TM30: The form getting expats in Thailand into a bureaucratic tangle

[4675636b596f75]

3 minutes ago, Thaifriends said:

police detective branch must be informed by hotel about foreigners

Hello police detective officer major general lieutenant captain ________________ this is the hotel Pea Pod and we want to report to you, that we have foreigners.  We know this never happens, but we thought we should alert you in case you wanted to _________ any of our guests.  Thank you.

 

That is all.

[holy cow cm]

1 hour ago, jmccarty said:

A bit easier, report to your nearest 7-11 and they can upload. Works for power and water bills, phone bills...Easy to comply. 

Freedom, just plain loss of freedom and being treated like a criminal always under surveillance, under the guise of National Security or the malarkey of saying it protects us. I don't care about if it is easy or not to check back in, but it is the fact of it's an ugly xenophobic drive and honestly just like a violation on Human Rights. Comply, well yes we have to in order not to be in bad standings (having a black mark) possibly having our renewal or visas denied because we are not good people doing what they order us to do. 

[lkv]

6 minutes ago, Thaifriends said:

I feel like laughing. Visitors should comply with law or go back. 

Yeah. That's what they kept saying at that conference also, when they did not know how to answer questions.

 

"It's the law"

 

????

[holy cow cm]

10 minutes ago, Thaifriends said:

I feel like laughing. Visitors should comply with law or go back. 

So if the next new rule says that all foreign men will have to wear a bra, under your logic you would say its the law and I'm proud to wear it, or just get out?  

[amykat]

6 hours ago, aqua4 said:

Then it leaves one singular question --- why are they paranoid?

I think it might be more like punishment, harassment, a resentment from someone who is vindictive ....

[amykat]

5 hours ago, lkv said:

And isn't that such a positive start to posting on a new forum? ????

 

I think statistically, 99% of people's first post on a forum would generally be a complaint or asking for advice.

 

Nobody bothers to create an account to tell us how great things are. Well, almost nobody.

 

Anyway, let us understand how easy it is to comply with the regulations, and let's ensure the peace and stability of the beloved nation.

 

Lmao.

 

The other funny thing is that, they would never post again or make one post per year of similar fashion.

 

There seems to be a whole database of "users" stacked up, that keeps growing in size every day now.

He is probably one of the shills hired by the government to combat Fake news and spread propaganda.  Look at the way he talks about his servant-like wife and assumes we all have that service, or he has servants like that, more likely.

[mania]

3 hours ago, Thaifriends said:

I feel like laughing. Visitors should comply with law or go back. 

Laugh till you cry ????

Not too worry I don't live in Thailand ????

I did for many years but left because many things corruption based.

 

But I will tell you something because you are bent on thinking expats are criminals & that is why these laws need compliance

 

I want to tell you I agree Thailand has many many criminals even monks are many times criminals but anyway

you want to talk about foreign/expat criminals?

 

Ok want to know why Thailand has so many? Because Thailand is a mostly corrupt mostly run by criminals country

 

Comply with laws ??....believe me all good expats do but they will catch no bad guys with laws...Why?

Because again Thailand is corrupt & money buys anything...ask the red bull heir ????

 

This is why Thailand is a magnet for less than good people

They know baht can buy anything

 

Baht Can buy an agent who WILL get them a visa... Law or no Law.. Because Immigration is full of corrupt workers backhander pay

 

They can buy a policeman who will get them out of any trouble... Law or no Law.... Because police department is full of corrupt police

 

They can kill a van load of tourist as many Thai have done while speeding & if they have baht no Law will hold them. Because courts are full of corruption.

 

So before you think your laws are worth anything realize laws are only as good as the people who enforce them.

 

In your country you have so much affordable corruption available to Thai & expat alike it is no wonder you attract

what you describe as "criminals among the so called expat community " ......Because Alike attracts Alike

 

So before you tell others they have something in their eye....maybe clear your own eye so you can see everything

 

 

Alike attracts alike

Edited August 29, 2019 by mania

[tigerfeet]

18 hours ago, GraThai said:

I totally agree that TM30 is an outdated law however I have lived here in Thailand for 30+  years and try to abide by all the rules including this one. Every time I return home from a trip she fills in the form pops into immigration and its done so what is the massive problem...unless of course people have something to hide?????

That's ok if you live near immigration we live in tak it's a 2 hour drive to our nearest one .so we go away for 2 nights then have to spend a day to fill out this form .I am sure other people live further away so I think we need to move get closer eh .did you not think of this selfish statement before writing it

 

[4675636b596f75]

1 minute ago, tigerfeet said:

That's ok if you live near immigration we live in tak it's a 2 hour drive to our nearest one .so we go away for 2 nights then have to spend a day to fill out this form .I am sure other people live further away so I think we need to move get closer eh .did you not think of this selfish statement before writing it

 

Try the ignore function.  It's pure bliss.

[lkv]

58 minutes ago, mania said:

So before you tell others they have something in their eye....maybe clear your own eye so you can see everything

In other recent news, and a sad situation I should add, the Supreme Court has upheld the death sentences of the two Myanmar guys convicted of the Ko Tao murders. Because of course, someone told us back then that "A Thai would never do such a thing".

 

Which goes to show there is nothing money cannot buy in Thailand. Including murder.

 

But anyway, let's not go offtopic. This thread is about TM30 and following the 1979 law, that was not really followed up until recently, making everyone a criminal for the last 40 years, including the IO's that ignored it. ????

 

These IO's, they must have known "it's the law". It's an old law.

Edited August 29, 2019 by lkv

[Chazar]

12 hours ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

If she was granted a visa.

you mean like we  were for Thailand.

[sunnyboy2018]

10 hours ago, Jumbo1968 said:

I acted as guarantor, my G.F. has no job, no savings, no property nought, we have had 2 UK Tourist Visas and will apply for the 3rd one in January.

i spent a great deal of time writing the Sponsors Letter and there was loads of advice on T.V. bit of advice, just be truthful.

Do you have property as surety?

[sunnyboy2018]

26 minutes ago, Chazar said:

you mean like we  were for Thailand.

I get a 30 day VOA. Thais must apply in advance from Thailand. They get no VOA. So no. Not like us in Thailand. What do you think?

[sunnyboy2018]

1 hour ago, mania said:

Laugh till you cry ????

Not too worry I don't live in Thailand ????

I did for many years but left because many things corruption based.

 

But I will tell you something because you are bent on thinking expats are criminals & that is why these laws need compliance

 

I want to tell you I agree Thailand has many many criminals even monks are many times criminals but anyway

you want to talk about foreign/expat criminals?

 

Ok want to know why Thailand has so many? Because Thailand is a mostly corrupt mostly run by criminals country

 

Comply with laws ??....believe me all good expats do but they will catch no bad guys with laws...Why?

Because again Thailand is corrupt & money buys anything...ask the red bull heir ????

 

This is why Thailand is a magnet for less than good people

They know baht can buy anything

 

Baht Can buy an agent who WILL get them a visa... Law or no Law.. Because Immigration is full of corrupt workers backhander pay

 

They can buy a policeman who will get them out of any trouble... Law or no Law.... Because police department is full of corrupt police

 

They can kill a van load of tourist as many Thai have done while speeding & if they have baht no Law will hold them. Because courts are full of corruption.

 

So before you think your laws are worth anything realize laws are only as good as the people who enforce them.

 

In your country you have so much affordable corruption available to Thai & expat alike it is no wonder you attract

what you describe as "criminals among the so called expat community " ......Because Alike attracts Alike

 

So before you tell others they have something in their eye....maybe clear your own eye so you can see everything

 

 

Alike attracts alike

Thailand allows corruption for the people. In the west only the established elite benefit from corruption.  A regular joe cant bribe a policeman. But a property developer can wrangle a bent contract for a russian mafia guy etc etc.

[mania]

1 hour ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

Thailand allows corruption for the people. In the west only the established elite benefit from corruption.  A regular joe cant bribe a policeman. But a property developer can wrangle a bent contract for a russian mafia guy etc etc.

True & years ago I use to say Thailand was an equal opportunity corruption country because both the lo-so & the hi-so can purchase corruption if they have the baht ????

Edited August 30, 2019 by mania

[uncola]

I have lived in chiangmai for over 30 years.   I generally take a holiday in country each year... 10-15 days.   I guess i spend 60-80k for food and accommodations.  With this TM30 <deleted> i am afraid of finding myself in trouble, somehow, so i am just going to stop traveling outside of the province.    I have been here long enough to know i won't change anything but i will hang onto my money and my sanity.

[Just1Voice]

20 minutes ago, uncola said:

I have lived in chiangmai for over 30 years.   I generally take a holiday in country each year... 10-15 days.   I guess i spend 60-80k for food and accommodations.  With this TM30 <deleted> i am afraid of finding myself in trouble, somehow, so i am just going to stop traveling outside of the province.    I have been here long enough to know i won't change anything but i will hang onto my money and my sanity.

Pretty much my feeling as well.  I'm not going to sell my CB300 or my 300cc Forza, I'll just find more places in CM province to ride them to. 

[jonclark]

19 hours ago, puchooay said:

 Still, 16 weeks wait for vetting and people on here are complaining about having to spend 5 minutes on the internet to file a TM30. ???? 

 

You can apply for PR in Thailand after 3 years. UK is 5 years.

Well you can actually get it after 2 years in some instances. 

 

But, I think you are missing the point. We can all talk about it being the law, until we are blue in the face and no-one is going to deny it is the law. But what you seem to miss is that people find this highly offensive. Residents of Thailand are being required (for no other reason than the fact we hold a different nationality) to report our movements within or when returning to the country under the guise of a vaguely worded statement about  'national security'. That is offensive. 

 

I was married here, my daughters both born here, i work and pay tax here (and i get tax back every year) I have a mortgage, 2 credit cards, pay a range of bills, am guarantor on my daughters car, have adopted a Thai child, have had 5 RTP police checks and submitted an Enhanced DBS check, have held an extension of stay for longer than I care to admit, have work permit, yellow book, pink card, have done 90 day reports for god know how long - all on time and I have Thai driving license. So perhaps you can understand why I (and many other people) find this offensive and that we won't leave because this is our home, but will continue to push immigration to get their act in order and or them to understand that the world has changed quite a lot since 1979 and with it people expectations. 

 

If immigration do not know where residents like myself live given the above. Then simply they should be shut down as they clearly incompetent couldn't find their own <deleted> with a map and me repeatedly telling them where I am will not change that fact. 

Edited August 30, 2019 by jonclark

[Eloquent pilgrim]

If the stated reasoning to strengthen National security is sincere, they could simply make TM 30 filing mandatory for anyone living in Thailand with any criminal conviction, be they foreign or Thai.

 

This would leave law abiding citizens and foreign nationals, free from this bizarre, malfunctioning, and quite frankly, pointless reporting system; a directive to file could simply be automatically added at any court conviction, and applied retrospectively to anyone already convicted.

[essox essox]

23 hours ago, ChipButty said:

I now know a few Thai landlords are not interested in registering their properties so the onus is on the farang to do it but why does the tenant have to do it?

Should crack down on the owners

THIS IS OBVIOUS...but where are you?? Your in Thailand....and they are making so farangs are not wanted, even though we spend spend and help with the economy!!

we spend a lot more than any Thais do...

[thaibeachlovers]

23 hours ago, Just1Voice said:

I have seen some truly asinine things in Thailand in my 10+ years here, but this B.S. tops them all. 

This has effectively killed my 2-10 day bike trips around the country. May as well sell my 300cc bikes and buy a 150 PCX. 

LOL, it doesn't affect your bike trips at all. It's NOT your responsibility to file TM 30, and if you stay at decent hotels ( ie not 200 baht a night hovels ) they WILL do it.

If you live in your own house/ condo all you have to do is do a TM 30 on return. Hardly the end of the world.

Keep the receipts from the hotels you stayed at in case they didn't do the form and you can prove that you were staying there, so they will be getting the fine.

 

[watcharacters]

30 minutes ago, jonclark said:

Well you can actually get it after 2 years in some instances. 

 

But, I think you are missing the point. We can all talk about it being the law, until we are blue in the face and no-one is going to deny it is the law. But what you seem to miss is that people find this highly offensive. Residents of Thailand are being required (for no other reason than the fact we hold a different nationality) to report our movements within or when returning to the country under the guise of a vaguely worded statement about  'national security'. That is offensive. 

 

I was married here, my daughters both born here, i work and pay tax here (and i get tax back every year) I have a mortgage, 2 credit cards, pay a range of bills, am guarantor on my daughters car, have adopted a Thai child, have had 5 RTP police checks and submitted an Enhanced DBS check, have held an extension of stay for longer than I care to admit, have work permit, yellow book, pink card, have done 90 day reports for god know how long - all on time and I have Thai driving license. So perhaps you can understand why I (and many other people) find this offensive and that we won't leave because this is our home, but will continue to push immigration to get their act in order and or them to understand that the world has changed quite a lot since 1979 and with it people expectations. 

 

If immigration do not know where residents like myself live given the above. Then simply they should be shut down as they clearly incompetent couldn't find their own <deleted> with a map and me repeatedly telling them where I am will not change that fact. 

 

They can always know where you are by pinging your phone.    

 

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

19 minutes ago, essox essox said:

THIS IS OBVIOUS...but where are you?? Your in Thailand....and they are making so farangs are not wanted, even though we spend spend and help with the economy!!

we spend a lot more than any Thais do...

LOL. Some Thais spend far more than you will see in your entire life. 

A few thousand expats spend so little in the grand scheme of things that they are ignored as a source of income, except by the families that live off them.

Millions of Chinese tourists outspend western expats by billions of baht a year.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, watcharacters said:

 

They can always know where you are by pinging your phone.    

 

 

 

Not mine. I don't have a <deleted> phone so my whereabouts are not tracked, nor is my spending information being sold. Don't know why they are called "smart" when they are just spy devices.

[thaibeachlovers]

36 minutes ago, jonclark said:

But, I think you are missing the point. We can all talk about it being the law, until we are blue in the face and no-one is going to deny it is the law. But what you seem to miss is that people find this highly offensive.

I've always done TM 30 when I had to. I fail to see why it is so offensive, unless people choose to be offended by minor <deleted> in their life.

No one forced any of us to live in Thailand and it's always been the case long as I visited/lived there. No one can claim ignorance of the law as an excuse.

Seems to me that this is the proverbial storm in the proverbial teacup, and much ado about nothing ( serious ).

[Jumbo1968]

3 hours ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

Do you have property as surety?

Only in the U.K. 

[thaibeachlovers]

TM 30 has been the law for decades. How come so much uproar just because they are finally enforcing a long standing regulation?

Did so many people think it was their right to ignore the law of the land?

[Sujo]

3 hours ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

Do you have property as surety?

I did the same as that poster except it was to australia. I have no property as surety.

[Sujo]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

TM 30 has been the law for decades. How come so much uproar just because they are finally enforcing a long standing regulation?

Did so many people think it was their right to ignore the law of the land?

Did immigration think it was their right to ignore the law of the land for so long?

 

its the fact that the law was never enforced and people decided to live in thailand under that premise. That has now changed and it is a dacronian law that does not serve the purpose they say its intended for. Plus there are many issues in being able to comply. Plus the law is not being applied everywhere as some are told its not needed.

[theoldgit]

A number of flames removed, members are not required to agree, but they are expected to be civil.