a house ( even if they can find an affordable one ), and how can they have a good life living pay to pay?

I'd hate to be trying to have a family now if I didn't have the bank of mum and dad to help me.

[Berkshire]

On 8/3/2019 at 11:09 PM, StreetCowboy said:

But it really does seem to me that life is harder for young people nowadays; everyone forces them to jump through hoops that require resources beyond what a teenager can reasonably be expected to have.

 

Life is hard for young people nowadays, and that’s all there is to it; grizzling won’t make it better.  Hard work might

Hmmm...when I was a teen, I worried a lot about my future.  Especially my financial future, whether I'd be able to retire and be financially secure.  So I made decisions in my life that would best assure a sound financial future.  And it all worked out.

 

So young people today are worried about their future?  Welcome to the real world.  We all had to deal with it and so shall they.  It won't be any harder, just different.

[CGW]

Reading through this thread it is noticeable that people consider that "money" is the number one driver in their lives, whatever happened to spirituality? going to be difficult to take that money with you, appears that this is a mute point with most, which makes me wonder if "society" has got just a little lost with its goals?

[Saltire]

A thought-provoking post.

 

Took me back to my university days in Scotland from 1973 till 1978. I paid zero for a full university education, and not only that but I got a grant at the start of every term. Because my parents had moved to England just before I started uni, I got paid the higher 'staying away from home' grant. I don't recall how much it was, but it was enough to pay most of my bills and allowed me to buy a shared car with my brother for commuting daily to university and home. 

 

I did however, as did my brother, have at least 2 part time jobs to supplement my income. I worked in a car rental company cleaning cars and a local petrol station at weekends. My parents moving made us grow up fast.

 

Fast forward to my 30-plus years of work as an IT Manager. Looking back I reckon I worked both slides of the fence, both reducing employees by implementing technology and recruiting trainees to my and other departments. In fairness more jobs likely went than came. Most projects had as part of their goal a reduction in personnel. I once replaced an entire call centre of 40 people who requested credit checks by phone from Visa etc for retail customer purchases, with a then-new, online, in-store credit check with a major credit provider. All standard stuff now but new back then.

 

I don't have kids and most of the time I am glad that I do not have the daily burden of worrying about them.

 

 

Edited August 5, 2019 by Saltire

[Berkshire]

49 minutes ago, CGW said:

Reading through this thread it is noticeable that people consider that "money" is the number one driver in their lives, whatever happened to spirituality? going to be difficult to take that money with you, appears that this is a mute point with most, which makes me wonder if "society" has got just a little lost with its goals?

It's a lot easier being "spiritual" when you don't have to worry about whether you can afford your next meal.

 

I do believe that in about 500 years or so, we won't have to worry about money (sort of like in Star Trek).  But in the year 2019, money still matters a lot.  Especially if one doesn't have any. 

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, Berkshire said:

Hmmm...when I was a teen, I worried a lot about my future.  Especially my financial future, whether I'd be able to retire and be financially secure.  So I made decisions in my life that would best assure a sound financial future.  And it all worked out.

I did that too, worked hard and saved all my life, and lost nearly all in divorce aged 52.

I made decisions in my life that would assure a sound financial future, and it all went away.

 

It's luck how your life turns out, very little you can do.

If I'd had my way, I'd be still living in my large and fully paid UK riverside home with my 60 year old wife and kids/grand-kids.

Now I'm forced to live in a foreign country with a woman half my age, and my new children, it was never my choice.

(on the upside, I did get to bang around 50 more young and attractive women than I expected when I was 'grandpa')

 

Edited August 5, 2019 by BritManToo

[john11k]

Life is as hard as you want it to be, ! Yes if you want a big house with three or more bathrooms and five or more bedrooms, then it’s hard !  Can only sleep in one bed can only pee in one toilet, if somebody from the family is in the bathroom! Just wait, 

a big expensive car only goes from a to b same as an inexpensive family car, 

i think a lot of today’s hard life is keeping up with what’s on FB and other social media, 

we would do a lot better to teach our children respect, to the world around us and older people who have already given there time to building this world we live in ! 

Not to want the latest phone , car , or tv, we talk about saving the world on social media, but we also learn on social media to want want want !

yes life is as hard as we make it ,  or we are told to make

we’re all individuals, it’s up to outer selves 

just my opinion !!

[natway09]

As I get older it does not get hard that often ,,,, Sad but true

[wolf81]

I do feel many young people from my country (The Netherlands) will have a hard life in the future. I feel it's likely the pensions will be gone in 30 or 40 years and they'd better have some back-up plan for old age. Life is becoming more expensive every year and wages have been more or less stuck in the last decennia. A lot of the higher costs of living are caused by the government through higher taxation. And because of the switch to "green" energy (often not as green as we're led to believe). So the rising costs also make it harder to safe up for old age. I feel most young people don't realise this yet.

 

So for the average young working man / woman, I do believe life is harder than it was a few decennia ago. And it will be harder in the future still.

 

Now as for me (I'm 37), life is pretty easy. I am a software developer so it's easy to find jobs. And I believe this will not change in the foreseeable future. I am also a freelancer and work remotely. I love working remotely and love working on (mostly) my own terms. Income is good as well. And because I live in Thailand now, I don't have to deal with the rising costs in The Netherlands. For me life is good and I hope to be able to "retire" by the time I'm 45. Just trying to save and invest money now. Will probably still work after 45, as I love working. 

 

For my daughter I feel life will even be better. I will try to teach her to spend money wisely, how to invest, etc... and if she listens well, I believe she could be better off in the future than I ever was. I believe I could create a circumstance in which my daughter doesn't /have/ to work, but I'd still encourage her to work, since I believe it's good for well-being. 

Edited August 5, 2019 by wolf81

[soalbundy]

On 8/4/2019 at 12:11 AM, StreetCowboy said:

You're right - for you and me life is easy and fun.  I'm not so sure about young people today.

I don't think my daughter's life is as relaxed and easy-going as mine was, despite the privileges she has enjoyed, and I can imagine that for her more proletarian peers, life is quite stressful.

I feel that things were somewhat easier in my youth than today but it's what you get used to, although I found things then to be hard. Today's youth grow up jumping through hoops, it is no surprise to them. They become very skilled at managing, when my daughter was a 20 year old in Munich (the most expensive city to live in in Germany) I was amazed at what she had to do to keep a roof over her head and how she managed travelling through the city as cheaply as possible to get to work, wheeling and dealing became second nature to her, I lived in the same city 50 years ago and it was easy then compared to now.

[CharlieH]

Troll remark removed.

[tabarin]

As a 28 year old? I think it is really really hard, I was lucky to start off working at the age of 15 and being super curious and interested to do business.
Did another 2 years of army service which contributed to some discipline. 

I do know that, if living back home, I would feel much less happy and even depressed as all the hard work is almost not rewarding,
since most of all the income would directly go to additional taxes, higher rent and similar + crap weather most of the year.

I am happy because I am working step by step to build more income, but if they would make it even more complicated, it is hard to keep seeing it as fun.

P.S. None of my friends back home made it here, neither do I see them do anything much. It is like nothing happened in the past 7 years.
They do not seem to think of life as real fun and are conditioned to follow the Sheep routine (go to work, groceries, eat, netflix / gaming, sleep).

It often comes to my mind and bothers me a bit as well, that so few people are really fighting and going after their dreams.
And with the right intentions, will and fighting mentality, I would rather say there are more opportunities in today's world but not in the classic ways,
people suck in adapting and change, guess that is why most suffer. They follow the path of limited possibilities taught in classic education.

Also, I would not have made it to Thailand or stayed, if I would arrived new here under the new visa regime / rules. 
I simply would not know my ways, not earn enough yet back then too, guess I was the last new generation that arrived, more or less.

Bottom line: The rich are getting richer and the poor become poorer. Why people still sit on their ass denying this? Take action for yourself.

Edited August 5, 2019 by tabarin

[brokenbone]

On 8/4/2019 at 11:57 AM, 473geo said:

You will work maintaining your robots

if i dont have a robot that can repair,

ill trade some of the goods to someone that has,

or trade goods for a handyman to repair them

[GTgrizzly]

On 8/4/2019 at 3:03 AM, Yinn said:

I think life is better now.

 

One hundred years ago not have fidge, microwave, electric, etc.

 

Today I go hospital (drive my car with air con, airbag, ABS, music player) with my friend, she have the “ultra sound”. Can know it a boy, and healthy. When it will coming.

 

We have Korean Barbq for eat. Food from everywhere can try.

 

Airplane so so cheap now. This week I go to Bangkok, only 1 hour 15 minute. 

 

Have air in the house, good for sleep.

 

music easy to copy. Free. Movies

 

hospital always getting better. And new drug can fix problem. Easy to be healthy. 

 

A lot of opportunities now.

 

many machine make life easier. On farm, wash the clothes, internet, lift, etc

 

life is wonderful. Fun. I want to live 500 years.

 

life get better every year. Young people can not complain.

The old people have the difficult life before. Not easy like now.

 

 

 

What a great outlook on life you have, you will go far

Its a shame there are so many miserable people on this planet

Dream it- do it