Sin Sod - who here got married without paying and what makes it not apply?

[Damrongsak]

41 years ago, I paid for our wedding party, but no sin sod. 

[riclag]

My wife has two daughters from a previous marriage to a Thai!

The oldest one fetched  1 baht in gold and 40 k in cash . She basically wants a simple life and was quite happy working at a 7

The youngest one is a recent law graduate,and would like to get a graduate degree and quite shy!  My wife seems to think she could fetch 400k and 5 baht in gold .

 

For me I paid no sinsot,why would I,I built a house,put her daughter through University and I give her a monthly allowance. 

Edited October 4, 2019 by riclag

[Damrongsak]

16 minutes ago, riclag said:

My wife has two daughters from a previous marriage to a Thai!

The oldest one fetched  1 baht in gold and 40 k in cash . She basically wants a simple life and was quite happy working at a 7

The youngest one is a recent law graduate,and would like to get a graduate degree and quite shy!  My wife seems to think she could fetch 400k and 5 baht in gold .

 

For me I paid no sinsot,why would I,I built a house,put her daughter through University and I give her a monthly allowance. 

My wife seems to think she could fetch 400k and 5 baht in gold .

 

Send me a picture - I'll make an offer.

[oldhippy]

No.

The father wanted 5.000 euro - 555 yes euro, very modern man.

I just laughed it away, the family never asked again.

We got married in Bangrak, no family involved, I paid about 10.000 baht in a restaurant in BKK (mainly friends), and another 10.000 baht for a simple monk wedding in the village. Most of that money was used to "make merit" with the monks, something I still regret.

 

[Nyezhov]

3 hours ago, White Christmas13 said:

No alimony is when you get divorced not when you get married

No, thats when the checkbin gets filled out. Start saving for it as soon as you say I do.

[Curt1591]

Paid a substantial sin sod.

 

To my surprise, a couple weeks after the wedding, it was all given to us as a wedding gift. 

[Moonlover]

12 hours ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

A dowry system, right or wrong has NOTHING to do with cattle or buying people. Traditionally its viewed as security for the wife against death or seperation of the husband. 

Oh really? The number of abandoned wives and hence fatherless children would suggest it's a tradition that doesn't work too well.

 

And I am not talking abstractedly at all. It's a very real and serious problem in this country.

 

Perhaps this 'sin money' could be put to better use supporting the new family instead of 'buying' papa a new car!

[Tayaout]

I paid 50K but it was optional. I wasn't even asked for it. I brought up the subject myself. My wife was university educated, no child and 26 years old. I would say the family is low middle class. 

Edited October 5, 2019 by Tayaout

[NanLaew]

9 hours ago, Damrongsak said:

41 years ago, I paid for our wedding party, but no sin sod. 

Hah! We never even bothered with a wedding party.

 

(Snip)

[kwonitoy]

No sin sod, topic never came up although she bitched about it later

No payment of any money on divorce.

 

[villagefarang]

After two years living together, we eloped and told our families and friends after the fact.  Many years later when we moved to Chiangrai from Bangkok, we built a house and did not have the traditional house warming party either.  We have also chosen not to have kids.  Twenty-two years later we are still in love, still breaking all the rules and living a great life.????????

[PatOngo]

How good are your negotiating skills!

[CharlieH]

14 minutes ago, PatOngo said:

How good are your negotiating skills!

That's the first mistake, you don't negotiate ever ! You stipulate what's going to happen.

[BobbyL]

We got married when we were both living in England which was her idea over doing it in Thailand. I didn't pay anything and it was never mentioned. I always perceived it as an outdated ritual that is better left to the Thais for their showing off. If her family ever asked for it, I would have said in Western culture the bride's family pays for the wedding ceremony (which she knew already).

 

Not sure whether or not it made a difference, but we were 29 and 28 when we got married a few years ago so it was different to a lot of relationships here. She is very westernised (been to university in England) and didn't seem to care about the idea of showing off a sinsod. I am not sure whether or not her family and her had more private conversations about me not paying it, but I don't care. 

 

Perhaps I did pay a form of sinsod as during our time living in England for a few years I was teaching and she was studying her Masters degree and only working part time so I was paying for the majority of our expenses (bills, transport, holidays etc). 

 

 

 

Edited October 5, 2019 by BobbyL

[GalaxyMan]

14 hours ago, Kinnock said:

Similar(ish) to Denim's above.

 

After 8 years living together we decided it would make visa applications easier if we formalized our happy relationship.  She had never been married, no kids and has a good (but low paying) job. 

 

She entered some complex negotiations with her Mother that made the Brexit issue look simple - and I bought some gold and emptied the cash machine adjacent to the hotel where we had the ceremony.

 

We got dressed up like Aladdin and Jasmine, put gold and cash on a fancy plate, knelt until my legs went dead, had a great party with her large extended family, sang karaoke, drank enough to make our ancestors proud, then after breakfast next day I got all the gold back except for a personal gift for her Mother, plus all the cash.

 

I was prepared to give some Sin Sod, but was not an active member of the negotiating team, and was surprised and slightly embarrassed that I got almost everything back. 

 

I'd paid for the party and hotel bookings plus vans and an impressive amount of Chang Beer, but I think the right woman will protect your (joint) assets.

I just got married recently and had a similar experience. Mom was given an envelope with money in it and it was given back to me after the ceremony had concluded, just as I was promised.

[emptypockets]

14 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

My wife is a school teacher by trade - excellent education, owns far more land than I do, etc - I paid ZERO sinsod. She has two daughters - now living with Gran - from a pathetic Thai man she married in name only.

 

If the girl has been married before AND/OR has kids then I would suggest zero sinsod as the right price. If you met her in a bar, I would also not pay sinsod - she's is a hooker after all !!!  I think many Thai parents accept the fact they will get zero sinsod in these instances, but do not want to be insulted, she is their daughter remember.

 

My advice if she has kids and/or divorced, sit down with parents and be honest and say you will not pay a sinsod due to her previous circumstances, BUT, are happy to help out the family in other daily matters in their lives within reason (don't go over the top). 

 

If your woman is from a bar, divorced with kids AND wants a sinsod, then you are just a cash cow. Walk away

 

 

 

Absolute nonsense meeting a girl in a bar and she's automatically a hooker. Where do you think maybe 75% of all people in the western world meet their partner? A bar, club or pub would be my guess. And Thailand would be no different in the big cities.

[emptypockets]

14 hours ago, Matzzon said:

No, it hasn´t. That bacause in real Thai tradition this money is just for show and shall after the marriage and the show be returned to the married couple for a good start in their marriage.

You see, I knew that too. Is there something more you wish to inform me about today, sunnyboy2018?

In real Thai tradition the money is given....and NOT returned. In contemporary Thai it may be returned.

[otherstuff1957]

My wife is from the south, were sinsot is not a big dearl.  Her first husband only paid a nominal sinsot (8000฿).  By the time we married both of her parents were already dead so I only paid for the wedding. (Actually, my father paid for the wedding and since it was a village wedding, it only cost about 50,000฿)

[richard_smith237]

Yes, I paid Sin-Sod, it was all returned after the Wedding. 

Additionally, I agreed to the Custom on the condition that the amount was not to be disclosed because I found it somewhat crass to discuss money on such an occasion. 

 

FIL gave us some land in Bangkok (outskirts) & We received all the 'envelope money' which pretty much covered all the costs of the Wedding at a hotel in Bangkok.

 

The Question of the Op is rather simplistic: It needs a further option: Paid Sin-sod to comply with tradition / culture, then inlaws returned the money. 

Most my my Friends paid Sin-Sod, only a couple of them did not receive it back.

 

 

 

[Matzzon]

27 minutes ago, emptypockets said:

In real Thai tradition the money is given....and NOT returned. In contemporary Thai it may be returned.

Maybe in your real tradition. That has totally to do with what kind of girl you marry. The only time it´s tradition that the dowry are not given back to the couple is following:

* When you marry a bar girl (Or someone that fallen from grace in similar ways. That due to the dowry is seen as restoring face and the family name.

* When marry a poor family out in the farm lands or similar. That due to the family takes the money and you do not see any of it no more.

 

Probably that´s tradition for you and likewise your fishing holes for a future wife. I was giving the rules from the middle class with a fairly good education and up.

[richard_smith237]

44 minutes ago, emptypockets said:

Absolute nonsense meeting a girl in a bar and she's automatically a hooker. Where do you think maybe 75% of all people in the western world meet their partner? A bar, club or pub would be my guess. And Thailand would be no different in the big cities.

Are you for real??? or perhaps being deliberately obtuse????

 

It's pretty obvious that Richard Coleman was referring to 'bars' with 'bar girls' and not the usual Pub / Club / Bar we get in the eWst. 

In fact, many relationships in Thailand originate from meeting in a 'Normal Pub / Club / Bar' but there are plenty of couples who've met in a 'girl bar'... anyone knows the difference, those married to girls who have been working in these bars are married to ex-hookers regardless of how much they try to pull the wool over their eyes - they know the difference and I imagine, so do you. 

[richard_smith237]

1 minute ago, Matzzon said:

Maybe in your real tradition. That has totally to do with what kind of girl you marry. The only time it´s tradition that the dowry are not given back to the couple is following:

* When you marry a bar girl (Or someone that fallen from grace in similar ways. That due to the dowry is seen as restoring face and the family name.

* When marry a poor family out in the farm lands or similar. That due to the family takes the money and you do not see any of it no more.

 

Probably that´s tradition for you and likewise your fishing holes for a future wife. I was giving the rules from the middle class with a fairly good education and up.

 

The issue with tradition and culture in a country such as Thailand is that is origins vary with the geography and socio-economic status of those imparting their knowledge. 

 

What one person tells you is completely different from the information you will receive from another - they will both be right, of course, 'same same but nid-noy different'

 

This is how many debates start between us Foreigners on forums such as this - the information with which we have been provided varies from source to source and we sometimes take it on faith that the person providing us with such information knows exactly what they are talking about, that they are not guessing or making something up to suit their idea of events / history / tradition / culture....

 

 

[PatOngo]

1 hour ago, CharlieH said:

That's the first mistake, you don't negotiate ever ! You stipulate what's going to happen.

You need to factor in a little face for them, it's what their entire culture is based around.

[Matzzon]

11 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

The issue with tradition and culture in a country such as Thailand is that is origins vary with the geography and socio-economic status of those imparting their knowledge. 

 

What one person tells you is completely different from the information you will receive from another - they will both be right, of course, 'same same but nid-noy different'

 

This is how many debates start between us Foreigners on forums such as this - the information with which we have been provided varies from source to source and we sometimes take it on faith that the person providing us with such information knows exactly what they are talking about, that they are not guessing or making something up to suit their idea of events / history / tradition / culture....

 

 

Ok, nevermind then. So, that my information comes from my wifes soon 86 year old grandmother, told in thai, has nothing to do with it then.

But, of course. Feel free to take your information from the next barstool in Pattaya, where the drunk foreigner sitting bragging about his last marriage with a very experienced bargirl and that he payed 1 million in dowry. ????????

Edited October 5, 2019 by Matzzon

[richard_smith237]

Just now, Matzzon said:

11 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

The issue with tradition and culture in a country such as Thailand is that is origins vary with the geography and socio-economic status of those imparting their knowledge. 

 

What one person tells you is completely different from the information you will receive from another - they will both be right, of course, 'same same but nid-noy different'

 

This is how many debates start between us Foreigners on forums such as this - the information with which we have been provided varies from source to source and we sometimes take it on faith that the person providing us with such information knows exactly what they are talking about, that they are not guessing or making something up to suit their idea of events / history / tradition / culture....

 

 

Ok, nevermind then. So, that my information comes from my wifes soon 86 year old grandmother, told in thai, has nothing to do with it then.

But, of course. Feel free to take your information from the next barstool in Pattaya.

 

OK, so you've deliberately misunderstood my point and responded with something rather idiotic. 

 

Why would your Wife's soon 86 year old Grandmother be any more accurate than my Father in Law, or my Wife or one of my many Thai Friends???

 

In your hurry to come back with a smart ar$$ed response you failed to grasp the very point I was making - Different sources will have varying understandings of the origin of their culture, no one source is any more accurate than the other because verbally passing on information down through generations is all 'culture' and 'tradition' truly are.

 

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

16 hours ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

A dowry system, right or wrong has NOTHING to do with cattle or buying people. Traditionally its viewed as security for the wife against death or seperation of the husband. 

So why does it not apply when the woman is not a virgin?

Wills exist to take care of the wife in the event of the husband's death. No need for an historical tradition which is used to fleece gullible farangs buying wives that have children, are divorced, or were prostitutes.

 

I didn't buy my wife, though I did give 50,000 baht which I got back.

[Nyezhov]

2 hours ago, CharlieH said:

That's the first mistake, you don't negotiate ever ! You stipulate what's going to happen.

Stipulate is not the correct word Cha Lee.

 

Its "tell them". You tell them you arent paying, and if they insist on it, you will dump the b**h and head over to the GoGo for a new one. Then they will never get a new fuel pump for the tractor and Bro In law will still have to ride around holding up a soda bottle filled with petrol connected by a tube to the carb. No wonder the rows arent straight.

[thaibeachlovers]

2 hours ago, emptypockets said:

Absolute nonsense meeting a girl in a bar and she's automatically a hooker. Where do you think maybe 75% of all people in the western world meet their partner? A bar, club or pub would be my guess. And Thailand would be no different in the big cities.

Good Thai girls don't go to bars where lots of farangs go as assumed to be a hooker. They have Thai clubs to go to where farangs don't go.

Thailand isn't the western world, if one hasn't noticed.

[lensta]

16 hours ago, CharlieH said:

Didnt pay anything and didnt have a "village wedding" either.

Just the correct legal procedure at the Amphur.

 

 

Same here

[phantomfiddler]

18 hours ago, Moonlover said:

Wife was a divorcee, both parents demised, sin sod not applicable.

 

I would never 'buy' a wife anyway. They're humans, not cattle!

Yours may very well have been human, but I,m not so sure about mine ????