The logic of masking

[Trujillo]

 

Thailand has had no local (domestic) cases of the virus that causes Covid-19 for 35 days as of June 29^th. (All “new” cases are Thais returning from outside the country who are immediately quarantined for 14 days and do not interact with the general population.)

(For those wishing to promote or discuss conspiracy theories alleging government lies or intentional under-counting of cases and the like, please start your own thread on the subject. Please do not interject this here, thank you.)

The accepted incubation time for the virus is up to 14 days (thus the global standard of quarantine for infected individuals).

After 14 days, a person suspected of coming into contact with the virus, if no symptoms are present, is assumed to be virus free.

 

Masks are used to prevent an infected person knowingly or unknowingly from transmitting the virus to another person who is virus free.

 

Since all the people in Thailand are virus free – i.e., the entire population has gone through more than two cycles of 14 days without a single positive case of coronavirus – no one can pass the virus to another, since no one is infected.

 

Therefore, there is no reason whatsoever to wear a mask now, since there is not a single person in the country who has the virus, knowingly or unknowingly.

 

So given these facts, why are we required to wear a mask?

 

Simply put: Since masks prevent the wearer from spreading the virus, and since no one has the virus, there is no point wearing a mask.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[BritManToo]

Cycled past my village green at dusk, about 20 villagers (and their kids) out at the tables talking, eating, drinking beer.

Not one of them wearing a mask, me neither.

[timendres]

6 minutes ago, Trujillo said:

Simply put: Since masks prevent the wearer from spreading the virus, and since no one has the virus, there is no point wearing a mask.

On 27 June 2020 at 18:00, Thailand announced that 1,695 additional people met the criteria for PUI, raising the total to 306,790 PUI, as shown in Table 1.

 

https://ddc.moph.go.th/viralpneumonia/eng/file/situation/situation-no174-270663.pdf

 

[CorpusChristie]

I was in an open air market yesterday and the security guard shouted at me to put a mask on , so I did , I then when and stood next to him and pointed at all the Thais walking by not wearing masks , I told him to tell them to put masks on as well ????

[Puchaiyank]

"please start your own thread on the subject. Please do not interject this here, thank you.)"

 

Commonly, when you limit a conversation to only one point of view... the results are predictable and uninformative...

 

Enjoy your personal thread...????

[ericthai]

OP you dont understand how a forum works, you dont get to dictate to people what they can post. 

[RichardColeman]

Like to me the one person fearing the virus more than a trip on the thai roads

[Lacessit]

"Therefore, there is no reason whatsoever to wear a mask now, since there is not a single person in the country who has the virus, knowingly or unknowingly".

Asymptomatic carriers do not know they have the virus. Thailand has tested less than 0.1% of its population. How the OP reaches the conclusion there is not a single person in the country with the virus defies the logic he is espousing.

I get that you don't want to wear a mask. I don't get justifying that position with BS arguments.

 

[saakura]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

Cycled past my village green at dusk, about 20 villagers (and their kids) out at the tables talking, eating, drinking beer.

Not one of them wearing a mask, me neither.

You cant talk, eat & drink while wearing a mask.

[Lacessit]

20 minutes ago, saakura said:

You cant talk, eat & drink while wearing a mask.

You shouldn't do it while cycling, either. Exercise requires freedom in breathing.

[dingdongrb]

1 hour ago, saakura said:

You cant talk, eat & drink while wearing a mask.

Hmmmmm....  I have no issue at all with speaking while wearing a mask. Perhaps if folks would speak loud and clear instead of mumbling they could be heard.

[johnray]

Because a young person will not show symptoms but can still have the virus and pass it onto a child or old person.

 

 

[FolkGuitar]

The decision to stop wearing a mask while the entire world is reeling from Covid19, with thousands of deaths daily, and no one really certain just who is or is not spreading the virus, isn't a political or even a medical statement.

It's an IQ test.

[johnray]

The quarantine is follwed by a medical test as well.  Skip to the end of this video.

 

 

 

[robblok]

BBC report showed Thailand having around 2500 deaths more then average in the last months. That is almost sure to be corvid. It just shows that testing here is not done well. 

 

The PUI timeanddress posts also shows that testing is not done well. So to conclude its gone is simply a stupid conclusion.

 

You wear a mask to protect others only selfish people refuse to wear them.

 

Then you got people who say just let those at risk die (that is becoming more popular). 

[jonwilly]

I'll stick to my mask for some time to come.

 

john

[Bill97]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

So to conclude its gone is simply a stupid conclusion.

Yes it is.  But not the first such conclusion from our beloved op.

[BritManToo]

9 hours ago, johnray said:

Because a young person will not show symptoms but can still have the virus and pass it onto a child or old person.

Maybe if no cases for 14 days.

But no cases for 30 days means there's no asymptomatic carriers.

[NotEinstein]

There very well may be no carriers currently, but when the vast majority of the rest of the world is requiring that masks be worn, no politician is going to stick their neck out.

In reality, bitching about the minor inconvenience of wearing a mask when out is playing into the hands of the divide and rule ramp up that has been actioned.

[Bill97]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

Maybe if no cases for 14 days.

But no cases for 30 days means there's no asymptomatic carriers.

I wish I could believe that but the logic escapes me.

[Trujillo]

First: 
"OP you dont understand how a forum works, you dont get to dictate to people what they can post."

 

Actually, those who have started threads have more say than you think. You must have seen threads that were started by someone and closed because that same someone ask that they be closed. 

My point (and I am quite familiar with forums) is that I did, and do not want this thread to be hijacked by tangential arguments about conspiracy theories. That's all. 

 

Second: 

"But no cases for 30 days means there's no asymptomatic carriers."

 

That's the whole point. I realize that some cling to this "no visible symptoms" rhetoric like a child's comfort blanket, but if there are no cases for over a month, then there can't be any asymptomatic carriers or symptomatic ones (other than the latter still in hospital). If you can't understand this, then yes, you fail the IQ test. 

 

"Asymptomatic carriers do not know they have the virus. Thailand has tested less than 0.1% of its population. How the OP reaches the conclusion there is not a single person in the country with the virus defies the logic he is espousing."

 

Again, think about this. Assuming the government is being transparent, and I have not seen any valid indications it is not, the figures tell us that anyone who could have had the virus  -- symptomatic or not -- would have already have had it and gotten over it. We have gone through more than two cycles of 14 days. 

Remember, I said "has" the virus, not "had" it. I am sure many more had it before, but having passed far, far longer than the incubation period, no one is lift with an active viral case. 

Increased testing will only continue to show no positive cases, unless you are talking about antibody tests and then you will find that, yes, more people had the virus but did not show any or appreciable symptoms, or did and recovered (you do understand people infected recover, don't you?). 

 

As for the world "reeling" from covid, I am not discussing the rest of the world here. This argument has context and has nothing to do with any other country. 

 

[teacherofwoe]

Wearing a mask is to stop infected people from spreading the disease to others. Wearing a mask yourself isn't to protect you. If I had COVID 19 and coughed or sneezed right in your face and got my lung fluid in your mouth, you'd be in trouble. Masks do usually block genetic material from the lungs and mouth. That's why surgeons wear masks when they are operating; to prevent them from contaminating the patient from coughs or sneezes. It's the same principle with distancing. Here's the problem: most masks have pores which are massive compared to the size of viruses. The virus can pass through quite easily. So, viruses themselves won't be stopped by a mask worn by either person. Coughs and sneezes travel farther than two meters (6 & 8 meters respectfully) and their droplets can stay suspended in the air for up to 10 minutes. How many people have you seen wearing a mask that is air tight on their face? In most cases there are openings at the sides and near the nose. Any lung droplets, let alone viruses, will easily creep behind your mask from a cough or sneeze from someone at the supermarket 10 minutes before you even got there. 

 

So why are we told to wear masks? If you let my five year old daughter ride a bicycle and you put a helmet on their head but my child dies from a brain hemorrhage caused by an accident, at least you can claim that you tried to protect her. It's the same thing. Governments need to be seen to be doing something to protect you. Unfortunately, they have got the whole thing entirely wrong. Masks, distancing and lock downs have been and will be far more devastating than any corona virus. 

[CorpusChristie]

7 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Maybe if no cases for 14 days.

But no cases for 30 days means there's no asymptomatic carriers.

No , an asymptomatic carrier could pass the virus onto another person who is also asymptomatic and it could get passed on until a person catches it and shows some symptoms .

  That could be months down the line

[Dante99]

3 hours ago, CorpusChristie said:

No , an asymptomatic carrier could pass the virus onto another person who is also asymptomatic and it could get passed on until a person catches it and shows some symptoms .

  That could be months down the line

Thanks, makes sense.  That is the story I am buying unless those 2 14 day cycle, 30 days means no virus guys come up with some reasonable support.  Hello

[cardinalblue]

People are like sheep here...

 

until they get on or in a motorized vehicle and passive/aggressive takes over...

 

mind boggling that people are unable to understand cause effect situations and there are many...

[grin]

My understanding is that in the worst case it can take people six to eight weeks to recover from Covid-19. Since testing is not that prevalent in Thailand who knows how many current cases there are. As long as there are current cases it is possible for the virus to be transmitted. It seems to me that we would have to wait two weeks after everyone in the country has recovered to be sure that there are no carriers. But without sufficient testing how can we know that?

[poloshirt]

Even doctors said they haven't really understood this virus so it is better we exercise more care than needed.

If you read the "Black Death", it was so bad that people died on the street and nobody collected the corpse because those who collected the corpses also died.

The virus of Black Death just suddenly disappeared for no reason. It really seems like The Reaper came and did his job and gone home.

Don't forget this virus mutates that alone is difficult to deal with.

[1FinickyOne]

23 hours ago, FolkGuitar said:

It's an IQ test.

And one in which the virus seems to be winning... 

 

In the countries where it is rampant, the greater chance of it mutating into an even more deadly form... first it hides undetected, then it attacks, next will be mutation... this is one smart virus often up against people not up to the challenge... 

[Emdog]

Okay, no reported covid cases for over a month. Excuse me if I don't put my trust in the government figures here and bet with my life. If deaths are up 2500 per month from a year ago with no known cause, or from PUI, I'd more likely figure something not good is going on. There is also factor of culture here: Thais are even more loathe to pass on bad news up the command chain.

A mask isn't that much of a hassle. It really isn't, full stop.

[1FinickyOne]

On 6/29/2020 at 8:07 PM, Trujillo said:

Therefore, there is no reason whatsoever to wear a mask now

Incorrect... 

 

I wear a mask when required or requested by other people... 

 

I brought my niece back to boarding school yesterday and they were being especially careful and if that meant me and everyone else wearing a mask during drop off time and during a briefing of new rules and them spraying all of her belongings - well, I surely have no problem with it... 

 

We do not know everything about this virus, so, why not take a few extra precautions... what if they find out that a strain of the virus can lie dormant for 6 months? Well, surely you would argue that we didn't know that at the time... 

 

I don't like wearing a mask either - but I wear one for the comfort that others will feel... and I am glad to see that they take this threat seriously at my niece's school. And I can comply easily w/such an incredibly minimal effort that it boggles the mind why anyone would complain...