Group representing European businesses in Thailand calls for TM.30 and TM.28 to be abolished

[webfact 183860]

Group representing European businesses in Thailand calls for TM.30 and TM.28 to be abolished

 

 

An association representing European businesses in Thailand has called on the Thai government to scrap the controversial TM.30 and TM.28 reporting requirements.

 

The European Association of Business and Commerce, which describes itself as the “voice of European business in Thailand”, has called for the requirement of TM.30 and TM.28 to be brought to an end, adding its enforcement has negatively impacted the ease of doing business in the country. 

 

In a press release, Mr. Jan Eriksson, President of EABC, stated: “The Immigration form TM.30, or 24 hour reporting, requires property owners and lessors (Thai as well as foreign) to report the movements of foreigners using such properties.

 

Both Thai citizens and foreigners have found the situation difficult and unnecessary, and the situation has caused some unfortunately negative views about Thailand both as an investment and ‘doing business’ location, and as a tourism destination. This is surely not good and need not be so.”  

 

A correctly completed TM.30 is now a pre‐condition to being able to use normal visa services.  

 

Mr. Eriksson also noted: “’We anticipate that discussions for a Thailand‐EU Free Trade Agreement will re‐open. That agreement should bring much higher, mutual value and not be burdened by troublesome ‘ease of doing business’ issues which can be addressed now for the benefit of all parties, not only European, and not only foreigners. We commend the government for positive steps in ‘ease of doing business’.  Currently we feel that TM.30 is undoing those good achievements”.  

 

Mr. Eriksson also stated: “There is overlap with another part of the Immigration Act about foreigners reporting inter‐provincial travel and other movements. This should also be addressed”.

 

“We understand that the Guillotine Unit (Simple and Smart License project) has recommended the removal of TM. 30 in the interests of the Thai economy and ease of doing business. This would seem to be the best solution. If then there is any identified benefit, another, exiting tool, can be considered to remedy any specific situation. It is hard to see how security which relies on self‐disclosure can be a useful solution”, Mr. Eriksson explained.

 

The news comes after Immigration chief Lt-Gen Sompong Chingduang told BBC Thai that improvements were needed regarding the enforcement of TM.30.

 

BBC Thai said that moves are underway to adapt and modernize the forty year old TM.30. regulations to make them more relevant for the present day.

 

Discussions about TM.30 and TM.28 were also set to take place at ministerial last Friday (13 Sept).

 

Dr Kobsak Pootrakool who is attached to the Prime Minister's Office posted on Facebook that he was due to hold a meeting to discuss matters related to TM.30 and TM.28.

 

Also last Friday, Immigraiton released a somewhat confusing statement relating to the reporting requirements in Thailand. 

 

While some mistakenly believed it signalled the end of both TM.30 and TM.28, the statement actually contained no new information and did in fact only confirm Section 37 of the Immigration Act regarding the reporting requirements for foreigners who stay in Thailand for the purposes of tourism, sports, business, investments, education, specialist skills and not expats on retirement or marriage extensions. 

 

 

-- © Copyright Thai Visa News 2019-09-18

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[darksidedog 55605]

It seems everyone and their dog are now on the case. Now all we need to do is hope the Thais are listening and paying attention.

[Cadbury 16608]

9 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

It seems everyone and their dog are now on the case. Now all we need to do is hope the Thais are listening and paying attention.

Any change would involve loss of face. Don't hold your breath waiting for a sensible response. 

The best you should expect is some gobbledygook meaningless statement from the Immigration. After all, any relaxation of the law could involve loss of government and hip pocket income.

[mikebell 22263]

23 minutes ago, webfact said:

It is hard to see how security which relies on self‐disclosure can be a useful solution”

A great quote and a smack in the face for the Immigration chief's only defense for this ludicrous system.

[MadMac 2392]

Nothing will happen, at least not anytime soon. People complain, immigration makes some statements, but none of these can change the actual law. So they started to enforce that 40 y/o BS and now there is no way back. 

[rkidlad 32013]

50 minutes ago, webfact said:

It is hard to see how security which relies on self‐disclosure can be a useful solution”, Mr. Eriksson explained.

Absolutely, yes.

 

I now have the TM30 username and password. I have the app on my phone. I have friends who live in other provinces who have the same. So now one of my friends can report me staying at his house in Buriram, etc. I can then report myself as home in Bangkok on the app. Now, let's just say, as crazy as it might sound - I didn't really go to Buriram. Let's say I was doing some nefarious activities far away. Wouldn't our registration of the TM30 be a great alibi? Or would it simply show that self-disclosure is meaningless when you're a criminal. 

 

My god, the TM30 is so ******* stupid. 

[4675636b596f75 1159]

40 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

It seems everyone and their dog are now on the case. Now all we need to do is hope the Thais are listening and paying attention.

And I'm selling timeshares for the Bridge over the River Kwai.

[GeorgeCross 8827]

6 minutes ago, rkidlad said:

So now one of my friends can report me staying at his house in Buriram, etc. I can then report myself as home in Bangkok on the app. Now, let's just say, as crazy as it might sound - I didn't really go to Buriram. Let's say I was doing some nefarious activities far away. Wouldn't our registration of the TM30 be a great alibi? Or would it simply show that self-disclosure is meaningless when you're a criminal. 

 

farang tink too mut nah 🤣

 

 

 

[GeorgeCross 8827]

55 minutes ago, webfact said:

It is hard to see how security which relies on self‐disclosure can be a useful solution

 

the absurdity of this policy summed up in one simple sentence

 

why did no-one in immigration step up and point this out?

 

yeah yeah i know..

 

 

[Filipplenoir 186]

18 minutes ago, rkidlad said:

Absolutely, yes.

 

I now have the TM30 username and password. I have the app on my phone. I have friends who live in other provinces who have the same. So now one of my friends can report me staying at his house in Buriram, etc. I can then report myself as home in Bangkok on the app. Now, let's just say, as crazy as it might sound - I didn't really go to Buriram. Let's say I was doing some nefarious activities far away. Wouldn't our registration of the TM30 be a great alibi? Or would it simply show that self-disclosure is meaningless when you're a criminal. 

 

My god, the TM30 is so f****** stupid. 

Ok. From now on you need to walk in. Thanks for suggestions how to improve the system.  Sorry no anklets yet

[rkidlad 32013]

2 minutes ago, Filipplenoir said:

Ok. From now on you need to walk in. Thanks for suggestions how to improve the system.  Sorry no anklets yet

Okay, I'll walk into Buriram Immigration. Register myself and then head off far away to do my dirty deeds. I'll then walk into Bangkok immigration days later to declare I was in Buriram the whole time and I'm now in Bangkok. 

 

Cheers.

[DavisH 5520]

Simple. There is no need to change the law, just stop enforcing it - like just about every traffic law in this country. 

Gotta love Thailand - thousands of laws that are never enforced and everybody has forgotten - then there is a money spinning "crackdown"....for while, until everyone forgets the law again. Rinse and repeat. 

[smedly 58308]

self reporting contributes nothing towards security or crime prevention 

 

it is yet another scheme dreamed up by (the long out of control) Immigration dept to gouge funds from people who now find it very difficult to comply 100% with everything they are dreaming up, time for some sensible intelligent government intervention and put a stop to this nonsense 

[Bangkoklostitsvalue 32]

“’We anticipate that discussions for a Thailand‐EU Free Trade Agreement will re‐open. That agreement should bring much higher, mutual value and not be burdened by troublesome ‘ease of doing business’ issues which can be addressed now for the benefit of all parties..."

 

Yes, if they don't abolish this, it's only fair for the Western countries to require the same procedure for all the hundreds of thousands of Thais (many of them rich children of the politicians who make these stupid rules) who have residency, jobs and property in Western countries. "Want to go from London to Bath? No problem! Simply go take a day off work or school to report yourself to Scotland Yard on your way in and out. Don't want to do it? Your visa won't be renewed and you will no longer be able to go to school and work in England. Bye Bye! We want quality Thais that follow the rules. It's not that hard, foreigner." 

 

Diplomacy should be based on reciprocity. What's fair is fair. 

[Airalee 5432]

The Thai government can have their ฿800 from me.  They will be missing out on lots of tax revenue however as I have recently chosen to take my “beach holidays” back in So Cal where I can hang out at my friends place in Playa Vista.

 

I would like to take this opportunity to apologize to my favorite hotels...

 

AWA Koh Chang

Ibis (HuaHin & Kata)

Too many Phuket hotels to mention.

All the related businesses (taxis, restaurants, massage shops, etc)

 

I’m sorry I won’t be staying with you or patronizing your businesses in the near future.  You can thank your government for that.

 

Spend every Baht like it’s a vote!

 

Playa Vista just last week...

 

 

 

[GeorgeCross 8827]

15 minutes ago, Bangkoklostitsvalue said:

“’We anticipate that discussions for a Thailand‐EU Free Trade Agreement will re‐open. That agreement should bring much higher, mutual value and not be burdened by troublesome ‘ease of doing business’ issues which can be addressed now for the benefit of all parties..."

 

Yes, if they don't abolish this, it's only fair for the Western countries to require the same procedure for all the hundreds of thousands of Thais (many of them rich children of the politicians who make these stupid rules) who have residency, jobs and property in Western countries. "Want to go from London to Bath? No problem! Simply go take a day off work or school to report yourself to Scotland Yard on your way in and out. Don't want to do it? Your visa won't be renewed and you will no longer be able to go to school and work in England. Bye Bye! We want quality Thais that follow the rules. It's not that hard, foreigner." 

 

Diplomacy should be based on reciprocity. What's fair is fair. 

 

all good points but moot, the FTA will be dead the moment thailand realizes it cant tax european car imports at 400% anymore

 

 

[Hockeybik 572]

1 hour ago, Cadbury said:

... any relaxation of the law could involve loss of government and hip pocket income.

If it is truly about the money... and maybe it is... then just increase fees across the board to take more money from us. There will be far less blow back from that than from the useless and ineffective enforcement of a 40 year old law. It frosts me to jump through all the hoops getting my WP and visa sorted and then to pay another 4,000 just so I can come and go for the next 11 months but nothing I can do other than grumble and pay it. There's no one complaining about "re-entry permits". 

[ThomasThBKK 5454]

3 minutes ago, GeorgeCross said:

 

all good points but moot, the FTA will be dead the moment thailand realizes it cant tax european car imports at 400% anymore

 

 

Not if the guy that signs it runs food production business, he couldn't care less about cars or thailand in general.

Thai summit is one of the biggest automotive companies here, and it's owned by thanatorns family which as you might have noticed is not exactly part of the goverment.

 

 

[boonrawdcnx 1740]

Remember the Erawan Shrine terror attack? .....”Some officers were transferred, including immigration officials.
The bombing suspects said they had entered and left Thailand many times, and often paid bribes to Thai immigration officers.
This also led to a crack-down on immigration practices at Don Muang and Suvannabhumi International Airports.”

In the aftermath the 99.99 % of innocent residents and visitors had to suffer because of the actions of corrupt immigration officials.

The real threat to “national security” in this country are the corrupt criminals in uniform who would sell their mother if they can make a profit.
But of course it’s easier for them to blame the rest of the world than to admit the the entire officialdom in this country from top to bottom is corrupt and rotten to the core.


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[the guest 2443]

Thais listening to pesky foreigners ?

[Nowisee 1462]

41 minutes ago, boonrawdcnx said:

The real threat to “national security” in this country are the corrupt criminals in uniform who would sell their mother if they can make a profit.

This is the weak link.

[sturdyd 323]

2 hours ago, Airalee said:

Spend every Baht like it’s a vote!

Brilliant! Absolutely spot on. I'll repeat this to myself every time I think it might be nice to spend a weekend in Hua Hin, Kanchanaburi or wherever. Yeah, I'd like the trip, but then having to kowtow to TM30 stupidity sours the thought..

[Chazar 8650]

Oh YEAh, go for it, you got em by the short  n  curlies.  The main target, you  will  lose  jobs/hence  money.

I enjoyed this debacle, I particularly  liked the posts from those timid  hamsters claiming we  should say  nothing, don't stir the sleeping bear, the wouldn't say  boo  to a  goose brigade, the don't sign any petition "we arent spineless but but but brigade"

[BobbyL 6276]

4 minutes ago, sturdyd said:

Brilliant! Absolutely spot on. I'll repeat this to myself every time I think it might be nice to spend a weekend in Hua Hin, Kanchanaburi or wherever. Yeah, I'd like the trip, but then having to kowtow to TM30 stupidity sours the thought..

Exactly the same. I used to do a fair few weekends away every year, but currently I am not planning one at all and will save the money for my holidays abroad. I am not bothering now with a golf trip in the October half term or the Phuket footy tournament in November solely because of TM30. 

 

This is just me, but I can vouch for another 5 - 10 friends and colleagues who have said the exact same thing. 

[Chazar 8650]

4 hours ago, Cadbury said:

After all, any relaxation of the law could involve loss of government and hip pocket income.

Not  a s much loss  when folk wont come, leave and close down their businesses  though, and that will be the over riding reason.

[Chazar 8650]

3 hours ago, 4675636b596f75 said:

And I'm selling timeshares for the Bridge over the River Kwai.

As  long as you have your  tm30  youll be  fine

[Artisi 20691]

4 hours ago, darksidedog said:

It seems everyone and their dog are now on the case. Now all we need to do is hope the Thais are listening and paying attention.

Hope, listening, paying attention - 

55555555 

[Chelseafan 5856]

3 hours ago, 4675636b596f75 said:

And I'm selling timeshares for the Bridge over the River Kwai.

I'm interested. How much ?

[Artisi 20691]

3 hours ago, smedly said:

self reporting contributes nothing towards security or crime prevention 

 

it is yet another scheme dreamed up by (the long out of control) Immigration dept to gouge funds from people who now find it very difficult to comply 100% with everything they are dreaming up, time for some sensible intelligent government intervention and put a stop to this nonsense 

And therein lies the problem - intelligence. 

[Chazar 8650]

1 minute ago, Artisi said:

And therein lies the problem - intelligence. 

This is NOTHING to do with intelligence, we  like to insult them, but the reason is CONTROL and how Thailand has been run for generations.